Am I hanging off too much?

[plowsie]

Lean the bike more? The knee is getting down but looking at this picture it says to me the bike is not cranked over enough, though it feels quick through the bend...

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w46/plowsie/31012009658.jpg

[pencil shavings]

that road looks soooo dirty, be safe :)

I think so you get more used to getting your knee down you will be able to get greater angles untill, well, you know.

other than that, looking good!

and my oppionion comes with a massive disclaimer: Ive never got my knee down :(

[kwak zzr]

ur position looks good mate, just lean alittle more but as stated above its not realy KD weather tho, cold tyres and salty roads :( any how its nearly upright :)

[dizzyblonde]

can't understand all this knee down milarky, I prefer to get the bike cranked over more:-)

[plowsie]

can't understand all this knee down milarky, I prefer to get the bike cranked over more:-)
Been there done that to the point of cranking over too far on a 180 tyre, just really testing out which feels comfier and faster at the same time.

[DarrenSV650S]

It doesn't look very far over at all. But that's what you want. Means that you'll have better grip. When I was trying to get my knee down I was constantly scraping the peg but my knee wasn't touching. I gave up in the end because it was getting dangerous

[Alpinestarhero]

Hanging of on a dirty corner is a gooood thing

I have been hanging off quite a bit latley, feels safer

[kwak zzr]

i find it almost feels silly you hanging off soo much! but once its scraped and you get a feel for where the ground is it'll come more natural mate.

[plowsie]

i find it almost feels silly you hanging off soo much! but once its scraped and you get a feel for where the ground is it'll come more natural mate.
Yeah its not that i haven't been able to do it, I was doing it consitently and comfortably end of last summer, just after having a look at this makes me wonder.

[kwak zzr]

its a cracking photo and your positioning looks good to me.

[Wideboy]

i don't stick my knee out i just hunker down on the bike and zip through the corners

[dizzyblonde]

When I try sticking me knee out it feels like it'll wobble me off...however I do like to do the butt shffle and get me **** hanging off the seat ;-)

[carty]

It does look like you're hanging off a fair bit, I certainly don't think hanging off that much at that lean angle is doing a lot for turning the bike but as others have said your actual body positioning looks pretty good to me, good head position, nice bent inside arm.

Just lean the bike more!

[arcdef]

sorry for the "noob" question, but do you have to stick your knee out when leaning off the bike? Can you shove your bum out there and keep you leg in, or does it jsut come as part of the package so to speak?

Cheers

[Oggyplonk]

got my knee down for the first time last year but had to lean off the bike loads......such a good feeling though....good times

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/Oggyplonk/n688160177_1034346_4596.jpg

[plowsie]

Hey Arcdef, ride how you feel comfortable mate, its taken me ages to learn how to get me knee down.

[carty]

sorry for the "noob" question, but do you have to stick your knee out when leaning off the bike? Can you shove your bum out there and keep you leg in, or does it jsut come as part of the package so to speak?

Cheers

You don't have to at all - pretty much everybody's positioning when sat on, or hanging off the bike is different. Generally if I stick my knee out I'm going round a fairly tight corner or at quite a pace and I pretty much look down the line of the knee which I find helps. Plowsie's just sticking his knee out at right angles to make the photo look good :p :mrgreen:

[carty]

got my knee down for the first time last year but had to lean off the bike loads......such a good feeling though....good times

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/Oggyplonk/n688160177_1034346_4596.jpg

Bl00dy hell mate you're looking straight at that drain cover - did you go over it?!

[plowsie]

got my knee down for the first time last year but had to lean off the bike loads......such a good feeling though....good times

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/Oggyplonk/n688160177_1034346_4596.jpg
Looking good, thing about my style also that is different to yours, my foot, i do not use ball of my feet, its more heel bottom flat on the heel plates.

[dizzyblonde]

I really like the vid/pic with the pillion getting their knee down.....now that is ace 8)

[Oggyplonk]

nah missed it by miles mate

[dizzyblonde]

Looking good, thing about my style also that is different to yours, my foot, .

run it over lately plowsie:mrgreen:

[plowsie]

run it over lately plowsie:mrgreen:
Not yet :lol:

[Oggyplonk]

I got a vid of it too :D


http://s134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/Oggyplonk/?action=view&current=P1000601_xvid.flv

[TSM]

Hanging of on a dirty corner is a gooood thing

I have been hanging off quite a bit latley, feels safer

Ahh thats a bit diffrent than hanging off to get knee down, hanging off to make the bike turn while maintaining the bike as vertical as possable for traction, good for bad weather road riding.

[carty]

I got a vid of it too :D


http://s134.photobucket.com/albums/q101/Oggyplonk/?action=view&current=P1000601_xvid.flv

Awesome

[plowsie]

Ahh thats a bit diffrent than hanging off to get knee down, hanging off to make the bike turn while maintaining the bike as vertical as possable for traction, good for bad weather road riding.
Agreed. And also good for maintaining the bike as vertical as possible to keep the topping on my Pizza.

[Frank]

its a cracking photo and your positioning looks good to me.
well,appart from being on the wrong side of the road;)

[ging6996]

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/th_bikeknee.jpg (http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/?action=view&current=bikeknee.flv)

[suzsv650]

really wouldnt be doing KD in this weather i can see a new Thread for a foot rest fairing and exhaust soon

[plowsie]

really wouldnt be doing KD in this weather i can see a new Thread for a foot rest fairing and exhaust soon
Already need them and to me the roads were okay on Saturday, warm enough and once I felt the temp in the tyres go down due to slippyness I stopped.

[ging6996]

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/th_bikeknee4.jpg (http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/?action=view&current=bikeknee4.flv)

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/th_bikeknee3.jpg (http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/?action=view&current=bikeknee3.flv)

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/th_bikeknee2.jpg (http://s270.photobucket.com/albums/jj82/rats_88/?action=view&current=bikeknee2.flv)





both bikes are sv's. and we were doing this at considerate times of day.

managed to get my knee down thanks to people on thise forum.

[kwak zzr]

This thread its NOT big its NOT clever! is foooooookin ACE!!!!! roll on the summer!!!!!

[Binky]

Knee down virgin here checking in seeing what all the fuss is about. :D

[plowsie]

Not much, especially looking that it wouldn't have helped today.

[Binky]

Not much, especially looking that it wouldn't have helped today.

Hopefully something i can tick off my list after this year though.

[carty]

Hopefully something i can tick off my list after this year though.

To be fair you didn't have leathers last year did you? I've seen you cranking that SV over a lot but you can't exactly try and get your knee down in textiles! :mrgreen:

[plowsie]

To be fair you didn't have leathers last year did you? I've seen you cranking that SV over a lot but you can't exactly try and get your knee down in textiles! :mrgreen:
Who says?

[vardypeeps]

Lean the bike more? The knee is getting down but looking at this picture it says to me the bike is not cranked over enough, though it feels quick through the bend...

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w46/plowsie/31012009658.jpg

Looks fine but remember your knee going down is to gauge how far your leaning. So in that sense your position is fine you just need to lift your knee as you go further over. Just be careful as when you get to the point there aint no going back.

[Dangerous Dave]

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w46/plowsie/31012009658.jpg

Not bad, you are getting there and it is by far not the worst I have seen, but as you already pointed out it is you thats is leaning and not the bike!

[DarrenSV650S]

Not bad, you are getting there and it is by far not the worst I have seen, but as you already pointed out it is you thats is leaning and not the bike!
Which is good

[carty]

Who says?

Well I guess you can if you've got knee sliders on your textiles or you don't mind shredding them to bits :confused:

[plowsie]

Well I guess you can if you've got knee sliders on your textiles or you don't mind shredding them to bits :confused:
I meant to put a :D in the middle of that sentence lol. I meant who says you can't :lol: Cos you said you can't try.

[Dangerous Dave]

Which is good
Errr.. no, you are shifting all the top weight without altering the centre of gravity by leaning the bike over.

[carty]

I meant to put a :D in the middle of that sentence lol. I meant who says you can't :lol: Cos you said you can't try.

Fair enough! Either way, Binky now has leathers so I expect to be seeing some knee down action at a ride-out soon :mrgreen:

[minifun]

I'm a short **** so I have to lean the bike over lots to get my knee down - I was scraping knee and toe at the same time around silverstone :-D

Wait till the weather and roads improve and just play lots! Best place to practice is track days though!

[speedplay]

I'm a short **** so I have to lean the bike over lots to get my knee down - I was scraping knee and toe at the same time around silverstone :-D

Wait till the weather and roads improve and just play lots! Best place to practice is track days though!

Theres some good, clean, new tarmac up at swan valley....;)

[minifun]

We have plenty of roundabouts in MK for practice when the weather improves! lol

[speedplay]

We have plenty of roundabouts in MK for practice when the weather improves! lol

Dont I know it!! MK is the reason I bought a tomtom when I first moved here!
Took me nearly 2 hours to get from wolverton to cosgrove!

[minifun]

Its not that hard! lol I only get lost occasionally :o

[plowsie]

Theres some good, clean, new tarmac up at swan valley....;)
Good facking point!!!!!!

[speedplay]

Just have to wait for the snow to clear so i can get off this estate!!
All the main roads are clear but I cant get to them!

[DarrenSV650S]

Errr.. no, you are shifting all the top weight without altering the centre of gravity by leaning the bike over.
Shifting weight will alter the centre of gravity. The bike will turn more than if he was sitting bolt upright. So he will turn more while keeping the same tyre contact patch, which means more grip

[Dangerous Dave]

Shifting weight will alter the centre of gravity. The bike will turn more than if he was sitting bolt upright. So he will turn more while keeping the same tyre contact patch, which means more grip
You may want to explain that to Valentino, Toseland, Kiyonari, Haga, etc....

[plowsie]

You may want to explain that to Valentino, Toseland, Kiyonari, Haga, etc....
Am I right in thinking, the centre of gravity (maybe not the right term) if cranked over enough and knee supporting is going to be your knee/leg?

[carty]

Am I right in thinking, the centre of gravity (maybe not the right term) if cranked over enough and knee supporting is going to be your knee/leg?

I've seen a diagram that explains c.o.g. somewhere- I don't know the physics behind it myself but I would guess the cog would be somewhere just to the side of the top of your engine when cranked over- moved to whichever side you're leaning- someone can explain better I'm sure!

[speedplay]

This one?

[carty]

This one?

That's the one mate :cool:

As I suspected (though I didn't explain it very well!) the C.O.G. is shown on the pic around level with the top of the engine and moved to the inside of the turn. Obviously it goes the other way if you're leaning the other way. The more you hang off the more to the way you're hanging the cog goes - but I'm sure there comes a point where you don't want to move the cog further away from the centre of the bike.

Can you tell I'm not a mathematician or physicist?!

Wherever Vale puts the C.O.G, that's probably the optimum place!

[DarrenSV650S]

You may want to explain that to Valentino, Toseland, Kiyonari, Haga, etc....
So if you rode in a straight line then theoretically held out an anvil :rolleyes: at arms length on one side, you think you would keep riding in a straight line?

[plowsie]

So if you rode in a straight line then theoretically held out an anvil :rolleyes: at arms length on one side, you think you would keep riding in a straight line?
The bike would, you wouldn't :lol:

[yorkie_chris]

So if you rode in a straight line then theoretically held out an anvil :rolleyes: at arms length on one side, you think you would keep riding in a straight line?

It is possible to do that.

[DarrenSV650S]

It is possible to do that.
Without adjusting/influencing the steering?

[dirtsk8]

I managed to KD my CBR6 and my SP-1, but I could only scrape my toe-slider on my SV

SP:

http://img236.imageshack.us/img236/8900/yeehaah33idzg3.jpg

Not leaned that far over, either, in the photo.

[Dangerous Dave]

So if you rode in a straight line then theoretically held out an anvil :rolleyes: at arms length on one side, you think you would keep riding in a straight line?
Re-look at the OP's picture and compare it it the COG picture of Valentino Rossi, Valentino is sitting upright and the OP is hanging off the bike. The Honda RC211V is cranked over and the SV650 is almost bolt upright, my point is it is the bike that should be leaning and not the person hanging off of it! Hanging off alters the COG, sitting upright and leaning the bike doesn't...

Errr.. no, you are shifting all the top weight without altering the centre of gravity by leaning the bike over.

[yorkie_chris]

Any cornering requires the CoG to be moved towards the inside of the corner, i.e off the vertical upwards line from the contact patch.

This is the CoG of the bike-rider system. Which can also be moved in relation to it's normal position by hanging off.

[DarrenSV650S]

Errr.. no, you are shifting all the top weight without altering the centre of gravity by leaning the bike over.


Hanging off alters the COG, sitting upright and leaning the bike doesn't...
You seem to be completely contradicting yourself there

[yorkie_chris]

CoG in what respect? It moves with relation to the ground when tipping in, but moves in relation to the centerline of the bike when hanging off.

[carty]

I think what DD is trying to say is that in order to get a bike round a corner, first and foremost you lean the bike. If you are going fast enough it can also be beneficial to hang off the bike to shift the weight to the inside. Hanging off is a style of riding, not 'the way' to turn the bike.

[DarrenSV650S]

I think what DD is trying to say is that in order to get a bike round a corner, first and foremost you lean the bike. If you are going fast enough it can also be beneficial to hang off the bike to shift the weight to the inside. Hanging off is a style of riding, not 'the way' to turn the bike.
The original point I was trying to make was that hanging off is good in that it means you can keep the bike more upright, not totally upright. Hanging off means you can lean the bike slightly less. Less lean means more grip

Dangerous Dave disagreed with that

[ArtyLady]

but surely if the bike is more upright it wont go round the corner? :confused:

[DarrenSV650S]

but surely if the bike is more upright it wont go round the corner? :confused:
Well I reckon hanging off has the same effect as leaning the bike. So lets say the bike is more upright............ for it to go round the same corner at the same speed you would need to hang off it to pull you around the corner

[DarrenSV650S]

Michael Neeves explains it better than I am here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCg3BMGe52M&feature=PlayList&p=51EEA250FCDBE7C7&index=0&playnext=1)

[yorkie_chris]

Well I reckon hanging off has the same effect as leaning the bike. So lets say the bike is more upright............ for it to go round the same corner at the same speed you would need to hang off it to pull you around the corner

It does.

The CoG (of the rider and bike combined) is normally vertical, it is leaned over to go around a corner.

When hanging off, the CoG of the system is effectively leaned over more than the CoG of the bike alone, meaning you have effectively more lean angle.

But, the tyres only notice the lean angle of the bike alone so you get a slightly larger contact patch.

[Baph]

It does.

The CoG (of the rider and bike combined) is normally vertical, it is leaned over to go around a corner.

When hanging off, the CoG of the system is effectively leaned over more than the CoG of the bike alone, meaning you have effectively more lean angle.

But, the tyres only notice the lean angle of the bike alone so you get a slightly larger contact patch.

Plowsie, that, right there, is a technical description of what I said to you at AR07. :D

For everyone else, I told Plowsie that I rarely lean off at all (I still don't) unless I'm hooning around, or the road conditions aren't great (it was raining when I talked to Plowsie). My argument for climbing off the bike more in the wet was that the bike can stay more upright & still make the corner, so you get better grip & it's safer.

Plowsie listened, tried it, and said he felt the same. :cheers:

As for the topic of the thread, IMO Plowsie, you're hanging off fine. When the weather gets better, don't stick the knee out as much. Instead throw the bike over more. Your knee will still hit the floor, and you'll be going faster around the corner.

[ady]

3195 and im not hanging enough! but being a short ****, thats all i have to give!! lol

[yorkie_chris]

Move your head over more IMO. You should be closer to saying hello to the wingmirror

[ady]

ill give that ago.... well when the bloody weather sorts its self out!!!

[yorkie_chris]

It's rare that my rse leaves the seat, a lot of my quick riding over summer is done 2 up so no point hanging off like an ape. I just move my head and upper body, it has the same effect.

[DarrenSV650S]

Where is Dangerous Dave?

[carty]

Where is Dangerous Dave?

Probably in danger somewhere :mrgreen: