View Full Version : The cost of tax winds me up.
thornton_chris
18-09-08, 01:44 PM
OK,
I've just found out that 12months tax on a Smart car is only £35! For my SV650 it has just cost me 36quid for only 6 months.
I take up less of the road, probably use less fuel, only have 2 tyres compared to 4 and take up much less car parking space.
Does anyone know what the emissions on an SV650 are? The government works out car tax based on CO2 emissions (g/km). If I can prove that the emissions on a bike are less than a Smart car then I feel a letter my MP coming on!
Cheers,
Chris
I think you will find they probably arnt to be honest.
I found it amusing that my tax on the 600rr is less than the sv650 even though it uses twice as much fuel, gets through twice as many tyres etc....
Tax is a funny thing.
I think you will find they probably arnt to be honest.
I found it amusing that my tax on the 600rr is less than the sv650 even though it uses twice as much fuel, gets through twice as many tyres etc....
Tax is a funny thing.
+1
My SV gets 45 mpg I'm sure a Smart gets more. My SV came with a catalyst, but i doubt it is as clean as a car's.
Yeah that 600 limit does irk me with the SV. But all in all, we don't do to badly with road tax. At least it's not £400 :smt103
And another thing, this argument that bikes take up less road & don't cause congestion is bogus. When they crash - and the do crash relatively more - they usually cause even more congestion than a car crash.
:rant:
Mr Speirs
18-09-08, 03:27 PM
+1
At least it's not £400 :smt103
Like my car will be in 2009!!!
In 2010....£945
Anyone wanna buy a car?
captainsmelly
18-09-08, 04:24 PM
Like my car will be in 2009!!!
In 2010....£945
Anyone wanna buy a car?
ouch! what are you driving?
Jackie_Black
18-09-08, 07:37 PM
Yeah don't get them to look too closely at how much crap our bikes put out the back or we'll all be paying £500 each!
Anyway I can tax my 650 for a year for less than one tank of petrol in me car. So I don't think its that bad.
Dave20046
18-09-08, 08:25 PM
How much do SV's cost to tax these days?!!!!!
I thought it was £49 a year.
Balls
£101 for 6months on a Rover 216...jokes!
The biggest joke is the tax-exempt band A vehicles, like a SEAT Ibiza Ecomotive, as if making a small amount of pollution whilst on the road somehow makes them ghost like, not adding to traffic numbers or taking up road space, or using the road infrastructure in any way at all. Surely there should be a minimum cost for a car sized car, and then emissions dictates how much on top of that you pay.
My festia car tax is £35 for the year too !!
Ch00
Mr Speirs
18-09-08, 09:25 PM
ouch! what are you driving?
Im driving a beast of a...........2.0l Lexus is200
Ive have actually just checked and my figures were incorrect. It will be £300 in 2009 and £430 in 2010. That last time I checked was when the budget was issued and the £400 and £900 figures were being quoted. Can only assume they have back tracked.
Still £430 a year is still a Joke.
TightRS
18-09-08, 11:11 PM
How much do SV's cost to tax these days?!!!!!
I thought it was £49 a year.
Balls
Bah, just got my renewal in the post. It's £66 (or £36 for 6 months), seems to go up £2 each time so far. I wish they'd change the 'over 600' category to 650+.
The biggest joke is the tax-exempt band A vehicles, like a SEAT Ibiza Ecomotive, as if making a small amount of pollution whilst on the road somehow makes them ghost like, not adding to traffic numbers or taking up road space, or using the road infrastructure in any way at all. Surely there should be a minimum cost for a car sized car, and then emissions dictates how much on top of that you pay.
that would never work!
think about it...
that would be far too logical...
injury_ian
18-09-08, 11:40 PM
Im driving a beast of a...........2.0l Lexus is200
Ive have actually just checked and my figures were incorrect. It will be £300 in 2009 and £430 in 2010. That last time I checked was when the budget was issued and the £400 and £900 figures were being quoted. Can only assume they have back tracked.
Still £430 a year is still a Joke.
the £900 is the price of a new cars 1st tax. to put off (even more) you buying the guzzler.
I'm in the same boat with my Rx8- Im doubly annoyed as I bought a pre 55 plate so as to miss the Band G, 3 months later they scrapped it all and I may as well have got a newer one!
northwind
19-09-08, 12:18 AM
Yeah don't get them to look too closely at how much crap our bikes put out the back or we'll all be paying £500 each!
Yup. I cringe every time someone plays the "environmentally friendly" card for bikes, because our economy level is really disasterous for what we have. 40mpg out of a small engine that only has to propel 250 kilos... Sure, we have the big advantages of constant progress etc, but the fact is, bikes aren't as clean as they could and should be, and it's stupid to trumpet what we have now and draw attention to it.
yorkie_chris
19-09-08, 08:36 AM
I think it was Bike who tried it. Adding a full race system and a properly set up PC3 gave about 5mpg extra in similar conditions.
Manufacturers dump fuel in to quieten exhaust note, then make up for it with heavy and expensive catalysers.
what fux*s me off about the ROAD tax is that yes fair enough tax less for less poluting, but the car still wears out and dammages the road netwoks more than a bike. So as road tax should be used for road upkeep and repair, they should always pay more than a bike IMO.
This tax by emision is bolox
what fux*s me off about the ROAD tax is that yes fair enough tax less for less poluting, but the car still wears out and dammages the road netwoks more than a bike. So as road tax should be used for road upkeep and repair, they should always pay more than a bike IMO.
This tax by emision is bolox
i can see why they do it though, they just want to encourage people to use clean cars...
thing is they should be just as interested in getting people on 2 wheels cos then the roads would clear up and people would get around so much quicker...
northwind
19-09-08, 04:21 PM
Manufacturers dump fuel in to quieten exhaust note, then make up for it with heavy and expensive catalysers.
Yup, and catalysts on bikes are madness anyway- bikes have a short, low-mileage lifespan typically, so you're reducing pollution in usage by only a small amount at the consumption end... But making a catalytic convertor tends to be a fairly high pollution activity, and consumes lots of valuable materials, and complicates the manufacturing process, so generally increases the production side pollution.
Then of course, loads of people decat the bike anyway!
I'm all for emissions controls, but what we have doesn't really work.
johnnyuk
20-09-08, 11:15 AM
aye and once every body is driving around in noddy cars..
gov right got that done tax height time. they won't let us get away free believe me...
all this global warming stuff is a load of crap.
do you really think China,India and the rest of 3rd world country gives a **** about all this fuss.
it just another excuse to get more money out of you.
we're being ripped off.
eg France put a cap on at 2%on fuel increase,Germany the same at 5% cap.
so where are these energy power company's going to get their money from -US thats you 'n' me.the list goes on.
what is this govenment doing same as always f***all
Ceri JC
15-10-08, 09:13 AM
Yup, and catalysts on bikes are madness anyway
+1
I don't think the government's current tack on green issues is solely based on the fashion for eco-waffle amongst the chattering classes; I really think the move to charges based on emissions (road tax, congestion charge's rebadging, etc.), rather than congestion/damage to roads as was the tradition, is to disassociate the revenue collected from motorists from money which should be spent on improving the road networks. Suddenly, when you explain all the tax motorists (already) pay for motoring as offsetting the environmental damage they do, it seems a lot more reasonable to charge them again for road networks ' development/repair. Hence new roads being toll roads, road use charging schemes, it being impossible to park anywhere other than outside your house for free in built up areas (eg council-owned car parking bays), etc.
I reckon the way motoring tax breaks down should be as follows:
70% goes to road networks and provision of free parking
20% goes into the general tax kitty
10% on directly offsetting environmental damage caused by motoring
I know the real figures are very very far from that situation indeed...
People will argue that if they drop the money going to the tax kitty here, it'll go up elsewhere. Fair enough, I say. The reason I don't really agree with any more than 20% of the revenue from motoring going into the general tax pot is that it results in people in the provinces without a useable public transport system, propping up a lot of people in London (one of the few areas you don't need a car/bike to commute a reasonable distance) who typically earn significantly more, but through not needing a car, end up paying equal or less net tax.
Fuel tax generally strikes a nice balance between the size of the vehicle (and hence damage to roads/congestion caused) and the amount paid, but falls down when it comes to bikes in this respect because of how fuel-inefficient bikes are given their size. To this end, as much as I think a single point of 'motoring' tax (levied on fuel) would make sense for the majority, for bikes it'd be a bit unfair. It'd be unwieldy and expensive to offer rebate/deductions to bikes, so I'd propose road tax being based on a cross between size, likelihood of causing congestion* and emissions and the rest done at a constant rate through fuel. To this end, I think the current balance is about right, albeit more through luck than judgement. I would also make the caveat that far more new roads need to be built (and existing ones improved) and that given the huge amount the motorist props up the economy, it is untenable that we should be charged additionally for the use/construction of these, a la the M6 toll.
Don't even get me started on the stupid, short-termist, penny-pinching idiocy of not building roads to save on tax now (if you built them, the country would be vastly more productive and ultimately pay more tax in the long run). :rolleyes:
*something small, gutless and ecofriendly can cause far more congestion that a large gas guzzling car like an M5.
My car tax is free. Just thought you would like to know.
My car tax is free. Just thought you would like to know.
Motorbility? :D
My car tax is free. Just thought you would like to know.
Thought you had a Volvo :???:
My car tax is free. Just thought you would like to know.
Ours too... :D
timwilky
15-10-08, 10:59 AM
mates Austin Healy 3000 costs zilch to tax, and pours pollution out the back end. Still it is more environmentally friendly than another mates zero tax 1971 dodge charger with its 440 in³ V8 engine. daughters car is free to tax as well. Wife uses it and get disability exception
Flamin_Squirrel
15-10-08, 11:15 AM
Don't even get me started on the stupid, short-termist, penny-pinching idiocy of not building roads to save on tax now (if you built them, the country would be vastly more productive and ultimately pay more tax in the long run). :rolleyes:
But that might benefit a future administraton, and we can't have that.
muffles
15-10-08, 11:18 AM
VED = emissions tax, really. They should separate that out and have a separate tax for emissions if that's what it's really for, with the VED being for road infrastructure.
However it's been mentioned that maybe it's for sneaky purposes and that's why it is what it is... :-k
What should wind you up is that it costs the same to tax an SV650 as it does to tax a GSX-R1000 ;)
Ours too... :D
I dont pay any car tax either....
But then again I dont have a car! :D
What should wind you up is that it costs the same to tax an SV650 as it does to tax a GSX-R1000 ;)
And more to tax a SV650 than a CBR600RR, GSXR600, R6 or ZX6R :D
Motorbility? :D
Indeed :cool:
Thought you had a Volvo :???:
I do, a gas guzzling one. But without having to pay road tax, I don't care.
Ours too... :D
Good innit. :lol:
muffles
15-10-08, 12:37 PM
And more to tax a SV650 than a CBR600RR, GSXR600, R6 or ZX6R :D
Same as the GSX-R750, though :(
vardypeeps
15-10-08, 01:09 PM
And they say tax doesn't have to be taxing in that advert LMAO
Good innit. :lol:
Oh yes... Just got to figure out how to get the bikes done the same way... :D
VED = emissions tax,
The E is excise not emissions (vehicle excise duty)
Nicky S
15-10-08, 01:48 PM
h8 tax
It's all b******s really, the manufacturers emissions figures are not real world and some cars that are cheap to tax are actually more dirty than some cars in the tax bracket above, and it all depends on driving style, for instance (and I know this isn't emissions it's consumption) did anyone see topgear earlier this year when they followed a prius with an m3 and the m3 returned better mpg.
edit; I'd rather spend an extra 37 quid a year and ride my bike than look like a bell end in a smart car.
Road tax should be included in the petrol. Been saying it for years. The more you use your car/bike/lorry etc, the more you pay.
Again, far too logical.
As for the M3/Prius on TG, ok, yes its probably true that if you cruise around on tickover in an M3 it will use less petrol than the Prius being threahsed. However, if the M3 was pootling round town, it would use more fuel than than the 'electric' Prius. So in the right situation, the Prius would be soooo much better.
muffles
15-10-08, 03:05 PM
The E is excise not emissions (vehicle excise duty)
Yeah I know ;) I was indicating what they (govt) are using it as!
Ceri JC
15-10-08, 03:47 PM
So in the right situation, the Prius would be soooo much better.
I can't think of many situations where a Prius would be "better" than an M5. ;)
kwak zzr
15-10-08, 04:03 PM
i was pleasantly surprised when my gixer was less tax than a SV, as for my cage i'm trying not to look :( i feel this is going to hurt.
Flamin_Squirrel
15-10-08, 05:47 PM
Road tax should be included in the petrol. Been saying it for years. The more you use your car/bike/lorry etc, the more you pay.
Again, far too logical.
Vast numbers of idiots are now employed as part of a huge government bureaucracy to administer all these unnecessarily complicated taxes though, so we couldn't possibly change things now.
Dave20046
16-10-08, 07:28 PM
My bike is going to be off the road for atleast a month. Is it worth it (and straight forward) to sorn the bike, get a refund then retax in a couple of months?
Hell yes. Why gift the them your money. Regardless of how little it is, better in your pocket than theirs.
Dave20046
16-10-08, 07:59 PM
Hell yes. Why gift the them your money. Regardless of how little it is, better in your pocket than theirs.
Do you know if you can sorn it (and get the refund online, or does it have to be at the postcode. Is there any loss or charge?
Do you know if you can sorn it (and get the refund online, or does it have to be at the postcode. Is there any loss or charge?
No idea on that one. I think you have to surrender your tax disc to get your refund.
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