Dogs as weapons...

[missyburd]

I've just watched this fascinating but thoroughly shocking documentary about young people owning and training their dogs to be aggressive towards people and the reintroduction of pitbulls. It's one of the most saddening things I've watched in a while, the dog-lovers on here will be sickened I'm sure but the programme really brings home this growing trend and it's bloody worrying. Having lived on council estates and witnessed these sorts of things myself, it's a scary prospect indeed...

Anyone else seen this?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00kmtl9/My_Weapon_is_a_Dog/

Near the end one of the fellas talks about these dogs being dangerous if used in the right way, obviously he means the wrong way! These people seem to be so naive and really don't understand the dangers! I sincerely hope this programme makes people think :-(

I warn you now it does contain cruelty cases that, if you're soft like me will bring a tear to the eye. But it's very interesting and a good watch.

Discuss at leisure!

[dizzyblonde]

Don't need to see Maria. I see it every day in chav central. Sickening really, especially when you spend many tiring hours training your own dogs to be the opposite

The worst thing round here, is the asian youngsters. Their thing at the moment is Akitas. Most of the asian comunity fear dogs, so why are these lads making thier comunity fear them more, by training them to be aggressive.

[BanditPat]

Watched this the other day when it was on TV, I don't see a problem with dogs being used as protection. My dogs soft as cake but it has a vicious bark to it, It makes me feel safer when im out with my dog than when I'm out on my own. I know that the dog wouldn't harm anything except a cat if i asked it to but other people dont know that if it starts barking. I wuv my doggy :]

[dizzyblonde]

Watched this the other day when it was on TV, I don't see a problem with dogs being used as protection. My dogs soft as cake but it has a vicious bark to it, It makes me feel safer when im out with my dog than when I'm out on my own. I know that the dog wouldn't harm anything except a cat if i asked it to but other people dont know that if it starts barking. I wuv my doggy :]

A dog will protect its master without ever training it to be aggressive. I know my dogs won't purposely harm anyone. BUT, by their own learning alone, protect my home. They only hear a gate and they bark, they see a person in hi viz jacket jump over the gate, and Honey will bite the ass of the gate hopper. If Im Indoors raised a hand I'm pretty sure Bob would eat him, he gets upset when we argue.....but the point is, I have never purposely gone out to get my dogs wound up to attack people or other animals

BOB the dog is an eternal puppy, but hear him bark and he sounds like the hound of the Baskervilles and runs around like the beast of Bodmin on the moor, he can look quite frightening!

[missyburd]

Watched this the other day when it was on TV, I don't see a problem with dogs being used as protection. My dogs soft as cake but it has a vicious bark to it, It makes me feel safer when im out with my dog than when I'm out on my own. I know that the dog wouldn't harm anything except a cat if i asked it to but other people dont know that if it starts barking. I wuv my doggy :]

Nothing wrong with using a dog as protection, of course not. My alsatian has a vicious bark and I know people avoid me in the street because of his breed's reputation but that's the way I like it tbh. But most of the people in that documentary had no control over their animals. A dog protecting its owner is an entirely different animal to one that has been pi$$ed off to the point of madness and ends up unleashing forced anger upon something/one else. Having a vicious dog because it's "cool" is disgusting.

The point here is that these animals are not being treated as pets but simply accessories, like a trendy handbag. My dog is loved as part of the family. I have tapped his nose a couple of times when he's eaten something he shouldn't have but never to deliberately provoke viciousness. IMO an angry dog is 10 times worse than the threat of a knife and 100x more unpredictable. Like it was mentioned in the documentary, if a youth pulls a knife out they'll rarely use it. In comparison, if they tell their dog to "attack" there's no going back. That animal will not rest till it's caused as much damage as it's capable of, and that power is clearly being put in the wrong hands. It's just fkin wrong.

[BanditPat]

Nothing wrong with using a dog as protection, of course not. My alsatian has a vicious bark and I know people avoid me in the street but that's the way I like it tbh. But most of the people in that documentary had no control over their animals. A dog protecting its owner is an entirely different animal to one that has been pi$$ed off to the point of madness and ends up unleashing forced anger upon something/one else. Having a vicious dog because it's "cool" is disgusting.

The point here is that these animals are not being treated as pets but simply accessories, like a trendy handbag. My dog is loved as part of the family. I have tapped his nose a couple of times when he's eaten something he shouldn't have but never to deliberately provoke viciousness. IMO an agry dog is 10 times worse than the threat of a knife and 100x more unpredictable. Like it was mentioned in the documentary, if a youth pulls a knife out they'll rarely use it. In comparison, if they tell their dog to "attack" there's no going back. That animal will not rest till it's caused as much damage as done, and that power is clearly being put in the wrong hands. It's just fkin wrong.


Ah good thought you were against dogs being used as protection as well ;)

there was the lad with the doberman that seemed to have control of his dog. Cant say the same about the rest of them but one of them seemed fine.

[missyburd]

Ah good thought you were against dogs being used as protection as well ;)

there was the lad with the doberman that seemed to have control of his dog. Cant say the same about the rest of them but one of them seemed fine.
That was a rottweiler, and yes he proved that a dog can be trained without abuse, of course it can. But I don't think these people understand a dog will want to protect you of its own free will, forcing it to see red will just backfire.

[Miss Alpinestarhero]

Nothing wrong with using a dog as protection, of course not. My alsatian has a vicious bark and I know people avoid me in the street but that's the way I like it tbh. But most of the people in that documentary had no control over their animals. A dog protecting its owner is an entirely different animal to one that has been pi$$ed off to the point of madness and ends up unleashing forced anger upon something/one else. Having a vicious dog because it's "cool" is disgusting.

The point here is that these animals are not being treated as pets but simply accessories, like a trendy handbag. My dog is loved as part of the family. I have tapped his nose a couple of times when he's eaten something he shouldn't have but never to deliberately provoke viciousness. IMO an angry dog is 10 times worse than the threat of a knife and 100x more unpredictable. Like it was mentioned in the documentary, if a youth pulls a knife out they'll rarely use it. In comparison, if they tell their dog to "attack" there's no going back. That animal will not rest till it's caused as much damage as it's capable of, and that power is clearly being put in the wrong hands. It's just fkin wrong.


I agree with ya there Miss YC.

No matter how well trained an animal is, you can never guarentee that they will be 100% obedient. An animal has its own free will and will do what it wants to. So irresponsible owners who encourage their dogs to be aggressive is just worrying.

[BanditPat]

That was a rottweiler, and yes he proved that a dog can be trained without abuse, of course it can. But I don't think these people understand a dog will want to protect you of its own free will, forcing it to see red will just backfire.


Damn it i get them mixed up all the time, dobermans the pointy less built one ;]

[appollo1]

Jus looked at this and I have to say I am disgusted. Most of you know I have a German Shepherd and he is a lot bigger than most but I know how well treated and looked after he is.

I cannot believe that these idiots are allowed to have dogs. I am sure there would be an outcry if their dogs turned on them and caused them injury.

[thedonal]

It's a shame dog licenses are no longer in force. That would make some difference, even if it did not eradicate the problem.

[sauluk]

Really sickening some of that. People need a proper slap, are far too thick to own an animal

[Swin]

Damn it i get them mixed up all the time, dobermans the pointy less built one ;]


Doberman = Pointy, Rottweiler = Curvy :D

Joking aside, what's the point of this? I can't view the link because I'm at work, is it so they can walk around with a deadly weapon in plain view, on the end of a lead?

[SoulKiss]

Simple bit of dog physiology (well as I understand it - any vets that want to correct me are welcome to.)

Aparently the heart muscles are anchored in some way that means if you grab the front legs then push them wide and backwards (think the crusifixion pictures) you will split a dogs heart = instant kill.

Back to the more important thing, I will approach ANY dog and have only ever had one snap at me, and he was very ill at the time.

I know when to back off, and how to do that if needed.

I had some idiot kid "warn" me off that his dog would bite (dog was investigating me at the time, I was interacting back)

I could tell that the dog was not stressed, worried or anything - it was just a puppy wanting to check out all the smells and play, but this kid was trying to make me fear his dog, which I then saw him try to wind up when some other kids came along (by kid I mean15-16 year old btw)

I really wish I had some way of getting that dog taken off him that wouldn't have had a chance of the dog being put down.

[missyburd]

Doberman = Pointy, Rottweiler = Curvy :D

Joking aside, what's the point of this? I can't view the link because I'm at work, is it so they can walk around with a deadly weapon in plain view, on the end of a lead?

Lol pretty much. Young people (i.e.16-25yrolds) are getting hold of the meanest looking breeds in a bid to give them a more "threatening" image. Many are being trained to "attack" and these owners are completely irresponsible, clearly not realizing the implications of this.

At one point one was being interviewed with his dog off the lead. Once back on the lead that dog was aggressive towards a person walking by and the interviewer asked the owner "had that dog been off the lead just then would ha have savaged that fella" (well that was the gist of the question...) and the owner replied yeah, well probably. To which the interviewer asked "what would you do in that situation?". Owner: "Nothing I could do, i don't know what I would do". It's just wrong. The programme shows the levels of cruelty that are being shown to these animals; overbreeding, severely mauled victims (both human and canine) and abuse to makie them so aggressive in the first place.

And I agree with thedonal, the bringing back of dog licences would be a damn good idea. If people had to pay to own a dog, the incentive to get hold of them quite so easy would not be so strong!

[timwilky]

Friend has two english bull terriers and a rott. He puts a mask on every day with the mother in laws face and gives the dogs a good kicking. Does it work?

No his wife locks them away and lets her mother in.


Only joking, he would never hurt his babies, but they do hate his mother in law. T'is funny to see them go into attack mode if they sense her within a 100 yard of his house

[Swin]

Simple bit of dog physiology (well as I understand it - any vets that want to correct me are welcome to.)

Aparently the heart muscles are anchored in some way that means if you grab the front legs then push them wide and backwards (think the crusifixion pictures) you will split a dogs heart = instant kill.




I seem to recall hearing something like this too, the only problem with this procedure that I can see is that to grab both of the dog's front legs, you're putting your face quite close to the bit with all the teeth in....

[missyburd]

I seem to recall hearing something like this too, the only problem with this procedure that I can see is that to grab both of the dog's front legs, you're putting your face quite close to the bit with all the teeth in....
Sorry SK I forgot to comment on that. It is true, the weakest part of a dog is its chest, with fatal consequences. So if a dog is charging towards you I remember being told one to kick its chest i.e. between its front legs which will cause it to cave in....

[Alpinestarhero]

I agree with ya there Miss YC.

No matter how well trained an animal is, you can never guarentee that they will be 100% obedient. An animal has its own free will and will do what it wants to. So irresponsible owners who encourage their dogs to be aggressive is just worrying.

This is why I am fearfull of dogs. If I know the owner, and I can see they are responsible, then (with the owner around) I'm ok with the dog.

I see alot of teenagers around here aswell with agressive dogs. I don;t go anywhere near them, you don;t know if the dog will flip when a stranger comes near

[yorkie_chris]

Sorry SK I forgot to comment on that. It is true, the weakest part of a dog is its chest, with fatal consequences. So if a dog is charging towards you I remember being told one to kick its chest i.e. between its front legs which will cause it to cave in....

A big dog is a true land-shark, they have very tough skulls, a strong ribcage. Not a fight you're going to win easily. If you could get the dog onto its back by falling onto it you'd have the advantage. But then you've still got to find a way to kill 9 stone of muscle with big teeth without a weapon... AND deal with the owner who will likely be annoyed at you killing his dog.
The good news is the owner will be much easier to snap bits off than the dog.

Dog licensing, well it's a non starter. These f##kwits wouldn't bother and there's nothing to stop people just breeding dogs when they fancy. People carry guns, knives, that is illegal too and it still happens.

I'd say solution is simply stop paying council estate scratters a living, pretty soon they would be hungry and eat the dangerous dogs. And then either do something useful and become real people, or starve to death. It's win-win.

[Professor]

My dog is a weapon:

http://www.homepages.ucl.ac.uk/~ucahdva/photos/monster.jpg

Mind you, this weapon is uncontrollable: he bites me and my daughter
regularly. Only Mrs Professor doesn't get attacked.

This is the way he was 12 years ago when we bought him as a puppy
and this is the way he is today. I guess some dogs are born that
way. Maybe some humans are as well.

[Becks]

Dogs are just as dangerous as humans, the government ascertaining certain breeds are dangerous is not the correct way to control violent/dangerous dogs.

A certain breed of dog is not dangerous, the way a dog is brought up will determine how it will behave just like humans.

[dizzyblonde]

Isn't it strange Mr Professor, how dogs who go off on one, get that milky tinge to their eyes. I had a Basset that went like that, when he wanted to show dominance, and a springer spaniel, who at five months old did this.....he later got sent to an ex policeman who trained dogs for sniffing drugs in nightclubs. I couldn't have him rehomed, as I didn;t want anyone to have to be put through what I went through with him, so he went to someone who could handle him.

Through having two dominant and aggressive dogs I have learnt many lessons, which I tried to use wisely when I had the 'who rules the roost' challenge when Bob started growing nuts and Honey felt she was being threatened in her old age.
YC will back me up on this, as he has been in the middle of some very serious dog fights in my home....its very very hard to control two dogs once they are completely embroiled in killing the other. Its taken me nearly two years of very careful montioring and strict rules to get my two dogs to live in harmony, and trust. They are beautiful dogs and really wouldn't hurt any human being, but I wouldn't trust either with a strange dog. I make sure that people know this when we're out walking, as butter looks like it wouldn't melt.....i can't take the chance. 9 times out of ten these days they frolic round fields with other dogs, making friends, but just once and Honey will start something if she feels that way inclined(she is blind in one eye and old).
Its sad that people purposely go out to make dogs like this, as when its in innocence, a dog is probably very stressed to be angry, so just think what it does to a dog when they are made to do it.

[Sally]

My first and only pet was a golden cocker spaniel, male, and also we had a female Irish Setter for 5 years when I got him as a pup.

Would be playing around with me one minute, and then just snap, just with the look of death in his eyes, snarling, biting me etc.
Would also do it randomly, even when no one was playing with him.

Vet said it was rage, so he had to be put down.
I miss him :(

[Ploppy]

To deliberately entice any animal to attack can be prosecuted under the the new animal welfare act. Its proving that a dog is violent and has been used this way which is the hard part. As for licensing, there are 4 dog breeds that need a certificate of exemption (as to there being violent) need muzzling while in public places and need to have someone over 16 years in control of them at all times (dangerous dogs act). If I can remember the breeds, i think they are American pit bull, Japanese Tosa, Fila braziliaro and the dogo argentino. BUT.... the people who do this daft stuff with dogs and weapons wont have these certificates and again how do you enforce it? Its police who should do this but i suppose its a question of manpower with them??....

[Bluewolf]

Can't watch things like this, I come over all irrational and throw things at the telly... :smt068

[missyburd]

Can't watch things like this, I come over all irrational and throw things at the telly... :smt068

Yeah I was hurling obscenities at it, stupid eejits :smt027