Anyone good with wiring?

[tactcom7]

Hi, recently swapped the standard clocks on my 2001 naked curvy for an Acewell unit. Got most of it wired up, clocks work fine but the bike won't start. There's a black and yellow wire labelled Ignition (Signal) that sit's in the original clock wiring loom that's not connected at the clock end, the other goes to the negative terminal of the front ignition coil. If you brush it against a positive connection briefly it sort of sparks up but not really.

Can't see why such a wire would need to go to the old clocks?

Could do with knowing where it's supposed to go, any help greatly appreciated!!! :)

[kwak zzr]

talk to baph he's a dab hand with the old wires.

[Baph]

The black/yellow wire from the clocks is the negative feed from the front coil, and the ignitor.

This probably explains why the bike isn't firing properly. Unfortunately the clocks are a bit of a mystical beast with regards their internals, but the black/yellow wire should DEFINATELY be connected up, otherwise your front clyinder won't run.

The wire should be connected in harness 2, which IIRC, is down behind the headstock (in front of the air box). From here, it should run to the coil & the ignitor afterwards.

Don't connect it to a positive feed, please, at best you'll run the clyinder backwards. :rolleyes: It's a ground wire.

[zadar]

just isolate wire and you be fine.it is coming from coil and is tachometer wire.
not reason for not running.nothing in clocks to stop bike from running.

[zadar]

but the black/yellow wire should DEFINATELY be connected up, otherwise your front clyinder won't run.


that is not correct.cylinder will still run since wire is connected to coil.
wire originally comes from ECU and splits in 2,one end goes to coil and other to tach.this is where tach reads pulse and shows rpm's.
it does not go to clock and than back to coil.

[Baph]

just isolate wire and you be fine.it is coming from coil and is tachometer wire.
not reason for not running.nothing in clocks to stop bike from running.

Funny, as the OP says the bike isn't running. :rolleyes:

The rear coil negative joins directly to the ignitor. There is a reason that the ground is connected from the clocks to the front coil, then to the ignitor. If there wasn't a reason for it, I'm sure that Suzuki wouldn't of bothered putting it there. As the OP states, it's labelled "signal" and used to detect when the front plug is firing.

On the pointy, without this wire connected at the clocks, you get an FI warning for no spark at the front plug (C32 IIRC). Also (again, pointy specific), if you don't have more than 7.5 volts coming into the clocks, you have no ignition. So the clocks have a pretty major role in the running of the bike IMO.

Regardless of if this is just a sensor wire for the rev counter, I'm guessing the OP wants an operating rev counter... and it's one less thing to look at with regard the bike not running.

[zadar]

reason been it is signal for rpm's.and it is not ground.it is signal coming from pulse generator that tells CDI box where piston is by trigger on flywheel.than CDI sends signal to coil to fire.reason for brief spark.
pointy and curvy S model is different storry.
you can unplug gauges from naked and bike will run.OP has problem somewhere else with wires,not that one.

[zadar]

Regardless of if this is just a sensor wire for the rev counter, I'm guessing the OP wants an operating rev counter
in which case this wire gives pulse.he still needs power and ground for tach to work.
since I deal with US models I looked in wire diagram.both US and UK models have same clocks and wires associated with it.

[zadar]

[quote=Baph;1596688]
The rear coil negative joins directly to the ignitor. There is a reason that the ground is connected from the clocks to the front coil, then to the ignitor. If there wasn't a reason for it, I'm sure that Suzuki wouldn't of bothered putting it there. /quote]
you are correct on rear.wire goes direct to coil and stops there.
now imagine wire going direct to front(as it does)and than you splice same color wire on it and go to clocks.it is just extension that ends on tach.with or without it you will have connection on coil.

[Baph]

now imagine wire going direct to front(as it does)and than you splice same color wire on it and go to clocks.it is just extension that ends on tach.with or without it you will have connection on coil.

No need to imagine, I know what you're saying.

As I previously posted, on a pointy without this wire connected, you get an FI fault for no spark at the front plug (which is somewhere in the region of low 30s, and IIRC, is C32 - maybe C33).

I guess in theory you'd have a bike running on the rear cylinder alone, but mine has always been a beggar to start on the rear alone (tried it a few times due to wet front plug syndrome).

Again, as originally posted, the B/Y wire is a ground wire (even if it only grounds from the coil to the ignitor), and as such, positive current shouldn't be applied to it.

IMO, all wires should be connected before someone starts electrical troubleshooting (finding a dodgy earth is bad enough as it is, for example).

[zadar]

Got most of it wired up, clocks work fine but the bike won't start.
does motor turn over when you push starter button?
if not check clutch switch wire/connector.

[zadar]

As I previously posted, on a pointy without this wire connected, you get an FI fault for no spark at the front plug (which is somewhere in the region of low 30s, and IIRC, is C32 - maybe C33).

on pointy you don't have this wire.it goes from ECU direct to each coil and nowhere else.tachometer is operated directly by ECU.

[Baph]

on pointy you don't have this wire.it goes from ECU direct to each coil and nowhere else.tachometer is operated directly by ECU.
Strange, as my K6 has a Black/Yellow wire from the clocks. I know about the FI error from experience. :)

EDIT: Possibly a US/UK difference. :-?

[zadar]

I think you are confused with wires.yellow/black is fuel on pointy and those codes you listed are fuel related.
I have wire diagrams for all models.

[Baph]

The Yellow/Black doesn't go to the clocks though, least, not that I remember.

As for the error codes, that's recollection from memory, and very possibly wrong. I don't have the documents to hand at the moment (I'm in the office), or I'd look up the code.

I could swear I've seen C32/C33 when my bike had a wet front plug though (and water in the front plug is lack of spark rather than lack of fuel). Again, could be wrong on the code.

Anyhow, getting slightly off topic now. :lol:

[zadar]

yea,it is getting late here(or early),got to go to sleep.
hope OP fixes whatever is.

[tactcom7]

thanks guys, if anyone has a eureka moment and thinks they might know what it is, please ring/text on 07823 776926, i'm getting pretty desperate! :)

Edit; off to the garage now for a fiddle.

Edit; With the bike, may i add..

[skumlerud]

Hi, recently swapped the standard clocks on my 2001 naked curvy for an Acewell unit. Got most of it wired up, clocks work fine but the bike won't start. There's a black and yellow wire labelled Ignition (Signal) that sit's in the original clock wiring loom that's not connected at the clock end, the other goes to the negative terminal of the front ignition coil. If you brush it against a positive connection briefly it sort of sparks up but not really.

This is the coil signal from the front coil. It is used by the tach to determine the engine's RPM. Leaving it disconnected will not cause any problems as long as you insulate it. But doesn't the Acewell gauge have a tach?

Please give us some more details on how you wired the Acewell. Which wires did you cut/disconnect when you installed it? Which wires (all of them, with colour codes) have you connected to the Acewell? Any other wires tham the black/yellow that are now disconnected? What exactly do you mean by "won't start"? Does the engine turn when you attempt to start it?

[riktherider]

ive got the same problem at the mo. the bike turns over but there is no spark. ive fault checked everything and i cant find out whats wrong. had the icu checked, etc. i havnt hd the original clocks on there for a long time, but i was tidying up the wiring on thursday and something drastically went wrong. if i find anything i'll let you know dude.

[tactcom7]

Right well quick update, spoke to someone at Banditmania who told me clock has no bearing on wether it will start or not so i started tracing my wires back.

Before i reveal this next bit may i just point out my mates garage is very dimly lit!
O.k so turns out i had the black/yellow wire connected up to the black/brown (throttle position sensor) at the ignition control unit end, and the black/brown wired up to the black/yellow, which explains no spark etc.

So i swapped them round and eargerly tried to fire it up again. But, no. After taking the back spark plug out there doesn't seem to be a spark at all so i'm thinking i've fried the ignition control unit.

Oh and yes Acewell has tacho just not got round to wiring it up yet...

[riktherider]

i got my icu tested at cresent suzuki earlier today, and they said they have never heard of any of the icu's going wrong on an sv. they tested it as i thought i too had demolished it, but no. tested it and it ws fine. no problems. they said its more likely to be the coils, so im witing to get hold of some. i tested them by how the haynes book states with resistance, and they tested fine, but the other test you need special equipment.
it sounds like youve got exactly the same problems as me. im going to un wind all the wires and make sure none are shorting tomorrow, before getting hold of a coil to test on monday. where abouts are you located tactcom7???

[tactcom7]

Sounds like i might have, just can't understand why the coils would pack up? Suppose bikes been sitting for nearly a year but thats it. Thing is i got it to backfire by shorting out front coil negative wire so must be sparking somehow. I'm in Hook mate near Basingstoke. Oh and it's Si.
:)

[skumlerud]

O.k so turns out i had the black/yellow wire connected up to the black/brown (throttle position sensor) at the ignition control unit end, and the black/brown wired up to the black/yellow, which explains no spark etc.


You *could* have fried the ICU, but I don't think so. Basically you've fed the coil control signal into one side of the TPS voltage divider, which would result in some strange TPS angles but shouldn't fry the ICU. And then you've fed the front coil with constant 12v instead of the pulses which tells it when to discharge. It is possible that this has fried the front coil.

So i swapped them round and eargerly tried to fire it up again. But, no. After taking the back spark plug out there doesn't seem to be a spark at all so i'm thinking i've fried the ignition control unit.

This is a dumb question, but it has to be asked: You did ground the spark plug body while cranking the engine, right?

[skumlerud]

O.k so turns out i had the black/yellow wire connected up to the black/brown (throttle position sensor) at the ignition control unit end, and the black/brown wired up to the black/yellow, which explains no spark etc.

Another question is what you were doing at the ICU end of the harness anyway ;-) The wires to the original gauges should be enough to feed the Acewell gauge. It would be very helpful if you could tell us exactly how you connected the Acewell and which wires you've used/not used/rerouted/whatever. It's likely to be more gremlins in the harness than the one you've found.

[riktherider]

You *could* have fried the ICU, but I don't think so. Basically you've fed the coil control signal into one side of the TPS voltage divider, which would result in some strange TPS angles but shouldn't fry the ICU. And then you've fed the front coil with constant 12v instead of the pulses which tells it when to discharge. It is possible that this has fried the front coil.



This is a dumb question, but it has to be asked: You did ground the spark plug body while cranking the engine, right?

ive got a constant 12 volts going to the coils consantly and drops to 9 volt when attempting to start. i reckon ive blown the coils. it worked fine when testing at basic stage, but then started to wrap all the wires up and fit new switches etc, and sods law it didnt work when i tried firing!

[tactcom7]

Yeah i grounded the plug against the cylinder head, and at various points on the frame to try get a spark.

Also i shortened the ICU harness by just over a foot so that i could put it just above the battery without have loads of wire to coil up.

I'll make a note of which wires i've used next time i'm at the garage mate.

[skumlerud]

ive got a constant 12 volts going to the coils consantly and drops to 9 volt when attempting to start. i reckon ive blown the coils.

The 9 volts you see while cranking the engine might be the average voltage of the pulsed 12v signal you get when the engine is running. It doesn't necessarily mean that the ICU or coil is broken.

[riktherider]

you know of any way of testing the coils to see if they are working without buying specialist equipement?? i brought a new plug just the eliminte those, so im just left with the coils. the only way i know of testing it is by elimination of buying new ones that i know work.

[tactcom7]

I've got 0 volts going to mine i think. :(

[riktherider]

I've got 0 volts going to mine i think. :(

sounds like the wiring then. with a multimeter, put the negative onto the negative of the battery, and with the positive test both terminals. i had 12 in both.

[skumlerud]

you know of any way of testing the coils to see if they are working without buying specialist equipement?? i brought a new plug just the eliminte those, so im just left with the coils.

Instead of measuring the voltage to the coils, try connecting a LED or a small lamp between ground and the coil signal. The lamp should be lit until you start cranking the engine, then it should start to flicker. If it does your ICU is probably OK, and the coil broken.

Btw if you have a working tach that starts at 0 rpm it should indicate the RPM while cranking. If it doesn't, the ICU is probably broken.

[riktherider]

no i only have a speedo. been completely stripped. i'll try that check tomorrow when ive got more time. this should proove its the coils that is fualty, or its a big job going through the wires all again

[skumlerud]

I've got 0 volts going to mine i think. :(

If you got 0v from the white and black/yellow wires from the ICU, the ICU is either broken, it's not powered or there's something wrong with the wiring from the ICU to the coils. Check that it actually got 12v on the igniton fuse, and that the fuse is OK. If it's OK, check the wiring from the ICU to the coils:

Disconnect the harness from the ICU, disconnect the white and black/yellow wires from the coils. Measure the resistance from the coil end of the to the connector to the ICU, it should be zero or close to zero. Measure the resistance from each wire to ground, it should be zero. Measure the resistance between the wires, should also be zero. Any other result means a broken wires or short-circiut.

[skumlerud]

no i only have a speedo. been completely stripped. i'll try that check tomorrow when ive got more time. this should proove its the coils that is fualty, or its a big job going through the wires all again

You said that it ran before you finished the re-wiring. If so, it's almost certain that there is a gremlin in your wiring. It might have killed your coils - if that's the case don't replace them until you've fixed the wiring or you'll kill the new ones as well.

[riktherider]

You said that it ran before you finished the re-wiring. If so, it's almost certain that there is a gremlin in your wiring. It might have killed your coils - if that's the case don't replace them until you've fixed the wiring or you'll kill the new ones as well.

that was my thoughts too. something either sparked or done something bad to the coils. i'm going to re-do all the wiring again and make sure theres no dodgy connections then test, then grap some coils and try it all again! oh the fun of electrics!!!!! grrrrrrrrr

[tactcom7]

If you got 0v from the white and black/yellow wires from the ICU, the ICU is either broken, it's not powered or there's something wrong with the wiring from the ICU to the coils. Check that it actually got 12v on the igniton fuse, and that the fuse is OK. If it's OK, check the wiring from the ICU to the coils:

Disconnect the harness from the ICU, disconnect the white and black/yellow wires from the coils. Measure the resistance from the coil end of the to the connector to the ICU, it should be zero or close to zero. Measure the resistance from each wire to ground, it should be zero. Measure the resistance between the wires, should also be zero. Any other result means a broken wires or short-circiut.

Going to do those checks tomorrow mate, just so i'm clear,with the ignition on but starter switch not pushed in, there should be a constant 12V going to the +'ve connection of each coil?
Much appreciated,
Si

[skumlerud]

Going to do those checks tomorrow mate, just so i'm clear,with the ignition on but starter switch not pushed in, there should be a constant 12V going to the +'ve connection of each coil?

Correct. Black/yellow wire on the front coil, white wire on the rear coil.

[riktherider]

checked the coils with a led. constant on when ignition on, and faint flickering when stater switch is pressed. then i thought i could try it on the ht lead and the ground. still a faint slicker, which to me means the coils are buggered. the coils acting as a transformer increasing the voltage and curtrent to the plugs. is this thinking correct??? so if the flickering is the same going into the coil and out of the coil, surely it means it is buggered. need to find some tomorrow at a breakers to test my theory. took all the wrapping off the wires, and they all seem fine. all going to the right place, continuity is all good. fingers crossed this should be sorted tomorrow!!

[skumlerud]

checked the coils with a led. constant on when ignition on, and faint flickering when stater switch is pressed. then i thought i could try it on the ht lead and the ground. still a faint slicker, which to me means the coils are buggered.

Yes, this sounds like the coils are dead. The signal from the ICU is good, and since you don't have a spark there not much else than the coils left.

need to find some tomorrow at a breakers to test my theory. took all the wrapping off the wires, and they all seem fine. all going to the right place, continuity is all good. fingers crossed this should be sorted tomorrow!!

Well, in a previous post you wrote...

it worked fine when testing at basic stage, but then started to wrap all the wires up and fit new switches etc, and sods law it didnt work when i tried firing!

So either you accidentily shorted something that fried your coils while finishing the wiring (which is possible if you do the wiring without disconnecting the battery), or you introduced an error in the harness between the last working test and the first non-working test. It's a good chance that replacing the coils won't work, even if they indeed are broken. The possible gremlin in your harness could even kill your new coils. Does everything else work?

[riktherider]

yea everything else works fine...well what there is at least. kill switch works, side stand switch works, turns over fine when starter pressed, but just no spark. i've double checked the wiring, and by the looks of things everything is fine. all goes to the right places, all insulated etc. i think it was a sprak when i was soldering some wires together. just hope that the coils arent too much second hand.

[tactcom7]

Well i did the resistance checks and everything was zero or near zero. Did a continuity test between the ICU Plug and the coils and that checks out. Also there is 12V going to each coil (white and black/yellow wires) with the igniton on, which varies from about 7V to 9V with the starter button pressed. There's also 12V going to the fuse and the fuse is good.

Probably me being silly but the white and black/yellow connections on the coils are the negative side according to the diagram, why would they have 12V going to them? Sorry if that is a stupid question.

So, i guess it's the coils unless there is anything else you can think of?

cheers,
Si

[riktherider]

the negative isnt the gound for the coils, its the kinda exit for the power to go to the icu. the ground is the engine foe the spark plug.
im getting my coils checked at the mo, the last thing on the list is the stator assembly (the generator and the pickup) its all one unit and cost an arm and a leg new, and aorund £80 on ebay. im hopefullt getting hold of a peak voltage adaptor today test everything. see whats buggered up.

cheers

[riktherider]

update......its not the coils. had one tested at cresent, and they said that there was a high resistance in the ht socket, so brought a new one and still doesnt work grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. so now the last thing is the pick up coil, which is part of the generator. so i need to test this with an analoge volt meter, which i dont have. so im not saure how im going to test it. anyone got any ideas would be greatly appreciated. i cant see how this could all of a sudden go like that though.

[tactcom7]

Bugger was hoping it would be the coils just ordered 2 from a breakers! :(

[fastdruid]

Have you touched the ign switch?

Druid

[tactcom7]

Funny you should mention that i chopped out the ignition and paired the 6 wires in twos according to the manual,

[fastdruid]

There is your problem.

There is a resistor inbetween two of the wires in the ign switch, without it the ECU will not spark.

DAMHIK but I bought a new ECU because I thought I'd fried it before I found this out...

Druid

[skumlerud]

So, i guess it's the coils unless there is anything else you can think of?

To be honest I think it's more likely a bug in your harness than the coils. Do you have an accurate description of your mods? Schematics? It's hard to debug electrical errors without access to the bike :)

[skumlerud]

There is your problem.

There is a resistor inbetween two of the wires in the ign switch, without it the ECU will not spark.

You are 100% correct, this is the problem :) IIRC it's a 100 Ohm resistor, but I can't recall which wires it is. I think there is an article or thread about this on svrider.com.

[tactcom7]

Amazing! do either of you two know where the resistor goes?

[fastdruid]

To be honest I think it's more likely a bug in your harness than the coils. Do you have an accurate description of your mods? Schematics? It's hard to debug electrical errors without access to the bike :)

Nope, I'm 100% confident it's the missing resistor from the ign switch.

Infact I'll up that to 10000%.

Been there, done that, spent a week every night messing about and even replaced the ECU before I found it out. OTOH it stopped the thieving toe-rags from starting it and getting it more than 50yrds! :D

Druid

[tactcom7]

Can't tell you how pleased i am now you've told me that fasdtdruid. If it works there's a beer in it for you.

[fastdruid]

Amazing! do either of you two know where the resistor goes?

Check the schematic for the wire that goes straight to the ECU and the other wire it connects to when you turn it on, can't recall of the top of my head what colours they are[1].

Druid

[1] It was about 7 years ago I found this out!

[tactcom7]

cool will go try it now and keep you posted!

[zadar]

search post under my name,I posted where resistor goes.it is between orange/red and black/white.
here is pic of race harness,you can see how it goes.
http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r71/twf164/svraceharness.jpg

[riktherider]

ooooooooo only just read all the rest of these posts. have to give this a shot tomorrow. as i too have chopped out my ignition. so its a 100 ohm resistor then....can pick one of those up from maplin, any specific rating?? or will just a standard ceramic resistor do the trick???

[fastdruid]

ooooooooo only just read all the rest of these posts. have to give this a shot tomorrow. as i too have chopped out my ignition. so its a 100 ohm resistor then....can pick one of those up from maplin, any specific rating?? or will just a standard ceramic resistor do the trick???

Can't remember myself the rating and my spare ign is buried at the end of the garage but yes a std ceramic resistor will do it, it's not carrying any power it's purely an anti-theft measure to prevent someone hot-wiring it (and to that end I'm glad to say it works).

Druid

[riktherider]

brilliant cheers mate. shall try this tomorrow. thing is i did try the old loom on the bike with the ignition but still didnt work, mabye had something not connected, but cheers dude, life saver.

[zadar]

100ohm,1/2 watt

[riktherider]

well i decided to rip apart my ignition and retrieve the little resistor to test it tongiht. soldered it inline with the orange and red wire, with the earth attached to the switch. tested it with a multimeter and was reading 96 ohms, perfect. tried starting it, still no spark!!! the last thing to check is still the pulse generator. hopefully its this, otherwise i havnt got a clue.
all that is wired in is what is in that race circuit digram plus all the side stand switches, neutral indicator, and coolant stuff.
power is going to the ignition coils when ignition is on, when starter is pressed drops down to 10 volts.

all connections are fine. grrrrrrrrr this is really starting to annoy me now!!!

[zadar]

do you have all wires removed or just disconnected?
is battery fully charged?

[zadar]

soldered it inline with the orange and red wire, with the earth attached to the switch.
what you mean inline?if you just solder it inline on orange/red it will not work.it has to be as shown in pic.

[skumlerud]

ooooooooo only just read all the rest of these posts. have to give this a shot tomorrow. as i too have chopped out my ignition.

If you'd told us this earlier it would have saved you a lot of trouble ;)

so its a 100 ohm resistor then....can pick one of those up from maplin, any specific rating?? or will just a standard ceramic resistor do the trick???

Any standard resistor will do. I'm not 100% sure on the value, so check this first. Use a multimeter and measure the resistance between the relevant wires on the ignition barrel.

[riktherider]

resistor soldered inline with the orange/red and the black and white earth. as shown in the diagram.
im going to go voer the wiring again but i went through it thouroughly yesturday and re did it all.

[riktherider]

its fixed!!! was a break in the wire between the pulse generator wire and the connector! little bugger! all being wired up and new headlights fitted. i can now enjoy the brand new tyres ive had fitted the other day!!!

cheers for the help guys. muchos appreciated!

[tactcom7]

Well i put the resistor in (temporarily) as shown in pics and diagram but still no spark from brand new spark plug. If the new coils coming tomorrow don't work i'm stumped :confused:

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/DSC00713.jpg

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/resistor.jpg

[fastdruid]

Thats wrong, should be between orange/red and black/white.

See the middle 'connected when on' in the ign switch inbetween the orange/red and the black/white? That's the resistor.

Druid

[zadar]

resistor is connected right.
picture he made on diagram is wrong wire :)

[fastdruid]

That's still why it wouldn't spark before, if it still wont spark then either it's connected wrong (make 100% sure by testing connectivity from the ign switch plug connector back to that wire) or some other issue as well.

Er what did you do with that wire you asked about first to the tacho? That's not earthed is it?

Druid

[riktherider]

get the multi meter from the earth black wire, to the orange and red at the icu connector. should read somewhere around 96 ohms. if not its wired wrong.
if you have an analogue multimeter, read the voltage coming from the pulse generator coil, the green and white/blue wires. a digital wont work because it pulses too fast for the unit to read it. also check the continiuity from the back of the connector of the green and white/blue from the generator cover up to the icu.
ive noticed youve used halfords butt connectors.....in my experiance i didnt like them. not hugely relible. since using them, i solder all my connections. a lot better connection.

other than whats ben stated allready, just get some parts tested at your local suzuki dealer.

[tactcom7]

Right, well fitted the coils today, still no spark. Took off all the halfords butt connectors and soldered the connections permenantly. Did the resistance check from orange/red at ICU connector end and white/black wire, read 99 ohms. Continuity checks were all o.k including from pulse generator coil but couldn't test voltage due to my digital multimeter.

Strange thing happened though, had my ICU plugged in flapping around and on the back of it, there's 2 metal plates embedded in the plastic stuff, and when the furthest of these 2 plates (from the plug end) grounded against the footpeg, lo and behold my spark plug sprang into life???

Any ideas?

P.s all the help so far is greatly appreciated :)

Edit; no, tacho wire has been taped up for now

[carsounds_dan]

maybe the earth to the ICU isn't good. 90% of electrical problems i find in cars is due to dodgy earth

[riktherider]

i am right in thinking its a curvy as you profile picture shows??? because my icu doesnt have any metal plates coming out of it that i think of. definatly check the earth, and check it to the point where it grounds to the engine, not the battery. just a simple continuity test should do. if you could post a pic of the icu that would help. have you had that tested yet??

[tactcom7]

Yes it's a curvy, will try get a pic of ICU tomorrow. Also I'll check the earth and let you know how i get on. Not had ICU tested yet, figured seen as i was getting 12V at coil terminals then it's working fine. Probably naive of me! Might just bite the bullet and get a new one :(

[fastdruid]

<snip>

Strange thing happened though, had my ICU plugged in flapping around and on the back of it, there's 2 metal plates embedded in the plastic stuff, and when the furthest of these 2 plates (from the plug end) grounded against the footpeg, lo and behold my spark plug sprang into life???


That's really not good, those 'plates' are where the resin hasn't fully covered the internals of the ECU, probably one or other of the heatsinks. Hopefully shorting it to earth hasn't damaged it!

Find someone nearby with a curvy and try your ecu out on their bike, easy enough to test (pita to get out but easy to test).

Druid

[riktherider]

+1. dont go buying a new icu and find out you dont need one. get it tested or test it with someone elses curvy. like druid said, im not sure those metal plates are meant to be there. the icu might still be sending some info to the coils, but other ionformation may not be getting through.
take it to a dealer and see what they say. instant result that way, and you know its going to be the right result.

[tactcom7]

K so here are the pics of the back of the ICU, the plate circled is the one that was grounding against the footpeg and making the spark plug spark constantly.

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/ICU.jpg

I have no idea what the white connector with the black thing stuck in it is, here's another pic of it for identification,

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/unknown.jpg

Tokk my META 357 (?) immobiliser off myself and was wondering if i'd missed a bit and it was anything to do with that??

Also here is a pic of the bike in it's sorry state :(

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/DSC00724.jpg

Something interesting happened last night, thought i'd have a last ditch attempt to get her started, pushed the starter button and as the engine cranked over i was treated to a nice display of sparks from both battery terminals. No idea if this is related to anything, just thought i'd let you know.

As always, all suggestions are gratefully received, believe me!
Thanks everyone.

[riktherider]

the white connector with the black thingy is a starter relay. leave that in. and those two metal things from the icu shouldnt be there. take it to your dealer and get them to sort it out. nice front end too, got some forks that need picking up monday to go on mine. its a job which has been held off for too long!

[yorkie_chris]

B0llocks taking it to a dealer you poofter :-P They'll say you need a new loom.

Right then, go through the ICU connector and check every wire is going where it should.

Run a couple of wires from ICU earth to frame, battery, coils, engine. Make a "web" of solid earths.

Sparks at the battery isn't supposed to happen, clean the terminals and tighten them.

Check you have power to coils and to ICU.

The white connector with the black thing is a diode, it's to stop back emf when you let go of the starter button arcing and shortening the service life of the starter relay.

[fastdruid]

the white connector with the black thingy is a starter relay. leave that in.
No it's not, it's a diode, not having the manual to hand I can't remember what that one is for but still leave it.

and those two metal things from the icu shouldnt be there. take it to your dealer and get them to sort it out.

WRONG! They are just where the ECU wasn't fully filled with resin (you can see it's only half full) and the heatsinks are poking through. Not a problem as long as you don't earth it against something!

Druid

[fastdruid]

Tokk my META 357 (?) immobiliser off myself and was wondering if i'd missed a bit and it was anything to do with that??


Well it's not likely to help.


Also here is a pic of the bike in it's sorry state :(

http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd319/tactcom7/DSC00724.jpg

Something interesting happened last night, thought i'd have a last ditch attempt to get her started, pushed the starter button and as the engine cranked over i was treated to a nice display of sparks from both battery terminals. No idea if this is related to anything, just thought i'd let you know.

As always, all suggestions are gratefully received, believe me!
Thanks everyone.

Make sure your connectors are properly connected, there should be no sparks!

Oh and get rid of the old design R&G crash bungs, they're useless at anything over walking pace.

Druid

[riktherider]

WRONG! They are just where the ECU wasn't fully filled with resin (you can see it's only half full) and the heatsinks are poking through. Not a problem as long as you don't earth it against something!

Druid

well then it still shouldnt bee there!! it should be fully covered as it is causing a big problem. the only way to properly test the icu is to take it to a dealer. cresents were really helpfull with solving my problem, they went through likely faults which happen with the sv, and any other places which should need testing. they tested the icu and coils for free too which was really nice of them. as most places woud have charged me for this!!!

[fastdruid]

well then it still shouldnt bee there!! it should be fully covered as it is causing a big problem.

It's not a problem in normal use! It sits on a plastic 'shelf' and the actual electrics are covered (and so water/vibration proof). Suzuki shouldn't have to design for someone bouncing the ECU off the footpeg!!

Cover it with some tape while you've got it bouncing around.

the only way to properly test the icu is to take it to a dealer.

Nah, just find another curvy and try it out, far easier than a dealer and cheaper too (unless you have a good relationship with the dealer and they'll do it as a favour). In the past I've heard of dealers just trying it out on a bike anyway, not quite so easy when your bike isn't current!

Druid

[yorkie_chris]

If it's actually earthed, which wouldn't suprise me, on many ICs the casing is earth or at least works as one, then it working when the heatsink is earthed tells me that you have a bad earth to the ICU.

Have you tried the stuff I suggested earlier?

[skumlerud]

If it's actually earthed, which wouldn't suprise me, on many ICs the casing is earth or at least works as one, then it working when the heatsink is earthed tells me that you have a bad earth to the ICU.

These are most likely the heat sinks for a couple of MOSFETs, and the heat sink is not connected to any of it's pins. It's grounded because soldering the heat sink to the ground rail on the PCB is an easy way to mount it. It's easy to check this. Just measure the resistance from the exposed heat sink to the ground pin on the ICU plug. It should be zero. Grounding it should not have caused any harm, but as you said - the earth connection to the ICU is most likely bad.

[carsounds_dan]

well could be your imobaliser wires... they often take a cut on the supply to the coils or cut a sensor from the ecu. check your connections that you have remade.. if it has two or more cuts check that you arent sending the wrong signals down the wrong wires.

[tactcom7]

Thanks for all the suggestions, back home up norf now will try the earthing and resistance checks when i getback down on tuesday, got a second hand ICU coming in anyway (i know you all said not to but i'd already ordered it) so that's one less thing to worry about. Hopefully it is just the earth like you all said. Starting to get a bit fed up of it if i'm being honest!

[tactcom7]

Quick update;

Installed the second hand ICU and the bike sparked and started up fine so it looks like i'd fried it, Just wanted to say thanks to all those who offered help and advice and everyone else for looking. Much appreciated!
Cheers
Si