View Full Version : Buying booze with kids in tow
Alpinestarhero
16-05-08, 07:39 AM
There was a thing on the BBC breakfast news this morning, about a guy who went into a shop with his 15 year old daughter (i imagine he had picked her up from somewhere, or she just wanted to tag along) and he wanted to buy some beer. He was refused service, because he had his daughter with him; there were concerns he might be buying the booze for his daughter.
But the bloke came across as a nice chap, who just fancied a beer or three after a long day at work. The bloke giving the opposite side of the argument, in favour of refusing people sale of booze with kids in tow, said it could lead to kids becoming binge drinkers etc etc. Me and my brother used to go with my dad to the shops to get milk, bread and then he would get a bottle of wine for mum and some beers for him, nothing wrong, we never got the booze, we have never ended up binge drinking...I dont even drink!!!!
It just got to me, more wrapping people up in cotton wool and people who don't know much about anything "protecting" people who dont need protecting
Matt
thats stupid.......... i would not be happy
Drew Carey
16-05-08, 07:42 AM
It bugged me too......bottom line, we have laws to not sell booze to kids......so if someone is older enough then surely they can't stop it being bought. It also bugs me as I saw a kid of about 12ish being served ciggies in Tesco's with no challenge. Grrrrrrrr. Double standards.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 07:48 AM
Its the shopkeepers right to refuse service to anyone they want.
There are also HEAVY penalties for any shop keeper that sells restricted items to those underage.
If the guy and his daughter had gone outside and he had handed her a couple of cans as she went off to meet her mates, when Mr Plod came along and asked her where she got it, she would probably name the shop.
The shop owner would then have a hell of a time proving that it was her dad, not her that bought the drink.
Yes its all a bit silly, but its also understandable.
Alpinestarhero
16-05-08, 07:49 AM
And whats next? No buying petrol with kids in tow, incase they go joyriding? No buying pharmecutics with kids in tow, incase they get addicted or overdose?
paaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah
this happened to a guy I know. He had bought a few cans to have that night watching the footie. his 15 year old son was with him as they were getting take away on way home and he wanted to see menu before deciding. he was helping his dad pack the bags. they got to drink and put it thru then noticed boy and asked him what age he was. he replied 15 why? the checkout woman then said sorry sir i cant sell you this alcohol in case you give it to him. he complained to manager who said it was due to the high fines they get, if a child is found with alcohol and the receipt is there, they will take action against the checkout person named on receipt. the manager spoke to him and agreed to sell to him.
can understand why cashier was not keen. not worth risking a fine not for £6 an hour. the world has just gone mad. kids who are going to drink dont go to supermarket with their parents normally.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 08:18 AM
Again, its the fact that the law is so general now that its VERY easy to find yourself on the wrong side of the law.
So people have to play it very safe.
We need to have EVERY law passed in the last 10 years reviewed and those found to be too general scrapped.
In this case the emphasis should go onto the Parental responsibility.
Basically if you let your kid go out and drink, you should be responsible, not the shopkeeper for selling it, the parent for having instilled such low standards in their child that they see going getting blitzed down the local park as acceptable.
Nothing against underage drinking if its supervised tho.
That same thing happened to me in my local Tesco when I had My 17 yr old with me.
I just had a nice rant ,demanded to see the manager and then walzed off leaving all my shopping on the conveyerbelt.
"next time I'll leave him outside tied to a post like a dog,shall I"
Stupid,he is old anough to get married,holds down a full time job ,but cant help out with the weekly shop.
I was that peeved off,we went back the next day and filled up with booze glue and aerosols,got to the till and said"uups sorry ,my lad is 17 bye bye".Childish,"yes".Satisifing
gou gotta believe it.
Drew Carey
16-05-08, 08:20 AM
That same thing happened to me in my local Tesco when I had My 17 yr old with me.
I just had a nice rant ,demanded to see the manager and then walzed off leaving all my shopping on the conveyerbelt.
"next time I'll leave him outside tied to a post like a dog,shall I"
Stupid,he is old anough to get married,holds down a full time job ,but cant help out with the weekly shop.
I was that peeved off,we went back the next day and filled up with booze glue and aerosols,got to the till and said"uups sorry ,my lad is 17 bye bye".Childish,"yes".Satisifing
gou gotta believe it.
PMSL
I had a similar situation in Sainsbury's a few months ago. Buying a couple of bottles of wine (with the rest of the shopping), and the checkout woman asked for I.D. Bit taken aback, as I haven't been I.D.'ed for years! Got my driving license out and she said "Not for you, for her" pointing at Samnooshka. Sam didn't have any I.D. on her, so the woman said " Sorry, I can't sell you alcohol, because I think she might be underage" I pointed out that Sam wasn't buying the drinks, I was. And would she do the same if I was with a 5 year old child" She looked a bit embarrassed and scanned the items through.
I haven't checked the laws recently, but I thought there wasn't anything actually illegal about under 18's drinking alcohol at home, under supervision, anyway?
I had a similar situation in Sainsbury's a few months ago. Buying a couple of bottles of wine (with the rest of the shopping), and the checkout woman asked for I.D. Bit taken aback, as I haven't been I.D.'ed for years! Got my driving license out and she said "Not for you, for her" pointing at Samnooshka. Sam didn't have any I.D. on her, so the woman said " Sorry, I can't sell you alcohol, because I think she might be underage" I pointed out that Sam wasn't buying the drinks, I was. And would she do the same if I was with a 5 year old child" She looked a bit embarrassed and scanned the items through.
I haven't checked the laws recently, but I thought there wasn't anything actually illegal about under 18's drinking alcohol at home, under supervision, anyway?
or in a pub with a meal I believe
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 08:25 AM
I had a similar situation in Sainsbury's a few months ago. Buying a couple of bottles of wine (with the rest of the shopping), and the checkout woman asked for I.D. Bit taken aback, as I haven't been I.D.'ed for years! Got my driving license out and she said "Not for you, for her" pointing at Samnooshka. Sam didn't have any I.D. on her, so the woman said " Sorry, I can't sell you alcohol, because I think she might be underage" I pointed out that Sam wasn't buying the drinks, I was. And would she do the same if I was with a 5 year old child" She looked a bit embarrassed and scanned the items through.
I haven't checked the laws recently, but I thought there wasn't anything actually illegal about under 18's drinking alcohol at home, under supervision, anyway?
As stated, Sainsburys has probably been hit with a few big fines and have put a notice out to their staff.
Its the backlash from the binge-drinking teen culture that has been allowed to flourish thanks to the lack of parenting.
As I previously said, they can quite legally ask you for ID, see it, then still refuse you - and they dont have to provide an explaination, its not a right that they must sell you anything from their shop.
missyburd
16-05-08, 09:01 AM
There are also HEAVY penalties for any shop keeper that sells restricted items to those underage.
There are indeed and we always get reminded of them even in a shop like Matalan. DVDs and kitchen knives are the main problem. I once had a little boy come up to the till with a 15 DVD, obviously I had to ask where his parents were, turns out they were nearby and came to see but does that mean I shouldn't have sold it to them? :confused:
Video games too, some have age restrictions and my young brother plays on them once my dad has finished with them, yes it's my dad's responsibility and the lad is 14 now. But it proves the point that stopping someone from buying age-restricted products just because they are known to have children doesn't stop the children from using/even sneaking a drink when they get home. But then that goes without saying.
I'd ID if I wasn't sure but if the parent is there, then I assume all is ok. Alcohol is obviously more of a problem though, so this post probably has no relevance lol.
i get asked for i.d all the time and i am 29 its absolutly rediculous nowadays what us lot have to put up with it made me that angry that i threw my driving licence at the lady behind the counter then went in the next day and said what you not going to ask me for i.d again then
missyburd
16-05-08, 09:23 AM
i get asked for i.d all the time and i am 29 its absolutly rediculous nowadays what us lot have to put up with it made me that angry that i threw my driving licence at the lady behind the counter then went in the next day and said what you not going to ask me for i.d again then
some people would see that as a compliment :p (the being asked for ID that is, not having a licence thrown at them :lol: )
some people would see that as a compliment :p (the being asked for ID that is, not having a licence thrown at them :lol: )
i know but i was stressed that day and i found it insulting usally i would laugh about it
some people would see that as a compliment :p (the being asked for ID that is, not having a licence thrown at them :lol: )
are you going on this ride missyorkie chris.
missyburd
16-05-08, 09:31 AM
are you going on this ride missyorkie chris.
Ill see you in the megathread ;)
Gazza77
16-05-08, 09:35 AM
some people would see that as a compliment :p (the being asked for ID that is, not having a licence thrown at them :lol: )
I was asked for ID about 18 months ago (when I was 29) when in B&Q buying paint stripper. Do many solvent abusers buy there solvents with a paint brush, dressed in paint covered clothes I wonder? I was actually quite rude as I thought that the shop assistant (a middle aged woman) was taking the ****, but then realised she was being serious......:o
Luckypants
16-05-08, 09:39 AM
B&Q employ drones.... she was probably told to ask everyone buying solvents for id, so she does - no room for initiative at B&Q.
My lad got turned down for a job there cos the psychometric test showed he would think for himself, the rejection letter even said he was 'too independant to fit into the B&Q ethos' (or some such ********).
But has has been said previously, would you risk being fined for £6 an hour? I'd be well flattered to asked for id these days.:D
Steve_God
16-05-08, 09:50 AM
or in a pub with a meal I believe
Correct (assuming it's not a one-off exception on the premises license).
And yes, it's VERY daft!
And would she do the same if I was with a 5 year old child" She looked a bit embarrassed and scanned the items through.
I was wondering that.
Say the situation of Housewife/househusband or single parent family with children that are not yet school age, There is never going to be an opportunity for them to buy alcohol without their children present. Or does this just apply to teenagers?
Bet Sammy was chuffed :D & you with your grey hair getting carded :lol:
yorkie_chris
16-05-08, 11:14 AM
As stated, Sainsburys has probably been hit with a few big fines and have put a notice out to their staff.
Its the backlash from the binge-drinking teen culture that has been allowed to flourish thanks to the lack of parenting.
As I previously said, they can quite legally ask you for ID, see it, then still refuse you - and they dont have to provide an explaination, its not a right that they must sell you anything from their shop.
Right that's it,
I'm going to own a shop, and not serve anyone Black, Asian, Irish, anyone wearing a tracksuit, anyone who looks a bit "funny" and DEFINATELY and I mean DEFINATELY no scousers.
I don't have a problem of buying booze with kids in tow (cos I don't have any kids) but I do very occasionally get ID'd. At which point I produce my "The Famouse Five Club" membership card (membership no. 377835 if anyone's interested). Must say that it doesn't go down too well with bouncers tho'.
Samnooshka
16-05-08, 11:38 AM
Bet Sammy was chuffed :D & you with your grey hair getting carded :lol:
No i wasn't!!! LOL they always ask me for ID in there! i felt like throwing the bottles of wine at her!!!
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 11:40 AM
No i wasn't!!! LOL they always ask me for ID in there! i felt like throwing the bottles of wine at her!!!
See - you cant handle your drink - so shouldnt be sold it :P
I don't have a problem of buying booze with kids in tow (cos I don't have any kids) but I do very occasionally get ID'd. At which point I produce my "The Famouse Five Club" membership card (membership no. 377835 if anyone's interested). Must say that it doesn't go down too well with bouncers tho'.
Hah! Excellent work! I'm 24 and wasn't ID'd for a while till I went out in Nottingham t'other week, I took it as a compliment :) Though I had it happen in Waitrose buying wine/brandy from the same checkout girl who thought that the asparagus the women in front was buying was an artichoke. Waitrose! Letting me down :(
Not letting the parent buy when child in tow is a bit over the top i'd agree, will they start using CCTV to track you from your car through the shop and then say "sorry sir I can see a child crouching in your passenger seat, you may give him the beer/knives/peanuts-if-he's-under-36-or-however-old-you-should-be-to-eat-peanuts? Too many stupid laws.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 11:49 AM
Too many stupid laws.
We are now reaping what was sown when it was made dogma that both a man and a woman can work 35 hour weeks and STILL have enough time to bring kids up properly.
Also the fact that kids started having kids - the youngest grandmother in the UK (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/432463.stm) is only 26. Her attitude, "I couldn't believe it when it started happening and I even threatened to smack an ambulance man when he said she had given birth." is the standard - its always someone else's fault. Oh and that was in 1999, the child in question is now 9.
So due to lack of experience and lack of guidance we have a generation of feral children that are more likely to knife each other than look at each other.
So now we have the reaction to the "Country going down the tubes" which has lead to the introduction of more and more laws aimed @ making each of us a criminal, which in turn gives the fear that is needed to control the population.
Basically we are screwed, as I cant see any other long-term solution.
We are now reaping what was sown when it was made dogma that both a man and a woman can work 35 hour weeks and STILL have enough time to bring kids up properly.
Also the fact that kids started having kids - the youngest grandmother in the UK (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/432463.stm) is only 26. Her attitude, "I couldn't believe it when it started happening and I even threatened to smack an ambulance man when he said she had given birth." is the standard - its always someone else's fault. Oh and that was in 1999, the child in question is now 9.
So due to lack of experience and lack of guidance we have a generation of feral children that are more likely to knife each other than look at each other.
So now we have the reaction to the "Country going down the tubes" which has lead to the introduction of more and more laws aimed @ making each of us a criminal, which in turn gives the fear that is needed to control the population.
Basically we are screwed, as I cant see any other long-term solution.
I very much agree, and it's awful to think about it as it seems endemic, you can't look at anyone anymore without getting that threatening stare back. I make eye contact with a driver waiting to pull out, to help ensure he doesn't do it into my car, and I get that "what the **** are you looking at?!" look in return! I get back to the mothers place in brum, park car, go to close gates, kids are walking past, I know if i look at them the car will get something landing on it.
I miss Wales, you could go for a drive in the country and wave at people and they'd wave back! And smile!
Alas, I plan on emigration when i'm filthy rich/even more disillusioned.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 12:00 PM
We are now reaping what was sown when it was made dogma that both a man and a woman can work 35 hour weeks and STILL have enough time to bring kids up properly.
I would like to add something I forgot to add when ranting, erm typing.
I dont care whether its the father OR the mother (or either of the Fathers/Mothers in this 21st Century World we live in) that is there for the kids, but someone should be "at home".
missyburd
16-05-08, 12:16 PM
At which point I produce my "The Famouse Five Club" membership card (membership no. 377835 if anyone's interested).
Ooooo how do I get one of those then?
8-[ :lol:
ArtyLady
16-05-08, 12:18 PM
No i wasn't!!! LOL they always ask me for ID in there! i felt like throwing the bottles of wine at her!!!
I'd be over the moon if I got asked for ID...sadly though it never happens :( ;)
Anyway re: the bloke buying the booze - and all the other stupid nanny state rubbish - the country's gone mad... whatever happened to common sense :rolleyes:
IMO The problem with today's tearaway teenagers is due to the fact that the nanny state has taken away power from parents to properly discipline their kids so that the kids now do what they like knowing their parents have no real authority :rolleyes:
philbut
16-05-08, 12:22 PM
I thought that parents had the right to give their children alcohol in their own home from the age of 5 (within reason obviously). I know I had the odd egg cup full of beer or wine everynow and again at christmas etc. I'm not an alcoholic - hiccup
Right that's it,
I'm going to own a shop, and not serve anyone Black, Asian, Irish, anyone wearing a tracksuit, anyone who looks a bit "funny" and DEFINATELY and I mean DEFINATELY no scousers.
I am not a binge drinking hooligan, and I live in Liverpool!
Four cans of San Miguel please :D
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 12:26 PM
Right that's it,
I'm going to own a shop, and not serve anyone Black, Asian, Irish, anyone wearing a tracksuit, anyone who looks a bit "funny" and DEFINATELY and I mean DEFINATELY no scousers.
Redundancy alert.
By referring to tracksuit wearers or looking a bit funny, you had already covered Scousers in your ban list
yorkie_chris
16-05-08, 12:27 PM
You can't be too sure. I saw one in a suit once.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 12:28 PM
You can't be too sure. I saw one in a suit once.
Yeah, but even scousers know you should be in a suit when you go to court........ enough of their family will have already have been after all
Yeah, but even scousers know you should be in a suit when you go to court........ enough of their family will have already have been after all
Now now...
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 01:02 PM
Now now...
You suggesting I should "Calm down like"
You suggesting I should "Calm down like"
Not at all, although I did set myself up there.
SoulKiss
16-05-08, 01:09 PM
Not at all, although I did set myself up there.
Indeed you did.
Please note that Soulkiss is an equal-oportunities ****-taker - I dont care what age, sex, colour, regionality or nationality you are, you are ALL fair game :)
Parents being allowed to smack/punch their kids in the face, seems everyone is scared to do anything, especially in public for fear someone will report them for beating their children. Was there a BIG problem with everyone and their neighbour beating their children when they decided to bring up this "don't smack 'em" malarky? I don't think so, a few cases, the television and all of a sudden it's top of the pile of stuff that isn't broken but just has to be messed with.
You know when there were wars going on people had more important things to concern them. Not saying we need a war, just stating that as far as I am aware, peace-time tends to give time for nosing into every part of our lives to try and 'fix' them. Bahh.
Slight tangetnt here, but this reminds me of a favorite game of mine from my earler years.
When stocking up for a party, get all your booze, mixers etc. and put a box of nappies in the trolley. When they scan it through, tell them you haven't got enough and look from a bottle to the nappies and back again, then ask to put the nappies back.
The withering scorn of the check out person, and everyone else in the queue is amazing!
Haven't read the whole thread - apologies. In fact, only read the OP. :D
When I was a kid, my mum (in particular) used to buy booze specifically for me (from the age of 14 ish although I'd been drinking various things way before then). This was done under the reasoning that if I'm not specifically excluded from it, I won't be drawn to it more when I can legally.
Also, it's perfectly legal for a child the age of 5 to drink alcohol in their own home, with their parents permission.
I now do exactly the same with my kids. Whenever asked if they want a little (even if it's just a little taste of something they haven't had before), my eldest (boy) will pretty much always decline, my daughter will accept if it's a girly drink (but she doesn't like red wine), and my youngest will attempt to guzzle anything he can lay his hands on.
With our kids, it started at Christmas etc, when everyone else was drinking wine, and my daughter asked if she could try some. Yup no problem, in front of grandparents et al. Then it's just grown from there.
They'll never be given enough to get drunk until they're at least 16 though.
IMO, if I'm refused service in a shop because the kids are with me, I'll shop somewhere else from that point onwards.
Another example of the nanny state we unfortunately live in today.
missyburd
16-05-08, 04:24 PM
my daughter will accept if it's a girly drink (but she doesn't like red wine), and my youngest will attempt to guzzle anything he can lay his hands on.
sensible girl :D
My 14 year old little bro always wants to try stuff at christmas etc. and he'll always want a glass. But then after a sip or two he'll whisper to me "urgh it's horrible" :lol: Bless 'im, must be an acquired taste hehe. He probably gets put off alcohol just by the amount of lager me dad sups :rolleyes:
Saying that, a lots of kids are drinking/smoking younger these days, would that be a result of kids being allowed to drink at home dya think?
Warthog
16-05-08, 04:32 PM
Slight tangetnt here, but this reminds me of a favorite game of mine from my earler years.
When stocking up for a party, get all your booze, mixers etc. and put a box of nappies in the trolley. When they scan it through, tell them you haven't got enough and look from a bottle to the nappies and back again, then ask to put the nappies back.
The withering scorn of the check out person, and everyone else in the queue is amazing!
hahahaha!
Age up to 23 = being IDed is embarrassing.
but
age 24 and above = I distinctly remember actually being chuffed! Now I like being ID 8-)
Saying that, a lots of kids are drinking/smoking younger these days, would that be a result of kids being allowed to drink at home dya think?
In my case, smoking isn't relevant, neither of my parents smoked, and I've never touched any.
As for alcohol, I was allowed to drink from around 6-7 years old. Started off little bits on special occasions, but gradually developed into me giving my mum money, and her buying whatever I'd requested.
So long as I didn't get too drunk, the deal was allowed to continue.
As a result, I could handle my alcohol (a lot better than I can now), but also, alcohol was never the first thing I went for.
I remember going to the local when I was ~18, and quite often, we'd just play pool there all night. Kept us off the streets I suppose. :lol:
There's only been a handful of times that I've been sick due to alcohol, but yea, I used to go out every fri/sat night and drink a couple of pints each night.
These days, I'll only really have lager with a meal in a pub etc, and rarely drink spirits at all. Now & again we'll share a bottle of wine if there's no need for us to get up early in the morning.
I reckon that my attitude to it is solely down to my mum instilling the rule of "Alcohol is OK, but never drink too much of it, or else!"
missyburd
16-05-08, 04:45 PM
I reckon that my attitude to it is solely down to my mum instilling the rule of "Alcohol is OK, but never drink too much of it, or else!"
+1. The problem these days I think is more along the lines of mums and dads hammering it into their kids that alcohol is a bad bad thing and if I ever catch you doing it....!! which of course just makes the kids want to rebel :smt011
My mum just never really mentioned alcohol to me, me dad drank a fair bit but that was all I knew about it, was a bit nieve until I got to secondary school :smt077
seedy100
16-05-08, 04:51 PM
I was always allowed to try/drink any of the booze on offer at home when I was a kid (though to be fair there was not a lot). I was always told I could smoke if I wanted to.
Never smoked, went through the falling down and throwing up stage with alcohol.
Now I reckon I drink about 2 to 3 units a month.
I operated the same system with my kids, now 23 and 21.
Neither smoke, both are still in the falling down and throwing up phase.
Both seem to be coming out of it now.
Did we do it right, or were we just lucky?
Who knows?
Mrs Blue Pete
16-05-08, 05:24 PM
Safeway over Easter, buying food and a coupld of bottles of wine...
Cashier: Hello madam. Are you buying this alcohol for yourself?
Me (36 and looking about 45, but with a smile): Yes I am.
Cashier: Can you confirm that you are over 21?
Me (gobsmacked at being asked such a question, smile now somewhat of a grimace, right eyebrow somewhere near my hairline): Erm...do you really need to ask?
Cashier: It's company policy. I'm not allowed to serve you alcohol unless you confirm that you are over 21.
Me: Ermm...yes. I am over 21.
Cashier: Thank you madam. Would you like a bag for that?
Now you might think that this only happens to those who might be mistaken for being under 21, but my over 60 year old father in law was also asked the same question in the same store. How's that for insulting?
missyburd
16-05-08, 05:26 PM
Now you might think that this only happens to those who might be mistaken for being under 21, but my over 60 year old father in law was also asked the same question in the same store. How's that for insulting?
Maybe they're machines on autopilot haha
blue curvy jester
17-05-08, 07:11 AM
my 60 yr old next door neiboughr was refused in tesco as he didn't have id
ArtyLady
17-05-08, 11:52 AM
my 60 yr old next door neiboughr was refused in tesco as he didn't have id
This is just disturbing! :eek: what the f**k is going on in this society? :confused:
I reckon that my attitude to it is solely down to my mum instilling the rule of "Alcohol is OK, but never drink too much of it, or else!"
Same here. I was always allowed a shandy here or a half there from being very young. When I got to the age where my mates wanted to buy a bottle of cider and drink it on the street corner, I just went home where I could have a beer for free so I didn't get into the street drinking culture. I was going to pubs at 15 but rarely got drunk and never got into any trouble.
I always offer a drink to my kids at party's etc but, to be fair, the say no more often than they say yes. Having said that, my 14 year old daughter did get a little bit drunk at a bbq recently. Not falling down but giggly drunk. I didn't mind as she stopped drinking as soon as she felt 'a bit wierd' and she was with me so I know she was safe.
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