Hagon progressive springs

[Blue_SV650S]

Useless website - amazingly helpful guy on the end of the phone!!! 8)

The story:-

Been thinking of getting some progressive springs, Hagon seem really competitively priced (£55). But I couldn't find the spring rate/s anywhere - website was no help.

I was a little concerned that in the pic the springs looked dual-rate i.e. had a bit that was one rate and a bit that was another, NOT true progressive across the spring. My concern was that you would effectively go from rate x straight to rate y and if those rates were a fair ways apart, it'd be quite horrid. I also didn't know if the springs would be too soft or too weak for my weight.

So decided to pick up the phone ...

Really really helpful/knowledgeable guy on the other end.

It is dual rate and starts at 6.5 and ends at 9 (N/MM - so 65&90). He quashed my fears by saying although it was technically a dual rate spring, under testing the way the spring compresses actually gives a really nice progressive curve.

So I have now ordered up some progressive springs for Hagon :)

[Dangerous Dave]

He quashed my fears by saying although it was technically a duel rate spring, under testing the way the spring compresses actually gives a really nice progressive curve.
Thats why they are called progressive, its the action not the rate.

[Blue_SV650S]

Thats why they are called progressive, its the action not the rate.

:rolleyes:

But they are not progressive ... it's more by luck than design!! ... other springs on the market are actually rising rate ... you can see it in the windings ...

I see this like getting emulators as opposed to true cartridge forks ... emulators don't make the forks as good a cartridge forks (how can they?? - they are a bodge) but the results are pleasing enough for it to not really matter ...

The important thing is that although they appear to be made that way, in practice the springs don't simply 'switch' from one rate to another. 8)

[Dangerous Dave]

The important thing is that although they appear to be made that way, in practice the springs don't simply 'switch' from one rate to another. 8)
Correct, they do not perform any differently to rising rate either.

[Blue_SV650S]

Correct, they do not perform any differently to rising rate either.


That is not exactly true now is it ;)

Anyway, I should hopefully get them in a few days and can see for myself :)

I figured as the damping is so primitive anyway, why spend twice as much on the more expensive springs ...

[mattc]

I put Hagon springs in my curvy and a ZX636C1H shock in the back.

It has made a huge difference, you can push harder without it tying it's self up.

That said I think the SV's (curvy) chassis is so good (well balanced) that a proper front end, combined with a rear shock developed for the SV (opposed to my Bodge), would be another massive improvement.

[rossinio]

I was looking at these, are they better than the hyperpro kit springs that come with 15W? The hyperpro has bumped in price recently from 85 to 110 or something but apparently it makes a HUGE difference..

[Blue_SV650S]

I was looking at these, are they better than the hyperpro kit springs that come with 15W? The hyperpro has bumped in price recently from 85 to 110 or something but apparently it makes a HUGE difference..

I highly doubt it, the Hyperpro are proper progressive springs, the Hagon are dual rate - so the Hyperpro are likely to be 'better' i.e. give more true progressive feel.

here is a closeup of a Hyperpro (http://www.motorcycle-road-and-race.co.uk/catalog/images/Hyperpro%20progressive%20fork%20springs.jpg) - note the distance between coils (and thickness) vary ... here are some Hagon (http://shop.wemoto.com/pictures/springs/hagonsprings.jpg) ... note simply 2 rates ...


Do I think Hyperpro are worth twice the money??? - I doubt that too, hence going for the Hagon myself ;)

[rossinio]

I found the hyperpro kit for ~£97 from http://www.twinshack.co.uk/prods/290.html. Do you know where i can get hagons + 15w oil for half that?

[Blue_SV650S]

I found the hyperpro kit for ~£97 from http://www.twinshack.co.uk/prods/290.html. Do you know where i can get hagons + 15w oil for half that?

:scratch: Are you taking the p1ss now?!!? ;)

[rossinio]

:) "Do I think Hyperpro are worth twice the money??? - I doubt that too, hence going for the Hagon myself"

Just looking for best option, totally brand agnostic so don't care which free stickers I get as long as it's good value and does the job! If the Hagons are super good value I'll go for those, although bet they are more than they were when I was looking at doing this 3 months ago..

[Blue_SV650S]

:) "Do I think Hyperpro are worth twice the money??? - I doubt that too, hence going for the Hagon myself"

Just looking for best option, totally brand agnostic so don't care which free stickers I get as long as it's good value and does the job! If the Hagons are super good value I'll go for those, although bet they are more than they were when I was looking at doing this 3 months ago..

Blatently I don't care about brand name either else I would have bought Ohlins!! ;)

Anyway, I paid £55 (+P&P) for my Hagons today. Sure if you need oil, you will have to buy a tub, so add what £7 on - I already have some though. ;)

Bearing in mind I obviously have not tried either (yet) I can't give any more advice/help/opinion than has been written in this thread ...

If you try hard enough, you might be able to find Hagon for <£55 but I was happy with £55, so didn't try too hard past that ... please don't tell me if you find them for £45 somewhere!! :D

[rossinio]

Very cool, £55+pnp is pretty good. Was that from Hagon themselves? I'm thinking hagons + 15W as I'm 14st and any thinner oil might be a bit spongy still..

[Blue_SV650S]

Very cool, £55+pnp is pretty good. Was that from Hagon themselves? I'm thinking hagons + 15W as I'm 14st and any thinner oil might be a bit spongy still..


Technically it was £55.50 ... but hey, what is 50p between friends!! :D

They are the same price as Hagon direct, but I actually got them from a shop (http://www.intobikes.co.uk/) ... I wanted a few other things too and they have set postage for the whole order, so to my mind I reduced the unit P&P 8)

[embee]

If I were doing another I'd be happy to go with the Hagons.

I'm no suspension expert (but I do know a bit about springs, valve gear in particular), but providing the material and heat treatment etc are appropriate, having a different brand name on a spring isn't going to make it any better all else being equal.

The argument between linear/progressive can go on at length, but I reckon on a road going SV with an average ability rider simply getting the rate somewhere in the right ballpark is going to give you a decent handling bike. The stock curvey springs are 0.709kg/mm according to the book, and the Racetec calculator gives a requirement in the realms of 0.8-0.9 for a rider of , say, 11-14st.

I'm 12st, and I fitted K-tech 0.85 linears (£75 ish with 10W oil). I'd say for normal road use they are at the stiffer side of ideal for me but by no means harsh, I'd guess they'd be perfect for a 14st rider solo. The main thing is the transformation from the stock items, the pogoing is all but eliminated 99% of the time.

It's definitely the best bang-for-buck improvement, and Hagons are the least bucks from what I can see. From what Blue says the rate at mid travel is going to be in the right range for most people.

[simesb]

Very cool, £55+pnp is pretty good. Was that from Hagon themselves? I'm thinking hagons + 15W as I'm 14st and any thinner oil might be a bit spongy still..

I don't think Hagon do springs for the pointy - at least they didn't.

[rossinio]

I couldn't find the Hagons for the pointy, think you are right simesb :(
Went to Racetech site and did calculation for my weight (201lbs):

Recommended Fork Spring Rate for Street: 0.872 kg/mm (use closest available)
Stock Fork Spring Rate: .670 kg/mm (stock)

So it looks like i need the 0.85 kg/mm springs if i go linear. Still unsure about fork oil, think 15W should be ok with these springs. Anyone know where to buy in the UK? There are other people that do linear springs like K-tech so I could do what you did embee. Kind of surprised with 10W oil as it seems everyone recommends 15W but you are a lot lighter than me..

[embee]

It's got to be worth a phone call to Hagon to see if they do springs for the pointy, I'd be surprised if they don't.

I took advice from K-tech about the oil, they supplied some Motul factory-line 10W which seems to control things just fine for me. Bear in mind that the oil weight on the label doesn't really mean an awful lot, the values can vary dramatically between brands.
See table here (http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm)

[Biker_Billy]

Hagon do sell pointy springs...bought some 3 months ago - 62.50 inc vat and del with oil

[steveg]

+1 have a set of hagons for my pointy make a big difference , they are a top company and were very helpfull when I phoned them asking for advice

Cheers Steve

[Dangerous Dave]

I can confirm that Hagon do sell springs for Pointy's, I have fitted a few now.

[maviczap]

I fitted Hargon fork spring over the winter, a big improvement over the standard, although new fork oil helped too.
Cos I'm a skinny chap (65kg), I think 15w is making the front end too harsh over lumpy roads, so I'm going to change it to 10w this winter.
Hargon rear shock was also a major improvement, although I might get the spring changed to suit my weight. Can't afford the top end stuff, but happy with Hargon stuff.

[Blue_SV650S]

I got an email saying they were put in the post today, should be getting my new springs through tomorrow :)

[mister c]

Got Hagon springs in my Curvy & love them. They made such a difference to the front end, it feels stiffer & gives a lot more confidence. I used 15w oil.
I think that you will really enjoy them when they are fitted.

[Blue_SV650S]

I have new springs!! :)

I'll put them in later :)

[Grinch]

I have old springs and new oil, feels lovely with the ZX6 shock.

[Blue_SV650S]

Well, fitted them and been for a burn ... who wants to know what I thought?!!? :)

[Grinch]

Nah...

[Warthog]

me!

[dizzyblonde]

Well, fitted them and been for a burn ... who wants to know what I thought?!!? :)

ooo they work:rolleyes:

[Grinch]

Sorry I was just being pedantic.

[Blue_SV650S]

As a summery (and teaser) ... I am not convinced ... :o

[Blue_SV650S]

Put the new springs in. Bearing in mind I had put new oil in fairly recently and it was a special Blue_ mix of ~13w Motorex fork oil, I decided to leave the oil I had in there. The recommended oil is 15w, so not far off. I obviously set the air gap correctly (well it recommends 140mm, I set at 115), topping up with 15w oil.

The springs are ~10mm longer than stock springs. I had ~5mm of preload (02 adjustable preloaders) on there with the stock springs, so decided to wind the preload right out and bang it in like that as a starter for ten. I couldn’t be bothered to check the sag, it was unlikely to be miles off …

So that was the install. Now out for a burn.

The front was notably soft over little bumps. But then I guess with an initial rate of 6.5, that isn’t massively surprising? It did feel under damped though, but this might just have been the lightness of the initial rate? There was still a fair bit of dive under normal-moderate braking.

Out on my fave backroads now, so time to wind the wick up … the front was a bit ‘pattery’ over the smaller bumps and there was a fair bit of fork movement. Bearing in mind I was using the higher rate of the spring now, I was certainly underdamped.

So that was the initial impression. But I did a few more miles to settle in/get used to it/just ride it.

My conclusion …

To give them a fair chance, I need to put at least 15w oil in there and try it again. - I think with thicker oil (night even need 20w, but will try 15w) the front will be pliable over the smaller bumps, but not feel so ‘pattery’.

I still think the front is moving more than the rear when going over bumps, I wanted a bit more even compliance.

From what I recall from when I fitted/tested the Reacetch springs and emulators on the road, I really didn’t like the harsh ride they gave over the slower bumps, but they came to life when roadspeed and ‘aggression’ was increased.

Are the springs a revelation? – no
Does the bike dive a bit more evenly front and rear – yes
Are the springs better than stock – yes (see above)
Do I think I was wise to go for progressive over stiffer linear? – I really didn’t like the slow speed riding on the linear (with emulators) … so for the road, and standard damping, I’d say yes, progressive is better.
Have I got £70 (by the tie I factor in postage and oil) of benefit? – Jury is still out until I have put the thicker oil in, set the sag and given it a more comprehensive try …

[Blue_SV650S]

People don't seem overly interested in my feedback :( ... but anyway ... here is the next instalment ...

Had another go ... 3hrs riding this time ...

I randomly set 2 rings more preload on the front and set off for a burn ... thought I'd give it a second/longer go to make my mind up.

My thoughts:-

Basically they aren't a revelation.

Front feels 'pattery' when going slow.

In faster smoother roads the front does behave.

Bike still dives too much under braking for my liking.

Bearing in mind they are supposed to be 9.5 at the top rate .... I just can't see it ...

Are they an improvement on stock? - Yes -> but it is not like the bar was set very high ;)

Have I wasted my money? - No

Do I wish I had bought 80 linear springs like I have in my trackbike? - Yes - I think I prefer the linear feel .. having a soggy front for the first few CM of travel isn't that confidence inspiring (to me).

Is it probably the primitive damping making things feel like they are, not really the springs? - Probably.

Would I spend the full £250 to get linear and emulators on my road bike? ... not on your nelly ... these are good enough and if anything having slightly inferior suspension that you don't have 100% confidence it will handle anything you throw at it, keeps road speed a bit more sane .. to my mind that is a good thing! 8)

I do still need to put 15w oil in it before its a closed case, but to be honest, with ~13w in there at the mo, I can't see it making gargantuan changes ..

So do I recommend this mod?

I recommend if you can justify to yourself spending 1/4 the bikes value on sorting the front end out then go for Emulators and linear springs. But if you are like me and think that is just insane (or you are on a tight budget) progressive springs are deffo a step in the right direction. Its all personal preference, but I do feel I would have been better off putting another £25 in the pot and buying linear springs ... but as I haven't compared like for like (might take the springs out of my trackbike one day and try), that is just supposition ...

[rossinio]

That is a really interesting read and has made me think twice about buying the Hagons over the linear 0.85 springs. It would be interesting if someone could do a back to back with the Hyperpro progressives but it would be a bit cost prohibitive!

Where did you get your linear springs from the race bike? I'm thinking with my weight and 15W oil those are the best bet. My biggest dislike is the dive under braking and if the hagons dont help "enough" with that I'll go for pricier hyperpros or linears.

cheers for the writeup :)

[Blue_SV650S]

That is a really interesting read and has made me think twice about buying the Hagons over the linear 0.85 springs. It would be interesting if someone could do a back to back with the Hyperpro progressives but it would be a bit cost prohibitive!

Where did you get your linear springs from the race bike? I'm thinking with my weight and 15W oil those are the best bet. My biggest dislike is the dive under braking and if the hagons dont help "enough" with that I'll go for pricier hyperpros or linears.

cheers for the writeup :)

I think the dive under breaking is a function of being progressive, not Hagon, therefore I would think the more expensive hyperpros would not resolve this 'feature'.

I have to point out that suspension is very subjective topic ... what I like/dislike others may not ... but I can only report on my perspective/wants ;)

As I said, I'll stick my linear springs in as some point (that I like in the trackbike - but they are running emulators too) and see if I prefer non-emulated linear to non-emulated progressive ... ON THE ROAD ... I know I felt that the linear with emulators felt a bit too stiff/non compliment at slow road speeds ... so didn;t like them at SLOW road speeds (they came into their own at higher speed!! 8)).

[ricky_t]

I am in a similar situation as you blue.

I have a curvy and want to improve the front end handling. I was considering just going and get a CBR600RR 6/7 but feel that it is too expensive to use on a regular basis. Leaving the sv in a car park I feel quite confident that it'll be there when I return but a newish CBR would get be worried.

I find it hard to justify spending too much on a bike worth around £1500.

You are recommending getting linear springs and emulators to improve the front end instead of hagon. I have only been riding for 3 years, will that still be good on the road, will it ok comfort (I use the bike for fun)?

What springs/emulators do you recommend?

Amrik (ricky_t)

[Blue_SV650S]

I am in a similar situation as you blue.

I have a curvy and want to improve the front end handling. I was considering just going and get a CBR600RR 6/7 but feel that it is too expensive to use on a regular basis. Leaving the sv in a car park I feel quite confident that it'll be there when I return but a newish CBR would get be worried.

I find it hard to justify spending too much on a bike worth around £1500.

You are recommending getting linear springs and emulators to improve the front end instead of hagon. I have only been riding for 3 years, will that still be good on the road, will it ok comfort (I use the bike for fun)?

What springs/emulators do you recommend?

Amrik (ricky_t)

When I got the springs and emulators (both racetech) for my trackbike, I tried them out on my roadbike first. Personally I felt they were a bit to solid/non compliment for slow road riding (through town, and really dodgy back/minor roads). I actually preferred the stock road setup for this. But when you start putting the SV through its paces, boy did the springs and emulators come into their own 8)

If you use the bike on the track or for fast smooth 'scratching' and need the front end confidence, linear and emulators are the way to go (if you can justify that silly expenditure). I don't think the emulators and springs are well suited to commuting/town/bumpy minor roads.

If you use the bike for commuting and weekend fun I'd say linear or progressive (I need to try the linear before I can decide on which I prefer/would recommend for people that like the same feel as me) but no emulators would probably do the trick and less wallet emptying.

There is obviously the GIXER swap which I haven't tried, but lets face it, it has to be better than anything with the SV forks ;)

[embee]

Just to re-iterate, I have 0.85 linear springs from K-tech in my curvey and find them very nice.

In theory they ought to be a touch stiff for my weight but I have slightly higher clip-ons on my SVS so don't have so much weight on my wrists. With stock bars I might find it a touch harsh and tiring, but as it is they are fine.

I haven't tried progressives so can't compare, but I certainly don't get any of the characteristics Blue describes from his. They feel exactly what they are, linear, the same stiffness throughout with no surprises.

I guess in the end you pays your money........................

[thedonal]

It's good to read this Blue- I was dithering on whether to go for Hagon progressive or Ohlins linears- now I am convinced to go for the latter. I also don't like the way the front end dives and would like to have a far more solid front end (!).

So- when I've got the cash after sorting my issues out (clutch next), I will be getting all modded up...

[Blue_SV650S]

It's good to read this Blue- I was dithering on whether to go for Hagon progressive or Ohlins linears

Hold on, I haven't said that YET!! ;) Its a hypothesis until I have tried linears (without emulators). If it wasn't a culmination of springs AND emulators making it seem a bit stiff at slow speed and just the springs, then I might dislike the stiffness linear gives and vote for the progressive (for road use that includes a lot of town/commuting/minor roads) ...

I also need to get some thicker oil in there ... thinking of sucking 50% of my 13w out and putting some 20w in to give me ~17w oil in there (i.e. I am slightly under and thinking of going slightly over recommended).

[thedonal]

So you're just taking AAAAges to get to the point, then?! :)

[Blue_SV650S]

So you're just taking AAAAges to get to the point, then?! :)

Yeah, I have everything I need to try all the combos, but I very much CBA to swap the stuff about!! :D

[Blue_SV650S]

Been out on the bike again today ... Guess what . . . . .

[simesb]

Been out on the bike again today ... Guess what . . . . .

What?

[Blue_SV650S]

What?

I now like the springs!! :D

.. let me just put a few words together ...

[simesb]

I now like the springs!! :D

You're as bad as a woman... :shock:

[Blue_SV650S]

Ok, so I had ~250ml of 15w oil knocking about (have a full one too, but didn’t want to crack that open as I think I need to be looking at a 17w mix and it would just be a waste to try a new pot of 15w beforehand). So syringed out some of the oil from one of the forks and put the 250ml of 15w in there (then resetting the air gap with the old oil).

I let the front tyre down from 34.5psi to 31.5psi. I also significantly backed off the damping on the rear so that when I pushed on the tank the front and rear went down at the same sort of time. The rear rebound looked too slow too, so backed that off almost completely.

Off for a ride I went … the bike was instantly better than what I remembered from the other day … a combination of the rear being a bit more compliant and the front being a little more damped. The rear being more compliant and the front a little slower too took the emphasis/load off the front a bit when suspension was required. i.e. front and rear was sharing the load more equally.

I could tell even at town speed the rear was now under damped, so I had gone OTT in backing that off ... no problem, I had a screwdriver in my rucksack 8)

Long story short, after re-setting the rear so it was better damped, but keeping a bit of unity between the front and rear action/reaction the bike felt so much more predictable.

The bike still dives a fair bit under heavy braking, but now I have the suspension more evenly distributed I am back to something I can predict …

I am certainly going to put some 17w mix in there now and try again, but I think it is a quantum leap from how I had it …

Or perhaps I am just getting used to it!! :D

[Biker Biggles]

Hmmm.interesting.I have some progressive springs (not Hagons) in mine and might try some thicker oil as I find them a bit boingy over bumps.

[Dangerous Dave]

I always use Hyperpro progressive springs, I use a little more oil than required and as yet I have had no complaints.

[wardy2602]

hi there
looking at a set of the hagons on ebay could you tell me if they are the same length for a k3 sv650s as a k3 sv1000s as i can not find the relevent info on the net myself.

cheers
craig

[Ginjaian]

I've just fitted Hyperpro progressive springs to my '99 curvy. The springs seem to be a one-size-fits-all, as they don't seem to come in different weights - I'll have to double check the box on that, but I wasn't given any options. Also, 20w oil was supplied with them, and a larger air gap of 140mm as opposed to 105mm (from memory). I'm not that heavy at around 70kg, so the first ride is going to be interesting; I'm expecting them to be initially pretty soft as it takes up the softest part of the spring and the air gap, then a bit on the harsh side as it gets to the heavy fork oil.

I haven't ridden it yet, as I found the previous owner had neglected the front brake calipers, to the extent that there was no dust seals, 2 sticking pots, and the oldest and most contaminated brake fluid I think I've ever seen! Had to buy 4 new pistons as the old ones were too damaged. £80! Hopefully I'll get it back together this week and report back.

[Blue_SV650S]

Guess what .... :D

[xXBADGERXx]

What :rolleyes:

[Blue_SV650S]

Went to the bike shop today ... intending to get some 20w fork oil ....

I have been using Motorex 'high performance' fork oil, so wanted to get more of that. Sadly the shop I normally get the motorex oil from only stock 2.5,5,7.5,10,15w oil .... I wanted to keep with the same brand as not only do I use that in my track bike, but if I am gonna end up mixing oil, its best if it is the same brand ...

Anyhoo, that was the plan but dash-it I couldn't get any 20w motorex :(

Managed to get some Bel-Ray (http://www.belray.com/) oil ... £9 for 1L :shock: ... looks a really carp/boring bottle too ...

Anyway, when I got back home I did a very scientific 'slop' test ... :D

Basically I took the full bottle of 15w motorex and the full 20w Bel-Ray and shook them both one after another to try and get an idea of the viscosity difference ... it was like one was water an one was ... well not treacle, but certainly notably thicker ...

oh .....

Anyhoo, where I wasn't prepared to mix brands (just in case they reacted with each other) I sucked all the old oil out and filled with 20w ...

Long story short it is now over damped ... :(

I think if I could have stuck with the same brand and got their 20w, it would have been spot on ... assuming bel-ray is slightly thicker stuff, their 15w would probably also have been spot on too ..

Once i had done a few miles and punished the forks a bit (heating and aireating the oil) it was nearer what I would have wanted. I had adjusted the rear again by this point to regain some balance.

After things had settled down and i got used to it a bit, I could live with it ... at the end of the day damper-rod suspension is never going to be anything other than wrong in most circumstances!! :D

[embee]

Have a look at the table down the page here (http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm) and compare the viscosities particularly at 40C, that'll be typical for most use.

You'll see that different makes of oil differ considerably within the same nominal viscosity range.

I found a good example when I put some Castrol synthetic 10W in a bike, and it felt very hard when cold but soon gets better after a few miles. Checking the table says it's up in the region of other 15W oils, but thins out a lot with temp. What I really need in that bike is something a bit more stable, a higher VI, thinner when cold but not thinning out much as it warms up, maybe like Red Line Medium.

[Blue_SV650S]

Have a look at the table down the page here (http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm) and compare the viscosities particularly at 40C, that'll be typical for most use.

You'll see that different makes of oil differ considerably within the same nominal viscosity range.

I found a good example when I put some Castrol synthetic 10W in a bike, and it felt very hard when cold but soon gets better after a few miles. Checking the table says it's up in the region of other 15W oils, but thins out a lot with temp. What I really need in that bike is something a bit more stable, a higher VI, thinner when cold but not thinning out much as it warms up, maybe like Red Line Medium.

Cool table ...

Looks like Elf Moto Fork Oil (20) it the boy 4 me 8)

To be honest, I'll just keep the 20w Bel-Ray in there for now ... I'll get used to it and it will prolly thin out a little ... if I can't live with it, then I'll water it down a but with some of the 15w Motorex I took out (and kept ;)).

Which raises the next question ... are they likely to 'react' with each other? I don't know ho inert the ingredients of the oil are ...

[ThEGr33k]

Ive had a quick read through here and couldnt see anyone mention this... But is 9N the same as 0.9Kgmm??

Cheers

[xXBADGERXx]

9N is Newtons , there are all sorts of new fangled measurements out now in the Metric form . Be very careful you don`t mix them up :D

[ThEGr33k]

9N is Newtons , there are all sorts of new fangled measurements out now in the Metric form . Be very careful you don`t mix them up :D


I know that mate :p

http://www.convertunits.com/from/kg/to/N Shows that 0.9kgmm = ~9N :cool:

[yorkie_chris]

How is a Newton equivalent to a kg mm^-1 at all? 0.9kg/mm will be near to 9N/mm, not newtons. Newton is force, not rate.

SI unit for spring rate is N/m

[ThEGr33k]

Aye ive figured that out... Its the idiots at K-tech that list them as just N, not N/mm. Urg. So I presume now that they mean N/mm.

Been a while since I done my Physics A-level so I had to do a little reading up ha ha.

[xXBADGERXx]

This is why I said to be carefull , we have loads of Torque settings in work and a lot of people don`t check what it says after the N/ <---- we have CM , MM etc and people have got it wrong and have risked lives because of this .

[nik_nunez]

sorry to bring an old thread back to life but i cant pm blue for some reason

blue - did you ever test a linear spring on your bike? or do u still have the hagons in?

[dizzyblonde]

you won't get a reply off Blue i'm afraid :-(
Progressives are great with 15W oil, linear well. . .Personally I'm not getting on, but thats because since having the washers pulled out of the forks that were preload and 10W oil put in, they aren't happy. When they're set up properly,and heavier oil, they behave.(not like the bouncy castle at the mo) theres not much difference IMO.
I have both, so can easily compare.

[Dave20046]

Sorry to drag up the old thread and this overdone subject, but where were people getting the hagon progressives from for a pointy? I have a K3 SVs in desperate need of these....

[skeetly]

hagon?
Thats where mine came from...........

[Dave20046]

hagon?
Thats where mine came from...........
ta skeetly, tried their website but you don't appear to be able to buy online nor is the sv650 listed on there :scratch:. Can you remember how much you paid and how you bought from them?

[steveg]

Got mine from Hagon
http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/main1st.htm

Just give them a ring , really good people to deal with

cost approx 60 quid I think made a big difference.

Cheers

[Dave20046]

cheers steve,will give them a mail tomorrow. Used to have them in my curvy just got a pointy and wish they were in!
considering oil viscositys now though... had 15 in before and they were slightly harsh (but the bike handles well) wondering what to use in the faired pointy... :scratch: might try a 12.5

[steveg]

got 10w in my pointy as recommended by Hagon , did say I was about 15 stone but was told to use 10W as 15w would be too harsh

cheers Steve

[Dave20046]

hmm cheers steve will try the ten me thinks, I'm a bit lighter than you. how do yours feel?

[skeetly]

Ring them up, they definitely do them.
I think mine were about 67 including the oil.
Should be a thread about it somewhere here...

edit. I used the reccomended 10w in mine and I found them fine. 12 stone and a faired k3 pointy.

[Spanner Man]

Good evening all.

I've fitted hundreds of sets of Hagon springs, & not yet had a complaint. They're excellent!

One thing I would advise is that you use Hagons recommended oil weight, & most importantly their recommended oil level, which can differ quite a lot from standard on some models.


Cheers.


P.S. I give org members a 10% discount on Hagon stuff!:D

[steveg]

hmm cheers steve will try the ten me thinks, I'm a bit lighter than you. how do yours feel?

Compared with original Hagons feel alot more controlled , less diving on brakes , I was really surprised when Hagon recommended 10 W however glad I went with their recommendation

Cheers Steve

[AndyBrad]

dave i remember your forks of iron and my forks of water :) 10w oil with progressivesuspension springs. however i stuck 3 washers in it and its transformed the bike now!!! make sure you add a bit of preload!

[Nobbylad]

Good evening all.

I've fitted hundreds of sets of Hagon springs, & not yet had a complaint. They're excellent!

One thing I would advise is that you use Hagons recommended oil weight, & most importantly their recommended oil level, which can differ quite a lot from standard on some models.


Cheers.


P.S. I give org members a 10% discount on Hagon stuff!:D

That's interesting, when Flymo and I fitted my Hagons (with the oil they sent with them), the oil levels they were recommending were well higher than the stock levels and also the springs were slightly shorter (we considered cutting some metal tube as longer spacers). Do you really fill the oil to the level Hagon recommend?

[Dave20046]

dave i remember your forks of iron and my forks of water :) 10w oil with progressivesuspension springs. however i stuck 3 washers in it and its transformed the bike now!!! make sure you add a bit of preload!
****e they felt like standard?!
I've just ordered some hagons with the recommended oil for £67.50 from hagon. Hope they'll be alright, they did give me the option for road or race but I went for race.
Would be interested to know levels I put the level recommended in the .org faqs in in my old curvy.

[Sally]

I worked out when doing a oil change that I have progressive springs, not sure of make.

I am ~ 14 stone, and the 8W oil that the previous midget/skeleton of a Lady put in was killing my cornering/general use.

I personally, if you are around my weight, use 15W, it doesn't feel too hard, and I can say that 10W would have been too soft.
Much improved with the new 15W oil over the 8W oil.

[Spanner Man]

That's interesting, when Flymo and I fitted my Hagons (with the oil they sent with them), the oil levels they were recommending were well higher than the stock levels and also the springs were slightly shorter (we considered cutting some metal tube as longer spacers). Do you really fill the oil to the level Hagon recommend?


Good evening all.

Indeed I always stick with Hagons recommended oil viscosity & oil level, & as I said, I haven't yet found anyone who didn't notice a considerable improvement in handling as compared to the stock springs.

Also as I do this repair lark professionaly, I have to be careful in these days of 'sue thy neighbour' should I deviate from any advice manufacturers of after market parts supply with their products.

Obviously Hagon design their springs to give an improvement in performance over the standard springs whilst taking a lot of averages into account, So it is possible to improve their perfomance still further by tailoring the spacing & oil viscosity to suit your particular needs. I.E. If you're a larger rider a touch of extra pre-load & a slight increase in oil weight may help.

But as I've said, if you're fitting them start with Hagons recomendations for oil level & viscosity, see how they fell & go from there.


Cheers.

[Dave20046]

I'm wondering if this confusion with weight oils is to do with manufacturers mislabeling viscosity. My hagons + silkolene pro 15 wt were 'forks of iron' however other people seem to be having good results with 10wt :scratch: The reason hagon recommend 10 is because if it's too thick it can't dampen properly.