General tuning

[ThEGr33k]

Right i KNOW this is on the site somewhere but after an hour of looking and not finding i feel i am allowed to start another :rolleyes:.

So the situation, i wanted to get an SV1000S but due to inability to test ride (i do a lot of miles and i dont want to get a bike blind and find i hate it - have to be 25 to test ride ffs!) and my bike not seemingly worth very little i have decided not to get rid of the SV650s for now...

So i have a K5 (red clearly best) SV as per Avatar, what im wanting to know is basically what effect do these things have on power. A combination or on their own:-

1. Power commander
2. K&N/performance filter + snorkel removed (maybe even ram air setup with powercommander to compensate?) :smt108
3. Is there a cam upgrade for the K5 similar to the k2?
4. End can / Full exhaust system increases.
5. Anything else that is fairly simple to do.

BUT please keep it to sensible stuff! I dont want a big bore, i want the reliability to be good!

Right and here is something else:-
1. What are the easy remoable parts to reduce weight?
2. Is the Gixxer fron end a good idea for weight and handling (and breaking with the radial 4 pots...)


So i think that is the meat of it. If you have any other info then please let me know. Im aiming for 80ish BHP at the back if possible with these mods and with keeping reliability?

Very interested in weight loss, for obvious reasons.

Cheers for any info!!

[northwind]

You could chuck a set of curvy model intake cams into the exhaust side, that'd give a wee bit of power, though not as dramatic as it is with the curvy... I don't really know the other pointy tuning options though, or where the easy weight loss lives, with the curvy it's all overengineered brackets and unneccesary parts.

I really rate the GSXR front end swaps, mainly because the SV parts have good resale value- you could fit a K2 GSXR750 front with the conventional calipers and, if you're careful, actually turn a profit! Emulators are a good option, and the Matris kit seems good as well, but they do cost. Bear in mind, you might still want to rework the GSXR forks, though they're a fair average usually. I'm too light for mine :smt092

[ThEGr33k]

Thanks North.

I was thinking of going for the newer k4-5 model unside downs and brakes if i ever get round to it...

I could do with getting everything together. Then take some holiday, see the problem i have is i have too much dependance on the bike, i cant afford for it to go wrong, i have no other transport :rolleyes:


Anyhow, is there none on here who has lightened off their SV650 K3- at all?

[Steve_God]

Anyhow, is there none on here who has lightened off their SV650 K3- at all?
The tank raiser that's under the rear seat - my theory is if you're gonna use it, it'll be while you're at home!

A full racing exhaust, race air-filter, and a yosi-box/ecu map will add about two brake.

Other than that... can't really suggest much.
It's mostly due to the engine design, it's a V-twin - most of its power is low down torque, and extra mods mainly increase the torque more than extra horseys.

[ThEGr33k]

Bump... Common guys someone has to know something! :rolleyes:

[jambo]

What do you want to change?

If you want a load more power, forget tuning an SV 650. You'll get a nice bit extra with engine work but nothing mega. The front end conversion can give better feeling forks and stronger brakes, but may take time, be tricky and highlight a need to suddenly budget £500 on a new shock. And it'll still have the same power as it did before.

Talk to your insurance company, you can't test ride an SV1000 simply because the shop's insurance doesn't cover you. Will your insurance cover it for a day? (If you're TPO / TPFT consider the cost of dropping the bike while on a test).

You can get more out of an SV650 but for it to solve what you want you need to be very specific about what you want to change and what sort of money you're happy to spend.

Jambo

[ThEGr33k]

You can get more out of an SV650 but for it to solve what you want you need to be very specific about what you want to change and what sort of money you're happy to spend.

Jambo

Well the power mods are above... Just pretty basic stuff for now.

At the moment im still looking for infomation, like what i can change and/or remove from the bike weight wise. How much power a cirtain item will gain, oh and im not looking for out and out power, more mid range, though a increase across the range is good :D.

The prices is something else that im wondering about... i know the cost of stuff like Power commander and air filters, but anything else that gets recomended then well im interested to know.

I might well see about the insurance! I think at the very best ill be waiting till next insurance year (in feb) before i go test riding again.

The reason im not major fussed about going for another bike is like i mentioned somewhere, my fiends SVthou wasnt that much quicker than my sv650, it was only over 120MPH that he started to pull on me by a margin. N' to be honest as a whole im happy with the setup i have atm, but as bits (suspension) gets tired then i wast to know what effect a major change might have...



Suppose ill just end up testing another bike and falling for it, i dont know...

[northwind]

The thing about weight loss is that chopping bits off a bike absolutely wrecks the resale value, and a lot of it isnt very reversible. That, and it'll be hard to really get the weight down. Ditching the exhaust makes a big difference straight away, but then you start to get into diminishing returns, particularily on a road bike. So, if you've got any thoughts of selling in the future, it might not be that good a move.

Suspension on the other hand, keeps its value well- a used Ohlins shock will generally fetch 3/4 of its new value for instance, and springs and emulators sell well too. The jury's out on the impact of a front end swap, I don't think it makes a lot of difference myself, it would put some buyers off but it probably doesn't actually impact the sale price badly I suspect, it just makes it harder to make the sale.

Power, well... The SV's generally said to be able to deal with 80bhp without significantly reducing its lifespan, that's obviously a rule of thumb but it seems to be born out. Mine sits at just over 80, but one thing that I've found is that day to day, it doesn't actually feel that powerful. If I ride a standard one followed by mine, the standard one feels heavy, wheezy and peaky, but if you add 5bhp, in a month you'll take it for granted again. It doesn't really make that much difference in the real world.

Obviously, I'm not the one to lecture on keeping things standard :mrgreen: Mine in bits is worth about 3 times what it is whole, at a guess... But I decided very early on that I was keeping it for the long run, so it's just not a concern for me.

[ThEGr33k]

Yea i can understand what you are saying with the power. But i think the standard setup has a bit of a hole in the middle of the power curve, do id like to turn it around so that the mid is the strongest part, as this is the part you use most of the time (as im sure you know).

Hmmm well the weight thing is an interesting one, i wouldnt want to go as far as making the resail drop such a large amount obviously. I think i will see what the insurance poeple think to me changing the forks and brakes N' see if a power commander will effect things while im at it.

Insurance is the thing which will be keeping me held back... sucks dont it! :(

[northwind]

I'd expect a remap should get around the hole in the middle to some extent, and should also make the bike generally a bit more responsive. Speak to people like JHS and Steve Jordans about this, I think Steve Jordan would recommend the Teka reflash rather than a PC but don't quote me.

Ignition advancer might suit you nicely... I've never been that convinced as to its merits to be honest, it did feel much better to me in the midrange but perhaps that's psychology. Here's a JHS dyno curve

http://www.jhsracing.co.uk/archive/99-650/dyno/images/std_v_std_w_key.gif

Though with my skeptic's hat on... I'm sure mine made no more peak power. TWF (formerly from SV Rider) is one person I always listen to, and he reckons it's a waste of time. Others disagree. But, I liked it, the butt dyno can be deceitful but even if it was just psychology it was a well spent £20 :mrgreen:

[ThEGr33k]

What is it that the dyno there is showing?

I might go to the local shop to me who does dyno runs and get him to do mine with what i have done now just to see how my bike is running... ATM all i have done is the end can but i did run a while with snorkel out. I put it back in for service just incase anything happened before the warrently went off.

So dyno with No snorkel and Scorpion end can... then i have a start point. Ill try to get it done after this shif cycle is over. Ill post it for you oggle :D

[northwind]

Powa! Basically, the red curve is standard, the blue curve is with the ignition advancer in. The bottom set of curves is torque. I'd say myself that the red run is a bit weak, and that the blue run looks better than it should by comparison, but you can see the difference in lower down power and torque.

[ThEGr33k]

I know what the lines mean :rolleyes: I ment what did the lines show... :) Im sure i heard that the SV puts out 70+ at the wheel or is it 70+ at the crank? If its at the wheel then it does look a bit weak :S

Interesting that then. How does the ignition advancer fit, N' if i use a Power commander wouldnt i get this option through that? While im mentioning the power commander, any idea if there is a good place to get one dyno setup near yorkshire?

Taaa North.

P.S. How is Eve going? :smt072

[drefraser]

My bike did 68 bhp on the dyno before its various modifications. I have to say that the cost benefit of getting more power doesn't make much sense. My bike had as much spent on it as it was worth by the previous owner to get 16 bhp more. It's always going to be cheaper to get a different bike.
Suspension mods on the other hand make a huge difference IMHO. Combine them with some sticky tyres and you'll be going faster and having more fun with the same power output.

[ThEGr33k]

Yea i hear you on that. Thats why with the power im mostly only wanting to know about simple (resonably) cheap options... No big CC kits for me.

Another reason other than power for me to be interested is the apparent increase in aconomy as well! So it should be a win win situation. :twisted:

[northwind]

Sorry Gr33k! I believe they're rw but it doesn't really matter, it's the shape of the curve that's important in those ones. There's 2 ways to do it, you can either move the ignition timing pickup a degree or two in the case, or you can move the generator rotor around on the crank by a couple of degrees using the offset key JHS sells. It's cheap for parts but takes a while to do.

Eve is going OK, I got very bored of it but then I moved corp and it's much better, I hadn't realised how bad the old shower was :smt083Running courier missions as I type this, who says men can't multitask :-D

My bike did 68 bhp on the dyno before its various modifications. I have to say that the cost benefit of getting more power doesn't make much sense. My bike had as much spent on it as it was worth by the previous owner to get 16 bhp more. It's always going to be cheaper to get a different bike.
Suspension mods on the other hand make a huge difference IMHO. Combine them with some sticky tyres and you'll be going faster and having more fun with the same power output.

Yes! In fact, I bet you money my suspension would take more off a lap of most tracks than my power mods, they both cost roughly the same. THe power mods are for fun, the suspension's what does the work.

[ThEGr33k]

Hmmm well the ignition advancer is an option. But there is one thing i dont quite get with it... Why wouldnt the ignition be advanced out of the factory? I mean if it makes that much difference.

The bike atm is feeling very nice in the corners :cool: But i think ill be keeping an eye on Ebay for the next few months and see what i can see...

North you tell your insurers about every mod? N' if so what do they think?




Ive been fighting BoB for a while... Im taking a short break atm. I just cant seem to get into it at the mo.just left my chars training upto HAC's. Should be nice :)

[yorkie_chris]

They back the advance off a bit to reduce NOX emissions

EU strikes again

[northwind]

Hmmm well the ignition advancer is an option. But there is one thing i dont quite get with it... Why wouldnt the ignition be advanced out of the factory? I mean if it makes that much difference.

North you tell your insurers about every mod? N' if so what do they think?

Ive been fighting BoB for a while... Im taking a short break atm. I just cant seem to get into it at the mo.just left my chars training upto HAC's. Should be nice :)

I wrote a message, then it broke :( Aye, like Chris says. Also, running with less advance means the bike's less choosy on fuel, you can run an SV on belgian lager... Whereas with more advance, it's just a wee bit more picky, though it's still fine with any UK pump fuel. If you were in the Andes, it might be an issue.

Aye, I tell them... They think "Excellent, more money!". The hard part is actually getting the mods covered, I could insure it fairly cheaply elsewhere but it'd mean getting a stupidly low payout in the event of a claim. It's not so much more expensive to cover the mods, just that only expensive insurers will do it.

I just trained the HACs skill, I didn't notice that you also need cruiser 5 to drive one- I've got an Ishtar parked up that I can't drive for another 20 days! Woe. Plus, I sold my Navy Vexor to pay for it. I'm that good... I think we're about to get in a war with some local hisec griefers, which would be much appreciated.

[yorkie_chris]

I just trained the HACs skill, I didn't notice that you also need cruiser 5 to drive one- I've got an Ishtar parked up that I can't drive for another 20 days! Woe. Plus, I sold my Navy Vexor to pay for it. I'm that good... I think we're about to get in a war with some local hisec griefers, which would be much appreciated.

What the F### are you on about?

[ThEGr33k]

G33k talk!

:compcrash::smt032

[ThEGr33k]

Back to the tuning thing. I had put my snorkel back in my bike for my final service before my warrently ran out to keep the place happy (just incase it voided the warranty).

Anyhow ive just taken it back out and man it seems to go better! It feeling like the dip in midrange power has inverted itself. I really do need to get it on a dyno and see how it is. Will a normal dyno run also tell you how good the fueling (rich/lean etc?)

[yorkie_chris]

Yes if they know what they're doing, an accurate dyno (inertial type) can show you what the mixtures like, drop offs can show lean, where the bhp curve is jagged its rich.
Somebody with decent experience can interpret a lot of info from one printout.

[ThEGr33k]

Has anyone on here used RTT motorcycles at Hoyland common in Barnsley? (just off of J36 if M1)

[j1m1jarv1s3xper1ence]

Back to the tuning thing. I had put my snorkel back in my bike for my final service before my warrently ran out to keep the place happy (just incase it voided the warranty).

Anyhow ive just taken it back out and man it seems to go better! It feeling like the dip in midrange power has inverted itself. I really do need to get it on a dyno and see how it is. Will a normal dyno run also tell you how good the fueling (rich/lean etc?)

Hiya you seem to know alot about tuning and stuff, I have just installed a K&N air filter however I am a littl eworried about the bike running lean, Its a 2003 model, any advice??

[Red Herring]

I've just been on a bit of a weight saving exercise. Removed pillion pegs. Replaced front fairing/headlights with enduro light unit (don't need to ride at dark, and when I do I'll use a bespoke rally set up) replaced rear body work with race unit, replaced footpegs with alloy race items, replaced whole exhaust system, no mirrors/indicators. Currently under 160 kgs. Going to change the entire front end for a GSXR K4 but it hasn't arrived yet so not sure if heavier/lighter. Beauty of all of this is it is all reversible (nothing chopped off....yet) Want to lose the tank which is about another 5kg but the air box is currently being a bitch.