car problem - oil

[Dave20046]

No one could give me a bit of advice about me cage (2002 golf -petrol) could they? Potentially about to get stranded miles from home.

On my drive to work this morning the oil light came on and started flashing, stopped and checked the oil (I'd topped it up about a week ago) and found the dip stick caked in thick white mush. I'm assuming this means moisture in the oil?
However the fact it prompted the oil light to come on worries me and the fact it was literally caked the full length of the dip stick, and everytime I wiped it and re dipped it did the same so there must be a lot. I put in a fair bit of oil just to try and help the oil to gunge ratio, but a bit worried my oil is mostly water and I'm going to seize the bugger. Any helps?
Is there any quick fix or am I going to have to drop the oil and refill asap?

Cheers in advance for any help.

[speedplay]

sounds like it could be the cylinder head on the way out :(

Although, when I have had one go, the water ends up in with the oil.

Whats the water like in your car?

[orose]

I'd suspect more than just moisture if the light came on - check your manual to make sure it isn't warning you about a pressure problem and the white goo is your coolant mixing with the oil. I'd have a think about walking home too tonight ;)

[Dave20046]

feck

I'll check the coolant level before I set off and see how far I get, no car no work :(
See what the manual says about 'flashing oil lamp...light'

cheers guys

[plowsie]

Moisture in the oil is not uncommon in this weather, but the oil light coming on is worrying.

[the_lone_wolf]

Has the oil level risen?

[fizzwheel]

Smell the coolant as well, check for fuel / oil in the coolant bottle. Check for mayonaise or gunk on the coolant bottle cap and also check for similar on the oil filler cap as well.

Might just be as simple as head gasket on it way out or gone. But if your dipstick has thick white mush on it it sounds a little more serious than that.

If your going to drive it keep an eye on the engine temperature as well as checking the oil light doesnt come on again.

Personally I'd not drive it very far if at all...

[Alpinestarhero]

Sounds like you have a big problem, maybe a head gasket faliure or soemthing. If the oil light is coming on, then that would indicate low pressure or something? Drain the oil and see how much comes out; i think the sump capacity is 4 litres, so assuming you dont loose any oil, you shouldnt have more than 4 litres.

How long had the engine been running before the light came on and you checking the oil? I dont think you should be using the car, you could be risking extensive damage to the engine.

[Richie]

Whats the SG reading of the Coolant...?
I know it not oil retaliated but if your engine has frozen you might have pushed out a core plug.

when the engine is cool, take off the coolant header cap, start the engine, If the Coolant pulsates noticeably then your head gasket / cylinder lining has gone.

[Dave20046]

cheers for your help guys
Light came on after 15 minutes it was the low oil pressure light. I stopped and topped up oil and it's not reappeared (done 3 miles). coolant's fine, not gone down, no pulsing no discolouration. Drives fine. Just gunky dipstick

[yorkie_chris]

How long has oil been in there? If there is no noticeable problem with coolant then it could just be gunky. could also be mayo collecting on dipstick tube because that part is cold.

Is there lots of mayo under oil filler cap?

[TazDaz]

Sounds like head gasket to me, but as you've said the coolant appears normal, I'd be tempted to drive it and monitor the coolant level, underside of filler cap etc.

Oddly enough, I've had the head gasket go twice on my car, once resulting in the complete engine failure - yet both times the oil warning light never indicated a problem...

[speedplay]

Oddly enough, I've had the head gasket go twice on my car, once resulting in the complete engine failure - yet both times the oil warning light never indicated a problem...

It went twice on the freelander and never showed any oil warnings either.
The dead give away was high water usage and the mayo in the oil.

[Dave20046]

How long has oil been in there? If there is no noticeable problem with coolant then it could just be gunky. could also be mayo collecting on dipstick tube because that part is cold.

Is there lots of mayo under oil filler cap?
Car was serviced about 6 weeks to - 2months ago by someone I trust, and I'd topped the oil up around christmas eve and there was definitely no engine jizz then. (the car does leak oil, drive's full of drips however in 14 months I've had it it's only required topping up maybe twice ... had two services though). Since christmas eve I had only done a couple of small journeys.

A few specs of white in the filler cap but not much more, not a mass of pressure when running the engine with the filler cap off either. Although the flashing light I actually got does mean 'low oil pressure'.

After a 7 mile trip home the white seems to have cleared slightly and the light didn't reappear. Also no change in the coolant level.

Rang 4 or more garages, they either won't touch it or can't start on it until after the weekend. The main stealer don't have courtesy cars (only reason to go to them) till the 13th and they quoted me, if it was the head gasket... £1300 after a bit of swearing from me she decided she had added it up wrong and it was actually £800, '£200 parts, 6 hours labour' now there's a slim chance I could wing a 50% discount on labour in which case it might might just be worth it but I still don't like the sound of that.

Spoke to a wrench that does a bit of work for my usual garage and to do it from his house he wants 2 days and £200-£250 maybe an additional £80 if there's any damage to ...something he mentioned which I forget (possibly a reskim).

[Dave20046]

Oh and the car got up to temperature at a good speed (probably better than ever) and stayed at a constant 90 all the way home.
It did the same this morning which I was shocked about as it's recently(ish) not being hitting ninety and I'd been worried it wasn't getting up to temperature right, also had the engine management light popping up over the last few months but not seen that for a fair few weeks. Mechanic told me at last service that he'd diagged the eng. man. light as temperature related.

[plowsie]

Kayla's engine management light came on the other week, she was worried but didn't know what to do so she drove it as normal. Last week on way to work, her car was seriously overheating and would only do 40mph. Took the dipstick out no gunk, water bottle had some gunk but not a lot. Took filler cap off, loads of gunk, Anorak standing next to me said 'yeah defo Head Gasket, I know someone who can get that done for about £400 as he's done one for me before, he works from home, i'll call him now'.

Her Dad and I were scratching our heads as we thought, yeah it may affect performance but not this severely, by Christmas Eve, the car would only do 20mph on its way to a garage of mine and his choice, blokey put it on the diagnostics. Rung her up, its the Catalytic Converter, few Lambda sensors have gone funny also. Still a wadge of cash to fix it, but, she'dve spent £400 on something completely wrong.

[Dave20046]

Kayla's engine management light came on the other week, she was worried but didn't know what to do so she drove it as normal. Last week on way to work, her car was seriously overheating and would only do 40mph. Took the dipstick out no gunk, water bottle had some gunk but not a lot. Took filler cap off, loads of gunk, Anorak standing next to me said 'yeah defo Head Gasket, I know someone who can get that done for about £400 as he's done one for me before, he works from home, i'll call him now'.

Her Dad and I were scratching our heads as we thought, yeah it may affect performance but not this severely, by Christmas Eve, the car would only do 20mph on its way to a garage of mine and his choice, blokey put it on the diagnostics. Rung her up, its the Catalytic Converter, few Lambda sensors have gone funny also. Still a wadge of cash to fix it, but, she'dve spent £400 on something completely wrong.
Cheers for that plowsie, my current options are - recommended small independant garage some time after the weekend, the usual garage's occasional cash in hander who was described to me by a mate who's cambelt he'd fitted as 'bit insane but did the job' or the main dealer...

I'm knackered because I can't hire a car as I ain't 21, main dealer has no courtesy cars, the SV is being a typical SV - plus if I could get it to behave for a day or two we have serious snow and ice this neck of the woods and my boss'll go mad if he finds out my cars out of order...happy new year.

[Dave20046]

I ****ing hate this country

Can't hire cars cause your not 21, can't have two policies on a car so can't borrow one.
I'll take a rollocking/career change then :rolleyes:

[cymroboi]

hey dave i run a 2002 golf my self !!!

what colour oil light yellow or red (yellow is level and red is warrning )you said that the car got serviced last few weeks was the correct oil put back in the engine,as wv/audi/seat and sckoda dosent like the incorrect oil in the engine ,it will use it like you would drink a pint of beer m8 and with the eng man light ,its a common fault on the vw the temp sensor ,with this it will make starting terible some times and no problem other times my temp was ok all the time on the dash, what hapens is it gets over fueld and floods,as for the slush ive had a bit on the oil cap but thats due to moisture in the engine because the wife only dose short 20 mile round trip every other day ,but also check your coolant bottle for sludge and coolant level .

[Dave20046]

hey dave i run a 2002 golf my self !!!

what colour oil light yellow or red (yellow is level and red is warrning )you said that the car got serviced last few weeks was the correct oil put back in the engine,as wv/audi/seat and sckoda dosent like the incorrect oil in the engine ,it will use it like you would drink a pint of beer m8 and with the eng man light ,its a common fault on the vw the temp sensor ,with this it will make starting terible some times and no problem other times my temp was ok all the time on the dash, what hapens is it gets over fueld and floods,as for the slush ive had a bit on the oil cap but thats due to moisture in the engine because the wife only dose short 20 mile round trip every other day ,but also check your coolant bottle for sludge and coolant level .
Thankyou very much for that mate, explains the temp sensor/illusive engine management light and odd troubles starting. Do you know of a fix? Can't say I know what oil it was unfortunately, I'll ask the bloke that serviced it.

The light that was flashing was the red oil lamp, 'low oil pressure'.

[cymroboi]

get a temp sensor from vw if i remember m8 i paid about £40 2 min job only a plastic C clip holding it in make sure you change it when the engine is cold no need to drain the water just leave the filler cap on and make sure when you remove the old sensor make sure the o ring comes out with it and use some sillicone lube on the seal to re place it ,you wont loose no water nearly so no need to bleed the coolant system after .what engine do you have ??
my m8 had a similar problem a couple of weeks after a service on his audi s3 the idiot bloke who serviced the car tried a quick one and filled it up with the wrong grade oil i think he put 15/40 semi instead of 5/30 fully which after a few weeks threw the oil light on but he got the car recoverd back to the garage and the fitter said he must of put the wrong oil in buy mistake !!!ye ye ye ,a quick way of making a few quid on oil as the 5/30 is expensive compared to the 15/40

[cymroboi]

this is what your looking for but id go for a vw temp switch because we dont get nothing but trouble when you buy cheap parts for our vehicles in work !!!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-DUEL-TEMP-TEMPERATURE-SENSOR-GREEN-4-PIN-GOLF-etc_W0QQitemZ170421274649QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Car sParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item27ade64819

[Dave20046]

this is what your looking for but id go for a vw temp switch because we dont get nothing but trouble when you buy cheap parts for our vehicles in work !!!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-DUEL-TEMP-TEMPERATURE-SENSOR-GREEN-4-PIN-GOLF-etc_W0QQitemZ170421274649QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Car sParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item27ade64819
Thanks for your above posts, really useful.

I'm not sure cheaper oil would congeal into the mayonaise type stuff, anyone know?

[Well Oiled]

My younger son has a 1600cc petrol polo and as he's a complet mechanical numpty I check stuff on his car for him. Over the past two weeks the really cold weather has caused quite a bit of condensation and "mayo". I'll bet that's your issue too.

VWs are notorious for being oil-thirsty. My lad had the oil light come on and luckily stopped before he had a major problem. If you don't do it already I'd say check your oil level weekly.

HTH Cheers Keith

[Well Oiled]

Thanks for your above posts, really useful.

I'm not sure cheaper oil would congeal into the mayonaise type stuff, anyone know?

It's not congealing. It's an emulsion (i.e. a mix of water and oil) The oil that foams gets mixed with the condensation and emulsifies into the creamy sludge. Different oils behave differently, but it's not necessarily the worst oils that form the mayo. If it doesn't form an emulsion the water will still be there until it gets boiled off. In some cases this is more dangerous as it build up at the bottom of the sump (it's heavier than oil) and can potentially be sucked up through the oil pickup (there'd have to be a heck of a lot for this to happen, but it's not unknown).

BTW - do you do a lot of short distance driving? If so this will make it worse. If you give it a good blast the oil in the sump will be well over 100C. the water in the oil will boil off through the crankcase ventilation system, back into the intake and out through the exhaust (although the white sludge will be harder to get rid of). If your only doing the "granny cycle" of a couple of miles each day the oil won't get that hot and the water will build up.

[Dave20046]

It's not congealing. It's an emulsion (i.e. a mix of water and oil) The oil that foams gets mixed with the condensation and emulsifies into the creamy sludge. Different oils behave differently, but it's not necessarily the worst oils that form the mayo. If it doesn't form an emulsion the water will still be there until it gets boiled off. In some cases this is more dangerous as it build up at the bottom of the sump (it's heavier than oil) and can potentially be sucked up through the oil pickup (there'd have to be a heck of a lot for this to happen, but it's not unknown).

BTW - do you do a lot of short distance driving? If so this will make it worse. If you give it a good blast the oil in the sump will be well over 100C. the water in the oil will boil off through the crankcase ventilation system, back into the intake and out through the exhaust (although the white sludge will be harder to get rid of). If your only doing the "granny cycle" of a couple of miles each day the oil won't get that hot and the water will build up.
There seemed to be a lot of the crap, dipstick tube was pretty full. It depends what constitutes as short trips, I guess I do currently. Average shortist trip daily is 5 miles I cover a minimum of 12-15 miles a day. However over christmas break (2 weeks) it's done two maybe 3 very very short trips and just layed dorment.

I'm just kind of hoping it was just low on oil and the gunge was a weather induced red herring. But it shouldn't have been low on oil as it was topped up around christmas eve and it's probably covered 2 miles since.

Today after the light came on I stopped, took a risk and topped up some oil (couldn't see the dipstick reading for gunge). let the car stand, drove 10 miles home - no light, no grumbles from the car, got upto and held temperature well.

Pretty much got no choice but to use it tomorrow so I guess time will tell, can just keep a very close eye on it.

[fizzwheel]

Thats probably not long enough for the car to get up to normal temp, especially if its as cold where you are as it is here.

Personally I'd check your oil level tomorrow morning before you start the engine, will give you a better idea then of what the oil level is like.

I've heard similar about newer VW / Audi's using oil. We had a Passat as a pool car and that used to use oil quite heavily, but I think that had alot to do with it being a pool car...

My MKIII GTI never used a drop though...

[Dave20046]

Thats probably not long enough for the car to get up to normal temp, especially if its as cold where you are as it is here.

Personally I'd check your oil level tomorrow morning before you start the engine, will give you a better idea then of what the oil level is like.

I've heard similar about newer VW / Audi's using oil. We had a Passat as a pool car and that used to use oil quite heavily, but I think that had alot to do with it being a pool car...

My MKIII GTI never used a drop though...
Checking the oil is difficult because there's gungey 'mayo'everywhere everytime I dip. Both times I've driven it today it did get up to it's preferred temperature (90) this is where it's always happily sat summer or winter (granted takes a little while longer to get there in winter).

But yeah oil check and drive in the morning looks to be the only option :)

ta

[Dave20046]

Just to update, cars still surviving, turns out it was an intermittent(ish) oil leak that caused the light + moisture in the oil which was a bit of a red herring.

And just wanted to thank cymroboi (and everyone else for yer comments)as you were bang on with the temp gauge! Took it to my local garage man t'other day and suggested the temp sensor to him.... £30 quid later and I had a new temp sensor, and had had the oil leak fixed (breather pipes at the back of the engine packed solid with crap) much cheaper than a new head gasket! (dealer quoted me £1300 for that!)

[cymroboi]

Just to update, cars still surviving, turns out it was an intermittent(ish) oil leak that caused the light + moisture in the oil which was a bit of a red herring.

And just wanted to thank cymroboi (and everyone else for yer comments)as you were bang on with the temp gauge! Took it to my local garage man t'other day and suggested the temp sensor to him.... £30 quid later and I had a new temp sensor, and had had the oil leak fixed (breather pipes at the back of the engine packed solid with crap) much cheaper than a new head gasket! (dealer quoted me £1300 for that!)

:takeabow: glad to be of help m8 ......

bit cheaper than a head gasket job ....