The cost of living

[gettin2dizzy]

Edit - wasn't intended to stay on here for eternity ;)

[600+]

what do you do for a job and what sort of pay bracket are you? also how many years have you been working ie experience?

[gettin2dizzy]

I'm an Engineer on a placement, I've finished my BEng, and have 1 semester left after this. It's frickin fuel, food and tax which nails me!

[600+]

erm then I think you are daydreaming if you expect to be paid proper money while on placement! none of the students I work with on placement get paid proper money so don't moan about it to much. all struggled while being students...if you are good and with a bit of luck on your side when you graduate you will get paid properly

[laMon]

I'm an Engineer on a placement, I've finished my BEng, and have 1 semester left after this. It's frickin fuel, food and tax which nails me!

what "low" pay bracket are you on?:-#, if you are prepared to share:) that info[-(:confused::lol:

[metalmonkey]

Yup its getting more expenisve for sure, I paid £1111 in tax ect last pay check, I was like WTF:smt103

I keep my out goings as low as possiable but when you have to get the tyre plugged on the bike, get your car wrote off it out of your control.

I don't eat take out unless it the very last resort, (or sharing with friends thats the best way!) becasue of the cost. I would to try buy somewhere, but I know for sure when I do I will find it hard. I hoping the property market crashes big time like they are saying, then I might actually be able to get something........

I can see it getting more expenisve and pay no where near matching the increases, I can't wait until my student load is payed in about 3/4 years.

[dissuade]

I know what you mean, I have 3 jobs at the moment, run around non-stop from 7am until i go to bed at around 1am, I've got to do uni coursework and supposedly 25 hours of extra reading per week. There just aren't enough hours in the day.

Constant bike repairs, my house that fell apart, mortgage, loan repayments, bills, etc are crippling me. Whilst living on my own is great, it is phenomenally expensive.

AND the bleedin tax man has just asked me for £350 quid that I supposedly owe them from the last 3 years! I thought I paid enough tax as it it at almost 300 quid a month!! Grrrschbugger.

[gettin2dizzy]

Placement as in I'm a full time employee of Britains largest employer, not on work experience. I'm currently leading a £1million project for them; I've got a degree and don't do any uni work whatsoever.

I've been fine until the past month or so, when you're on my budget you really notice the little increases happening everywhere.

As for students- different lifestyles. You've got all day to not spend money, not have to go anywhere, not have to pay tax, not need to look smart.

[metalmonkey]

I know what you mean, I have 3 jobs at the moment, run around non-stop from 7am until i go to bed at around 1am, I've got to do uni coursework and supposedly 25 hours of extra reading per week. There just aren't enough hours in the day.

Constant bike repairs, my house that fell apart, mortgage, loan repayments, bills, etc are crippling me. Whilst living on my own is great, it is phenomenally expensive.

AND the bleedin tax man has just asked me for £350 quid that I supposedly owe them from the last 3 years! I thought I paid enough tax as it it at almost 300 quid a month!! Grrrschbugger.

I still paying for being a student I wish I had cut back on the loans that I had, though it will gone soon with any luck.

[laMon]

I know what you mean, I have 3 jobs at the moment, run around non-stop from 7am until i go to bed at around 1am, I've got to do uni coursework and supposedly 25 hours of extra reading per week. There just aren't enough hours in the day.

Constant bike repairs, my house that fell apart, mortgage, loan repayments, bills, etc are crippling me. Whilst living on my own is great, it is phenomenally expensive.

AND the bleedin tax man has just asked me for £350 quid that I supposedly owe them from the last 3 years! I thought I paid enough tax as it it at almost 300 quid a month!! Grrrschbugger.

get yourself a One Account, no loan repayments as you put it all in one, and your money (the one you have) is lowering the interest you pay on your mortgage. I would never go back to a normal mortgage:cool:. I know that if I can't afford the grand of bills this month, no one will come knocking asking for money nor will the account get overdrawn.
Rent a room, although it's not ideal it's money coming in.

[arenalife]

This country places a terrible burden on it's working class. I have many friends who do fine, skilled jobs yet have second jobs just to be able to fuel their cars, eat and pay mortgage. That's absolutely terrible. Doing a decent hard days work should be able to get you enough to live but it's just not happening for many people.

[timwilky]

I do sympathise. Welcome to the real world. It is cruel and ends up dog eat dog.

Although I have never and could never support a labour government, I do feel they have let down their own power base. This being the legion of decent hard working people who simply want to make a better life for their old & infirm and a life with better opportunities and prospects for their children.

I don't want to get into politics, it is too late in the evening. However, I will say one thing. This govement has to recognise that there is something wrong where you can pay an individual the national minimum wage and then tax them on their income.

Personal tax rate should/must be increased to remove this ludicrous anomaly.

I am of a slightly fortunate generation. Our governments wanted an educated work force and I got a grant whilst I was being educated. I was also sponsored to do my degree etc. I see my daughter having to take student loans, then professional development loans and no guarantees all that education will evolve into a career path.

[embee]

....just be comforted by the fact that the abolition of the 10% tax band will mean you'll be paying more tax next year on your salary.

I've noticed the cost of food is really taking off this last month or so. Then there's the 4% increase in Council Tax to look forward to, and the 15% increase in gas/elec........................ah but inflation is 1.9% (yeah right!)

[JamesMio]

I know, our food shopping bill (for just me & the missus) has jumped up by about £20 a week in the last few months. We hardly ever buy any booze/sweets/or other 'luxury' items, both work full-time in so called professional jobs and yet due to the massive costs of Council Tax & the appalling rate of F*C$ING FUEL TAX, we're both skint every month!!

My fuel bill (Car Alone) is now up to £60 a week, that's in a Diesel Mondeo - hardly a guzzling super car.

I hate this country sometimes, in fact most of the time in fact, I really do.

[gettin2dizzy]

Well I'll be leaving with close to ?20k in student loans on top of all this; hardly a good way to start your working life.

I was looking at the BBC dividing up what percentages peoples pay goes on.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7213177.stm

My rent + bills is 40%
Food 17%
Transport 27% (car alone)
Phone and Internet 4%

So add in anything like clothes & home items needed, fuel for irregular journeys (my family live 350 miles away, my gf 200), any maintenance costs, any costs to do anything to keep yourself alive (gym for me) or a single drink; and you're screwed.

[anna]

.. and people wonder why we are in so much debt and, people who have to declare themselves bankrupt is on the increase??

[G]

I dont struggle to be fair, not yet anyway. I see all the increase and sometimes wonder how this is not affecting me yet. The only one i really notice is the cost of fuel right now as i do 30k+ a year and only get 10p per mile back from the company :( You do feel like the noose is getting tighter and tigher around your neck though and sooner or later it will get you.

All you hear now days is tax this, tax that but see nothing for it other than rediculous ideas being thrown about by the goverment and £70m being given to Africa, £1.6bn being spent in Iraq/Afganistan etc.

Sooner or later it will catch up with me and probably start hurting though. At the moment my mortgage is on a 5% fixed rate for another 5 years, hopefully a new goverment will be in and things calmed down by the time that ends.

We have another forced 2p on fuel at the end of march, not including any normal rise in the price of the barrel oh yey.

[600+]

All I am on the same situation as you are - not struggling yet but can see how others will! In terms of tax though don't complain too much as there are other countries in Europe that do pay more tax than we do.....in fact Greece :)

[neio79]

well you know the solution dont you people, move out of the UK, go to Poland or some other s**t country, get citezenship there for a while. Then when its right come back, pretend to be an imigrant, the Government will throw money at you, you will get a house and al the benifits you want!!!!

[gettin2dizzy]

All I am on the same situation as you are - not struggling yet but can see how others will! In terms of tax though don't complain too much as there are other countries in Europe that do pay more tax than we do.....in fact Greece :)
you've got to add up all of the tax, not just income tax. There's so many hidden taxes in everything in addition to VAT

[$tevo]

I can't remember when the change was made but the present index used to measure inflation, which is used at wage bargaining time, always seems to be quite a few points behind the older RPI (retail price index). Last week I heard on the radio that the RPI was around 5%.

They're shafting us good style.

[lucky strike]

It makes for some interesting reading some of the comments posted above. Like dizzy, I too have circa 18k's worth of student loans to look forward to. After completeing a B.Eng(Hons) degree, I am currently studying for a doctorate in Engineering (Oh God why?!?!) to hopefully 'better' my chances of a more viable job. But all I see around me in this country is 'tax this, tax that' as has already been mentioned. Once the debts are paid, I can honestly say that I don't see my self living in this country for a minute longer.

It seems a shame to say it, but I've had enough. My father came here 45 years ago to give himself and ultimately me, a better chance in life. He came from a very poor country let's just say! It also seems a tremendous waste on the part of the British taxpayer for 'footing the bill' for my education, but as I say, enough is enough.

I also have personal reasons that I'm not going to go into too much detail at the moment, but let's just say that my religion and race don't exactly put me at the top of the tree! But that could just be my take on it.

And to top it all off, London is now fast becoming the developed worlds number one ****hole to live/work in. It's full of scum and quite possibly the last place on earth you'd want to raise children in. It's amazing how much a city can change in 20 odd years......

[Daimo]

Your saying your skint, but what about all those student loans??

Also, welcome to life :( It sucks. Wait to you buy a house and still have to do all this..... Its only an extra £500-£1200 a month out your pocket......

[Daimo]

hopefully 'better' my chances of a more viable job. But all I see around me in this country is 'tax this, tax that' as has already been mentioned. Once the debts are paid, I can honestly say that I don't see my self living in this country for a minute longer.

And to top it all off, London is now fast becoming the developed worlds number one ****hole to live/work in. It's full of scum and quite possibly the last place on earth you'd want to raise children in. It's amazing how much a city can change in 20 odd years......


Agree totally.

Taxed on your wages.
Taxed on anything you buy
Taxed on your death (of which you've already been taxed on the wages).

Totally agree about London. Not scum i'd say, but people who seem to lack any consideration towards other humans. Its all about me me me me me and not about the overall goal. I even find in "professional" companies how each department bickers and squabbles about xyz, budgets, pay, perks blah blah. Another reason i need to find me a nice smal company outside the city where everyone is committed and has the same goal of making it all work.

[gettin2dizzy]

Your saying your skint, but what about all those student loans??

Also, welcome to life :( It sucks. Wait to you buy a house and still have to do all this..... Its only an extra £500-£1200 a month out your pocket......
I've been dicking around working in various hourly paid jobs and not struggled before. (I'll be 24 when I graduate) It's only since I've been put on a salary and can't up my hours to 70-80/ week to relieve a bit of debt quickly that it's become harder.

If you're in a position to buy a house I have no sympathy, I don't get £1200 a month full stop ;) I'm talking about how the basics are now out of reach. No wonder so many sit on their arses taking benefit.

Wonder where your taxes go?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7214573.stm
makes you sick

[Daimo]

I've been dicking around working in various hourly paid jobs and not struggled before. (I'll be 24 when I graduate) It's only since I've been put on a salary and can't up my hours to 70-80/ week to relieve a bit of debt quickly that it's become harder.

If you're in a position to buy a house I have no sympathy, I don't get £1200 a month full stop ;) I'm talking about how the basics are now out of reach. No wonder so many sit on their arses taking benefit.

Wonder where your taxes go?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7214573.stm
makes you sick

Its what being a student is about. You either start working straight away, have money, but usually wont earn outright as much as if you went to uni but gain experience. (What I done)

Or

Go to uni, live a young life of having nothing and no money at all. But then when you get your results, manage to get a job, then you will be earning loads.

Its the choice you make unfortunatly, but I bet in 5-10 years while im still on roughly the same wage, your earning a lot and living a nice life.

Many of the uni people I knew in your position had to run 2 jobs if they wanted to run their cars etc. Bar work/restaurant work in the evenings type thing.

Owning a house, well i have been working for 8 years FT and have a partner on a similar wage, but what I mean is, although im earning much more, im trying to say it doesn't change. Yeah i earn more, but i have absolutly nothing every month as I have bills and debts I need to pay. The money comes in, it goes out, im no better off other than owning a house.....

Welcome to life :( :lol: It sucks. :smt045

[G]

I've been dicking around working in various hourly paid jobs and not struggled before. (I'll be 24 when I graduate) It's only since I've been put on a salary and can't up my hours to 70-80/ week to relieve a bit of debt quickly that it's become harder.



This is the bad thing about a salary, you often dont get paid over time. I can sometimes end up work 50hours+ a week and get no benefit than if i was to come and go at the right times etc :(

Although in the grand scheme of things i would rather be salaried than on minimum wage.

My girlfriends mum worked two bank holidays last month and did 17 hours over time, as well as taking on extra responsibility at £1 a day. She came out with £1123 after tax which when you look at what she had to do to get it is fairly naff. She has to be handcuffed to killers and paedos who spit and try to **** on her all day.



Overall though, yes it is a very very crap situation to be in. There is always people better than you earning £60-£100k+ a year. The only way to get it is to work damn hard to better yourself and not to sit moaning unfortunately.

Unless of course you sit moaning whilst not working and have 3+ kids.

[gettin2dizzy]

Its what being a student is about. You either start working straight away, have money, but usually wont earn outright as much as if you went to uni but gain experience. (What I done)

Or

Go to uni, live a young life of having nothing and no money at all. But then when you get your results, manage to get a job, then you will be earning loads.

Its the choice you make unfortunatly, but I bet in 5-10 years while im still on roughly the same wage, your earning a lot and living a nice life.

Many of the uni people I knew in your position had to run 2 jobs if they wanted to run their cars etc. Bar work/restaurant work in the evenings type thing.

Owning a house, well i have been working for 8 years FT and have a partner on a similar wage, but what I mean is, although im earning much more, im trying to say it doesn't change. Yeah i earn more, but i have absolutly nothing every month as I have bills and debts I need to pay. The money comes in, it goes out, im no better off other than owning a house.....

Welcome to life :( :lol: It sucks. :smt045
True. I know what you mean, regardless of your wage you'll always be skint.

It just amazes me how high that threshold is nowadays to live on the bare essentials only. Having a car is an essential for me; my works 35 miles away and I'm living in the only place I could afford (not many houseshares in the middle of rural wales!) and there is no public transport whatsoever.

This year I'm not a student, I'm a qualified aerospace engineer I just happen to be going back to do a masters next year; so I'm only on a 12 month contract.
Having two jobs at uni I can understand, or when you're doing bar work but not when you 7-5 every day already...

[dissuade]

Transport 27% (car alone)


yikes! doesn't/can't your company give you some sort of allowance for this?

well you know the solution dont you people, move out of the UK, go to Poland or some other s**t country, get citezenship there for a while. Then when its right come back, pretend to be an imigrant, the Government will throw money at you, you will get a house and al the benifits you want!!!!

thank you for that overtly bigoted viewpoint. I do believe we are discussing how appalling the UK is, describing other hard-working European nations as s**t is not constructive, it is merely insulting a vast number of people who have had to do what it takes and move countries to be able to afford a better life. I happen to class myself as foreign, I do not leech off your glorious government. I think you will find that most of those abusing the system and crippling this country are actually British, born and bred. And FYI, "immigrant" is not synonymous with "scum".

[gettin2dizzy]

yikes! doesn't/can't your company give you some sort of allowance for this?



thank you for that overtly bigoted viewpoint. I do believe we are discussing how appalling the UK is, describing other hard-working European nations as s**t is not constructive, it is merely insulting a vast number of people who have had to do what it takes and move countries to be able to afford a better life. I happen to class myself as foreign, I do not leech off your glorious government. I think you will find that most of those abusing the system and crippling this country are actually British, born and bred. And FYI, "immigrant" is not synonymous with "scum".
:lol:

very well put i thought ;)

Diesel is 112.9/ litre here

[yorkie_chris]

Agree totally.

Taxed on your wages.
Taxed on anything you buy
Taxed on your death (of which you've already been taxed on the wages).

You missed a bit;
Taxed on anything you don't buy

I think you will find that most of those abusing the system and crippling this country are actually British, born and bred. And FYI, "immigrant" is not synonymous with "scum".

Round here most of the dole dossers are White or stanis, every site I've been on that's employed Polish or other Eastern European workers (mainly joiners it seems) I've seen them working bloody hard.

Anyway neio, if you want money throwing at you, there's no point being an "immigrant" you want to claim asylum.

[Xan173]

Personally I think your employer pays you very well to sit on this forum and post all day. If you showed them your post history during working hours they might agree to a rise.... :rolleyes:

Sorry but you get what you settle for.

[Daimo]

Personally I think your employer pays you very well to sit on this forum and post all day. If you showed them your post history during working hours they might agree to a rise.... :rolleyes:

Sorry but you get what you settle for.

I don't think this comment is valid really as you don't know the situations of peoples employment and whats going on with their jobs and how they may have been treated for the contributions they've added.

See that post about managing the Thames Barrier park posted by someone in this forum.......

[ThEGr33k]

It is getting silly! Where is all the tax going!? I really dont know!!!! Its like there is a hole somewhere (labours pockets) getting filled. I hope they get voted out and never voted back in. They are supposed to represent the rights of the working class. New labour... more like new conservative, and you know what they say about copies.

In with the conservative. :D

[Xan173]

I don't think this comment is valid really as you don't know the situations of peoples employment and whats going on with their jobs and how they may have been treated for the contributions they've added.


Hang on a mo. He's told us all those things in earlier posts.

My point is you get what you settle for. Meaning either "if you need more pay go out and get more" OR "if you resent the tax situation then vote accordingly (or emigrate)".

There are probably some things you could do to reduce your outgoings though mate;

For example;

Car Share
Lose the mobile phone completely.
Downgrade your internet subscription.

Also check out http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/

[Ed]

To everyone who asks 'where is the money going' here is at least part of the answer.

I am NOT against helping people less fortunate than ourselves, but I do say that the sums you will see in this link (which is to a United Kingdom government website) are way too large and need to be scaled back. Why are we giving huge sums to Sudan? They hate the British. And why are we giving anything at all to that bunch of gun runners that calls itself 'Democratic [joke] Republic of Congo'? And so it goes on. Plus don't forget £50m to China (unapologised Tiananmen Square human rights abuses that Brown prefers to ignore) too for research into cleaner emissions technology, £825m additional to that quoted on this link to India to train teachers - bit of a joke when the Govt here is closing 22 junior schools in Shropshire alone, I'm sure there are more for the cut wherever you live. Incidentally, India is that rich country that prefers to spend its money on developing nuclear weapons and starting a south Asia space race than rather than feed its own people. Need I go on.

http://www.dfid.gov.uk/aboutdfid/statistics.asp

[husky03]

Sorry but you get what you settle for.

Got to agree with this-its down to the individual-there only one person who can change your life and thats you:smile:

[Razor]

I blame everything on peak Oil...

Or to be more exact I should call it the energy crunch, it's not the only cause really but it's one of those mitigating factors that drive up the price of everything around us.

[gettin2dizzy]

Personally I think your employer pays you very well to sit on this forum and post all day. If you showed them your post history during working hours they might agree to a rise.... :rolleyes:

Sorry but you get what you settle for.

Some weeks I'll post nothing, some days i could have 20 posts; I'd be more than happy for my employer to look at my post history as I arrive earlier than him at 7am every morning and work until my job is finished anytime after 5. A minute or two here or there could be sent cramming myself with crisps, biscuits or cigarettes, but I waste it on here ;)

I do agree that you get what you settle for entirely. Looking in the long term this is a wise career move for myself hence why I'm settling for it. I'm happy to earn a low wage as long as I'm able to sustain a healthy living, but when you can get electrical products for less than a tank of fuel or a basket of shopping it lead me to wonder am I the only one who's really feeling the squeeze with the price hike on the essentials.


To everyone who asks 'where is the money going' here is at least part of the answer.
http://www.dfid.gov.uk/aboutdfid/statistics.asp

Scary link. You can't fix anything by making it dependent.

This makes me sick:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7212990.stm
MP in my girlfriends area. She working 7 days a week because she gets stung by mental council tax in that area. Glad to see it's being spent on some nonce of a son; I think he's as guilty and should be prosecuted.

[laMon]

This makes me sick:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7212990.stm
MP in my girlfriends area. She working 7 days a week because she gets stung by mental council tax in that area. Glad to see it's being spent on some nonce of a son; I think he's as guilty and should be prosecuted.

your GF lives here? that is blooming far from South Wales, is it a telepathic relationship? pmsl :rolleyes:
Mine is the same council:smt076

if you want a good debate, best on the waves, listen to Nick Ferrari on at 7am weekdays http://www.lbc.co.uk/article.asp?id=26153

[tigersaw]

What seems fishy to me is that the governemnt finds it nescessary to tax us to death, cant supply even the most basic services like free dental care, but can suddenly find £50,000,000,000 to bail out a bank!

[gettin2dizzy]

My point is you get what you settle for. Meaning either "if you need more pay go out and get more" OR "if you resent the tax situation then vote accordingly (or emigrate)".

Who can we vote for? It's either the Eton **** who thinks he's 'hip' because he was the president of the Cambridge University Nummamorous Team or the champagne socialist **** who preaches his aim to rid society of greed before being swallowing up ?500k a year in makeup expenses.

Both will preach their religion (with particular emphasis on anything sexual being evil), spend fortunes on reviews, achieve nothing and then be discovered ****ing a scout before blaming 'evil' and expecting forgiveness and a six figure autobiography figure.

In the 80s we showed the government it's our country they're running by refusing to pay poll tax; now they've got the media so hooked up to show us films of elderly women going to jail for not paying council tax it's no wonder everybody has been scared in to a corner they're not willing to fight from.

We've had spy-chips in wheelie bins, fake government reports that took us to war, police covering up manslaughter, troops left disabled without any support, businessmen buying their way in to government power, endless political figure scandals, lies and deceit.

We've got a 1984 CCTV nation; with speed cameras, congestion cameras face scanners; they've even got microphones! And don't forget criminals held illegally, a **** NHS, millions of illegal immigrants, a massive amount of tax on everything, repeatedly again and again. A nation where the criminal rules, debt spirals, and a population living in it oppressed to a state of constant fear; fear of criminals, fear of police, fear of debt, fear of their health.

Every day we lose another freedom and with that freedom goes the recognition of what it's like to be free. Every ban turns us in to a nation of cowards always willing to **** on your neighbour because he's doing something you're not allowed to do but you'd like to. We're all becoming scared which stop us reaching out to help others, closing our doors in order to protect ourselves first.

I'd love to think we're headed the right way but I don't see the people protesting the way we did in the 80s. They've shaped us so perfectly that they now have a licence to do whatever the hell they want with no fear of attack from us.

[gettin2dizzy]

I just get grumpy when I'm hungry ;)


your GF lives here? that is blooming far from South Wales, is it a telepathic relationship? pmsl :rolleyes:
Mine is the same council:smt076

if you want a good debate, best on the waves, listen to Nick Ferrari on at 7am weekdays http://www.lbc.co.uk/article.asp?id=26153


Yeah on station road. It's better than last year, I was living in Manchester!

I've give that link a whirl :smt023

[Rich]

People have plenty of choice nowadays. Your not bound to one thing all your life, years ago you either worked on a farm, down the pits or carried on the work of your father.

I could have chosen to go to uni but i didn't fancy studying for a degree and end up stacking shelfs at Tesco. About 60% of the people i know that have gone through uni have a degree and arent using it. :confused:

So i decided to do and apprenticeship, i was on £65 a week for a few years and the £100 a week for my final year (working hard throughout). Now i'm qualified i have the potential to earn £35,000 a year.

For you Dizzy your still working towards the big pay out, if you get the right job and work hard, it will come, moaning about it on here isn't going to help.

Yeh the cost of living is going up faster than wages i know, perhaps we should work as hard as our great grand fathers ect, mine i know used to struggle to put food on the table. Now we have all these things we have to have, that really we don't.

I think we just take too much for granted these days. Most of the things we pay for are our choice and Tax is there for a reason. It's all good moaning but without it we wouldn't have the tarmac we ride on. :riding:

[gettin2dizzy]

People have plenty of choice nowadays. Your not bound to one thing all your life, years ago you either worked on a farm, down the pits or carried on the work of your father.

I could have chosen to go to uni but i didn't fancy studying for a degree and end up stacking shelfs at Tesco. About 60% of the people i know that have gone through uni have a degree and arent using it. :confused:

So i decided to do and apprenticeship, i was on £65 a week for a few years and the £100 a week for my final year (working hard throughout). Now i'm qualified i have the potential to earn £35,000 a year.

For you Dizzy your still working towards the big pay out, if you get the right job and work hard, it will come, moaning about it on here isn't going to help.

Yeh the cost of living is going up faster than wages i know, perhaps we should work as hard as our great grand fathers ect, mine i know used to struggle to put food on the table. Now we have all these things we have to have, that really we don't.

I think we just take too much for granted these days. Most of the things we pay for are our choice and Tax is there for a reason. It's all good moaning but without it we wouldn't have the tarmac we ride on. :riding:


The tarmac our grandfathers tax put on the road? A road is relayed on average every 74 years. ;)

I made clear earlier up the post I'm not talking about my particular situation, I'm putting up with it for a reason. I was pointing out the fact that so much can be taken away from you before you can provide for yourself.

As for how it used to be doesn't bother me. In the old days their winters were colder, summers hotter, skies bluer, work harder and apples bigger along with creme eggs of course. It's impossible to gauge a perspective, speak to someone in their later years on a level and they think we go through hell.

Comparing us to miners is like comparing ourselves to slaves; it was never a job, it was the birth of our government learning how to exploit us.

Farmers outside of the 'modern' world in Mongolia, South Pacific, Indonesia have a 'hard' life when you're observing them through your TV eating a microwaveable meal. But for these people to outlive us suggests a somewhat different tale; that our life punishes your body, that mental turmoil can kill you. Tax IS there for a reason but when 80% of your wages go back to the government it is YOUR responsibility as an intelligent human to ask the ques.........oh sorry..... there's a article about who Simon Cowells latest fling is I'll just read instead.

Not aimed at you rich :)

[Rich]

The tarmac our grandfathers tax put on the road? A road is relayed on average every 74 years. ;)

It's quiet well looked after this side of the bridge. :tongue:

I made clear earlier up the post I'm not talking about my particular situation, I'm putting up with it for a reason. I was pointing out the fact that so much can be taken away from you before you can provide for yourself.

I know i just aired my thoughts. :rolleyes:

As for how it used to be doesn't bother me. In the old days their winters were colder, summers hotter, skies bluer, work harder and apples bigger along with creme eggs of course. It's impossible to gauge a perspective, speak to someone in their later years on a level and they think we go through hell.

They had hard times for different reasons, it's been down to us for the rise in house prices that caused them to rise for example. If we didn't want them no dought the prices would fall, as is the case for flats at the moment. Greed also springs to mind.

Comparing us to miners is like comparing ourselves to slaves; it was never a job, it was the birth of our government learning how to exploit us.

Miners get paid for work, Slaves Don't. If your thinking along them lines then we are all slaves to the government.

Farmers outside of the 'modern' world in Mongolia, South Pacific, Indonesia have a 'hard' life when you're observing them through your TV eating a microwaveable meal. But for these people to outlive us suggests a somewhat different tale; that our life punishes your body, that mental turmoil can kill you. Tax IS there for a reason but when 80% of your wages go back to the government it is YOUR responsibility as an intelligent human to ask the ques.........oh sorry..... there's a article about who Simon Cowells latest fling is I'll just read instead.

Not aimed at you rich :)

It's all good fun :smt016

[tigersaw]

years ago you either worked on a farm, down the pits or carried on the work of your father.


Or joined the forces, came out with a skill. Not sure thats even an option nowadays.

[Rich]

Or joined the forces, came out with a skill. Not sure thats even an option nowadays.

Good point, yeh still goes on my cousin had the choice to serve his term with the forces and then get trained in an area of his choice. Engineering ect. He was stupid enough to leave early therefore losing his opportunity. :mad:

[metalmonkey]

I think the main issue all us here work dam hard for everything we have, I work bloody hard to enjoy my bike and I'm sure all you guys do as well.

What the issuse is that we all pay a lot of tax and see very little benfit for it, I noitce now that I pay a hell of a lot more for the basic things in life before I get to have fun. When I started driving in 98, petrol cost 56.9/litre what the hell its double now:mad:

Trust me public services are suffering from lack of investment across the board, it affects all of us. I would really like know how our money, your money is being spent becasue sure ain't going on what we need.

The people reposniable for this should be chanllenged and be made totally accountable for the waste and be dealt with, prison if it is found they have acted outside the law.

I don't think it is right that we pay in and see very little return.

What happens when my generation retiries, or will we? There will be no public pension that would have been spent a long time ago. So why am I paying for this when I won't see a penny, this time bomb that is gonna go off. What happens then:confused:

The age paymid in this country is inverted by the time I reach about 40, they will be more people retired than working, with any ever decearsing skill base in the UK this is a huge problem with no anwser present by the clowns that pretend to run the country.

I'm not sure what the answer is, but the clowns in power need to get a grip, when I saw V for Veneatta I though I hope I never live like that, umm we now have shout towers FFS what is going on?

I'm not sure what say, but its not looking great it it?

In the mean time I plan take what ever I can get and have fun:D Thats what I'm here for......

[Rich]

One thing thats does annoy me about fuel tax though is seeing an ever growing profit for the providers. Shell are reported to make £1.5 million an hour. AN HOUR :sick:. But we're still stupid enough to pay it, or have we got to the point where we don't care, or we have no choice. :confused:

[tigersaw]

with any ever decearsing skill base in the UK ......

It OK, McDonalds are coming to the rescue by granting every spotty burger flipper a degree.

[Rich]

It OK, McDonalds are coming to the rescue by granting every spotty burger flipper a degree.

Atleast the McGraduats are working. I work in alot of housing association (council) homes and 50% of them sit on their @rses all day complaining about the work we do or havent done. Yet the house is a **** hole and theres last weeks dishes in the sink, we put dust sheets down to protect ourselves most of the time. (no joke) It annoys me so much, we're all slaving away to keep them in fags and Sky TV. :smt088

I Hope the government go through with this proposed shake up of the benefits system, fair enough for those who don't have the ability to work but for those who do should. Take away benefits means they will have to get jobs, sounds so simply simple. Why does it take them so long to see it.

[Xan173]

Timely article from the BBC.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7213177.stm