View Full Version : This lad should be shot dead
newts924
05-08-09, 09:26 PM
This happened yesterday evening not far from my house.
http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/blackburndarwenhyndburnribble/4529335.VIDEO__Girl__nine___violently_sexually_ass aulted__in_Great_Harwood/
I have a little girl who is seven years old and goes to the same school as this little girl
This just brings home how unsafe the country that we live in has become!!!
My thoughts are with the little girl and her family
Thats horrific. If it was my daughter, I would kill him myself:(
yorkie_chris
05-08-09, 10:27 PM
My sympathy goes out to the young 'un and her family.
The bloodthirsty part of me would put a bullet through his head in a heartbeat.
Sensible me says he's not proven guilty yet, he was simply there.
It must be really hard for the victims of crimes like this to recover mentally knowing that animals like this are free to roam, or will be some day. I do not consider nonces as human and would not afford them the courtesy of release.
The poor girl and her family i hope they can pull through this.
The boy (if guilty) just 17! i mean wtf, shouldnt he be on a street corner or driving round in his nova, sickening.
Castration, it's the only way to be sure.
Thats horrific. If it was my daughter, I would kill him myself:(
I'd agree with that.
BanannaMan
06-08-09, 04:24 AM
Here's in Britain's first colony, we deal with the likes of such in a proper manner.
http://gallerydriver.com/Art/03ElectricChair.gif
Here's a scenic view from the Greenville Correctional Facility in the lovely state of Virginia....
......Second only to Texas in criminal executions.
madness
06-08-09, 06:54 AM
Assuming the lad is guilty, I agree that he should never be allowed to do this sort of thing again, and as prisons are already overcrowded and my taxes are so high, execute the sick *******!
Before we round up a lynch mob, we don't have any details. As the police say, "We are still in the very early stages of our investigation."
I was reading this the other day: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood_massacre and it kinda shows what mass hsteria can lead to.
this might sound harsh...
i dont see the point of putting this story up. I can guarantee every single member of this good forum is sickened by whats happened in this case, and we're all old enough and ugly enough to understand that sadly this sort of thing does happen.
Naturally I've every sympathy for the people involved, but i've not clicked on the story - just "hovered" over the link to see the title/content, i didnt need to do any more - I dont need to click on it to know deplorable things happen. this site cheers me up, it makes me smile, its a good place.
but, of course what makes it a good place is its diversity. so, as you were....
Alpinestarhero
06-08-09, 07:57 AM
This has made me nauseous. String people who commit these crimes up by the balls and pour acid down their throats.
Such crimes are not justly punishable under our current system, I feel.
Bluewolf
06-08-09, 08:05 AM
.
Kate Moss
06-08-09, 08:09 AM
So scary when things like this happen so close to home.
timwilky
06-08-09, 08:21 AM
Yuk, as a father and grandfather I cannot understand why anyone would want to attack children in this way. Childhood innocence is wonderful. To see children play blissfully unaware of the evil that exists in society is heart warming. And then some scumbag then has to bring their evil world into theirs.
In years gone by, scum like this would get the message never to come back before being handed over to the police. Part of me thinks this day and age the messengers would get a harder punishment than the offender.
Alpinestarhero
06-08-09, 08:25 AM
Yuk, as a father and grandfather I cannot understand why anyone would want to attack children in this way. Childhood innocence is wonderful. To see children play blissfully unaware of the evil that exists in society is heart warming. And then some scumbag then has to bring their evil world into theirs.
In years gone by, scum like this would get the message never to come back before being handed over to the police. Part of me thinks this day and age the messengers would get a harder punishment than the offender.
Yea, I was somewhat suprised that the police praised the citizens for making the pursuit (well, sort of pursuit) and apprahending the suspect. Normally, they get told off
That's a very sorry story, however, I've been quite sure for some time that there aren't necesserily more of these types of criminals now, but simply we hear more about it. What was once local news is now national, or local news can be viewed internationally. With more reports making it to our doors and screens there is a perception that society has more of these people. I'm just not sure thats true.
Children should still be allowed freedom to play, the chances of this happening to them are thankfully remote. Statistically the people most likely to hurt young children are sadly family and close family friends, which is where the mind has great trouble working out how this happens to be the case.
Jambo
Lost for words. Tried 3 times to put something together about how sick it all is.
Thoughts with the girl and her family.
Just hope the welcome the guy gets from other inmates is, er, 'suitable'.
Biker Biggles
06-08-09, 09:42 AM
That's a very sorry story, however, I've been quite sure for some time that there aren't necesserily more of these types of criminals now, but simply we hear more about it. What was once local news is now national, or local news can be viewed internationally. With more reports making it to our doors and screens there is a perception that society has more of these people. I'm just not sure thats true.
Children should still be allowed freedom to play, the chances of this happening to them are thankfully remote. Statistically the people most likely to hurt young children are sadly family and close family friends, which is where the mind has great trouble working out how this happens to be the case.
Jambo
Very true.I actually think there was a lot more child abuse twenty or more years ago,much of which got hushed up.Sadly there were frequent serious events like this one as well.
Red Herring
06-08-09, 10:01 AM
I'm not quite sure what disappoints me most, the fact that things like this do occasionally happen, or the reaction of some people when it does. Assuming what is alleged did actually happen, and assuming the 17 year actually did it, then this is not normal behavior. As has already been said most 17 year old hang round street corners with their mates and don't go attacking young girls, so the first thing we should be asking is why has it happened. Is the "offender" mentally ill, was their any indication of such behaviour, if so how have we as a society failed to protect ourselves. I have no problem with all kinds of nasty things being done to deviants with a history of such acts, or even an adult who had committed such an act in sound mind, but a 17 year old is neither of those. He is a young individual still learning his way in life and his path was very much dictated by the society he lives in, ie: us.
The Guru
06-08-09, 10:06 AM
...He is a young individual still learning his way in life and his path was very much dictated by the society he lives in, ie: us.
But at 17 years of age he should have learned right from wrong :confused: and 'normal' 17 year olds know that this is wrong.
Red Herring
06-08-09, 10:20 AM
So where did he learn "wrong" from then?
Alpinestarhero
06-08-09, 10:29 AM
But at 17 years of age he should have learned right from wrong :confused: and 'normal' 17 year olds know that this is wrong.
+1
there are some things you should know are right and are wrong. I cant beleive the suspect wouldnt know that the legal age of consent is 16. Thats consenting age, not "she's old enough, i'll do as I please" age
Now this may not be a "learned" behaviour, that the suspect is exhibiting. It could be that he has formed abnormal sexual urges, which make him a potential danger in society. This dosn't mean lock him up and throw away the key by any means, but it does mean he has a lot to learn about recognising and controlling such feelings.
Red Herring
06-08-09, 10:33 AM
He's going to have trouble learning after being shot in the head, strung up by the goolies and having had acid poured down his throat, only some of the remedies so far suggested on here. Of course an impressionable youngster reading this forum might form the view that such penalties are acceptable to some.....
Of course an impressionable youngster reading this forum might form the view that such penalties are acceptable to some.....
Yup and then there's the implied acceptance of mob rule/vigilante justice, too.
This forum peally does pi$$ me off some times with people jumping to conclusions to something they've read in a news paper then taken as fact before any legal process.
Papers' are sold to make money. They are not 100% accurate or reliable.
It's all knee-jerk reactions hyped up by the interpretation of facts by some hack wanting to sell more papers.
Wow! Some heavy, revengeful, stuff being suggested. For those who suggest something barbaric, could you carry out the punishment?
I don't subscribe to hang 'em high school of thought. That only brings a supposed civilised educated society down the level of behaviour exhibited the offender. But nor do i subscribe to the 'oh the poor thing he needs a cuddle' liberalism that some prefer.
Imprison to protect society. Educate whilst in prison, and if you can guarantee the person won't commit a crime against an individual on release then parole/probation. And i do feel the term should be a deterent, not a couple of years for manslaughter and out early for good behaviour.
as you say, an emotive story, and difficult to control a knee-jerk reaction to. The trouble is, the situation is always more complicated than most people want it to be. Im not condoning anything but what about the people who actually beg to be castrated because they have urges they know are wrong? They are usually never given any sort of assistance because people can't get past the knowledge that these people have/want to commit crimes you automatically want to put them down for.
SoulKiss
06-08-09, 11:22 AM
He's going to have trouble learning after being shot in the head, strung up by the goolies and having had acid poured down his throat, only some of the remedies so far suggested on here. Of course an impressionable youngster reading this forum might form the view that such penalties are acceptable to some.....
I'm going to have to find myself doing that rare thing and agree with Mr Herring.
1st thing - I am DEFINATELY against what this kid is alleged to do, I think I made my feelings pretty clear in the Underage Thread of a couple of months ago, my stance is that anything done without Informed Consent (so knowing EXACTLY what you are agreeing to) is VERY wrong, I also accept that the mandated age of 16 is the line in the sand, despite knowing that the ACTUAL age that an individual is able to give that consent is variable on a person by person basis.
I once saw a program about paedophiles, they went into prisons and interviewed them, as well as talking to some who had been in prison and were now out and living as normal a life as they can while on the sex offenders register.
There was one guy that was actively campaigning to NOT be released from prison, he knew what he did was very wrong, but there was a compulsion to do it. He wanted to be locked up for the safety of the general public.
Every one of us finds something different to be attractive, be it leather/rubber, corsets/stockings etc.
These days, most of us (I hope) find homosexuality to be acceptable, and at its base (and in hideously simplified terms) all that comes down to is an extreme shift from being attracted to the opposite sex.
Is it then such a huge shock, that some people end up programmed, by whatever it is that sets our sexuality, to be attracted to children?
One point I must make, at this point is that I am CATEGORICALLY NOT equating homosexuality with paedophillia, one is a consenting act, the other is not, which is where my right/wrong line is drawn.
The problem is that there is no way that the guy involved could get help, I dont even know WHAT help could be given, but something caused him to see this poor girl as a focus for his sexual needs.
Again, what was done was VERY wrong.
Alpinestarhero
06-08-09, 11:24 AM
I conceed my initial post was a knee jerk reaction
hindle8907
06-08-09, 11:40 AM
I dont have any kids yet ... but if i did and this happend . and the person was guilty if i could get my hands on them i would kill them ..end of .
cant say how because of the U rating .
Red Herring
06-08-09, 11:47 AM
I do have kids, and despite my arguments to the contrary I'd do exactly as you would if someone harmed my kids like that. That's why we have to keep emotion out of justice.
I have two daughters, if anyone hurt one of them in this way, I think, in the heat of the moment and should I catch him, only one of us would be walking away. But I have another daughter I would not want to leave her with a Dad locked away for years.
I believe the justice system we have in the UK is one of the best in the world, but not prefect. I dont want the death sentence. I want them alive to be punshed for a very very long time, in most cases a murderer should only leave prison in a box on the way to the furnace.
As our children learn right from their family and society, so they learn wrong.
Did you know that roughly 1 child a week is killed in this country by it's parent/s/guardian/s?
Red Herring
06-08-09, 12:32 PM
And having a teenage daughter I can totally understand why!! Joking aside any form of domestic violence is incredibly hard to deal with as anybody getting involved from the outside has to first understand the emotions involved. It's very hard to rationalize with someone full of emotion, sometimes you just need to try and calm everything down first, if you have the opportunity to do so. Regrettably as it so often happens in private you are all to often clearing up the aftermath.
yorkie_chris
06-08-09, 10:51 PM
He is a young individual still learning his way in life and his path was very much dictated by the society he lives in, ie: us.
At 17 I was quite well aware that rape was not the done thing old chap. This is the work of someone who's monstrously sick in the head, it's not like possession of 2g of weed or setting off fireworks after bedtime! There is a quite important difference between a childish misjudgement and a barbaric act like this.
"Us"? Practically everyone I've ever met would not disagree with me too much if it was suggested that nonces were doused in petrol and set afire. You think he needs an ASBO or what?
Specialone
06-08-09, 11:35 PM
I'm not quite sure what disappoints me most, the fact that things like this do occasionally happen, or the reaction of some people when it does. Assuming what is alleged did actually happen, and assuming the 17 year actually did it, then this is not normal behavior. As has already been said most 17 year old hang round street corners with their mates and don't go attacking young girls, so the first thing we should be asking is why has it happened. Is the "offender" mentally ill, was their any indication of such behaviour, if so how have we as a society failed to protect ourselves. I have no problem with all kinds of nasty things being done to deviants with a history of such acts, or even an adult who had committed such an act in sound mind,
People who commit these acts on the whole are mentally ill because no sane person would ever do it.
Locking them up or beating them half to death will not stop their urges to young children, majority of sex offenders will re offend at some point because they cannot help themselves.
They are not deterred by violence, custodial sentence or death.
Castration is the only logical way i can see, take away that urge and i dont think a lot would re-offend.
But...if that happened to a member of my family (i dont have kids) i agree with a lot of you, i dont think i could contain myself as i'm sure the red mist would take over.
That young girl is tarnished for the rest of her life, mentally will never be the same, poor girl.
Red Herring
07-08-09, 12:12 AM
At 17 I was quite well aware that rape was not the done thing old chap. This is the work of someone who's monstrously sick in the head, it's not like possession of 2g of weed or setting off fireworks after bedtime! There is a quite important difference between a childish misjudgement and a barbaric act like this.
"Us"? Practically everyone I've ever met would not disagree with me too much if it was suggested that nonces were doused in petrol and set afire. You think he needs an ASBO or what?
And I'm fairly confident you're of sound mind old chap. There are however persons out there who are not, sometimes society gets some warning about these people and sometimes not. I'm not suggesting dangerous individuals should be cared for in the community, but you can't execute or lock up everybody who's short of a couple of planks, all you can do is try and manage these people, help them adjust to society if possible, protect us from them if not. We as a society have a responsibility towards such individuals, that's what civilization is all about. We have all kinds of systems in place to try and identify potential offenders early but we're not quite yet in Minority report territory, sometimes we can only react to events. Such events are fortunately extremely rare, I don't think we should abandon all principals of society and justice so easily.
BanannaMan
07-08-09, 01:19 AM
He's going to have trouble learning after being shot in the head, strung up by the goolies and having had acid poured down his throat, only some of the remedies so far suggested on here. Of course an impressionable youngster reading this forum might form the view that such penalties are acceptable to some.....
I proposed that he be executed in the electric chair.
A penalty that is acceptable, where I live.
IMHO people who commit such crimes are never going to "learn" any better.
No doubt he already knew better...that what he was doing was wrong.
These people have a sickness they cannot control or overcome.
Teach him all you want. Let him go and I am sure he'll do the same again.
Red Herring
07-08-09, 07:02 AM
I
No doubt he already knew better...that what he was doing was wrong.
These people have a sickness they cannot control or overcome.
Actually we don't know he knew better, in fact during most of this thread we have assumed he isn't "normal". There are plenty of people who are mentally ill and a danger to society if released. Are you proposing we round them all up and have one large fry up? I think there has already been mention of how successful (not) your electric chair is at reducing crime and protecting society so that's nothing to boast about.
Stewart.C
07-08-09, 07:14 AM
Hope the girl will be ok.
i have two daughters & if that were one of mine id have cut his nuts off there & then.
Alpinestarhero
07-08-09, 07:40 AM
At 17 I was quite well aware that rape was not the done thing old chap. This is the work of someone who's monstrously sick in the head, it's not like possession of 2g of weed or setting off fireworks after bedtime! There is a quite important difference between a childish misjudgement and a barbaric act like this.
"Us"? Practically everyone I've ever met would not disagree with me too much if it was suggested that nonces were doused in petrol and set afire. You think he needs an ASBO or what?
+1
Like chris here, I worked out right from wrong with regards to these sorts of things long before I was 17. The suspect is clearly not right in the head, to be able to think this was an acceptable act. Indeed, I assume he may have understood it was a bit wrong, since he led the girl to a quiet, secluded place.
BernardBikerchick
07-08-09, 07:47 AM
This happened yesterday evening not far from my house.
http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/news/blackburndarwenhyndburnribble/4529335.VIDEO__Girl__nine___violently_sexually_ass aulted__in_Great_Harwood/
I have a little girl who is seven years old and goes to the same school as this little girl
This just brings home how unsafe the country that we live in has become!!!
My thoughts are with the little girl and her family
only one word for this and it begins with C !!!!!!:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
BanannaMan
08-08-09, 02:45 AM
Actually we don't know he knew better, in fact during most of this thread we have assumed he isn't "normal".
:-({|=
Oh please......:rolleyes:
That's hardly even a credible argument.
Sure he knew better.
Oh, I suppose there is some chance he was raised locked up in a basement for his whole life before escaping that day, Or perhaps has a IQ of -3.....but i doubt it.
If he's been living in todays world, then yes we do know, he knew better.
There are plenty of people who are mentally ill and a danger to society if released. Are you proposing we round them all up and have one large fry up?
If they are guilty of what this lad's supposedly done....
YES!!!
I think there has already been mention of how successful (not) your electric chair is at reducing crime and protecting society so that's nothing to boast about.
:smt017
Funny....I never mentioned it reducing crime.
Rather what someone who did this deserves.
You know...in fact.....I've never heard anyone other some un-informed politician ever say anything about it being a crime deterent. Maybe that sounds better to the foriegn press and the fellow politicians in Europe and such.
Here, it's looked on more as fitting punishment.
But (as bad as I hate too to be) perfectly honest..... most are put to death by lethal injection as of late.
And that would be far, far too easy a way out for someone who's committed this crime.
I'd rather see him rot in jail.
Give him the chair......If nothing else it's great personal satisfaction for victims family. ;)
Nicky S
08-08-09, 08:43 AM
thats grim
im surprised the guy didnt get his head kicked in by them two workers
I didnt read the article but I can imagine what it said. This seems to happen more and more these days or at least it is spoken about more. I think some of the problem is that kids are not allowed freedom these days, they therefore have no street sense. If he is found guilty put him in a room with kids family and let them decide his fate
Red Herring
08-08-09, 09:31 AM
I suspect that the majority of persons of this thread proposing some fairly barbaric retribution against those found guilty of such crimes are themselves fairly normal people and of sound mind. To them the commission of such a crime against such a young child would require such an evil state of mind that they assume that those that do commit such act are that evil, and therefore they believe the response justified.
The reality is that the majority of persons convicted of such crimes are not of sound mind, they have distorted values and beliefs, and although they knew what they were doing was wrong they did not appreciate the scale of their wrongdoing. In their own mind they justify their actions. These people have no place in society and we should do everything we can to protect ourselves from them, but I'm not about to sink to their level and start dishing out inhumane punishments just because in my own mind I can justify it. If you want to get really deep we could go into how they get like that but i suspect that is not what is driving this thread, instead I'm getting the distinct drift that's it's a desire to unite against a common hatred. Good luck to you, I'll bow out now, but before i go just remember that it's at a time when the emotions are highest that we make the most mistakes. How do we know that the 17 year old caught by the two men wasn't just walking through, how do we know the girl was actually telling the truth? Rape is one of the most horrific crimes committed by man, but it is also the one where it is most often not what it initially seems.
Why would anyone leave their 9 year old daughter unattended at a park in the evening. I wouldnt even leave a child alone in the daytime.
Samurai Penguin
08-08-09, 10:46 AM
“The mob is man voluntarily descending to the nature of the beast. Its fit hour of activity is night. Its actions are insane like its whole constitution. It persecutes a principle; it would whip a right; it would tar and feather justice, by inflicting fire and outrage upon the houses and persons of those who have these. It resembles the prank of boys, who run with fire-engines to put out the ruddy aurora streaming to the stars. (http://thinkexist.com/quotation/the_mob_is_man_voluntarily_descending_to_the/325178.html)”http://thinkexist.com/i/sq/as4.gif Ralph Waldo Emerson (http://thinkexist.com/quotes/ralph_waldo_emerson/)
Red Herring
08-08-09, 10:50 AM
There are places in the UK i wouldn't leave any female alone, but lets not get into that. I don't think it has quite yet got to the stage where we need to keep our kids locked up at an age when they should be out there learning what the world is all about, and nine is all about learning independence. I'd like to think that when my daughter was nine she would have know better than to go anywhere with a stranger but now that she has made it to 16 it's the ones she knows I worry about....
This just brings home how unsafe the country that we live in has become!!!
Eh? An isolated incident surely.
yorkie_chris
08-08-09, 02:27 PM
I'm not about to sink to their level and start dishing out inhumane punishments just because in my own mind I can justify it.
How do we know that the 17 year old caught by the two men wasn't just walking through, how do we know the girl was actually telling the truth? Rape is one of the most horrific crimes committed by man, but it is also the one where it is most often not what it initially seems.
A single shot to the back of the head seems pretty humane to me. It is fitting for a rabid dog, the danger of which seems to be equal to that of somebody who would commit such a crime.
As for him being guilty, well I did say similar in my first post in this thread.
But, not what it seems? If guilty, he would either be a rapist, or a nonce. Both as bad.
Red Herring
08-08-09, 02:35 PM
But, not what it seems? If guilty, he would either be a rapist, or a nonce. Both as bad.
OK, I concede I perhaps didn't word that very well. Rape will always be rape, but how many initial allegations of rape actually turn out to be rape in the end.
This perhaps isn't the best thread to discuss this on, given the age of the girl involved this isn't your average allegation.
newts924
08-08-09, 03:24 PM
A quick update on what is happening.
The boy they arrested has been charged with GBH and serious sexual assault. In the newspaper it Say's he was on bail for the same thing which he committed in St Helens. As a rehab attempt they moved him out of that area and he came over to our area.
HE THEN DOES THE SAME CRIME !!!!!!! :smt072
So all you people saying he does not know right from wrong, get a life, he is a sick bast##d who needs shooting.
If he did this to any of your family would you take the same approach and view to the situation, and say "well it's OK as he may not know right from wrong and he may have mental problems, we should that pity on him and show him how to behave in society" I VERY MUCH DOUBT IT.
I have also heard that they are charging one the lads who caught him as he broke the lads jaw when they made the arrest :mrgreen:.
That is all
Red Herring
08-08-09, 03:50 PM
A quick update on what is happening.
The boy they arrested has been charged with GBH and serious sexual assault. In the newspaper it Say's he was on bail for the same thing which he committed in St Helens. As a rehab attempt they moved him out of that area and he came over to our area.
HE THEN DOES THE SAME CRIME !!!!!!! :smt072
So all you people saying he does not know right from wrong, get a life, he is a sick bast##d who needs shooting.
If he did this to any of your family would you take the same approach and view to the situation, and say "well it's OK as he may not know right from wrong and he may have mental problems, we should that pity on him and show him how to behave in society" I VERY MUCH DOUBT IT.
I have also heard that they are charging one the lads who caught him as he broke the lads jaw when they made the arrest :mrgreen:.
That is all
OK, thanks for the update, at least we know they caught the right bloke.
Firstly I don't think anybody has said he might not know right from wrong. All that has been argued is that persons who do such things have a different thought process to the likes of you and me.
Secondly he doesn't need shooting, that's not what civilized societies do. He needs removing from society so they are protected from him. That is what the system should do, and on this occasion seems to have rather spectacularly failed to do. That is where some of the questions should now be directed, and you'll get loads of support from just about anybody I can think of when it comes to bolstering our justice system.
Thirdly, I think even I said that if someone did anything like that to any of my family I'd definitely want to shoot them, that's why emotion and justice have to be kept separate.
Finally re the last paragraph, that's a shame. Hopefully he'll go not guilty and end up in front a jury. Would you convict him?
Wow a lot of stone throwing going on here.
No one will dispute this is a horrendous crime. No one will dispute that the perpetrator must be accountable for his actions.
I don’t feel that anyone here however is in possession of the full facts. As such I don’t feel that you are able to comment on how this young man should punished. That is what courts are for.
Samurai Penguin
08-08-09, 05:17 PM
So all you people saying he does not know right from wrong, get a life, he is a sick bast##d who needs shooting.
I think it is traditional to assume that he is innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt.
This country may have slid some way down the path of fascism/totalitarianism but we do, thankfully, still have due legal process.
Red Herring
08-08-09, 05:28 PM
In the newspaper it Say's he was on bail for the same thing which he committed in St Helens. As a rehab attempt they moved him out of that area and he came over to our area.
Which papers that in please, I can't find it.
Shooting is too quick.
Take something from Thailland, they have a drowning pool for people like this.
This crime is not excusable, moraly extremely wrong and deserves severe punishment, which our legal process cannot issue.
Spiderman
08-08-09, 05:48 PM
I think it is traditional to assume that he is innocent until proven guilty beyond all reasonable doubt.
This country may have slid some way down the path of fascism/totalitarianism but we do, thankfully, still have due legal process.
Sadly only when it suits the powers that be at times tho. Lets not bring up poor Jean Charles De Menezes again and how he was ececuted without trail, let along due procees or even fair warning. And all the purpetrators fo that killing, from the Govt offivcials who santioned it right down to the guyys who lied under oat about how they killed him, got away with it scott free.
Who is it that is avenged by these types of justice? The victim, or the mobs sense of outrage?
Milky Bar Kid
08-08-09, 05:56 PM
Who is it that is avenged by these types of justice? The victim, or the mobs sense of outrage?
My thoughts exactly.
Folks, I'm afraid that unless any of us has been in the position of the victim, or the victims family, then we cannot actually say how we would react.
This incident is terrible. It is terrible, horrific, painful and horrible but we cannot start demanding that "if it was your family you would want him dead" and therefore insist he should be killed.
I have my own personal views on this and what I believe the punishment should be, views which I do not wish to go into but can we please stop assuming we all, as uninformed (for want of a better phrase) "rubber-neckers" who do not know the family, can possibly understand what they are going through or what they want as justice?
My thoughts exactly.
Folks, I'm afraid that unless any of us has been in the position of the victim, or the victims family, then we cannot actually say how we would react.
This incident is terrible. It is terrible, horrific, painful and horrible but we cannot start demanding that "if it was your family you would want him dead" and therefore insist he should be killed.
I have my own personal views on this and what I believe the punishment should be, views which I do not wish to go into but can we please stop assuming we all, as uninformed (for want of a better phrase) "rubber-neckers" who do not know the family, can possibly understand what they are going through or what they want as justice?
Along with Anna and RedHerring, voices of reason and intelligence. A terrible action carried out to be sure but there are always many angles and perspectives to consider in a civilised and advanced society
yorkie_chris
09-08-09, 10:30 AM
I have also heard that they are charging one the lads who caught him as he broke the lads jaw when they made the arrest :mrgreen:.
Hopefully he'll go not guilty and end up in front a jury. Would you convict him?
He must have said the wrong thing. Surely "defending yourself" against a violent psychopath with reasonable force is an absolute piece of p*** to make a case for. Given what he'd done previously you could probably get away with giving him a proper kicking.
This is just as annoying though and doesn't send out a decent message to decent people at all, it just gives more credit to the idea that the police are not on the side of decency. The media will no doubt go mental that a hero catching a dangerous rapist would be tried for it! Do the boys in blue have a target to annoy the general populace?
If someone tried to mug me, I'd be far more likely to batter them (with reasonable force, your honor) and leave, than wait for the police. Because it would be me who caught the crap rather than the scroat!
"Do unto others, before they do unto you, then p*** off before the police arrive"
This is just as annoying though and doesn't send out a decent message to decent people at all, it just gives more credit to the idea that the police are not on the side of decency.
"Decent" people don't go around breaking strangers' jaws! Thugs do that.
How did they know that the person *was* the person that is alleged to have done these despicible acts? It was a wooded area - it could have been other people inthe vicinity - someone out walking their dog or fell walking etc. So they could have stopped the wrong person.
yorkie_chris
09-08-09, 04:08 PM
Man stops rapist, in the struggle his jaw gets broken. Guy doing his civic duty gets charged for it.
Nice one that.
Man stops rapist, in the struggle his jaw gets broken. Guy doing his civic duty gets charged for it.
Nice one that.
We don't know the specifics of the case so we don't know what the alleged child abuser actually did. That's for the police/courts.
Breaking someone's jaw is not "civic duty", and just say that they'd got the wrong man - i.e. someone walking their dog. That dog walker would want charges brought against the "civic duty" thugs.
yorkie_chris
09-08-09, 04:19 PM
We don't know the specifics of the case so we don't know what the alleged child abuser actually did. That's for the police/courts.
Breaking someone's jaw is not "civic duty", and just say that they'd got the wrong man - i.e. someone walking their dog. That dog walker would want charges brought against the "civic duty" thugs.
But in this case everything seen so far points to the guy being guilty.
But in this case everything seen so far points to the guy being guilty.
I don't think anyone's crime deserves getting a kicking from vigilantee (sic?) justice.
And it is possible that they could've got the wrong man when dispensing their "justice". A bit like that couple that had their house burned down by a mob because the mob heard that they were paediatricians!!!
yorkie_chris
09-08-09, 04:26 PM
We are never going to agree here.
My point is I have seen the police on occasion charge people with legitimately defending themselves. Hence my complete lack of trust in the system.
Lack of trust in a system is one thing.
Supporting vigilantes is something else entirely.
Yuk, as a father and grandfather I cannot understand why anyone would want to attack children in this way. Childhood innocence is wonderful. To see children play blissfully unaware of the evil that exists in society is heart warming. And then some scumbag then has to bring their evil world into theirs.
very true, people like this make me physically sick, there is no punishment on this earth that can bring justice to that little girl.
Wow! Some heavy, revengeful, stuff being suggested. For those who suggest something barbaric, could you carry out the punishment?
Yes, without batting an eyelid or feeling any kind of remorse or sympathy for the one receiving the punishment.
Who is it that is avenged by these types of justice? The victim, or the mobs sense of outrage?
Regardless of a so called "punishment" being handed out by the court or a punishment at the hands of a vigilante group, neither the young girl or her family will be avenged & it can now never be removed from their minds, however if he is proven guilty i say remove him from the human race & do not give him a chance to repeat such a horrendous crime or to dilute the gene pool any further by maybe having children of his own who there is a strong chance he may then also abuse.
northwind
12-09-09, 02:07 PM
Age is no excuse... But lets wait til we know he actually did it before we shoot him eh?
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