An interesting moment with xXBADGERXx

[xXBADGERXx]

Some of you may know that I fumbled my Speedo Rotor the other weekend . The story is that I took my wheels to a tyre place to get new rubber fitted to loose wheels , came home and de-gunked the wheels with paraffin whilst wearing latex Gloves , decided to clean the rotor for the speedo sensor as that was gunky and the little bugger popped out of my wet , paraffin gloved hand ,li ke soap in a bath , and hit the deck .... whereupon it did it`s best impression of the falling chandalier from "Only Fools and Horses" and shattered into 5 pieces ................ Bugger .

So I order a new one and pick it up yesterday and decide to fit it today . Tools at the ready and the bike is up on a front paddock stand . Now this is where things get a bit iffy . The left hand fork leg (as you look at the bike from the front) sits in the paddock stand nicely due to the Pinch Bolt for the front Spindle , the right hand one sinks into the Two prongs of the paddock stand but rests there quite happily , or has done when I have had the Abba stand on the back ........ anyhooooo . I get busy with undoing all bolts and whip the calipers off as well ........ up on the stand and unwind and pull the spindle out to drop the front wheel and to my HORROR ..... the bike lists to the right as the fork Stanchion starts to slide up the fork leg . I jumped up and grabbed it by the mirrors and look around the street in panic , not one person to be seen , damnit . I am standing here with a wibbly bike on the bare minimum of support and thinking "It`s gonna drop and It is all my own fault for forgetting to bother putting the Abba stand on as well" .............. I KNEW I should have done it but was so obsessed with getting some work done on the bike that I forgot about it .

Luckily I espied a plank in my front garden by the bin , I used this plank a few months ago to lock the rear wheel against the swingarm when I did a Sprocket/Chain change , I inch my way around the bike and grab the rack on the back and support it . I reach for the plank but it`s just too far , the Force doesn`t work either and the plank will simply not jump into my hand .... Bloody well works for Darth Vader .. tut . I reach out with my leg and just manage to hook it and flip it towards myself . Once grabbed , I scuttle around the left side of the bike and wedge it under a crash bung and support the bike . Phhhh-eeeee-eeee-eeeeewww!!!!!!! . Rotor is put back in front wheel and everything is clamped up nicely and I check everything to make sure I torqued it all up . Ignition on , spin front wheel and get 9 mph indicated , sweet . Now for the front brakes .

Why oh why do I expect anything short of corroded tight when it comes to SV brakes and servicing ? I am armed with Plusgas and I flick the pad pin R clip out and Plusgas the pin and do the same the other side . I even shock the pin with a plastic ended mallet and squirt it again and leave it for 10 minutes . I slurp a brew , play with the mutt in the back garden for a bit and then come back to the bike . The pad pins will not budge and rounded the hex off at the tiniest amount of pressure , these are in tight and Bo11oxed , Sooooooo , what do we do people , cut them with and angle grinder and try to wind them out with a Stilson ? or is there an easier way ?

[xXBADGERXx]

And before Wolf posts something stupid , good common sense replies please ...... I can see you lurking Wolfie and heading for some sort of iffy picture related pee-take ;)

[Dave20046]

Sorry no advice but feel you pain on the supporting a bike on your own with no one in sight thing. Had a very interesting 5 minutes (felt like an hour) with curvy, no wheels, perched ontop of a trolley jack.

[Spikenipple]

Completely drown the pins in plusgas and leave it for a few hours, spray some more on them then leave it til the next day and try again. You could also try tightening the pins up a touch before trying to undo them, this can help break the corrosion, as can tapping the end of the pin with a mallet (which you've tried).

[DarrenSV650S]

DarrenSV650S thinks that you could try cutting a gloove in them, then unscrewing them.

[Dave20046]

DarrenSV650S thinks that you could try cutting a gloove in them, then unscrewing them.
dremmel is your friend for this method :smt111

[xXBADGERXx]

Completely drown the pins in plusgas and leave it for a few hours, spray some more on them then leave it til the next day and try again. You could also try tightening the pins up a touch before trying to undo them, this can help break the corrosion, as can tapping the end of the pin with a mallet (which you've tried).

Will probably have to do this next weekend then , might be best to take the calipers off completely and take them into my workshop and clamp them in the vice betwixt some wood . I`ll order new pins and Brake pads anyway , as I can see these K3 ones getting a beasting to get them out even after a good relaxing bath in Plusgas . I have never had to maintain them before , everything I have gotten to has been replaced on the brakes with new parts that have been suitably treated with the correct grease .

[Owenski]

mine were rounded off and I thought we'll if they are dead already not harm in trying some mulgrips. Get those on the job the teeth shoull grip better.

[xXBADGERXx]

DarrenSV650S thinks that you could try cutting a gloove in them, then unscrewing them.

Mate , no amount of screwdriver action is gonna budge these

[Baph]

Failing all of that, the YC fix: Drill the beggars out.

Worked on my rear caliper. :)

(Took long enough to drill through 'em though)

[husky03]

the pins are done so i'd get the calipers off and use a vice to hold the remainder of the pins and twist them out-done this a few times, then on the rebuild use plenty of copper grease

[xXBADGERXx]

mine were rounded off and I thought we'll if they are dead already not harm in trying some mulgrips. Get those on the job the teeth shoull grip better.

Yeah I can actually get one of the pads forward enough to get it off the stationary pin and flip it out of the way , giving me enough room to get Moles onto the pad pin for a "Wind-out" , that with plenty of Plusgas and Thread shocking should be enough to get these pins out without killing my Calipers .

[xXBADGERXx]

the pins are done so i'd get the calipers off and use a vice to hold the remainder of the pins and twist them out-done this a few times, then on the rebuild use plenty of copper grease

yeah , I don`t put stuff like that back in the bike , goes in the bin and gets replaced with a new one , got a Titanium pad pin for my rear caliper as it doesn`t corrode and used Copper Grease on the threads on that . The rear one just serves a purpose of holding the pads in place , not sure If I would buy Stainless/Titanium ones for the front but might swing the extra cost for them as I like corrosion free SV bling ;)

[xXBADGERXx]

Decided that nobody can see the front ones anyway and ordered a pair of Pins from Wemoto in bog standard steel , hopefully they`ll get here before the next weekend with postal strikes and whatnot . £10 all in including postage .

[yorkie_chris]

Drill the little nipple off the end of the caliper casting so you can knock the pin out. 3 minute job.

[xXBADGERXx]

The bit on the back of the caliper you mean , opposite end of the hex part ?

[yorkie_chris]

Yes, like a little bump stuck out. Drill down it 3mm or whatever fine parralel punch you have then you can knock retaining pin out easy.

When you put together just leave hole full of grease and it will be easy next time. If you are tart you can put a blob of black silicon in there (or bit of black moly grease) so you can't see hole.

[xXBADGERXx]

I do have quite a fine punch that would pop in a drilled hole , I can now see what Baph was on about before , you just clarified it a bit more . If I go oversize by accident though I will have ballsed the caliper up ..... then again I could put a partially threaded hole in there and fit a grub screw if that does happen . I think I shall have to go and get some copper washers for my banjo`s and spend an hour or so servicing these calipers of mine this weekend .

[yorkie_chris]

No you won't. You can even drill out to full 6mm or whatever pin is with no issue. Pin cannot go anywhere because it has lip around the outside on the other end.

[xXBADGERXx]

No you won't. You can even drill out to full 6mm or whatever pin is with no issue. Pin cannot go anywhere because it has lip around the outside on the other end.

Aaah yeah , gotcha , the R clip stops it coming out and the lip will stop it dropping through . Wasn`t sure if it was lipped or not as I have never taken a set out before , well , as far as I am concerned that has answered it all with the combined might of the Org . Now all I have to do is wait for the parts and go for it next weekend .

[xXBADGERXx]

Just about had my fill of this sodding caliper , I drilled the end out and have been going at it with a pin punch for sodding ages , have plus gassed it and tried shocking it etc etc , it is not even budging one Micron ................... this is the last Suzuki I ever own .

[Neeja]

Drill it out. Carefully. Worked for mine ;)

[xXBADGERXx]

I cut the pin in half and got the pads out , managed to pin punch the top part out after drilling the blind hole and I have now managed to abso-****ing-lutely bollox up the bottom half that has the R Clip hole in it by mangling it with the pin punch , Suzuki can kiss my chocolate Starfish after this . Gonna have a cuppa and fire up the drill , will centre pop it , centre drill it and open it out with progressively larger drills .

[xXBADGERXx]

Opened the Hex-head end out with a drill and then sawed the head off close to the body of the caliper and Plus gassed it . Managed to give it some movement and gassed it again and then popped that bugger out ........ one caliper down , what a faff :(

[xXBADGERXx]

Ok I `m taking piccies of the next one , this should prove to be the definitive way to remove absolutely seized-beyond-belief Calipers .

[xXBADGERXx]

Famous last words , the Hex head part literally fell out after I cut the pad pin to release the Pads , the bit that sits in the blind hole was a nightmare , in the end I got a Heat Gun on it , clamped it like nobodys business in the vice , then Plus Gassed it again . Came back after 10 minutes and heated it up til it smoked then got the Pin Punch out and gave it 2 great hoofs with my Copper Headed Mallet , that baby dropped out ..................... 7 hours this has taken to get 2 Pins out . I expected an hour tops .

[Neeja]

Bet I coulda got them out in under an hour. You should've seen my housemate's rear caliper. :pale:

[xXBADGERXx]

No offense Neeja , but I am an Engineer and have got Seized 500 ton presses apart in less time than this . All drilling has taken minutes , trying to hammer these pins out without destroying the calipers , distort them , oversize the holes etc has taken ages . I seriously doubt these Pins have been out since the bike was made , the right one didn`t even have an R Clip .

I have noticed the seals around the Pistons are turned out a bit as well , they are gonna need doing as well ............ pffffffff.

[Neeja]

I know you're an engineer, but you went down the route of trying to remove them. I just drilled them out carefully after trying for 40 minutes to get anything at all to move. Took about 5 minutes (and three broken drill bits) to get most of it out, and then carefully cleaned out the rest. Worked perfectly. If at first you don't succeed, find a bigger hammer. If you still don't succeed, just destroy whatever's being annoying :smt070

[xXBADGERXx]

I would have drilled them out if I couldn`t get them to budge , I will try all traditional routes first before resorting to actual machining methods , what I didn`t want to do was start down the path of removing metal and run the risk and knackering the original holes that that Pad Pins were in . I`m just stubborn at the end of the day and will keep on at something until I win :) . If I had a decent Pillar drill this job would be done and dusted but I used a normal domestic drill and erred on the side of caution .... got there in the end dude .

[Neeja]

I know...you approached the task as an engineer. I approached it as an impatient dude with power tools ;)

[xXBADGERXx]

All cleaned and re-assembled today but I am so *******ing aggravated with these brakes , no matter how I have tried I can`t get a good bit of power on the lever and have had such a ball-ache with it that this will be my last Suzuki .... gonna take it over to Genesismike`s so he can have a gander at it as well .

[kizza]

grinding would be my last.... very last resort.. id try soaking them over nite to try n break the corrosion off if not i usually get an old chissle ( i have a special one for ****ed bolts) and tap down into the bolt a few times to create a groove then try and tap them round. purely because you have less chance of damaging any other parts were as molegrips or angle grinder ur more likely to damage parts

[yorkie_chris]

The retaining pins aren't bolts :-)

[kizza]

ah ryt ok... in that case will a center punch and gud clout with a hammer not get them out?

[yorkie_chris]

You have to grind the caliper to get a center punch to them!

[xXBADGERXx]

ah ryt ok... in that case will a center punch and gud clout with a hammer not get them out?

I used a Pin Punch which was 1mm diameter smaller that the size of the Pad Pin , this gives a large area of impact and keeps it away from the sides and avoiding damage to the caliper , a Centre punch just deforms the centre where it is struck and concentrates the impact into the centre , it is needed around the edges to help break the hold that the corrosion had on them so that is why I opted for a Pin Punch .

I didn`t use a hammer as a normal one was not heavy enough , I ended up using a copper headed mallet which weighs a fair old bit and it still took ages to get the seized parts out , they came out eventually . In all honesty I would have been better off using a Fly-Press to have pushed these pins out , a good couple of wangs with one of those would have done the job .

[xXBADGERXx]

Right , finally back from Genesismike`s lovely garage , carpeted nonetheless , and my brakes are bled . Mike Tried all the things I had done and spent some very frowny moments looking at the bike . The upshot of it all is that Mike suggested removing the lever away from the bars and tipping it in case the master cylinder had trapped anything , we bled the brakes ........ slight improvement .

We then bled the brakes again by pulling the lever right back with it being off the bars and then stuck it back on the perch and tried it , better improvement but still not biting as hard as it could . Mike then suggested we bleed one more time , but release the lever very slowly and by jove , it worked . Hardly any air , if any , was expelled in the last few attempts so there is something very strange about the Master Cylinder on my SV that makes it a pig to bleed . So all I need now is for my pads to bed in and I`ll be a happy Badger .

[yorkie_chris]

Don't mean to insult you mate, and yes the calipers are a pain in the arris. But if you'd serviced them sooner it wouldn't have been half as bad.

[xXBADGERXx]

Well aware of that , it is one of those jobs I have never had to do before , the bike has never had the front pads changed as they were OEM pads that I removed . I did the back one over the Summer and that was not too bad and changed the pad pin for a Titanium one . This is one of those jobs that I never knew existed until I had to replace the front pads .

[yorkie_chris]

changed the pad pin for a Titanium one

Cool. You got some for front?

[xXBADGERXx]

Cool. You got some for front?

No , the rear one is on show but the front ones are well and truly hidden so new ones were actually a Kawasaki part . I put them in with Copper Grease smeared on them in a thin film and the parts that make contact with the caliper have been treated as well . I will be having a delve into the Calipers again over the Xmas period to sort the seals out and get the Pistons right out for a good thorough overhaul . I might treat the calipers with some anti-corrosion stuff in the bore where the Pad pins go .

On a side note , one of my R clips was missing out of the Pin , so I replaced it with a split pin for the time being , whilst I was grubbing about on the floor putting it all back together I actually found the R clip in the Grass next to my bike .......... what are the chances of that happening ? That lawn has swallowed more bounced nuts , bolts and washers than I care to remember over the years .

[yorkie_chris]

Just copper slip is fine if you do it at reasonable intervals :-)

What anti corrosion stuff do you have?

[xXBADGERXx]

Just copper slip is fine if you do it at reasonable intervals :-)

What anti corrosion stuff do you have?

Yeah , I will be checking on a Quarterly basis at least . Don`t have anything yet but I am sure there is something on the market that will do the job .

[genesismike]

Yeah , I will be checking on a Quarterly basis at least . Don`t have anything yet but I am sure there is something on the market that will do the job .
stop by my bench sometime tomorrow, got something you may be interested in regarding this, cant remember the name at the mo but dont think its commercially available:smt023
ps. glad the brakes feel better,

[xXBADGERXx]

Well I didn`t wanna say mate ;)

[Dave20046]

Who wants to come do mine?

[xXBADGERXx]

Get yer a$$ down here and I will help you , other than that you can Foxtrot Oscar ;)

[Dave20046]

Get yer a$$ down here and I will help you , other than that you can Foxtrot Oscar ;)
lol, I should be aight (fingers crossed) they were serviced like 2 months ago with plenty of copper slip yet the flathead pin cap's still managed to seize.

[xXBADGERXx]

Pin Cap , rear brake I gather then ?

[Dave20046]

Pin Cap , rear brake I gather then ?
Aye, sorry - rear
PITA

[xXBADGERXx]

I also got a Titanium Screw to go in that , Pro-Bolt conveniantly forgot to send it to me until I called them up and reminded them gently ............... . Loads of copper grease in the threads of those for deffo

[Dave20046]

I also got a Titanium Screw to go in that , Pro-Bolt conveniantly forgot to send it to me until I called them up and reminded them gently ............... . Loads of copper grease in the threads of those for deffo
Titanium screw's probably a good idea, grr I don't see how it's managed to seize in just 2 months, I'm sure I coated it in acf50 then layered it with copperslip , grrr

[beabert]

Blimey same as me last week, i completely wrecked my caliper in the end lol.

[xXBADGERXx]

That is what I was trying to avoid doing , lesson learned here people , get those pins whipped out and greased for the Winter .