bloody clutch cover [Archive] - SV650.org - SV650 & Gladius 650 Forum

AndyBrad

01-03-09, 09:16 PM

Ok ive been having a fiddle with the bike today and thourght i would have a bash at fixing the small drip i had from the clutch cover. So i took it off and cleaned the mating faces up. smeared it in silicone grease and bolted it all back up. Now its p1ssing out! Ive also managed to bend a couple of the bolts somehow. Im guessing by tightening it up too much. So best wy to fix it?

Im thinking of fitting a bit of o-ring chord of a larger size to the cover. Alternativly getting some instant gasket. However is it best to get a new suzuki o-ring as i see its got nipples on it for some reason.

Any advice?

Also i dropped it on that side on friday. very disapointed in myself about it all but maybe this is why ive got a couple of bent bolts?

Dave20046

01-03-09, 09:23 PM

Don't think dropping it could bend bolts

I did exactly the same (infact mine's sprung another leak today after fixing a leak on the other side.). Just take it off and redo it. If you remember the state my clutch cover was in andy that was because it took me three attempts to seal it and I got really ****ed off so let the gasket stuff go everywhere. Need's doing again now lol :(

If it's only a trickle I'd be inclined to leave it.

AndyBrad

01-03-09, 09:26 PM

i should have done. it was only a trickle. now its more of a stream :(

yorkie_chris

01-03-09, 09:26 PM

Dave20046

01-03-09, 09:30 PM

lol everyone does it andy, I'm sure I must have overtightened mine....although it was leak free until today. (It did get thrashed a bit though)

Dave20046

01-03-09, 09:32 PM

i should have done. it was only a trickle. now its more of a stream :(
If you didn't have such a tidy bike I'd recommend what I've done; leave it and bang a manky old tailpack on your back seat with a bottle of oil in. Although it hasn't actually needed a topup yet.

AndyBrad

01-03-09, 09:36 PM

Andy you seem to manage to break something every time you try and fix it.

Tightening those bolts does NOT fix the problem with the clutch cover. Overtightening CAUSES the problem!!

I have spare bolts. Use some instant gasket or silicone sealer.

can i have those bolts off you please? how much? Its all the short ones really :)

tbh i torqued it up properly first time. then just nipped it a little more when it leaked. Oh well.

northwind

01-03-09, 09:44 PM

I got fed up with mine, tried every fix under the sun, finally just splatched universal blue over the o-ring and refitted it, worked a charm.

dizzyblonde

01-03-09, 09:53 PM

I just leave the one on the black one. It leaks, has done for a long time, its regularly looked at so it doesn't go low. Its a weep, not a huge leak. I think I've asked YC once or twice to maybe have a look, but I don't see it as urgent. look a it this way, its always got new oil!

yorkie_chris

01-03-09, 09:55 PM

can i have those bolts off you please? how much? Its all the short ones really :)

tbh i torqued it up properly first time. then just nipped it a little more when it leaked. Oh well.

You dig through the oil box of bits to find them and you can have them

Dave20046

01-03-09, 10:13 PM

You dig through the oil box of bits to find them and you can have them
bet he loses a finger

husky03

01-03-09, 11:13 PM

done the shadows the other week there, his was warped and almost every bolt was bent-check yours is level before you do anything else

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 07:57 AM

just taken it off and yup its like a banana! balls.

going to take it into work and see if i can get an oversized o-ring chord to fit seeing as its not really holding any pressure it might just work :)

Dave20046

02-03-09, 08:48 AM

Mine's flat and it still flipping leaks

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 09:58 AM

had a good look this morning. the original oring is 2.25mm dia on the cross section. the groove is approx 3.125 wide to allow for the oring to spread.

Nowthen those nipples are purely to hold the oring in place so no need to worry about that. If you hold an edge over the bolting holes than you can clearly see the cover is warped and there is no chance of it sealing. Also its like a 50p piece and this is due to the actual moulding and not over torquing the bolts. The holes are slieved and thus you shouldnt be able to warp the cover as much as it is. Im guessing is a issue with messing about with it while its still warm.

So ill be fitting some larger section oring chord and propper bolts later and let you know how i get on.

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 09:58 AM

Mine's flat and it still flipping leaks

you sure its flat?

Dave20046

02-03-09, 10:08 AM

you sure its flat?
pretty, it's no where near bananaish. I put it on a pane of glass and couldn't see any gaps.

husky03

02-03-09, 10:23 AM

use plenty of grease -fill the gap before you put the gasket in,then give it a good coating before you line it up

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 01:42 PM

Ok folks. heres something for you.

take a look at these piccys you can clearly see how distorted the cover is. Theres no real chance of the original oring sealing unless its clamped flat. unfortunatly due to those spacers that isnt going to happen so i substituted some oring chord (glued to form an oring) Ill let you know how it goes.

dizzyblonde

02-03-09, 02:14 PM

heres an interesting read n TLzone about their little clutch cover problem

http://www.tlzone.net/forums/frequent-tl-mods/66337-why-97-s-clutch-covers-leak-how-fix-them.html

wonder if it works for ours?

oh pap. you have to be logged in, scrap that :-(

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 02:33 PM

Care to copy the info for us?

TheShadow

02-03-09, 02:38 PM

This is correct.. i made a hash of it using one of these

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-34570-Ratchet-Torque-Wrench/dp/B0001K9T2O/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1236004362&sr=8-1

It was set to 10NM and even at this it bent the bolts.

My clutch cover failed on the way to Huskys on the m8 and decided to drop a rather large amount of oil on the rear tyre... So much so that a fellow motorbiker in a car signaled me to pull over to altert me.

done the shadows the other week there, his was warped and almost every bolt was bent-check yours is level before you do anything else

dizzyblonde

02-03-09, 05:52 PM

I'll say this right off so no one is confused.

TIGHTENING THE CASE BOLTS WILL NOT FIX 97 S CLUTCH COVER OIL LEAKS.

ok, so quit honkin down on them and read this.

If you don't know, TL clutch covers are made out of plastic, three layer sandwich, but none the less, plastic. Plastic is much softer then aluminum, steel, magnesium, etc.

So the bright guys at Suzuki put steel spacers in the plastic where the mounting bolts would go through to keep wrench heads from crushing the be-jesus out of the soft (read that cheap to manufacture) plastic clutch cover

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P1010807.jpg

alright, so far, so good.... the cover is mounted on the bike, the flange head bolts are run through the spacer lined mounting holes and tightened.... pushing the O-ring into the grove and against the engine case. Everything seales up nice and tight..... until you heat the plastic up a few hundred times, it gets soft and the plastic under the bolt squishes..... the bolt is now sitting against the spacer.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P1010809.jpg

the case can move on the spacer, I punched them out with a pencil, just putting it in the hole and pushing. They are press fit. So the bolt is now pressing against spacer and the squished plastic cover can sort of float around on the spacers. Moving in and out as heat and case pressure changes and every time it moves it squishes the plastic even more, making it more loose.... AND MORE LEAKY

Ok, so this is why tightening the mount bolts doesn't work. YOU ARE SIMPLY TIGHTENING THE BOLTS AGAINST THE SPACERS. YOU ARE NOT ACTUALLY PRESSING THE CLUTCH COVER ANY TIGHTER AGAINST THE ENGINE CASE.

The newer replacement cases are actually the same size (with a few changes in the height of the spacers) but have a "T" shaped spacer that spreads the pressure of the mounting bolt out over more area of the plastic clutch cover. The "T" also prevents the cover from 'floating' around on the spacer shaft.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P1010811.jpg

So what can you do to your 97 S cover to make it stop leaking. Or do a little pre-emptive strike to stop it before it starts.

Two easy steps.... Remove the spacers (a punch and hammer, or a pencil and a tough palm of the hand) and then shorten them up just a little bit. I ran them through my lathe but you can pass a file over them, sand them on some course sand paper.... invent your own way to take off about 1/32nd of an inch (thats half a millimeter for you metric types) of spacer lenght.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P1010810.jpg

Then get some washers and put them on as you mount the bolts in place (make your own "T" spacer)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P1010793.jpg

I would replace the O-ring and give it a little oil bath before installing just to be on the safe side if you have had a chronic oil leak problem.

there you have it, how to fix your leaky 97 S clutch cover.

copied from the TL forum. Dunno if its any use to us lot, but Im Indoors reckons on the clutch cover on the TL and Raptor is the same design

Can I just throw a little spanner in the works by telling you what suzuki told me when mine started leaking

The gasket has a little 'tang' on it to time it correctly when laying in the o ring groove, '97 clutch covers and the gasket have the tang on the outside of the groove which allows oil to seep around the seal and out of the cover, I bought a replacement one for £70 and have the old one still in my garage
[/QUOTE]
It has been noted that 97s covers and 98 and later covers have a different "alinement slot" for aligning the O-ring... this is true. However the New O-ring should fit the older cover, just require that the little timeing tab be trimmed back.

Here is the "alinment slot" on the 97S cover, also note that it faces toward the inside of the cover, thus allowing oil to access the O-ring channel... one of the many reasons a leak can develope.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P3080828.jpg

Here is the 98 and later cover, note that the alignment slot is facing away from the inside of the cover.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v620/Ricejocky/P3080826.jpg

I would recomend using a new O-ring, triming away just a touch of the alignment nub and putting a blob of silicone sealant at the alignment slot if you are going to install a 97S clutch cover.

hope this helps.

Dave20046

02-03-09, 06:26 PM

I don't understand why you have to shave half a mil off the metal inserts before putting the washer on. Does it mean the cover can crush closer against the engine casing or sommat?

Never noticed that tang thing on mine.

dizzyblonde

02-03-09, 06:30 PM

I don't understand why you have to shave half a mil off the metal inserts before putting the washer on. Does it mean the cover can crush closer against the engine casing or sommat?

yes.

Dave20046

02-03-09, 06:35 PM

Cheers for posting that dizzy it's on my list of 'to do's' Got chain & sprocks and brakes to do first.

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 10:17 PM

yup seems about right. I tried the new seal and yup it works. but the coveres so warped that i can only get 4 bolts in. bugger. new cover it isthen :(

Dave20046

02-03-09, 10:23 PM

Looking at what you describe as banana shaped andy mine very possibly is warped lol. I didn't pay that much attention

maclovin

02-03-09, 10:23 PM

yup seems about right. I tried the new seal and yup it works. but the coveres so warped that i can only get 4 bolts in. bugger. new cover it isthen :(
if you get a new one give me a shout and i can remachine it (if i'm still working) the old one that is

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 10:27 PM

i could ge the old one skimmed at work but thourght it was more hassle than its worth, did consider asking somone to make me one out of stainless but then thourght of all that weight :)

northwind

02-03-09, 10:30 PM

I flatted mine with a sheet of glass and some wet and dry- it did the job for about a month then it warped again. I guess that once the plastic's gone once it'll do it again, or perhaps I was just unlucky. That was when I got sick of it and hylomar'd it to ****.

Dave20046

02-03-09, 10:30 PM

i could ge the old one skimmed at work but thourght it was more hassle than its worth, did consider asking somone to make me one out of stainless but then thourght of all that weight :)
Aye, I was thinking alluminium

AndyBrad

02-03-09, 10:32 PM

Aye, I was thinking alluminium

aye but that costs :)

Dave20046

02-03-09, 10:33 PM

aye but that costs :)
God forgot about that! Yeah glue it to **** :mrgreen:

dizzyblonde

02-03-09, 10:36 PM

isn't there a risk of condensation having a billet cover?
I'm sure I seen someone mention this before, because of the cold conditions here. May be talking bosswolocks too!

I wanted a fake Duc looking billet cover from Germany, but then decided it looked too chav!

Sid Squid

02-03-09, 10:57 PM

going to take it into work and see if i can get an oversized o-ring chord to fit seeing as its not really holding any pressure it might just work :)
Being a V-twin there's quite a bit of crankcase pumping, even though there's no oil 'pressure' as such the crankcase experiences quite violent pressure fluctuations which worsens the effect of even quite a small oil leak.

Dave20046

03-03-09, 08:10 AM

Being a V-twin there's quite a bit of crankcase pumping, even though there's no oil 'pressure' as such the crankcase experiences quite violent pressure fluctuations which worsens the effect of even quite a small oil leak.
So I've found!

yorkie_chris

03-03-09, 02:28 PM

All I do is use sealant. Smear a little bit of grease/oil (probably already oily anyway) around the engine cases first and degrease the plastic cover. Seemples.

You can make some sort of tophat spacer instead but it seems a lot of messing about. they can still leak even with this if it has warped in between bolt holes.

Dave20046

03-03-09, 02:57 PM

AndyBrad

03-03-09, 03:28 PM

Yea the sealent seems like the plan but i was hoping to solve the problem with the oring.

Nowthen this cover alreay has top hat spacers so that didnt really work then!

Dave20046

03-03-09, 03:29 PM

Yea the sealent seems like the plan but i was hoping to solve the problem with the oring.

Nowthen this cover alreay has top hat spacers so that didnt really work then!
Feck, is there a gap on the otherside of the spacer too?
What about this tang malarky from the tl forum. might be worth a shot.

AndyBrad

03-03-09, 08:11 PM

Dave20046

03-03-09, 08:22 PM

well i grabed an old clutch cover off yc ths eve and fitted it with the larger o-ring. job seems to be a goodun as it fitted well and i appear to have no leaks. If its not snowing tomorrow ill take it to work and see how it goes. Dave if your having that kriega stuff i can stick some oring chord in it for you to try if you like. It might help sort your leak out but ill let you know how this goes first :)
Yes please do mate! That'd be excellent, I snapped my oring last time I had it apart after trying to clean it :rolleyes:. It'll take a few hundred miles I would have thought to show itsself as leaking again - mine started to get a teeny bit leaky through the hardy bikers and then after this sunday it's got a little worse. So that's probably about 700 miles.

By the way when do we send you the payment have you worked out the costage yet?