Police bike check

[markryker]

Got stopped today in Ruthin town centre, doing 20 mph so i know im doing nothing wrong, on come the blue lights and siren, attracting all and sundry out doing the shopping!..."hello sir, just checking all bikes over the weekend for safety reasons"
First copper looks straight down the exhaust and i think, here we go (no baffle), does not say a thing, checks tyres, number plate, while the other is on the phone to the pnc. "All in order sir" and gives me a sheet saying i been checked, with todays date to show to any other Police who decide to stop me today too.
15 minutes later im on my way, not sure if im happy to get away with no baffle etc, or angry at being targeted just for riding a bike?

[Frank]

Id be totally ****ed off

[CarlosSV650S]

Got stopped today in Ruthin town centre, doing 20 mph so i know im doing nothing wrong, on come the blue lights and siren, attracting all and sundry out doing the shopping!..."hello sir, just checking all bikes over the weekend for safety reasons"
First copper looks straight down the exhaust and i think, here we go (no baffle), does not say a thing, checks tyres, number plate, while the other is on the phone to the pnc. "All in order sir" and gives me a sheet saying i been checked, with todays date to show to any other Police who decide to stop me today too.
15 minutes later im on my way, not sure if im happy to get away with no baffle etc, or angry at being targeted just for riding a bike?


You think they would have had somethin better to do !

What is the need ???

****in *******s !

[abdul.aziz]

I been stopped a few times, not on the bike but with the car.

Just be happy i suppose, if they really wanted to be nasty i'm sure they could find some tiny defect of some sort on most vehicles and do you for that. But if they allow you to get on with youtr journey its not so bad.

[the_lone_wolf]

:rolleyes:

[skeetly]

http://www.pepipoo.com/Law_Practice.htm

[Stu]

Well they can check your insurance, tax, and driving licence (assuming ridden by owner) from your plate without stopping you, they can also have a rough idea how legal the bike is with a quick look without stopping you.
The Police are supposed to have reasonable suspicion before stopping you, so if they've used that sole fact that you are on a bike I would be incensed :mad: if they stopped me like that

[maviczap]

Think I read somewhere that there is some kind of European wide road safety intiative going on at the mo.

This probably counts as a tick in the box :confused:

[Baph]

On the commute I used to have (Anglesey to Denbigh), I often went down the A55, and could get stopped 2-3 times a week for spot checks.

That went on for a couple of months, and I think almost every officer stopped me, so they decided they wouldn't bother again as they never saw anything wrong. I think part of that was that I always kept all the receipts they hand out, and they looked pretty sheepish when I produced them to show how many times I'd been stopped that month alone etc.

That's with a small plate & no baffle.

I just saw it as an occupational hazard, commuting past 3 different divisional HQ's.

[GazandKatie]

I wouldnt worry about it to be honest.

A Police Officer can stop any motor vehicle on a road at any time under the Road Traffic Act. They will usually check You and the Vehicle out on the PNC and if all is in order send you on your way.

If you had just had your bike nicked of your drive whilst you nipped back in the house for your wallet you would have been well impressed that the Police stopped the bike fives minutes later for no other reason that because they can lol.

Theres plenty of decent cops out there and plenty of ar$e$ too, so be grateful you didn't get a ticket, I know plenty that would have as they love doing bikers.

[markmoto]

beware chaps i heard rumour from a mate of mine who runs a car parts business that they can now do you £60 fine and three points for an illegal number plate, must be full size with Bs number on proper spacing etc no special writing etc. And im sure if they can nw police will be happy to enforce that one.

Just victimising bikers yet again.

[Baph]

beware chaps i heard rumour from a mate of mine who runs a car parts business that they can now do you £60 fine and three points for an illegal number plate, must be full size with Bs number on proper spacing etc no special writing etc. And im sure if they can nw police will be happy to enforce that one.

Just victimising bikers yet again.

Unless things have seriously changed, the plate is a non-endorsed offence (ie, no points), and it's £30. I was caught for this not so long back. But long enough that it may of changed.

Apparently if caught a few times consecutively, they're allowed to remove the plate & leave you & the bike where you are, whilst they refer you to a court for further rodgering, sorry, prosecution.

[Jamiebridges123]

I have a "slightly" smaller than standard plate on my bike, it's still a square one square and the digits are still fully readable for anyone with half a brain. Can't see any BS marks on it but it does say SV650s so I'll just claim I have dyslexia.

Sucks to hear bikers are getting targeted, but unfortunately it's becoming a country wide problem. :smt087

[Bluepete]

So lets get this right. You were stopped, had a chat with a couple of blokes who could have fined you £30 for your can but didn't. That took, what three minutes out of your life? Plus, you got a "get out of jail free card" to wave to show you have already been checked. Not all bikers are riding Gods with an intimate knowlege of the law and their bikes roadworthyness. Some need stopping and looking at.

Stu, yes, Insurance and MOT can be checked from the plate, driving licence needs a date of birth.

Mototech, not heard that one, it's still £30 for an illegal plate.

So overall, a non-story really.

Pete

[timwilky]

Pete

In the spirit of fairness and to prove they are not discriminatory, should plod not also have targeted days where they will pull all cars and give them the once over and a ticket to go on their way if no defect found etc.

[markmoto]

Pete, i think what probably got the Ops back up was the statement "hello sir, just checking all bikes over the weekend for safety reasons" when we all know its not for safety reasons in northwales! If it was they should be checking all vehicles.

Aparently the £60 fine and three points is getting fazed in to discourage the use of non legal plates, its the first ive heard of it but he owns a shop who makes number plates so maybe its come down from sometome in that business, could it be a merseyside thing only purhaps?

Pete i lost alot of respect for the police resently when i was done for speeding, yes i was doing slightly over the limit but it was on a dual carriageway with a 30limit and i was doing under 40mph. to cut a long story short the police officer who delt with me said nothing about road safety just wanted to get me on the books and get onto the next one while there are people driving through red lights while using mobile phones etc , in my opinion speed doesnt kill its the inappropriate use of speed that does oh and around here the police never stick to the speed limit so its abit hipicritical me thinks.

sorry for the derail and the rant just wish they would do more towards dangerous idiotic driving than minor speeding offences but i guess they wouldnt make as much money.

[the_lone_wolf]

Pete

In the spirit of fairness and to prove they are not discriminatory, should plod not also have targeted days where they will pull all cars and give them the once over and a ticket to go on their way if no defect found etc.

i believe they're called "the other 364 days"

;)

[Stu]

Stu, yes, Insurance and MOT can be checked from the plate, driving licence needs a date of birth.

:D
So can you not get date of birth from the insurance records? I presume that's where Plod got my occupation from when they determined that I was riding it like I stole it 8-[

:lol:

Oh & for completeness you can check tax from the plate yeah?

[Leopard_lily]

Apparently lately they have been checking bikes for any modifications and calling insurers to see if they have been declared, if not - they seize the bike on the spot.

[markmoto]

Apparently lately they have been checking bikes for any modifications and calling insurers to see if they have been declared, if not - they seize the bike on the spot.

Realy? where did you get this info? reliable source it certainly wouldnt suprise me part of me thinks its long over due.

[Frank]

back to the number plate and it needing to have the manufactures name or stealers name on it.
Doesnt this only count on vehicles from 03(I think) onwards

[Leopard_lily]

Realy? where did you get this info? reliable source it certainly wouldnt suprise me part of me thinks its long over due.

My partner told me (he's a biking instructor) the ponderosa cafe is one of the places they are targeting for this.

[Ch00]

:D

So can you not get date of birth from the insurance records?



The computer does not hold the date of birth on insurance files. Also who says its that person driving/riding at the time?

Ch00

[Speedy Claire]

Glad they weren`t able to do you for anything..... you`d think they had something better to do tho!!!

[Ed]

Pete - so what if someone has a small plate? Does it mean to say that police officers have to give someone a £30 fine?? Does it REALLY matter? Does it really mean that the bike isn't safe? Yes of course it's the law - but bigger things happen in life, a small number plate is not a safety issue. Or have I missed something?

[the_lone_wolf]

Pete - so what if someone has a small plate? Does it mean to say that police officers have to give someone a £30 fine?? Does it REALLY matter? Does it really mean that the bike isn't safe? Yes of course it's the law - but bigger things happen in life, a small number plate is not a safety issue. Or have I missed something?

the current level of enforcement doesn't mean every bike has a legal plate, if that were the aim then it could easily be enforced heavy handedly, but it does mean that the vast majority of bikes have a half sensible 7x5 or larger

if the level of enforcement drops further suddenly lots of people have 6x3, and a sizeable number have even smaller plates, but if they get pulled everyone moans and claims they're being victimised

now imagine you get run off the road by someone with a tiny 4x2 plate with a silly font and you can't tell the police what it was, all of sudden keeping the level of enforcement to somewhere where the vast majority of riders stick to a sensible, if not legal, size seems like a much better idea...

[Baph]

A sufficiently small plate can't be read by ANPR. I've had it proven to me that a 7x5 cannot be read by ANPR when you pass a stationary police car at 50mph.

That's exactly the caution I was given (along with my £30 fine). The officer's words to me, were "It's all well & good having a small plate, call it fashion, call it aerodynamics, but if some scouser comes & nicks your bike, I could be 5miles down the road & wouldn't know about it when they pass ANPR cameras. If you have a legal plate, I'd know about it. Which would you prefer?"

I still have a small plate, but it's not 7x5 like it was. :rolleyes:

I hasten to add, that whilst giving me tickets for a small plate & crossing solid white lines, no comment was made about the speed of either vehicle for the last 25 miles, and it was in excess of the limit. :thumbsup:

[Bluepete]

Pete - so what if someone has a small plate? Does it mean to say that police officers have to give someone a £30 fine?? Does it REALLY matter? Does it really mean that the bike isn't safe? Yes of course it's the law - but bigger things happen in life, a small number plate is not a safety issue. Or have I missed something?

Nope, not a problem, not a safety issue, but TLW and Baph have answered the question before I saw it. Thanks fellas!

Silly one liners the size of a Mars Bar may get a ticket, but it's a rare and unusual event ;)

Pete

[flymo]

......but if some scouser comes & nicks your bike.

The cheeky get.

[Nobbylad]

The cheeky get.

+1

[Speedy Claire]

A sufficiently small plate can't be read by ANPR. I've had it proven to me that a 7x5 cannot be read by ANPR when you pass a stationary police car at 50mph.

That's exactly the caution I was given (along with my £30 fine). The officer's words to me, were "It's all well & good having a small plate, call it fashion, call it aerodynamics, but if some scouser comes & nicks your bike, I could be 5miles down the road & wouldn't know about it when they pass ANPR cameras. If you have a legal plate, I'd know about it. Which would you prefer


He should have been reported for discrimination!!!

[Jamiebridges123]

I'd say if someone nicked my bike you wouldn't bloody care anyway!

[Baph]

Isn't it funny how people jump to conclusions?

What I wrote, was said by the officer in question with a smile on his face, and in a thick scouse accent.

Please, non of this... :smt062

[flymo]

Isn't it funny how people jump to conclusions?

What I wrote, was said by the officer in question with a smile on his face, and in a thick scouse accent.

Please, non of this... :smt062

A scouse copper that nicks bikes at the weekend.....thats even worse!

[Ed]

I had never thought of this particular law being there for positive reasons - ie to assist ANPR and so recognise a stolen bike. I confess that I thought it was there simply to make life difficult. My bike has a legal dinner plate on the back, I can do without the hassle of being pulled, but I'd like a smaller plate as the present thing is one of Prince Charles's monstrous carbuncles. So the law is there to protect me from myself.

I wonder how many people actually realise that this is so. It seems to me that the government - and, with respect Pete, the police - have entirely failed to communicate what a helpful rule it is, rather than to whack people over the head with a fine and a finger wagging.

[G]

I had never thought of this particular law being there for positive reasons - ie to assist ANPR and so recognise a stolen bike. I confess that I thought it was there simply to make life difficult. My bike has a legal dinner plate on the back, I can do without the hassle of being pulled, but I'd like a smaller plate as the present thing is one of Prince Charles's monstrous carbuncles. So the law is there to protect me from myself.

I wonder how many people actually realise that this is so. It seems to me that the government - and, with respect Pete, the police - have entirely failed to communicate what a helpful rule it is, rather than to whack people over the head with a fine and a finger wagging.

To be honest if my bike was stolen, I wouldnt want it back, it would be damaged, ragged no doubt and it would not feel the same.

Although strictly speak I have a legal plate now its not 9x7 but all the spacing, borders and letter sizing is 100% correct which is all the DVLA specify.

Onto the original topic I dont see the problem with bikes being pulled over in all honesty, alot do ride like idiot (myself probably included in some people eyes), alot do have illegal bikes......and a hell of alot dont have tax and insurance.

Car are pulled over just as much during the week so concentrating on the bikes at the weekend is not a big deal.

[Baph]

I wonder how many people actually realise that this is so. It seems to me that the government - and, with respect Pete, the police - have entirely failed to communicate what a helpful rule it is, rather than to whack people over the head with a fine and a finger wagging.

Ah, but Ed, the way it was worded by the officer that stopped me, some people here have visibly taken offence (even if to a minor extent).

The words "can't do right for doing wrong" come to mind. :rolleyes: :lol:

[Ed]

Ah, but Ed, the way it was worded by the officer that stopped me, some people here have visibly taken offence (even if to a minor extent).

The words "can't do right for doing wrong" come to mind. :rolleyes: :lol:

Well if people bothered to explain that these daft laws that we have to contend with really do have a sound purpose - I think I'm reasonably bright but it was lost on me - then perhaps people would realise that the man from the ministry really does have our best interests at heart. Instead of the Government's financial interest.

Basic failure to communicate. And people like Pete are given the thankless job of enforcing it.

[Bluepete]

At the end of the day, a number plate is there to identify a vehicle to any person on the road. Not just for my purposes, be it ANPR or just being nosey and stopping cars, but for others to be able to identify it if it were to be involved in a collision or criminal endeavour.

Therefore, a plate has to be legible and to that end, plate sizes, fonts and spacings etc are defined in law. With something like this, where a specific measurement is given, below that level is not legal, if it meets the requirements, it is legal.

There are no grey areas, too small is enforceable.

However, each force seems to have their own guidelines about enforcement. We all know certain forces are very keen to prosecute bikers for seemingly minor enfractions, others, (perhaps a northern city force?) have no huge influx of motorcyclists every sunny weekend, so have no press to stop and enforce the letter of the law.

As Ed says, usually, the order comes down from on high, and as poo trickles downhill, the PC's get to meet the clients and issue the £30 fine. They might not have an issue with small plates, but they all have a mortgage to pay, and orders are orders.

Perhaps better education is the key? Then again, bikers always seem to know the law better than anyone else ;) so shouldn't be surprised if they aren't legal and get stopped.

So, we come back to the OP. He was stopped by Cops from a force with a notorious attitude towards bikers. He had a can with no baffle, but wasn't given a ticket for it. Lucky lad I say.

Pete

[xXBADGERXx]

Well this has shed a positive light on things for me with it also being a plus with the ANPR if the bike is nicked . And I read Baph`s post as it was meant by the Officer , some humour on the Officers side with a cheeky wink I should gather ?

[G]

Therefore, a plate has to be legible and to that end, plate sizes, fonts and spacings etc are defined in law. With something like this, where a specific measurement is given, below that level is not legal, if it meets the requirements, it is legal.

There are no grey areas, too small is enforceable.



The DVLA do not specify specific plate sizes as a legal requirement, just measurements......for example the plate A1 would not be expected to sit on a 9" x 7" plate.

[markmoto]

but if some scouser comes & nicks your bike

Eh La you got a problem with scousers like mate~?? :smt094

[Damian]

hi all dose any know about bikes meetting up @ the ponderosa i think the 19th of september, to protest about the way the welsh police.if so dose any one want to go :smt104

[Gemaroo]

It's deffo £60 non-endorsable for number plate not conforming (changed a couple of months ago, along with no seatbelt)

[Luckypants]

Meeting up to protest the way the Welsh police what? :rolleyes:

I think you mean this.... http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=137681

[Milky Bar Kid]

It's deffo £60 non-endorsable for number plate not conforming (changed a couple of months ago, along with no seatbelt)

Yeah thats correct. No points but the fine has gone up to £60, although its a fairly recent thing.

[custard]

heres the rub with ANPR... most are forward facing, i think cars are the only things that have anpr to read your rear plate.

it actually stands for Absolutely Necessary Promotional Requirement.

they had prolly had a few bike thefts and might actually be doing something about it...

[Stewart.C]

I would be happy that you got the OK from the cops.

so they took 15 mins off your life but you know you have a safe bike :)

[Stewart.C]

Here is another reason for pulling people.

One In Five Young Drivers Uninsured

[Luckypants]

they had prolly had a few bike thefts and might actually be doing something about it...

:smt046 Please that is too funny! No N. Wales police do pull bikes for no reason around the honeypot bike roads / meeting places in order to hassle bikes.

I would be happy that you got the OK from the cops.

so they took 15 mins off your life but you know you have a safe bike :)

The police call them 'safety checks' but the only thing safety related they check is the tyre tread depth - something I'll check myself thank you and so should all bikers. The reason they check tread depth is they can fine you and give points for it. Do they check your brakes? Steering? Suspension? Wheel bearings? No of course not - because they cannot nick you for any of that! (Unless the bike is blatantly not road worthy) Do they do a document check? Of course - in case they find something they can do you for! If I got pulled for a 'safety check' I would always give them grief for not checking safety items. ;)

Here is another reason for pulling people.

One In Five Young Drivers Uninsured

Which refers in the main to car drivers! Do we see cars being stopped en masse in N. Wales? An emphatic NO! Insurance / MOT / RFL can all be checked with a simple radio call or by ANPR without stopping the rider, so this is not necessary but they still do it.

I don't get stopped in N. Wales because I avoid the areas where the Police flex their muscles, but it still annoys the hell out of me that I have to do that though.

[slark01]

Well motorcycle groups could always try a class action against the police for discrimination to motorcyclists. The groups would have to prove that the safety checks are not actually safety checks and are just pulling the bikers up to try and stop them from riding in that area.
It would have to have a very large number of people involved and must have a solicitor that knows about motorcycling and the laws regarding it.
Having a protest is useless and a waste of time, it could also make the police happy as they can check alot of bikes at the same time.
I've never been pulled by the police and actually had a few nods, I believe this is due to the fact I wear textiles, Trip helmet and I am on a sv650s thats not doing 120mph ;-)

[markmoto]

Well motorcycle groups could always try a class action against the police for discrimination to motorcyclists. The groups would have to prove that the safety checks are not actually safety checks and are just pulling the bikers up to try and stop them from riding in that area.
It would have to have a very large number of people involved and must have a solicitor that knows about motorcycling and the laws regarding it.
Having a protest is useless and a waste of time, it could also make the police happy as they can check alot of bikes at the same time.
I've never been pulled by the police and actually had a few nods, I believe this is due to the fact I wear textiles, Trip helmet and I am on a sv650s thats not doing 120mph ;-)

Im with ste, ive never in over ten years riding more bikes than most been stopped, and i also make a point of nodding at them just to be cheaky, maybe its because i never dress like a power ranger and dont use unappropriate speed, although im sure i used to, the majority of the biking commiunity bitch on about getting victimised!! Is it any wonder? wales just chose to take a strict line on it probably due to the amount of casualties, so they make a few quid out of it, this only goes towards the cost of sweeping up bits of plastic when the heros become unstuck.. Bikers are reaping what they sow just unfortunate that the sensible amongst us may get tared with the same brush sometimes...

[punyXpress]

Guy stopped near Llangollen 'cos of his speed!
Driving 1928 Humber @ 40mph so he's stopped for that & we're stopped for 41mph?

[Damian]

Meeting up to protest the way the Welsh police what? :rolleyes:

I think you mean this.... http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=137681
hi thanks yes ill be going to this any one else????????

[Speedy Claire]

I`m not convinced it`ll achieve anything Damian... fingers crossed it will but I`m sceptical. Why aren`t the MCN leading people to the meeting point? surely that would have more clout?

I`m concerned that this would become a mad free for all with a load of bikers descending on North Wales for a "protest" but if there`s no control over the ride to the meeting place I fear there`s going to be a lot of fines given out. I`d anticipate that riders who don`t usually ride in Wales due to its reputation suddenly realise how good the roads are and feel a false sense of security because they`re part of "A big MCN protest"... this could lead to a few riders thinking they`re on a race track and god forbid one or two casualties.

Personally I`ve never been stopped by North Wales whilst on the bike, i`ve made a point of nodding a polite hello at any police motorcyclists and always get a nod or a wave back.

[skeetly]

I don't think it's going to help either.
Meeting at places like the ponderosa after publicising it in the press will mean that the cops will be in attendance.
Riders who wish to 'take the roads back' are likely to be riding in a manner that attracts attention one way or the other.
So we'll have crashes and people getting nicked.
Everyone will say how terrible north wales police are and vow to never return.
North wales police will say how terrible bikers are.
MCN get lots to write about.
:D

[Luckypants]

From the local press....

http://www.northwalesweeklynews.co.uk/conwy-county-news/local-conwy-news/2009/09/03/protest-rally-to-hit-the-conwy-valley-55243-24591716/

[Damian]

il be going any one to meet up with me ?????