possibly 1 for mr spiers? microphone help....

[Dappa D]

rather than pm thought id put it here as are some other music types here...

I currently have a Rode NT1-A mic in the studio and its becoming to much of a PITA now.

Basically its a great mic, but too clear for my liking. I have to tweak with equalizer after to get it sounding how i like it. im after something that doesnt pick up quite so many frequancies...

I know mics are personal preference just wondered if mr spiers or any one else had a starting point for me?...something i dont have to spend a fortune on..sell the Rode and use proceeds to buy the new one.

thanks in advance

Dappa

[Mr Speirs]

Hey buddy. What are you using the microphone to record? I'm assuming vocals but just wanted to be sure.

[Dappa D]

yea its vocals mate, I have a rode NT4 for most other things if i wanna record live percussion/guitar etc which im happy with (but dont like it for vocals), I also have a sure SM58 which i use on stage but doesnt cut the mustard in the studio.....

as u probably know / guess...i dont do much singing..and lately all new stuff has been bassline 4x4 so its pretty much just MCing/rapping over the top....i usually end up double tracking and dropping one of the takes down a semitone in pitch to make it sound deep enough as the NT4a is to "bright"......any suggestions?

[matt_rehm_hext]

I think maybe you need to EQ the recorded vocal properly. Are you also using compression, and a decent pre amp?

I've used the NT1-A many times and whilst there are much better mics, its fairly good for the price.

[Mr Speirs]

Honestly I am not much cop in the studio environment.
However I do have a couple of suggestions but need to know your price range firstly.

[matt_rehm_hext]

Mr Speirs, I'm guessing your a live sound engineer, so am I to some extent lol

[Mr Speirs]

Yeah I am.

[matt_rehm_hext]

Do you work in house or randomly for different people or what?

[Mr Speirs]

I work for a PA hire company who supply to touring artists and amongst engineering also rig the PA and occasionally I teach engineers how to use the new fangled digital desks.

[Dappa D]

matt, thats the point, i dont want to spend ages EQ'ing properly...my recording environment is spot on, completely flat, no reflexions etc....

bout 10 yrs ago i shared a studio with others but cant remember what the mic was in there, as that was perfect every time...no need to EQ/double take/duplicate/pitch shift.....

britters its about £100 budget, might just have to go and try some out and see what i like me thinks...

matt what do you do?

[Sosha]

Beats the hell out of wishing someone had used a vox mic that recorded more frequencies though...

(Sorry no help at all)

[matt_rehm_hext]

You don't have to spend ages, just EQ the vocal correctly once then save the settings in the plugin and apply to all vocal tracks.

Can you be a bit more specific "matt what do you do"?

[Mr Speirs]

£100 wow thats tight.

My advice to you would be to consider upping that budget if you can. The reason I say this is the microphone is the most important aspect of recording or sound reinforcement. Its the first thing the soundwaves reach and that representation is the only thing you have to work with. The better the representation the better the outcome.

I have spoken to a friend of mine who is a quite a high profile Studio Engineer and from what you said instantly said Electrovoice RE20 (which was my first gut reaction however I don't have the experience in the studio to back it up with any real conviction) suffice to say it is a fantastic microphone which characteristically gives a rich and warm sound.
Unfortunately it is slightly out of your stated price range and if it doesn't suit you will be alot of money to find out.

As you said go and try some out, find a decent shop who will let you bring it back if you don't like it and swap it until you find the one you like, try them out in your studio as this will give you a much clearer picture and you will instantly know.

My other recommendation was the Audio Technica AT4033. This microphone is basically the much more expensive AT4050 model but without the dual diaphragm pic.
Also a great microphone.

Unfortunately I don't really use anything at the low end of the market so couldn't comment on all the £100 mark condensers that are out there.

Another thing I would say is for you to try the Shure beta58a instead of the SM58. It is a far superior microphone and may just be the little bit extra you need to make that type of microphone work for you in the studio. The beta model benefits from a higher frequency response than the SM up to 18k I believe and from my experience delivers 6db more than the standard at the same gain level so signal to noise ratio is much improved.
Just one thing though buy one from a proper shop as there are many many (very many) fakes knocking about.
And the beta58a is in your price range.

Hope this helps.

[Dappa D]

You don't have to spend ages, just EQ the vocal correctly once then save the settings in the plugin and apply to all vocal tracks.

Can you be a bit more specific "matt what do you do"?

with respect dude im sure your trying to help, i have patches saved etc and know how to EQ properly, but all takes are different, unless your singing perhaps but i wouldnt know as i dont sing. my question is on mics tho, not how or what to do in the studio.

you said you were a sound engineer to some extent......so asked what you do...as that could cover a rather large spectrum!

[arcdef]

Some of the SE mic's are amazingly good for the money, ive used them lots of times with some great results, plus they are fairly well priced, may be worth looking into?

[Dappa D]

£100 wow thats tight.

My advice to you would be to consider upping that budget if you can. The reason I say this is the microphone is the most important aspect of recording or sound reinforcement. Its the first thing the soundwaves reach and that representation is the only thing you have to work with. The better the representation the better the outcome.

I have spoken to a friend of mine who is a quite a high profile Studio Engineer and from what you said instantly said Electrovoice RE20 (which was my first gut reaction however I don't have the experience in the studio to back it up with any real conviction) suffice to say it is a fantastic microphone which characteristically gives a rich and warm sound.
Unfortunately it is slightly out of your stated price range and if it doesn't suit you will be alot of money to find out.

As you said go and try some out, find a decent shop who will let you bring it back if you don't like it and swap it until you find the one you like, try them out in your studio as this will give you a much clearer picture and you will instantly know.

My other recommendation was the Audio Technica AT4033. This microphone is basically the much more expensive AT4050 model but without the dual diaphragm pic.
Also a great microphone.

Unfortunately I don't really use anything at the low end of the market so couldn't comment on all the £100 mark condensers that are out there.

Another thing I would say is for you to try the Shure beta58a instead of the SM58. It is a far superior microphone and may just be the little bit extra you need to make that type of microphone work for you in the studio. The beta model benefits from a higher frequency response than the SM up to 18k I believe and from my experience delivers 6db more than the standard at the same gain level so signal to noise ratio is much improved.
Just one thing though buy one from a proper shop as there are many many (very many) fakes knocking about.
And the beta58a is in your price range.

Hope this helps.

ah quality, i like the sound of the beta, may try this as i love the sm58 as a stage mic, cant justify spendage at the moment as moving house this year, so £100 is top really as will get close to this for the NT1-A, good advice, cheers Mr Spiers

[arcdef]

this (http://www.seelectronics.com/sE2200a.html)for example is a lovely mic.

[Dappa D]

this (http://www.seelectronics.com/sE2200a.html)for example is a lovely mic.

nice one sounds good from reading that, dont know why but id always thought of usb mics when i thought of SE, will look into that one defo, cheers dude

[arcdef]

lol yeah so did i until my mate lent me some of his mics, the reflection filter they sell is also great, you can record vocals almost anywhere and you dont get much nosie from the room, although it sounds like you have your room set up fine anyway.

[matt_rehm_hext]

Dappa- I work as a freelance live sound engineer and sometimes in the studio, mainly nowdays only working in the studio to do stuff for myself as I focus on live sound.

The SE2200a is a very good mic I have used it a few times for vocals and it sounds good.

What is the recording equipment you are using? from the mic to the (i'm assuming) digital storage medium?

[Dappa D]

Dappa- I work as a freelance live sound engineer and sometimes in the studio, mainly nowdays only working in the studio to do stuff for myself as I focus on live sound.

The SE2200a is a very good mic I have used it a few times for vocals and it sounds good.

What is the recording equipment you are using? from the mic to the (i'm assuming) digital storage medium?

ah cool i wasnt sure if u were saying you done a bit of this and that or u actually are an engineer so thats good to know,

ive got a pretty basic set up, mic as said, tascam ul122 audio interface, desktop comp running protools, reason 4 and cubase sx 3, oxygen 8 midi controller and various other keyboards that i useas controllers, behringer bcf2000 digital mixing desk (dont use it when mastering/final mix down as it aint great but helps get ideas down quick)...a crappy but does the job usb turntable should i want to sample vinyl also have an old copy of nuendo but not used it as find the cubase and reason set up best, and a pair of tannoy reveal (5A i think they are called)monitors, suround sound and stereo speakers hooked up so i can A/B through the various speakers

goes without saying got loads of the free plugins/vst's/vsti;s etc ....thinking about getting the vintage warmer when funds are better, and would like a korg ms20 but all costs....

will take time to build again as sold all my stuff 8yrs ago when i went to work abroad but im getting there..all be it slowly!!!

[anna]

DD check out Richer sounds on the top of white ladies road if they are still there..always friendly and usually have some bargain stuff.

[Spikenipple]

The Shure Beta 58 is surprisingly good to record vocals in a studio environment. It's almost identical to the SM58 but has a quicker transient response and is more transparent.

[Mr Speirs]

It's almost identical to the SM58

I do not agree.
The beta model is far superior to the point that if I had spec'd a beta58a and someone supplied an SM I would refuse to use it.

[Spikenipple]

Hence me saying why the Beta is better :D
The AKG C1000S is also around £100 (depending where you look) and is pretty flexible. It's not the best for vocals but performs very well for the price, and can be used for all sorts of instruments with clear results.

[xXBADGERXx]

What about using some of those Green Joe Meek boxes , I used to sell a lot of those a fair few years ago and some of the TC Electronics stuff . A lot of peole with studio mikes complained of a very brittle sound and used to warm them up a bit with these boxes . I am trying to remember a mike that was a Neumann copy that I used to sell , began with an L and those flew off the shelves , was never a fan of the RODEnt`s LOL

[matt_rehm_hext]

I think it might be worth trying a decent valve preamp or something similar

[Mr Speirs]

I think it might be worth trying a decent valve preamp or something similar

Well worth considering.

Keep an eye on this Dappa D. ebay item no 110348793335
Can personally vouch for this, I've owned one for many years and rate it very highly, especially for the cost. The compressor is very transparent which I really like also.
If you can get that for £150 you'll be very happy IMO.

[anna]

I currently have a Rode NT1-A mic in the studio and its becoming to much of a PITA now.

Basically its a great mic, but too clear for my liking. I have to tweak with equalizer after to get it sounding how i like it. im after something that doesnt pick up quite so many frequancies...

Having re-read your post you are after a microphone that doesnt perform as well as the NT1.

Foget the SM Beta 58 and just get a bog standard SM58 you dont need a better microphone as you are not using it as a vocal mic is normally used.

[Mr Speirs]

Having re-read your post you are after a microphone that doesnt perform as well as the NT1.

Foget the SM Beta 58 and just get a bog standard SM58 you dont need a better microphone as you are not using it as a vocal mic is normally used.

The SM Beta 58? :D

Dappa D Already owns an Sm58 but stated it didn't cut it in the studio. That's why i think for his budget a beta58a will be the better option for a few reasons.
It will perform better than the SM58 as its frequency response is 2kHz higher than the SM58 however as it is dynamic it should by design sound less clinical than a Condenser.
The beta58a is also about 6db louder than the SM58 so doesn't need driving as hard to sound good something the SM58 suffers from, saying that it shouldn't be as 'excitable' as a condenser microphone.

[Dappa D]

great advice everyone many thanks,

the rode will be going on fleabay this week (unless anyone here wants it?) and im gonna speak to sound control (reverb i think they called now) and see if i can try the beta 58 and the se one as the guys there are usually pretty good.

Anna, i had no idea richer sounds sold this sort of thing ive only drove past it (like every day!) and they have tv;s and stereos in the window....ill go check them out.

thanks all :-)

[Mr Speirs]

great advice everyone many thanks,

the rode will be going on fleabay this week (unless anyone here wants it?) and im gonna speak to sound control (reverb i think they called now) and see if i can try the beta 58 and the se one as the guys there are usually pretty good.

Anna, i had no idea richer sounds sold this sort of thing ive only drove past it (like every day!) and they have tv;s and stereos in the window....ill go check them out.

thanks all :-)

If you want Dappa I can see how much my local friendly music shop will do it for super best friends deal?

[Dappa D]

that mr speirs me ole mucker would be sound, hold fire untill the rode has sold tho,

there is one on ebay at the moment with 4 days left, few bids and currently at £77, so im gonna take some pics of mine tonight and list it tomorrow so need to see how much i get from the sale of that first to see what my budget is!!