View Full Version : Hard nosed b*stard
Me, that is!
If people cannot get to work because they claim to be snowed in, am I right to deduct a day's pay?
if you want
i think the better option would be to request people either make up the time or take it as holiday
You're running a business........so from you point of view I would say yes.
I have worked from home two days this week because of the snow. I set off at 7 this morning and by 9 had done 2 miles...........I live 18 miles from work.
There is no trains, no buses (they were stuck in the same traffic anyway) and no other option for getting to work short of walking.
The problem is different people have different circumstances, some people are lazy and cant be arsed.......and some genuinely would struggle to get to work.
I offered to take today as holiday because I'm running out of work to do at home but my boss declined......he is not a partner though so does not loss money from non profitable days.
if you want
i think the better option would be to request people either make up the time or take it as holiday
Yes, agreed, but if they make it clear that they think it's my loss? Incidentally I've checked that the bus service is running.
also it's not like we weren't all giving plenty of warning. prior arrangements should have been made, and as you say the buses were running so if they claim its your loss they're skating on thin ice to be honest
dizzyblonde
05-02-09, 10:05 AM
problem of today is, everyone lives far away from where they work. In tha 'good old days' everybody lived within walking distance of their job, or one bus journey.
plus you obviously made it in Ed, or you'd not be posting on here!!!
problem of today is, everyone lives far away from where they work. In tha 'good old days' everybody lived within walking distance of their job, or one bus journey.
Dizz - this person lives out in the south Shropshire hills but it is a direct bus service.
The reason why it has irritated me is that everyone else has made an effort to get in - and some have had the same problems - but this person has not.
Dicky Ticker
05-02-09, 10:08 AM
yes----------------hard nosed and Scottish
Although we did tell our drivers not to bother as it is cheaper to pay a days wages than have a truck off the road being inspected and repaired. Apart from that they now have to do 5days work in 4 days----swings and roundabouts.
If the offending party does the same work in the ensuing days by staying for an extra hour to cover the shortfall,I think would be a fair outcome for both parties
the_lone_wolf
05-02-09, 10:09 AM
first the bins...
now he's docking wages
eeeeexcellent
http://agencyspy.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/burns.jpg
;)
We've had two days off this week because of snow and ice. The first, we came in, and went home because we couldnt get on with anything (we work outside). We wont get paid for that, which is annoying butfair enough. The second day we were told to stay at home, so I expect to be paid.
I would offer them the choice of having it as a holiday day or unpaid.
dizzyblonde
05-02-09, 10:10 AM
The reason why it has irritated me is that everyone else has made an effort to get in - and some have had the same problems - but this person has not.
hmmmmmm I think its a case of Ican'tbearseditis then;)
petevtwin650
05-02-09, 10:11 AM
Ok, workers may be able to get into work (eventually), but what happens if the snow continues and they can't get home again?
I wouldn't want to force anybody I was responsible for to do something potentially dangerous even, in extreme cases fatal, just for a non essential job.
Dock em a days holiday Ed.
Incidentally, my street is full of cars, when it would be virtually deserted on a weekday. It's like a Sunday out there. :cool:
I agree with keithd, ask them to make up the time or take as holiday. I've not made it in today for the first time this week but spoke to my boss and he couldn't get in either (we catch the same train). My boss doesn't care cos I'm paid daily anyway. Jobs round the house for me today!
Ahhh, now I was going to say not fair to deduct pay, until you said that everyone else had got in. That's different, I know how I would feel if I'd made the effort and someone didn't and they didn't either lose a days pay or a days holiday.
I think you have to give them the option, but they need to lose something in fairness to the others.
Now I'm lucky, 7 min walk to work, but as the school is closed I'm working from home as able to log on! Can get loads done without being disturbed, except by the .org!!
Sometimes it's great working in a school!
fizzwheel
05-02-09, 10:13 AM
i think the better option would be to request people either make up the time or take it as holiday
That would be what I'd ask my employeer if I could do. Thing is, whilst the main roads might be clear the side roads havent been. On tuesday when we had all the snow here, the only car that moved was our 4 x 4 nobody even bothered trying to get out. But when I went for a walk 200 or 300 metres away the main road through Yeovil was open and had no snow on it, just getting out to it was a nightmare. The when Liz did get out onto the A303 it wasnt gritted and she said getting to work was a nightmare.
Yesterday she collected a colleague from her house as she coudnt even get her car off her drive...
Mind you if the buses are running then maybe you are not...
dizzyblonde
05-02-09, 10:13 AM
Ok, workers may be able to get into work (eventually), but what happens if the snow continues and they can't get home again?
poor Melody had this on monday night. She'd done a twelve hour shift, and the hospital car park was completely filled, her car wasn't even going to think about going anywhere. I still don't know if she went home or stayed in the hospital and did a rollover shift.
Note to self, never apply for a job with Ed! :D:D
Mr Lou has walked to work, has taken him 2 hours to walk, but he's made it.
Note to self, never apply for a job with Ed! :D:D
I'm not that bad!!! Yesterday's explosion was over my email asking the team to take staggered lunchbreaks so as to ensure we have enough people to answer the phone, as usually there's a 1 o'clock stampede:rolleyes:
timwilky
05-02-09, 10:19 AM
Ed
When I was an apprentice, we had one lad who would regularly phone in in winter to say he was snowed in. After a while of this, the training officer went out to check on Pilky "snowed in".
He did manage to make it through to Pilky farm, unfortunately he did manage to write off a company car getting there and had to walk 3 miles on the moors to get to the nearest house (Pilkys).
His family were good enough to put him up overnight until the snow ploughs were able to break through next day. After that it was accepted that if Pilky said he was snowed in. He was.
Incidentally my company has a bad weather policy. We do not expect people to travel to meetings etc away from their normal place of work if the government advice is not to drive in that area. We will allow 30 minutes late, and to leave early without loss. OR for people who have the ability to work from home.
We expect staff who are fit and able to be prepared to walk upto 2 miles in order to get into work .
usually there's a 1 o'clock stampede:rolleyes:
Crikey they last out a while! I've usually finished my lunch by 12:01!
Be fair to them Ed, it doesn't seem like you've got your head down this morning :-dd
:-D
Be fair to them Ed, it doesn't seem like you've got your head down this morning :-dd
IT policy clearly isnt enforced
lol
I'm not that bad!!! Yesterday's explosion was over my email asking the team to take staggered lunchbreaks so as to ensure we have enough people to answer the phone, as usually there's a 1 o'clock stampede:rolleyes:
As long as they have a break then not a lot to moan about! When I worked for the Beeb we had to stagger lunches, at first took it in turns for who went at 12 and who went at 1, in the end we agreed that we preferred a set time, so one group stuck with the 12 and one with the 1 o'clock.
I'm now lucky if I ever manage to get a lunch break.
petevtwin650
05-02-09, 10:24 AM
Tim Wilky's company seem to have the right idea.
I got docked a days wages last year even though I rang in in plenty of time to ask for a days holiday. I deemed it imprudent to drive in those conditions. I only work in a warehouse ffs.
Aren't people being advised not to travel unless absolutely neccessary?
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i184/petevtwin650/Weatherreport.jpg
I'm with you Ed.
I think the option of making up the time or a days holiday is fair enough. I guess it comes down to the working relationship you have with this person. For somebody who is otherwise hard working, doesnt complain about the odd half hour extra work and honest I would give them the benefit of the doubt and let it go.
If not, the option of making up time or a holiday. Its only fair.
I have a pretty good working relationship at work, I often go out of my way to do things that technically I dont have to. The odd late bit of work, meeting at lunch time etc. For that I get flexibility and trust, I can take a couple of hours to see my kids Christmas carol concert etc without having to claim a holiday.
It works well for me and I feel like an adult, not a school kid. I think they call it work/life balance these days :-)
Dangerous Dave
05-02-09, 10:34 AM
I say don't pay them, there is no such thing as being snowed in.
Me, that is!
If people cannot get to work because they claim to be snowed in, am I right to deduct a day's pay?
Absolutely not Ed! As an employer it is your risk if people are not able to get to work. It's your fault for employing someone who lives out in the sticks & you chose not to provide accommodation in a flat above the office ;) If they were on a contract that you paid them the hours worked then that would be different.
Take my example on Monday, there was literally 12 inches of snow outside my house (35 miles from the office) so I couldn't ride & the Police had closed the slip road to the main trunk road to London so I walked for an hour & half to the train station to find that there were no trains running (bloody local radio couldn't even report that :roll: & the internet was so overloaded I couldn't get onto National rail.com)
So I would say I made sufficient effort to get to work & I would not be willing to even take that day as holiday nor be expected to make up the time. Plus you may know that no a single bus ran that morning in London
On the other hand if the person in question clearly made insufficient effort to get into work you can do what you like with him - dock a days holiday/wages or fire him for lying to you depending on how much you rely on him.
I say don't pay them, there is no such thing as being snowed in.
True, someone ffrom Guy's hospital walked 18 miles in the snow to get to work :shock:
But Feck that ;)
Gazza77
05-02-09, 10:48 AM
I'd say offer them the alternative; lose a days annual leave or take it as unpaid. If there is public transport available and it is not unreasonable to get to, then it should be used.
As people probably know, I get the train into work everyday rather than drive or ride the 50+ mile round trip. Everyday this week the train has been loads quieter than usual and I can't understand it; if people don't want to drive, then surely it ought to be busier with people using alternatives to get to work. I had to walk down steep, unlit country lanes to get to the station which is about 1 1/2 miles from my house in up to a foot of snow on Tuesday, and I was still on time.
If I was being lazy and couldn't be bothered to go to work, I'd not have been in this week, as there is still 6 inches of snow down the lane to my house, so no way of getting my car out.
[When I was a lad mode on] People today just won't put the effort in...:rolleyes: [When I was a lad mode off]
You'll all be delighted to hear that said person has just arrived:cheers:
I posted originally immediately after I called the person concerned, so it was hardly a mammoth struggle to get in.
Gazza77
05-02-09, 10:52 AM
You'll all be delighted to hear that said person has just arrived:cheers:
I posted originally immediately after I called the person concerned, so it was hardly a mammoth struggle to get in.
Hope you gave them a bollocking for beibng late. :p
the_lone_wolf
05-02-09, 10:52 AM
wonder how much compo he'll get when he slips on the pavement outside or crashes his car going home this evening when it's all frozen solid and gone dark?:mrgreen:
When I worked at Lotus (about 8 miles from Norwich) a couple of years ago we had people claiming they were snowed in who lived in Norwich yet two contractors who travelled from Colchester and Chelmsford everyday still made it in. Those that "couldn't" make it in were made to look very silly the next day!
wonder how much compo he'll get when he slips on the pavement outside or crashes his car going home this evening when it's all frozen solid and gone dark?:mrgreen:
As long as it doesn't happen in my office, that's their problem:mrgreen:
Gazza77
05-02-09, 10:59 AM
When I worked at Lotus (about 8 miles from Norwich) a couple of years ago we had people claiming they were snowed in who lived in Norwich yet two contractors who travelled from Colchester and Chelmsford everyday still made it in. Those that "couldn't" make it in were made to look very silly the next day!
I used to work about 25 miles from where I lived last time we had much snow in Leeds, about 1998/9 iirc. I got into work 30 mins late having driven, and bet people who lived less than a mile away by over an hour. :rolleyes:
petevtwin650
05-02-09, 11:01 AM
wonder how much compo he'll get when he slips on the pavement outside or crashes his car going home this evening when it's all frozen solid and gone dark?:mrgreen:
As long as it doesn't happen in my office, that's their problem:mrgreen:
Better turn the heating on then Ed. :p
See. you've given yourself an ulcer over nothing. :smt019
the_lone_wolf
05-02-09, 11:06 AM
As long as it doesn't happen in my office, that's their problem:mrgreen:
until he claims he was "instructed" to come to work despite weather warnings...
the HSE inspector probably won't like the piles of flammable waste paper appearing next to the desks either;)
Dave20046
05-02-09, 11:17 AM
Our boss doesn't do mercy, everyone who took a day off either took it as holiday pay or unpaid. My manager didn't come in from huddersfield on the 3rd and he got a rollocking. Tough love, everything we do we get a rollocking for (even if it was nothing to do with us) yet we still work are arses off.
Dangerous Dave
05-02-09, 11:21 AM
Our boss doesn't do mercy
Good for him/her.
People moan the country comes to a stand because of the snow, I wonder if the majority of these people are now sat at home because of a little snow???
As long as it doesn't happen in my office, that's their problem:mrgreen:
+1 this is turning into a nanny state (if we arent already there!). What if it rains and they get wet, OMG!
Warthog
05-02-09, 11:26 AM
I think it depends Ed, he could well have been properly snowed in, or he could be lazy. As in Tim Wilky's example, you can't really tell unless you go there and see for yourself. I managed to make it in, it really wasn't that hard, plus the roads are deserted cos of all the wusses!
What happens if anyone who doesn't go to work gets shot instantly? I bet everyone would be able to make it in then no problems...
If you feel that deducting pay after the authorities have said "only essential journies should be undertaken" is ok then by all means take their pay away.
After all, you are the boss.
Mind you, if you were my boss I would be having some very harsh and thought out words if you deducted my pay.
Putting pressure on people and having them risk theirs, and other road users safety, not to mention possible costs for repairs to vehicles is not what I would like to see in a boss.
Why not go the other way and reward the ones that made an effort to get to work.
I am sure you will gain more respect for rewarding rather than punishing.
I make no apologies for deciding not to go to work today. I was allowed home early yesterday because I had nothing to do, that will not change today, so I'll take it as holiday.
It's all very well saying people should make the effort, but if I fall and break something I'm totally screwed. I don't get sick pay.
Warthog
05-02-09, 11:30 AM
If you feel that deducting pay after the authorities have said "only essential journies should be undertaken" is ok then by all means take their pay away.
After all, you are the boss.
Mind you, if you were my boss I would be having some very harsh and thought out words if you deducted my pay.
Putting pressure on people and having them risk theirs, and other road users safety, not to mention possible costs for repairs to vehicles is not what I would like to see in a boss.
Why not go the other way and reward the ones that made an effort to get to work.
I am sure you will gain more respect for rewarding rather than punishing.
Thats a very good point.
Dave20046
05-02-09, 11:34 AM
Good for him/her.
People moan the country comes to a stand because of the snow, I wonder if the majority of these people are now sat at home because of a little snow???
This is what I've been saying (on another forum). There was a lass who worked for the NHS who didn't go in because her usual bus wasn't running and the other one was £1.80 more expensive so she rang in but found it unfair they didn't pay her for her day off. She got absolutely slated then the next day she came online and was all day until someone pointed out our taxes were paying for her to sit on an nhs computer all day ****ing about on forums.
Dave20046
05-02-09, 11:36 AM
If you feel that deducting pay after the authorities have said "only essential journies should be undertaken" is ok then by all means take their pay away.
After all, you are the boss.
Mind you, if you were my boss I would be having some very harsh and thought out words if you deducted my pay.
Putting pressure on people and having them risk theirs, and other road users safety, not to mention possible costs for repairs to vehicles is not what I would like to see in a boss.
Why not go the other way and reward the ones that made an effort to get to work.
I am sure you will gain more respect for rewarding rather than punishing.
You're right in a way but if the poeple are likely to take the pizza then I can see why they get tough. I brok my pelvis in a bike crash, rang the boss from the ambulance saying I wouldn't be in tomorrow (at this point couldn't feel my legs and was a little worried), took about a week and a half off then came in for the next few weeks on crutches. I got paid in full for my time off 'because I tried' and I respect him for that. Just try and concentrate on that occasion when he does unfair stuff lol
Gazza77
05-02-09, 12:03 PM
I make no apologies for deciding not to go to work today. I was allowed home early yesterday because I had nothing to do, that will not change today, so I'll take it as holiday.
It's all very well saying people should make the effort, but if I fall and break something I'm totally screwed. I don't get sick pay.
I don't see the harm in that - you choose to take it as leave. It's the people that expect to get an extra day leave for free and so don't make an effort that get my goat.
To be fair to Ed he phoned me and asked what the roads were like and if the busses were running as i live not far away from the person concerned (Just cross country a few miles). the bus was running and the roads were just wet. No lying snow at all. The bad weather was mainly in the east of the county ( Telford, Bridgenorth etc). The roads there were diabolical, Icy and snow on them, loads of accidents this morning mainly from skidding on ice. The weather forecast just gave a blanket warning of orrible conditions and for peeps to only drive if neccessary, didn't apply to the majority of the county at all, just the east. I'm sure Ed will deal with the problem in his usual and caring way.:-D
Daryl.
p.s. having been for drinkies with Ed last night i know how p***ed off he is with some of his staff, so i can understand his frustration when she didn't turn up for work.
...and after I called Daryl, I called the bus company, which confirmed that the bus service from that particular location to Shrewsbury was running normally. The person arrived here within just over an hour. So I think I was justified. Also, as D says, most of the snow was in the east of the county, I still have people from Telford and Shawbury who came in.
I will tell everyone to go home at 4pm today though, cos it will freeze and they might catch a cold:rolleyes::D
jimmy__riddle
05-02-09, 12:10 PM
make them take it as holiday.
having been for drinkies with Ed last night i know how p***ed off he is with some of his staff
Something wrong with his recruitment practices too :lol:
Here it's simple. Can't get into work then either a take a day's paid leave or work from home if you'd had the foresight to look at the weather forecast (and you have the type of job where taking work home is possible).
Ed, to not have this hassle again may i suggest buying a 7 seat 4 wheel drive, employ me to look after it and pick up all your staff and deliver them to your office on time. i would then return in the afternoon and take them home again.:D:D:D:D
Daryl.
I'm with you Ed.
I have a pretty good working relationship at work, I often go out of my way to do things that technically I dont have to. The odd late bit of work, meeting at lunch time etc. For that I get flexibility and trust, I can take a couple of hours to see my kids Christmas carol concert etc without having to claim a holiday.
It works well for me and I feel like an adult, not a school kid. I think they call it work/life balance these days :-)
I'm the same with my assistant, she works hard and always goes the extra mile, so if she's 5-10 mins late in the morning I turn a blind eye, as I know she won't leave till she's happy she's cleared everything.
also it's not like we weren't all giving plenty of warning. prior arrangements should have been made, and as you say the buses were running so if they claim its your loss they're skating on thin ice to be honest
Indeed. I knew there was a high chance I wouldn't make it into the office today. I took work home with me. As it is, I am now in the office the roads clearing enough for me to make the journey. I think a very slack attitude toward making any effort should be reprimanded. Dock them a days pay or make them take the day as a holiday.
slark01
05-02-09, 12:41 PM
If it was me, I would have asked for evidence from the person, ie a digital photo of them blocked in.
This person was taking the **** and should have been dealt with a rollocking at the very least.
Ed your a wuss ;-):smt019
I say don't pay them, there is no such thing as being snowed in.
True, but there is such a thing as the roads being blocked by other things. This morning, it took nearly 2 hours to complete 3/4s of my journey to work that normally takes 45 mins. I never actually made it there, because the roads were blocked by lorries who were unable to get up hills and therefore caused tailbacks of several miles, and whilst sat there not going anywhere I had a call to say my workplace had shut because people couldn't get in.
It then took nearly another 2 hours to get home. The main roads were blocked by lorries, so impassble but because of other vehicles stuck, not because I was stuck. I resorted to using the C-roads that nobody else had been on. Although they had about 10cm of snow on them, nobody else was using them so it was fairly easy. As I say, it's not the snow that stopped me, it was the other idiots who had blocked the roads!
SoulKiss
05-02-09, 04:34 PM
We got the following badly worded email today
· Thank you to all those who have made the effort to get to work despite the adverse conditions
· Please make sure that your timesheet reflects the work you have done for customers even if you were working from home, so we can bill accordingly
· Finally, if you have chosen to enjoy the snow we would appreciate it if you book holidays accordingly
Fortunately I was able to work from home - otherwise I would be arguing that TfL cancelling the buses and that leading to an overload on the tube meaning that my local station was closed did not constitute "chosing to enjoy the snow."
I could have walked in - would have taken me a couple of hours with the conditions, but only if they guaranteed me full pay if I was off due to slipping and injuring myself........
I got in ok after an hour journey , normally takes 15 mins .
Other people in the office who live only 8 miles away did not come in .
Office was closed at 1:30 by which time I had worked 5 hrs .
People who did not get in or try to get in have to book in half a day holiday and half day free
People who came in get made up to full day ( 7.24)
Really don't know why I bothered to make a effort as its not rewarded :smt013
kwak zzr
05-02-09, 05:49 PM
Me, that is!
If people cannot get to work because they claim to be snowed in, am I right to deduct a day's pay?
Snowed in? Has Royal Mail stopped because of the snow? and dont even start me on schools :twisted:
petevtwin650
05-02-09, 05:51 PM
Snowed in? Has Royal Mail stopped because of the snow? and dont even start me on schools :twisted:
Well we haven't had any mail in three days, so yes it has around here. And no refuse collection on Tueday either.
kwak zzr
05-02-09, 05:53 PM
perhaps people aint sending u any letters.
dizzyblonde
05-02-09, 05:53 PM
Snowed in? Has Royal Mail stopped because of the snow? and dont even start me on schools :twisted:
they're hard b*tards are the posties in HX
http://editorial.jpress.co.uk/web/Upload/HCCN//TH1_3220094HX_news_ab1(21)snow.jpg
this one delivers round Ripponden...believe me its grim up there!
Theres a woman that does her rounds in shorts too, I've asked her if shes cold....apparently not
Snowed in? Has Royal Mail stopped because of the snow? and dont even start me on schools :twisted:
Why are you so wound up about about school's closing? To anyone with an ounce of common sense we had no choice.
About 3/4 of our 1200 students come by (dodgy, 30 year old, double decker) buses from some fairly rural areas so hopefully wouldn't have even attempted to come in.
Many of the 70+ staff have quite a journey to get in and the police were saying don't travel unless you have to.
So we could've ended up with 300 kids in school with a skeleton staff. Snow and ice on the playgrounds and heating struggling.
How would you have felt if your kids had been hit by an icey snowball because the few stretched teachers on duty were having to deal with the kids who'd fallen and broken a bone on the ice?
We are not babysitters. We aim and want to teach the kids in our care. We cannot do that when a variety of conditions makes it dangerous.
I am confident that all the kids who had one or even 2 days off, often with their famililies playing and laughing and all manner of other good things, overall benefitted more than sitting in cold, damp classrooms.
kwak zzr
05-02-09, 06:10 PM
because my children's education IS SO IMPORTANT i cant even take them out of school in the summer for 1 weeks holiday.
because my children's education IS SO IMPORTANT i cant even take them out of school in the summer for 1 weeks holiday.
Yes you can. It may be frowned upon but up to 2 weeks per year is allowed for family holidays.
And I repeat, they would've learned a lot more mucking about in the snow than cooped up in a classroom without enough teachers
Just my bit :)
Well, the way I see it, if you make a real effort to get in, u'll make it there. I did on a bike, in proper snow. I went home at midday, and the tuesday i went in for 1pm. I worked from home in the morning. I made the effort both days, so in my bosses eyes I shouldn't be done for it.
My gf boss was proper angry though. People in his town calling saying they couldn't get in. So he went "be there in 15 min" and hungup and went to get them :lol:
Anyone who still didn't make it in was deducted 1 days holiday.
If the staff made it in, I think they should be fine. Anyone who didn't should either have 1 days pay, OR 1 days holiday removed.
Snow does not stop the country. People stop it. If i can make it in on a bike, people can make it in cars and transport. Or even a bicycle if owned ;)
Dave20046
05-02-09, 06:21 PM
I did 100 miles int golf today (nice and heavy so not bad in snow...if there was any) Yeah there were some iffy roads but if people had of actually tried them they'd have been fine. Every svhool I arrived at was just being manned by the caretaker. Do caretakers all own skimobiles or are teachers and students skiving ****s?
Do caretakers all own skimobiles or are teachers and students skiving ****s?[/quote]
Most caretakers live on site.
And thanks for the insult :(
Dave20046
05-02-09, 06:39 PM
Do caretakers all own skimobiles or are teachers and students skiving ****s?
Most caretakers live on site.
And thanks for the insult :([/quote]
Oh yeah I forgot about that the one at my main school I look after is contracted out by a company and has to come a fair few miles.
Haha sorry but all the one's in our area are trying their best not to get to work. I got to one school and the worried little lady said
'gosh which way have you come we've had a number of teachers stuck on the m1 and had to abandon their cars'
'erm I've just come up the m1 and it's okay until you hit about 65mph as the wind and wet don't mix well'
'oh they must not have gritted the other way then :confused:'
:rolleyes: she's been fed some right porkies!
Personally, I'm very very fortunate.
In the recent past, I've called in to work in person to explain issues, and the return comment was "OK, take all the time you need, we'll book it under compassionate leave, so you'll still be paid. Just give us a call when you're ready to come back."
A couple of days ago, the snow settled a little around here (only 2 inches tops), and I was repeatedly saying how happy I was about getting the chance to ride in the snow. Everyone else kept saying I was mental, but still. My boss turned around to me 5 hours before the end of shift "Your choice, you can either stay & I'll not pay you, or you can go home now & I'll pay you to the end of the shift. I'm genuinely concerned for your safety."
If I was the employer though, I wouldn't be nearly as nice. I'd be saying take it as holiday, unpaid, or work it (be that at home or the office). :twisted:
Dave20046
05-02-09, 06:58 PM
Personally, I'm very very fortunate.
In the recent past, I've called in to work in person to explain issues, and the return comment was "OK, take all the time you need, we'll book it under compassionate leave, so you'll still be paid. Just give us a call when you're ready to come back."
A couple of days ago, the snow settled a little around here (only 2 inches tops), and I was repeatedly saying how happy I was about getting the chance to ride in the snow. Everyone else kept saying I was mental, but still. My boss turned around to me 5 hours before the end of shift "Your choice, you can either stay & I'll not pay you, or you can go home now & I'll pay you to the end of the shift. I'm genuinely concerned for your safety."
If I was the employer though, I wouldn't be nearly as nice. I'd be saying take it as holiday, unpaid, or work it (be that at home or the office). :twisted:
What the hell do you do and where can I apply?
Tim in Belgium
05-02-09, 07:20 PM
Haven't read this tread, but personally yes, you shouldn't have to pay them.
the_lone_wolf
05-02-09, 07:31 PM
And no refuse collection on Tueday either.
the biffa boys were doing 6-wheel drifting up our road on tuesday:mrgreen:
Quick update. Person came in and hardly spoke to me for the day. Well I don't care. I have sent a message that I will not tolerate this sort of thing - everyone else made an effort and got in. I think the real issue was that person had to pay the £7 bus fare. There was a suggestion that I should pay, swiftly rebuffed.
Snowed in? Has Royal Mail stopped because of the snow? and dont even start me on schools :twisted:
Do you know what? Schools just cannot win. On Monday we had a sprinkling of Icing Sugar, you could hardly call it snow. But parents phoned in demanding to be told why we hadn't shut the school. FFS.
The schools are becoming punchbags and it's really starting to p*ss me off. Dammed if they do and dammed if they don't.
Do caretakers all own skimobiles or are teachers and students skiving ****s?
Most caretakers live on site.
And thanks for the insult :([/quote]
seconded.
Flamin_Squirrel
05-02-09, 08:11 PM
Why are you so wound up about about school's closing? To anyone with an ounce of common sense we had no choice.
About 3/4 of our 1200 students come by (dodgy, 30 year old, double decker) buses from some fairly rural areas so hopefully wouldn't have even attempted to come in.
Many of the 70+ staff have quite a journey to get in and the police were saying don't travel unless you have to.
So we could've ended up with 300 kids in school with a skeleton staff. Snow and ice on the playgrounds and heating struggling.
How would you have felt if your kids had been hit by an icey snowball because the few stretched teachers on duty were having to deal with the kids who'd fallen and broken a bone on the ice?
We are not babysitters. We aim and want to teach the kids in our care. We cannot do that when a variety of conditions makes it dangerous.
I am confident that all the kids who had one or even 2 days off, often with their famililies playing and laughing and all manner of other good things, overall benefitted more than sitting in cold, damp classrooms.
In the brave new world, parents won't tolerate the slightest harm occurring to their kids in the care of others. Those that complain the schools are closed are probably the first that would try to sue you if they came home with a small bruise.
The kids in your care are a massive liability, and I don't see how anyone could begrudge you the decision to reduce the risk.
What the hell do you do and where can I apply?
I do IT Support within the Gambling Industry. Unless you're local-ish to Anglesey they wouldn't be interested, but they are still actively hiring - despite the recession. :D
My last full-time job was an hour and a half train/tube journey on a good day. On occasion it could take up to 3ish hours (leaves on the line, snow, etc).
Now, if you're sitting comfortably in one of the seats, this isn't too intollerable... Just a HUGE drag. More realistically, you'll be one of the sardines standing up. That is until they cancel the train you're on, dump you off at the next stop that they crawl into, send you off to another platform in the hopes of catching the next train. Which gets cancelled. The next train'll be in about 20 minutes. It's packed and there's 2 train-loads of people wanting to get on.
Call me lazy, but I just CANNOT be arsed with that.
If I hear of problems with the trains I cringe, go to the station anyway to see what's going on. I make a decision. If it's looking bad I turn right round and go home, phone in to say it's utterly rubbish so I'll work from there.
As a web developer there's no sane reason on this planet for me not to work from home all the time apart from managers being paranoid about having that iron grip on staff.
My old line manager was great, he'd say ok. I'd be online all day we'd talk on msn. My more recent 'manager' after he left would get the right **** whenever I did that. And for what? :rolleyes:
The work still got done. Makes me a little irritated to see these hard-nosed management ideas. These are people you're dealing with, not paid slaves.
I'd agree with the 'make up the time or take a day's leave' scenario. It treats your employees as grown up people.
yorkie_chris
05-02-09, 09:25 PM
How would you have felt if your kids had been hit by an icey snowball
We just used to get told to duck
kwak zzr
05-02-09, 09:27 PM
they got hit by a few hundred whilst in the steet.
454697819
05-02-09, 09:35 PM
everybody has an acceptable level of risk, Mine is higher than catherines, and as shuch I drove in on monday and she didnt because she was going further into the sticks than me and had further to drive, she lost the days pay but Id rather that than the car or kitten was hurt!
I dont think its fair to deduct wages but holiday or make the time up yes... but how would you feel if you couldnt get into work because it was outside your comfort zone? (not saying that is the case but this is how it should be if the person has rationaly take the decision not to come in!)
my 1p...
Dave20046
05-02-09, 09:37 PM
I do IT Support within the Gambling Industry. Unless you're local-ish to Anglesey they wouldn't be interested, but they are still actively hiring - despite the recession. :D
I do IT support for schools its ****e, how far away's anglesey from sheffield and how mcuh do they pay?
Me, that is!
If people cannot get to work because they claim to be snowed in, am I right to deduct a day's pay?
Yes, you are right.
This morning at 06-50 I was due to go from Bedford Station to Accrington, Lancs by train to collect a car. I ended up leaving an hour late because I couldn't decide whether to go or not, the snow was quite bad but trains were running on time. I got there at 2pm with my mate and we bought the car, a 325bhp Lancer Evo VI and then I drove it carefully back home via Market Harborough, Northants - by 8pm I was home.
If I can do that then your staff can make it the few miles into work in the morning.
Yes, you are right.
This morning at 06-50 I was due to go from Bedford Station to Accrington, Lancs by train to collect a car. I ended up leaving an hour late because I couldn't decide whether to go or not, the snow was quite bad but trains were running on time. I got there at 2pm with my mate and we bought the car, a 325bhp Lancer Evo VI and then I drove it carefully back home via Market Harborough, Northants - by 8pm I was home.
If I can do that then your staff can make it the few miles into work in the morning.
And what if the trains weren't running or running with severe delays?
And what if the trains weren't running or running with severe delays?
They were running on time today in the worst snow I've seen in recent years. It was 7 inches deep across my back garden this morning, it's a long time since it's been that bad. My trains took me from Bedford to Leicester, change for Birmingham New Street then on to Preston where we got a local train to Accrington. Every one of them was bang on time despite the midlands being worst hit by last night's snow.
BanannaMan
06-02-09, 04:03 AM
I'm with you Ed!
I don't think most people realise how hard is is running your own business.
If my business is open, employees either make it in or lose one day of holiday or one day of pay.
Of course the one I ever have out has already used up all his holidays. :rolleyes:
He has a week of holiday and a week of sick leave. (2 weeks total off for the year) Used them all up in his first 3 months. :rolleyes:
454697819
06-02-09, 08:13 AM
And what if the trains weren't running or running with severe delays?
Or if that was out of thier comfort zone.
there is a Reasonability of expecting ppl to get into work but not if it is our of thier comfort zone (within reason)
They were running on time today in the worst snow I've seen in recent years. It was 7 inches deep across my back garden this morning, it's a long time since it's been that bad. My trains took me from Bedford to Leicester, change for Birmingham New Street then on to Preston where we got a local train to Accrington. Every one of them was bang on time despite the midlands being worst hit by last night's snow.
That not be what I asked, mister. :P
What if the trains weren't running or running with severe delays? Would you have managed to complete that job?
timwilky
06-02-09, 09:40 AM
OK, So I am old and miserable. but the snow is not how I remember it from my childhood in the 60s. As a kid our drive was about 400yds long and down hill. So from age 6 onwards if it snowed us kids had to get up early to clear the snow so dad could leave on time to take us to school on his way to work. bonus was mum had to get up early too in order to to provide bacon and egg reward. we also had to clear it at night so dad could get his car up the drive.
There was one series of hills on the way to school, where the police would stop you, let air out of your tyres and another copper on the other side with a foot pump to get you back upto pressure.
We would build 100yrd long slides in the playground in the ice. fall on our backsides and throw snowballs at each other/teachers etc.
OK my school was also a convent. The teachers all nuns who lived on the premises etc. But it was still an 8 mile drive from home. Never was the school closed despite far worse snow than we have seen.
When I first started work in the 70s, we were only once sent home early because of the weather. It was heavy snow and all those who lived more that 5 miles away were sent home when roads started to be closed as they knew we would have to walk. but still expected in next day.
petevtwin650
06-02-09, 09:55 AM
Roads were quieter, tyres were narrower, so gripped better through the snow. No driver aids. Better standard of driving then too IMO. Everybody used to clear the pavement outside their house. Kids were allowed to flirt with danger.
Dave20046
06-02-09, 10:16 AM
Roads were quieter, tyres were narrower, so gripped better through the snow. No driver aids. Better standard of driving then too IMO. Everybody used to clear the pavement outside their house. Kids were allowed to flirt with danger.
Talking of flirting with danger did you know you can be sued if you clear the pavement outside your house and some trips. sickening aint it.
That not be what I asked, mister. :P
What if the trains weren't running or running with severe delays? Would you have managed to complete that job?
Well, Missy :D
My orginal response was refering to yesterday, when Ed said he checked the buses were running and one person decied they weren't coming in to work despite the fact they could have.
There were no 'what if's' to consider yesterday, it was a clear cut case of transport being available yet they didn't bother to use it.
If, and this is a big if, the trains were delayed I would still have made my trip yesterday. We set off an hour later than planned because I procrastinated about whether we should go or not. Once I'd found out the trains were running on time we set off. Had all trains been cancelled then the decision would have been out of my hands, because there was no other transport available.
Luckypants
06-02-09, 10:22 AM
Talking of flirting with danger did you know you can be sued if you clear the pavement outside your house and some trips. sickening aint it.
yeah but in the 'gold old days' we didn't have the blame and claim culture.... If you had tried suing someone for being public spirited, you would most likely be reprimanded for wasting the court's time! I still grit the road outside my house, allows a safe breaking area before the hill.
Roads were quieter, tyres were narrower, so gripped better through the snow. No driver aids.
Yesterday I was driving with no ABS, no traction control and on 225/45 - 18 tyres. It did help that I had mud and snow tyres though :D
petevtwin650
06-02-09, 10:44 AM
yeah but in the 'gold old days' we didn't have the blame and claim culture.... If you had tried suing someone for being public spirited, you would most likely be reprimanded for wasting the court's time! I still grit the road outside my house, allows a safe breaking area before the hill.
Yep, back in the day, there was always a hopper at the bottom of a hill filled with salt/grit. Certainly on main roads at least.
Yesterday I was driving with no ABS, no traction control and on 225/45 - 18 tyres. It did help that I had mud and snow tyres though :D
That sounds fun.
DanAbnormal
06-02-09, 11:13 AM
I couldn't get to work Monday. Riding the bike would've ended up with me inhospital, no question of that. I live 2 mins from a train station and all trains were cancelled all day. There were 12 accidents on the roundabout near my house. While I knew it would snow I don't have a laptop so how can I plan ahead? Unless I decide to take my desk PC home with me. So I called the boss and got nothing but grief, he made it in so there was no reason I couldn't apparently. No taxi firm would come out, no buses, no trains. I couldn't actually afford a taxi 32 miles to work anyway but was trying to get to a station that may be open but turns out none were anyway. He is now saying he will dock a days wages and I am fighting this with HR. He said it's not the companies fault I could not make it to work, only 3 people in our office out of 250 made it in on Monday. This is after I actually ended up working on Monday anwyay as I asked him to send me work to my home email address. I fecking hate this place.
jimmy__riddle
06-02-09, 11:17 AM
I couldn't get to work Monday. Riding the bike would've ended up with me inhospital, no question of that. I live 2 mins from a train station and all trains were cancelled all day. There were 12 accidents on the roundabout near my house. While I knew it would snow I don't have a laptop so how can I plan ahead? Unless I decide to take my desk PC home with me. So I called the boss and got nothing but grief, he made it in so there was no reason I couldn't apparently. No taxi firm would come out, no buses, no trains. I couldn't actually afford a taxi 32 miles to work anyway but was trying to get to a station that may be open but turns out none were anyway. He is now saying he will dock a days wages and I am fighting this with HR. He said it's not the companies fault I could not make it to work, only 3 people in our office out of 250 made it in on Monday. This is after I actually ended up working on Monday anwyay as I asked him to send me work to my home email address. I fecking hate this place.
will they not let you take it as holiday?
Dave20046
06-02-09, 11:18 AM
I couldn't get to work Monday. Riding the bike would've ended up with me inhospital, no question of that. I live 2 mins from a train station and all trains were cancelled all day. There were 12 accidents on the roundabout near my house. While I knew it would snow I don't have a laptop so how can I plan ahead? Unless I decide to take my desk PC home with me. So I called the boss and got nothing but grief, he made it in so there was no reason I couldn't apparently. No taxi firm would come out, no buses, no trains. I couldn't actually afford a taxi 32 miles to work anyway but was trying to get to a station that may be open but turns out none were anyway. He is now saying he will dock a days wages and I am fighting this with HR. He said it's not the companies fault I could not make it to work, only 3 people in our office out of 250 made it in on Monday. This is after I actually ended up working on Monday anwyay as I asked him to send me work to my home email address. I fecking hate this place.
He should dock it from you pay with no complaints, if he pays you then he's very generous for a boss. I agree though you had no way of getting in, if I was you boss and understood that you'd genuinely tried to get in then I'm probably give half pay.
That sounds fun.
I forgot to mention 365bhp and 4WD to play with too.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3100/3258039350_2998be3805_o.jpg
The new toy
vBulletin® , Copyright ©2000-2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.