SVs as a trackbike?

[daytona63]

Hi all,

Just been pointed in this direction after asking a mate about how good would a SV650 be as a trackbike. They seem very solid bikes and even the earliest ones seem to be in pretty good nick.

Is there anything in particular i should be looking for and checking when buying? And is there anywhere that specialises in track stuff for the bike?

Any help and advice much appreciated.

Cheers

[mister c]

I watched this guy at Wigan on Sunday (No97), I don't know if it is anyone off here, but my god is he fast :cool: It sounds awesome as well.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/croozenooze/DSCF1054.jpg

So I would say yes, go for it, they seem to make awesome track/Race bikes.
Someone will be along shortly no doubt to tell you what & where. Good Luck :)

[Sideshow#36]

There is a whole race series created because of the SV650. Its called the minitwins. They make awsome track bikes, just need a bit of work on the suspension. www.jhsracing.co.uk (http://www.jhsracing.co.uk) or www.stevejordanmotorcycles.co.uk (http://www.stevejordanmotorcycles.co.uk) are your main bets for tweaking the SV. See avatar! :D

[Red Herring]

There is a whole series specially for them, Minitwins (actually it's not specially for SV's, it's just that they are the bike of choice). Look in the Forum under Racing. The good thing is that this means there are loads of tuning bits and pieces available, unfortunately this also means that the bikes hold their value and some of the bits, forks, radiators etc are very expensive. If you are just going for a trackbike to get started on then it makes more sense to get an old SS600 bike, or even a 400. Just as fast (or even faster) as an SV although I will concede not as nice sounding.

[Paws]

bluethunder on here is selling his track sv

[Blue_SV650S]

Do you currently have a trackbike and thinking of getting an SV as something different or new to trackdays?

I'd say if it is the latter an SV is not the obvious choice! =;

What is your rationale for getting an SV as a trackbike?

If you do go the SV route and it is to be a dedicated track bike, buy a x-race bike as a stock SV needs a fair bit of money thrown at it to get it to work properly on track. :smt026

We all love them (I've got a few myself 8)), but be under no illusion ... SVs are ****!! :D And any semi-modern 600 (even stock) is far better suited to the track ...

[Sideshow#36]

SVs are ****!! :grin: And any semi-modern 600 (even stock) is far better suited to the track ...

How very very very dare you!!! :D

[fastdruid]

How very very very dare you!!! :D

True though, I rode a stock '96 CBR600 round cadwell and it's fantastic. You can pick up an old steelie for 500quid.

The SV with sorted suspension is ace but as standard just about every sports 600 is better as a track bike.

Good excuse to post another pic of my track SV :) :D
http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/cadwell2008druid/thumbs/640x480070808-731.jpg

Druid

[Sideshow#36]

As soon as the Sv's suspension is sorted it is a superb bike. A little heavy and cumbersome maybe but I get a huge sense of satisfaction of muscling it around a race track. And its the rider that matters most not the bike. Any monkey can buy a 600 road bike and get it round a track in a half decent time.

Yamaha R6 '08' £7000
Matching A* leathers with ebay 'used' knee sliders £1150
Track day in the experienced group £150

The look on their faces as you go around the outside of them....

Priceless.

[St0rmer66]

And even with sorted suspension the SS600 will always have more power (unless you bore it out to 800cc, but that costs a hell of a lot). If you want to race in minitwins however, it's perfect of course.

[St0rmer66]

As soon as the Sv's suspension is sorted it is a superb bike. A little heavy and cumbersome maybe but I get a huge sense of satisfaction of muscling it around a race track. And its the rider that matters most not the bike. Any monkey can buy a 600 road bike and get it round a track in a half decent time.

Yamaha R6 '08' £7000
Matching A* leathers with ebay 'used' knee sliders £1150
Track day in the experienced group £150

The look on their faces as you go around the outside of them....

Priceless.
Starting with a bike that is fundamentally flawed as a track bike (heavy and cumbersome) makes absolutely no sense at all. If he already had an SV, then fair enough it might be worth it. But when you can get a better bike for the job at the same or less money, you'd be stupid to pick the lesser option!

Someone who is crap on an '08 R6 would likely be even worse on an SV, assuming the same amount of experience was spent on both.

Don't get me wrong, I really do like my SV, but I am under no illusion that it's better than a SS600. I bought it as a road bike, upgraded the suspension a bit and it's quite fast (can out-ride both my dad and my uncle on bikes with double the horsepower). But if I wanted a dedicated track bike, I'd look elsewhere... but that's now I suppose. If the OP is relatively inexperienced for example (and there is nothing wrong with admitting it, I'd be novice group on the track), the SV is a good bike to learn on (it's taught me a hell of a lot about fast riding) because it has enough power (usable) without the ridiculous top end speed that could land you in trouble. Also there is the fact it's a twin over an IL4, but that's personal preference.

[Sideshow#36]

Starting with a bike that is fundamentally flawed as a track bike (heavy and cumbersome) makes absolutely no sense at all. If he already had an SV, then fair enough it might be worth it. But when you can get a better bike for the job at the same or less money, you'd be stupid to pick the lesser option!

Someone who is crap on an '08 R6 would likely be even worse on an SV, assuming the same amount of experience was spent on both.

Don't get me wrong, I really do like my SV, but I am under no illusion that it's better than a SS600. I bought it as a road bike, upgraded the suspension a bit and it's quite fast (can out-ride both my dad and my uncle on bikes with double the horsepower). But if I wanted a track bike, I'd look elsewhere.


Sorry I think we have crossed wires here, you see when I was born I was issued with a sense of humor. I suggest you try and find one :kiss:

[Lozzo]

True though, I rode a stock '96 CBR600 round cadwell and it's fantastic. You can pick up an old steelie for 500quid.




+1.

I love my SV650S K5 to bits as a road bike, but it would tie itself in knots round a track if I rode it anywhere near as fast as I ride my CBR600 trackbike, and my SV has mildly uprated suspension front and back - lovely on the road, but not up to much on track.

The CBR600 goes better, handles better, and stops far better than my SV, and it's 8 years older, has 28,000 miles more on the clock, has a knackered rear shock, the wrong fork oil in and cost me 400 quid as opposed to nearly 3 grand for the SV.

[Blue_SV650S]

So I think we are all agreed (except sideshow ;)) that unless you intend to do minitwins or have a donor bike already, or have a V-twin fetish and can't afford a proper one, an SV as a trackbike makes little sense.

Hopefully that has answered your question daytona63?

Give us a bit more info on why you are considering an SV and we can give a more prescribed answer 8)

[boo86]

I've got 1, see left <-- It's an awesome track bike. Obviously it has no power compared to most other things. My road bike is a 141 rwhp zx9r so everytime I get on the sv it fells like a 125. It handles well with £150 spent on the supension and weighs less then a fart.
I run sticky Michelin power races in medium soft compound. I can get the pegs down going at 50% and I've had the belly pan down a loads of times on turn 3 at Croft.

[lexinoo]

Well,i was looking for a sv650 as a road bike but after reading some of the negative comments on here,i think i might look for another old 30,000 mile cbr6,seems they go,stop and handle better than a modern sv!??? i thought you all loved your svs on here.?

[fastdruid]

Well,i was looking for a sv650 as a road bike but after reading some of the negative comments on here,i think i might look for another old 30,000 mile cbr6,seems they go,stop and handle better than a modern sv!??? i thought you all loved your svs on here.?

Oh we love them alright but for a first trackbike it doesn't make sense to get a stock SV in comparison to an SS600. Especially as the SS600's are dirt cheap.

I still prefer the SV to a SS600 on the road as the SS600's are so silly fast but without the torque to be fun at low speeds.
For example the 2003 Hornet 600 I had as a hire bike for a while, no power below 25mph (5k) and the only real power (in first) came in at 50mph (10k)!

Druid

[Lozzo]

I prefer my SV as a road bike because it's not as frantic. I ride in different modes:

Fairly brisk on the road - which is why the SV makes sense because I love the V-twin power delivery and fairly plush ride quality. It's not as manic as the CBR and doesn't encourage too much hooliganism from me.

Very quick on track - I need something that has low value but does the job well, which is why I bought the CBR.

[jambo]

Well,i was looking for a sv650 as a road bike but after reading some of the negative comments on here,i think i might look for another old 30,000 mile cbr6,seems they go,stop and handle better than a modern sv!??? i thought you all loved your svs on here.?

Horses for courses. You go on a pan-European forum and ask what the best back road bike is, sure some will say they go b-road bashing on their pan European's, but most would point you to something lighter ;)

The SV is a very good bike for the money, but the suspension's a bit basic, for hard track use you'd be looking to upgrade it, which leaves you using donor shocks from another bike that may or may not suit, or expensive new components.

A SS600 will be more powerful, better suspended (assuming the shocks not knackered, and it has fresh oil in the forks) and better braked (assuming the calipers are in good working order). As those are the sort of things you want on a track bike, if it's a dedicated track bike I'd look at a good, used SS600.

That said someone on here has a dedicated track CB500. It's very cheap, fast enough for novice, and when funds permit can compete in the CB500 cup!

I have also seen a GS500, and a 1980's Motoguzzi, make SS600s look very silly on track, so it's mostly about the rider:D.

Jambo

[Blue_SV650S]

As others have said, the SV is a great roadbike and for many of us it makes way more sense than an SS6 or thou on the road.

They can be modified to make a 1/2 decent track tool, but it costs money and it will always be underpowered and inferior to even a standard-ish, modern-ish SS600.

That said, an SV with sorted suspension is actually fair bit easier to ride on track than a 600 or thou, simply as you don't have to account for the speed/power ...

You can ride the heart out of a SV on the track and keep up with some quicker kit on an overall lap, but they have to either be really plops, or you have to be making things up the hard way as they will take miles out of you down every straight ...

[Zombie Jesus]

Any modern supersport is capable of running a decent pace in fast group with no mods so that's a definate advantage. Though I also agree that in some ways it's easier to learn better track technique on a slower bike because it removes the over reliance on using brute power to overtake amongst other reasons.

[r4ce_e3nd]

It al depends on the track you are riding! You have twisty tracks and fast tracks. On the twisty tracks, the SV will not disappoint because of the good handeling, torque and light weight. On the more faster tracks on the other hand, the SV will have a lack of power to battle with the SS's... I say this out of experiece.

http://aeltermanwouter.googlepages.com/1216909769_resized.jpg

[boo86]

Any modern supersport is capable of running a decent pace in fast group with no mods so that's a definate advantage. Though I also agree that in some ways it's easier to learn better track technique on a slower bike because it removes the over reliance on using brute power to overtake amongst other reasons.

Why worry about which group your in !? Track days are about fun not proving your self. I lap Croft 4 seconds a lap quicker on my sv650 than i do on my zx9r. The sv IS underpowered that's true but it is more fun. That's what bikes are about, having a laff, not being p*ssed of cos if you had more power you'd be 0.1 seconds quicker.
I'd go for an aprillia 250 or suzuki 250 2 stroke, cb500, sv650, maybe even a zxr400 for a track bike. If I didn't have the sv650 I would go for the zxr400 I think. Or the rgv 250. those things turn like house flies !
keep it cheap and it'll be more fun.

[Zombie Jesus]

Yamaha R6 '08' £7000
Matching A* leathers with ebay 'used' knee sliders £1150
Track day in the experienced group £150

The look on their faces as you go around the outside of them....

Priceless.

No shame in that really. A minitwin rider could always get raped by a 13 year old on a race 125 :p

[fastdruid]

Why worry about which group your in !? Track days are about fun not proving your self. I lap Croft 4 seconds a lap quicker on my sv650 than i do on my zx9r. The sv IS underpowered that's true but it is more fun. That's what bikes are about, having a laff, not being p*ssed of cos if you had more power you'd be 0.1 seconds quicker.
I'd go for an aprillia 250 or suzuki 250 2 stroke, cb500, sv650, maybe even a zxr400 for a track bike. If I didn't have the sv650 I would go for the zxr400 I think. Or the rgv 250. those things turn like house flies !
keep it cheap and it'll be more fun.

Me I'd go for an RVF400, ooh look what I have in the garage :D :lol:

http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/cadwell2008druid/thumbs/640x480070808-6012.jpg

Druid

[boo86]

Me I'd go for an RVF400, ooh look what I have in the garage :D :lol:

http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/cadwell2008druid/thumbs/640x480070808-6012.jpg

Druid

That's lush. http://forums.sv650.org/images/icons/icon7.gifToo pricey for me though !! Maybe after the lottery win.
They race on track with us in mini twins. minitwins formula 400 and gp 125s all out together. Some of the 400s make 80 rwhp

[Zombie Jesus]

Why worry about which group your in
Lap times or group is not important. The point I was trying to make is that I think it is easier for someone's riding to progress to an arbitrary level on a supersport as opposed to a SV where they might have to consider modification x on component y to achieve a faster or safer/consistent pace.

[G]

Lap times or group is not important. The point I was trying to make is that I think it is easier for someone's riding to progress to an arbitrary level on a supersport as opposed to a SV where they might have to consider modification x on component y to achieve a faster or safer/consistent pace.


+1 after reading all the posts, thats the way I see it also.

I loved my SV but at serious speed it would become unstable and unpredicatable so it had its limitation without spending money on it.

So I bought a cbr, which I'm much quicker on than the SV but feel safer and more planted. If I tried to take the SV to that pace it MAY have been more fun but it would have been squirming all over the place uncomfortably and an accident waiting to happen.

The SV taught me alot though, I would have another one.

[Blue_SV650S]

Lap times or group is not important. The point I was trying to make is that I think it is easier for someone's riding to progress to an arbitrary level on a supersport as opposed to a SV where they might have to consider modification x on component y to achieve a faster or safer/consistent pace.

Its more than that ... sadly you are gonna get creamed on every straight bit, the other riders will then duly get past and then park their bike in the turns as it is hard/they can't judge the speed they need to scrub. You are now gonna have to start making some brave moves, or get held up by them. Sure it is fun beating them up if you have the experience/balls, but if you are new, its just going to get annoying and impair your progress. At least if you are on a SS6, you are more equal down the straight so more likely to arrive at a turn on your own terms and can then negotiate it as you feel fit without some spoon parked in the way!! 8)

Oh and r4ce_e3nd,. how the hell can you say an SV is lighter and more flickable than a modern SS600? :scratch: ...

[daytona63]

Hi guys
Thanks for the feedback.
I'm not a complete track novice but have limited experience. I currently ride a CBR954 FireBlade on the road and have been riding bikes or over 10 years and have taken it on track a few times but it really has too much power for me to learn more about getting quicker through corners.
I want something that will enable me to learn more but still keep a good pace and not cost a fortune to run...but equally not be a pile of sh*te! The SV seemed to tick those boxes but i am a bit concerned about how many aftermarket parts there are for it for track use.
From the feedback it would seem a 600cc CBR or similar would be better but it depends what i can find over the winter. My guess is there will be some real bargains to be had.

[Blue_SV650S]

There are plenty of aftermarket spares to get the SV up to scratch, but as the minitwin series is rife, don't expect to find any second hand parts on eBay going for pittance ;)

I have a SV trackbike and I find it a real hoot to ride, and I love that it is a no-brainier to ride, when I ride bigger bikes on track now, they scare me a little!! :oops: :lol:

[sv650k4]

There are plenty of aftermarket spares to get the SV up to scratch, but as the minitwin series is rife, don't expect to find any second hand parts on eBay going for pittance ;)

I have a SV trackbike and I find it a real hoot to ride, and I love that it is a no-brainier to ride, when I ride bigger bikes on track now, they scare me a little!! :oops: :lol:



+1 thers more than enough aftermarket/race parts avilable for them!!

;)

[r4ce_e3nd]

Oh and r4ce_e3nd,. how the hell can you say an SV is lighter and more flickable than a modern SS600? :scratch: ...
I wasn't talking about the modern SS's and more or less talking from my point of view (with my SV). Mine weighs 181 kg's full tank etc. Don't think many SS of the same age can compete with that. Also the upgraded suspension. But hey, If I would buy me an trackbike it would defenitly be a SS600/750!! At the moment I'd like to have more power, it would be more fun to me...

[Tim in Belgium]

I agree that the SV is a good bike to learn your trade on track, but it can be frustrating to overtake the same guy 2-3 times a lap, only for him to re-take you one each straight, although this is more of a problem on power circuits. I found my Sv was happy in inters, about 1/3 of the way down the group. However as a dedicated track only tool I'd agree with the others and go for a SS600 of some sort.

I've had the SV on all sorts of tracks (Zolder, Spa, Nurburgring, Lydden, Mallory, Cadwell, Croft, Croix en Ternois) and had a great time on it though (time for some pic wh0ring ;) ).

http://inlinethumb36.webshots.com/43427/2311293010084392296S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2311293010084392296hStQSX)

http://inlinethumb63.webshots.com/44094/2456139110084392296S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2456139110084392296QHTFMr)

http://inlinethumb11.webshots.com/39498/2307114630084392296S600x600Q85.jpg (http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2307114630084392296QZgThE)

http://inlinethumb58.webshots.com/26617/2935355490084392296S600x600Q85.jpg (http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2935355490084392296IqYIBZ)

[northwind]

If I was going to get a track bike, I'd either get a trashed SV- just because I know them inside out and it'd be instantly familiar on track- or a random ancient race bike. They go for ridiculously small amounts, generally far less than their value in parts... Sure they'll be past their best, usually pretty scabby, but who cares? Depends a wee bit on whether it has to be road legal of course (personally I'd MOT and tax it, the number of people you see turn up at trackdays with a bike that doesn't work, then take all day fettling it and never get a good lap in is nuts...) Test it on the road, use it on the track, is how to do it.

[toadie]

I watched this guy at Wigan on Sunday (No97), I don't know if it is anyone off here, but my god is he fast :cool: It sounds awesome as well.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/croozenooze/DSCF1054.jpg

So I would say yes, go for it, they seem to make awesome track/Race bikes.
Someone will be along shortly no doubt to tell you what & where. Good Luck :)


Tis me Mr C!!

Thanks for your kind words!

Probably very biased, but I think the SV is a cracking trackbike, granted they can take some cash to make real good, but once there what a thing to ride!!!!

My Sv can lap Anglesey at a pace that would get top five in the SS600 race:shock::smt026 and up till last weekend was the fastet bike round Three sisters this year:eek:

I could rattle on all night about my love affair with my SV, but the missus is watching so I'll have to tone it down a bit.....

Horses for corses really, but I will say some of those £500 steelies need some proper TLC and in truthfullness are they that much more FUN?.......nah:rolleyes:

Paul T

[northwind]

You are now gonna have to start making some brave moves, or get held up by them. Sure it is fun beating them up if you have the experience/balls, but if you are new, its just going to get annoying and impair your progress. At least if you are on a SS6, you are more equal down the straight so more likely to arrive at a turn on your own terms and can then negotiate it as you feel fit without some spoon parked in the way!! 8)


Quoted for truth... Even I get this and I'm not fast at all. If the red mist fades I'll just take a slow lap and get away from folks like this if possible, but it's still annoying, you end up riding to their pace or lack of and not being able to ride how you want. For a racer or aggressive rider it might be fun but for me it's just constant frustration. And frustration is NOT good on a trackday.

(edit- this happens much less in intermediate, but I usually do the knockhill evenings that have only fast and slow groups, and I'm miles away from fast.)

[erik]

This thread is a bit depressing, but I guess you're all just being honest.
I've just done my second trackday on my sv650s (have done others on my bandit 400 before) and it's heaps of fun, but the stock suspension isn't great. I've put emulators in the front, will be getting springs soon and probably putting a zx6r shock in the back.
I got my sv because I wanted to try a twin and the sv's are a nice looking and sounding bike and also because I knew that with a bit of work, the sv's are good on the track. They race them here in F3 and protwins.

It is a bit frustrating being stuck behind someone on a bigger bike in the corners (as I experienced yesterday: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PleZUgZD2Qk).

[Blue_SV650S]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PleZUgZD2Qk).

35s in 8) 8)

EDIT: Just watched the rest of the Vid (had to post the 35s comment as that was cool! :D). Good vid .. and yes in parts, that is a good illustration of getting held up spoiling your flow/laps*. I see you have more videos, gonna watch one or two more 8)


*I actually wanted to grab the bars - put you in a different part of the track and flick your fingers off the front brake leaver at times mind!! :D ... you could have wasted so many more of them with only slight adjustments ;) ... good safe and confident riding overall though good to watch 8)

[northwind]

Was that guy's head even once on the inside of the turn? Was he a hunchback or something, the further to the inside his bum went the further to the outside goes his head.

[Blue_SV650S]

I keep re-watching 35s ... :D

[mister c]

Tis me Mr C!!

Thanks for your kind words!

Probably very biased, but I think the SV is a cracking trackbike, granted they can take some cash to make real good, but once there what a thing to ride!!!!

My Sv can lap Anglesey at a pace that would get top five in the SS600 race:shock::smt026 and up till last weekend was the fastet bike round Three sisters this year:eek:

I could rattle on all night about my love affair with my SV, but the missus is watching so I'll have to tone it down a bit.....

Horses for corses really, but I will say some of those £500 steelies need some proper TLC and in truthfullness are they that much more FUN?.......nah:rolleyes:

Paul T

Nice to see you stuffing the IL4's mucker, very entertaining stuff :)

[erik]

35s in 8) 8)

EDIT: Just watched the rest of the Vid (had to post the 35s comment as that was cool! :D). Good vid .. and yes in parts, that is a good illustration of getting held up spoiling your flow/laps*. I see you have more videos, gonna watch one or two more 8)


*I actually wanted to grab the bars - put you in a different part of the track and flick your fingers off the front brake leaver at times mind!! :D ... you could have wasted so many more of them with only slight adjustments ;) ... good safe and confident riding overall though good to watch 8)
I'm glad you liked it, thanks for the comments. :)
Was that guy's head even once on the inside of the turn? Was he a hunchback or something, the further to the inside his bum went the further to the outside goes his head.
The guy with the orange patch on his leathers? I hadn't noticed that before, but I see what you mean. He seemed to be doing ok though, I think the guy on the black gsxr was holding him and me up. We're not allowed to pass on the inside going into corners, and the black gsxr was taking such wide corner entries that I couldn't figure out how to pass him. Maybe next time.