Google lattitude as a Bike Security Device?

[PsychoCannon]

Due to my line of work I have a large number of totally redundant Blackberry Smart phones and I'm thinking of enabling Google Lattitude on one of them and secreting the device somewhere on my bike.

Google Lattitude is basically Google Maps that pin points your phones location on a real time map.
I've used it as a Sat Nav before so it's fairly accurate.

Combined with auto answer it could double as a bug, or with a very loud ring tone and no voicemail, a good way to pinpoint it within a building or vehicle.

The only tricks going to be wiring the thing into the bikes power to keep it running discretly, with GPS running it should still have 24 hours or so battery life if they disconnect that.

How hard would it be to hook a phone upto a bikes power discreetly?

[muffles]

Due to my line of work I have a large number of totally redundant Blackberry Smart phones and I'm thinking of enabling Google Lattitude on one of them and secreting the device somewhere on my bike.

Google Lattitude is basically Google Maps that pin points your phones location on a real time map.
I've used it as a Sat Nav before so it's fairly accurate.

Combined with auto answer it could double as a bug, or with a very loud ring tone and no voicemail, a good way to pinpoint it within a building or vehicle.

The only tricks going to be wiring the thing into the bikes power to keep it running discretly, with GPS running it should still have 24 hours or so battery life if they disconnect that.

How hard would it be to hook a phone upto a bikes power discreetly?

Probably not too hard to hook it up if you had a charger, but discreetly is the problem. It's going to be pretty obvious to anyone who looks - and having seen the lengths to which a tracker installation goes, you have to hide it fairly well (assuming they make it that well hidden for a reason).

[SoulKiss]

Due to my line of work I have a large number of totally redundant Blackberry Smart phones and I'm thinking of enabling Google Lattitude on one of them and secreting the device somewhere on my bike.

Google Lattitude is basically Google Maps that pin points your phones location on a real time map.
I've used it as a Sat Nav before so it's fairly accurate.

Combined with auto answer it could double as a bug, or with a very loud ring tone and no voicemail, a good way to pinpoint it within a building or vehicle.

The only tricks going to be wiring the thing into the bikes power to keep it running discretly, with GPS running it should still have 24 hours or so battery life if they disconnect that.

How hard would it be to hook a phone upto a bikes power discreetly?

Very easy as long as you have access to feed from the battery that is not ignition switched.

Just get the cigarette adaptor for said phone, break it open, solder a live and an earth to the appropriate places on the circuit board (may have to wire in a replacement fuse) and put in a new box - probably cost < £10 from Maplins for the bits for modifying it plus the cost of the car charger.

[PsychoCannon]

Yeah that's what I'm worried about if I make it obvious and they find the phone it defeats the object :(

[PsychoCannon]

Very easy as long as you have access to feed from the battery that is not ignition switched.

Just get the cigarette adaptor for said phone, break it open, solder a live and an earth to the appropriate places on the circuit board (may have to wire in a replacement fuse) and put in a new box - probably cost < £10 from Maplins for the bits for modifying it plus the cost of the car charger.

Me and you may be having another sit down in the pub me thinks :)

[Biker Biggles]

Im not convinced.Firstly it wont deter thieves because they wont know its there,and once they have nicked it by throwing it in a van and driving off the damage is done.
Then theres the battery drain.All very well having security,but if the bike never starts because of a flat battery theres no point.
Id just go for a bigger chain.

[madnlooney]

phone sat nav arnt really good unless outside so if it was put in a van then a building it would of lost connection i think

[PsychoCannon]

True, The Chain etc are the deterent, this is an essentially free, if all else fails shot at:

a) Getting it back
b) getting the *****'s that took it nicked or badly beaten depending on who I decide to call =p

The bike would either be in constant use or on an optimate while standing should I get a rat bike as planned but I'll certainly look into the battery drain.

As for accuracy inside a Van should be fine, refigerated...hmm..will have to find some way to test that lol.
Buildings and underground not so good true, I'm in the middle of my building at the mo and it's reporting me on the wrong side of the block..but it's close... but the greatest likely hood is this is going to be 3am in the morning woken by alarm as it's thrown on a truck, call police and tell them what road and direction they are taking rather than the professional, expensive system that will work inside shipping containers etc =p.
I want one of those...just can't afford it right now :)

[SoulKiss]

Me and you may be having another sit down in the pub me thinks :)

No problem, let me know when - I have to give you some cash anyway.

[muffles]

The expensive 'proper' trackers often use multiple systems to track the vehicle. If you use a phone with GPS then you are actually pretty close, if it can track by mobile phone cell as well as by the GPS location coming 'down the wire'. IMO the main obstacle is making it discreet, you have to blend the wires in to the loom, hide the different parts, etc.

[SoulKiss]

The expensive 'proper' trackers often use multiple systems to track the vehicle. If you use a phone with GPS then you are actually pretty close, if it can track by mobile phone cell as well as by the GPS location coming 'down the wire'. IMO the main obstacle is making it discreet, you have to blend the wires in to the loom, hide the different parts, etc.

You are forgetting what he rides these days... BMW K1200LT "Battlestar Galactica" :)

If you cant hide a phone on that thing...

[muffles]

You are forgetting what he rides these days... BMW K1200LT "Battlestar Galactica" :)

If you cant hide a phone on that thing...

Haha...good point - he could hide it inside the coffee machine, or perhaps in the en suite toilet somewhere?

[Dave20046]

I've had exactly the same thought. If this is on an SV then they're not exactly going to expect a tracker I'd just gaffa it to the inside of some plastics (water sheltered) and try and hide the wiring as best as possible. I've thought about doing a lower tech equivelent; get an old phone keep it charged at home whenever I know I'm not going to be parking the bike at home hide it under the seat for example and if the bike goes missing use one of the 'find my phone' services.

[SoulKiss]

Haha...good point - he could hide it inside the coffee machine, or perhaps in the en suite toilet somewhere?

Or strip out one of the Viper bays...

Oh and this has already been done (ish) - http://ephermata.livejournal.com/204026.html

I believe that Baph's bike security is home-brew as well.

[PsychoCannon]

Sorry but the coffee machine and en suite stay! as does the mini bar :)
I may be able to get rid of the kitchen sink =p.

[Villers]

I would have a sticker that said 'tracker fitted' but personally if someone steals my bike I have no interest in getting it back. I dont want to find my bike somewhere smashed to bits and abused, only for the insurane company to repair it and **** all over its HPI. Catching someone in the act would be nice but again that isnt a final solution.

Think about it, bike gets stolen, police go looking (apparently if they can be arsed), insurance notified etc etc. At this point your premium is going northward anyway, without the added heartache of seeing your pride and joy in bits and losing all its value.

Security is a difficult thing, deterrence is probably the best means but with bikes its never going to be 100%. Take alarms for example, if one goes off everyone but the owner takes no notice. Next time you park your bike in town, set yours off and see if anyone bats an eyelid.

[DarrenSV650S]

Can I please have a free blackberry?

[rob13]

Can I please have a free blackberry?

+1! I was just going to ask that myself!

Shy bairns get nowt!

I reckon the switch on and leave when you're leaving it somewhere is a fairly good shout. Secreting it somewhere is something entirely different!

[ophic]

You can't hide it so obscure it. How do you obscure a blackberry? with other blackberries of course! Just stick them all over the bike and any thief will think twice before nicking it.

You said you had a few, right? :cool:

[thefallenangel]

Now hold on your average theif would they know a Blackberry could be used as a tracker?

Also why not just try to fool them and make it look like it's on "charge" rather than a tracker?

[SUPERSTARDJ01]

Correct me if i'm wrong but on my satnav and Iphone you have to be outside to get a GPS signal so if they have it in a storage facility then it wont pick the signal, you will also have to make it weather/heat proof.

Good idea though.

[hindle8907]

Its gave me a good idear this has .... i might do it and buy a cheap old 125cc leave it outside untill it gets nicked and then go bash the Crap out of em ! ??? what you think .

[muffles]

I would have a sticker that said 'tracker fitted'

If you didn't have a tracker....perhaps. The thing with trackers is, they are intended more to be used rather than as a deterrent, hence the hiding in amongst the loom, etc within the bike. You're not 'supposed' to let people know it has one :)

Correct me if i'm wrong but on my satnav and Iphone you have to be outside to get a GPS signal so if they have it in a storage facility then it wont pick the signal, you will also have to make it weather/heat proof.

Good idea though.

Yeah, you need a view of the sky, but you will also have the cell phone location that you can use. When using GPS, the phone finds out where it is via GPS and then sends it over the phone network to wherever you are looking at it from. If it can't figure out where it is, you still have the back up of using the mobile network to work out which phone mast it connected to - this is more resilient than the GPS signal so more likely to get through. It's not as accurate though.

[PsychoCannon]

For me this sollution is really a first few hours thing where minimal damage will occour hopefully.

If they find the phone chances are they'll remove the batt and try to sell it.
As for accuracy most likely it's going to be wake up at 3am to sound of alarm/van - On phone to police who will ask which was was it going.

At this point it should be still pinpointing what road and direction its going down so I can say A41 south, approaching junction x, ok stopped in a layby here.
I imagine handing the police an Easy bust like that which looks awsome on their stats will get a response!

If it still works when they dump store it, you can always arrange to pop down and check it out, and maybe have a few large friends sitting in a van nearby to see who comes to collect it =p.

[Villers]

If you didn't have a tracker....perhaps. The thing with trackers is, they are intended more to be used rather than as a deterrent, hence the hiding in amongst the loom, etc within the bike. You're not 'supposed' to let people know it has one :)


Hang on a minute, so you would rather someone didnt know it was tracked and nicked it? Rather than they see the sticker and know that they could be dealing with some decent security??

What do you do with your house? Leave the window open and put glow in the dark paint on the floor so you can follow the burglar home?

Deterrence is an important part of security, if my security fails then I dont want a stripped down/written off/ burnt out bike back to deal with. I'd rather they looked at my bike, saw the security info and then moved on to an easier target. I wouldnt be sat in my house while it was carted away rubbing my hands saying 'I cant wait to get that back'.:confused:

[muffles]

Hang on a minute, so you would rather someone didnt know it was tracked and nicked it? Rather than they see the sticker and know that they could be dealing with some decent security??

What do you do with your house? Leave the window open and put glow in the dark paint on the floor so you can follow the burglar home?

Deterrence is an important part of security, if my security fails then I dont want a stripped down/written off/ burnt out bike back to deal with. I'd rather they looked at my bike, saw the security info and then moved on to an easier target. I wouldnt be sat in my house while it was carted away rubbing my hands saying 'I cant wait to get that back'.:confused:

We call that an alarm!

I know of NO tracker companies that will advertise their product in any way, would like to know if any do. The deterrent part is for alarms, if they know there is a tracker they will take the bike and simply enclose it so the tracker can't be located. It's not an alarm and doesn't have any alarm features such as sirens.

[hindle8907]

if they know there is a tracker they will take the bike and simply enclose it so the tracker can't be located. .

+1 then just remove the tracker lmao .... why would any one advertise that they have a tracker fitted .. it defeats the point in having the tracker

[PsychoCannon]

I've always seen Tracker and such like are a "last resort/Peace of mind" if all deterents have failed and someone has managed to circumvent your security or enough of it to get away with the vehicle to work on the rest at lesuire, it's your ace in the hole as it were.

A mate at work got a stolen bike back purely because another bike stolen that night in the same van had a tracker fitted so the cops got all 4 bikes back :)

I guess it's like the Silent alarms to police you can get for your house., the house will have a regular Alarm but theives know most people ignore them.
You don't advertise it's ALSO linked to the police, or they'd just cut the phone lines as well defeating the point.

On that note it annoys me IMENSELY that you have to put a HUGE sign up saying CCTV! when you install hidden cameras on PRIVATE PROPERTY to catch people vandalising or robbing your property so they know to just wear a freaking hoodie and take care not to let it slip defeating the freaking point!.
You can install them without the signs, but then it's not admissable evidence in court apparently, freaking JOKE!

[Villers]

If an opprtune theif thinks there is a tracker he isnt going to take it. If its a gang of people doing it proffessionally and targeting bikes then they will take all required precautions anyway surely.

Like I keep saying, once its gone its gone, I dont want it back, I'd rather it wasnt taken in the first place.

[muffles]

If an opprtune theif thinks there is a tracker he isnt going to take it. If its a gang of people doing it proffessionally and targeting bikes then they will take all required precautions anyway surely.

Like I keep saying, once its gone its gone, I dont want it back, I'd rather it wasnt taken in the first place.

I don't understand your first point there - that's basically what an alarm does (stops opportunistic thieves). All I'm saying is no tracker is meant to do that. There are as you have pointed out, 2 different approaches to security, proactive and reactive. Trackers fall in the second camp, that's how they've been designed, whether it surprises you or not ;)
If you want a tracker for proactive security you may as well just buy the sticker (well...a sticker - like I said I don't know that you'll get any trackers that advertise), and not the tracker itself. What's the point in actually having it if you don't even want the bike back?

P.s. you'd be surprised at how many bike thieves don't take precautions for trackers.

[Dave20046]

On the 'labelling up' of a trackered bike subject - has anyone ever seen a car/bike that's been stolen/recovered with a tracker fitted? They get absolutely torn apart, expensive/write off states sometimes if they can't find the tracker as they get more and more desperate. Thieves take one of two approaches if they're unsure it actually has a tracker fitted it they nick it and leve it somewhere and return a day or so later to see if it's been recovered if not they finish up with whatever they need it for. If they know there's a tracker fitted they rip it apart and kick the **** out of it until it's found.

[muffles]

On the 'labelling up' of a trackered bike subject - has anyone ever seen a car/bike that's been stolen/recovered with a tracker fitted? They get absolutely torn apart, expensive/write off states sometimes if they can't find the tracker as they get more and more desperate. Thieves take one of two approaches if they're unsure it actually has a tracker fitted it they nick it and leve it somewhere and return a day or so later to see if it's been recovered if not they finish up with whatever they need it for. If they know there's a tracker fitted they rip it apart and kick the **** out of it until it's found.

Good points there, I've only ever seen bikes that have been recovered with a tracker when the thieves didn't know it had one, and the bikes have been recovered intact. I can see them tearing it to pieces if they knew it had one!