Quick shift

[Bill.Cross]

I find that shifting up in higher gears at mid to high revs without de-clutching is very slick but I wonder if it abuses the gear box. Anyone have an idea about this - am I going to break something or wear it out quickly?

[Alpinestarhero]

This topic has been discussed quite a bit (but that dosn't mean we shouldnt discuss it again :smt040). As long as you take the load off the gearbox by throttling off when you shift up, I dont beleive there is a problem. I prefer to always use the clutch, but thats just me. I can get pretty quick shifts by just about disengaging the clutch and snicking the gear home.

Shifting down the gearbox is another matter all together...

[Baph]

Shifting down the gearbox is another matter all together...

Although is a useful tool to have in the arsenal in case your clutch cable snaps etc.

In the past, I used to go up & down the gearbox without the clutch. I'm not about to advise that anyone else do either, but it's certainly possible.

[Nicky S]

iv herd about this but never had the balls to do it :(

[Bill.Cross]

iv herd about this but never had the balls to do it :(

Nothing ballsy about it. Put pressure under the gear level just before you want to change up. Then very quickly close the throttle and open it again. You don't need to shut the throttle, only close it enough to unload the gearbox. If you do it too much and too slowly, the bike dives a bit under engine braking. It's easy to get the hang of.

I went to BSB at Croft last year - the first time I've ever been to watch motor sport. The noise is part of the atmosphere obviously. Those bikes have electronic quick shifters as you probably know. As they shift up, the electronics cuts the spark to unload the gearbox. As a result, a charge of unburned gas goes down the pipe to explode in the heat there. So you hear these pistol shot noises as they change up going down the straight.

Sad, I know, but I like it.

[BILLY]

I up shift my motocross bike without the clutch and i doesn't do any harm! i only use the clutch for setting off and down shifts!

[cymroboi]

:smt075 i used to do the same with the cr 125 i used to have but 1 day i managed to litrely :smt067blow the gbox up by forcing it into gear ,that why ill never change gear without using the clutch, for the sake of a second or two its cheaper than having to strip down the box in my opinion any way :rolleyes:

[flymo]

this is exactly what a race quick shifter does, as fitted to every World Superbike, MotoGP and many others.

Only difference is that it does this electronically using a pressure sensetive switch built into the gear shift linkage. The moment that you attempt to move the lever it kills the ignition for a predetermined duration taking the load off the gearbox.

As long as you are not clumsy with it, after a bit of practice it is pretty easy to do on upshifts. Continue to use the clutch on downshifts though or you'll lock your rear wheel into a slide if you're not careful or maybe even over rev the engine to the point of breaking it.

[Baph]

As long as you are not clumsy with it, after a bit of practice it is pretty easy to do on upshifts. Continue to use the clutch on downshifts though or you'll lock your rear wheel into a slide if you're not careful or maybe even over rev the engine to the point of breaking it.

Whilst good theory, in practice you can change down the box without either locking the rear or blowing the engine/gearbox up. Again, I wouldn't advise anyone to do it though, purely because of the risks involved.

I still change down the box without the clutch from time to time... but I accept the risks associated.

[svdemon]

As long as the revs are right it doesn't hurt the gearbox. Its all about getting a feel for when to shift it in time with closing the throttle.

[sinbad]

this is exactly what a race quick shifter does, as fitted to every World Superbike, MotoGP and many others.

Only difference is that it does this electronically using a pressure sensetive switch built into the gear shift linkage. The moment that you attempt to move the lever it kills the ignition for a predetermined duration taking the load off the gearbox.

As long as you are not clumsy with it, after a bit of practice it is pretty easy to do on upshifts. Continue to use the clutch on downshifts though or you'll lock your rear wheel into a slide if you're not careful or maybe even over rev the engine to the point of breaking it.

+1. The upshifts can be super quick and smooth with a bit of practice, but doing it on the downshifts is a complete waste of time as long as your clutch lever works. It would be about as unnecessary and almost as detrimental as swapping your hands and using your left on the right lever. :)

[flymo]

Whilst good theory, in practice you can change down the box without either locking the rear or blowing the engine/gearbox up. Again, I wouldn't advise anyone to do it though, purely because of the risks involved.

I still change down the box without the clutch from time to time... but I accept the risks associated.

Thats fair, although I think the main reason for not using the clutch is speed, faster changes. Its a racing technique thats very common.

During a race its pretty normal to do rapid shifts down the box during the braking zone. Trying to do this without the clutch (and no quickshifter) is extremely difficult to do when you are under pressure.

Probably fine to do under gentle riding conditions but I dont really see the point personally.

[gettin2dizzy]

Downshifts are easy tbh. Doesn't hurt the gearbox unless you're a moron.

[sinbad]

Downshifts are easy tbh. Doesn't hurt the gearbox unless you're a moron.

How do you rev-match without disengaging drive?

[gettin2dizzy]

How do you rev-match without disengaging drive?
By changing down where the gears cross over. You just put a dab of throttle on to take the weight off the gearbox.

[sinbad]

By changing down where the gears cross over. You just put a dab of throttle on to take the weight off the gearbox.

Where the gears cross over?
I don't understand. Rpm will always be higher in a lower gear at any given speed- if you don't disengage drive and rev match then the revs will be forced up by the rear wheel, and however you do it, you're not disengaging drive if you don't use the clutch (unless you're going from 2nd to neutral -rev- and then to first :) ).

[Baph]

Where the gears cross over?
I don't understand. Rpm will always be higher in a lower gear at any given speed- if you don't disengage drive and rev match then the revs will be forced up by the rear wheel, and however you do it, you're not disengaging drive if you don't use the clutch (unless you're going from 2nd to neutral -rev- and then to first :) ).

Simple really. When you're changing up, you roll off the throttle & snick up when the gearbox isn't loaded (well, in practice, when the load is so small that it'll easily jump to the next gear).

When changing down, you need to bring revs up a little, so you open the throttle a little. There's a small time delay in that increase in RPM getting to the drive chain. During this time delay there's relatively little load on the gearbox again and you can snick it down a gear with ease.

With practice you can change gears both up & down without the clutch, without really unsettling the bike (I find clutchless downshifts easier when I'm hard on the brakes TBH).

However: Shifting down without the clutch has far more chance to go wrong. If it goes wrong, the consequences can be pretty severe.

[John 675]

I find it quicker to have good clutch control tbh I suspected that I fudged my 675 gearbox by clutchless up shifting so I tought my self to be fast on the clutch, I wouldn't recommend it without a racing or equvilant clutch setup.

[plowsie]

Down shifting without the clutch - I just blip the throttle. It works. Upshifting all the time without the clutch, was useful at getting on the gas early yesterday.

USD gearbox helps too.