View Full Version : New Track Bike
Just after a few opinions really and drawing on peoples past experiences.
Think i will keep the SV for the road as it's more than enough, but would like to get a decent track bike. Few questions...
- Would you be mad to go straight to an R1/GSXR1000 etc straight away.
- Have any of you made a jump from the SV onto a big supersports bike? How'd you get on?
- Would you be better off getting a CBR600/R6/675 for a year or two first?
- Any recomendations for particularly good track bikes, be it litre bikes or 600.
If you made the jump to a litre sports bike or just 600 on the road, i'd be interested too...
Hoping a good discussion kicks off here really. Let battle commence. :cool:
Owenski
04-01-10, 09:13 PM
Get another SV,
You know how to ride one,
You know the mechanics of one,
You know a good resourse for al your tuning quieres,
You know a good place to get some spares if needed
Plus it'l give you more of an idea what your road bike is capable of.
Get another SV,
You know how to ride one,
You know the mechanics of one,
You know a good resourse for al your tuning quieres,
You know a good place to get some spares if needed
Plus it'l give you more of an idea what your road bike is capable of.
But i'd want better performance, a bigger engine, better handling.
I've tracked my SV a few times already too...
speedplay
04-01-10, 09:17 PM
So will you be getting a road legal track bike or a van/car and trailer to go with it?
Ive seen you ride and think your the sort of person that could hop onto any bike and after a short while, get on well with it.
I know your a Knob*, but you can handle a bike no problems.
Do you feel that you really need to look at a litre bike?
I have a feeling that you could have as much fun on a 600 and still pull away from a lot of others on the track.
Get out and test ride as many bikes that spark your interest and get an idea of what they feel like to ride.
Then have a look for a dropped one or tracked one (as the chances are you wont be able to test them).
*Friendly dig from Elvis
Dave20046
04-01-10, 09:20 PM
But i'd want better performance, a bigger engine, better handling.
I've tracked my SV a few times already too...
smashed up ducati :)
Failing that personally I wouldn't be thinking of hopping straight up to a 1l il4 - but that's just me. Tortured myself with prospects of gsxr 6s and 750s though. I'd be looking for a good deal/suitability.
I think berlin mentioned his gsxr6 turned in similarly quick to the sv, which appealed to me.
Do you feel that you really need to look at a litre bike?
I have a feeling that you could have as much fun on a 600 and still pull away from a lot of others on the track.
Get out and test ride as many bikes that spark your interest and get an idea of what they feel like to ride.
Then have a look for a dropped one or tracked one (as the chances are you wont be able to test them).
Well, i'm not sure ATM. maybe a 750 could do, but hoping i could start to make a better decision after this thread.
I've test rode a CBR600 and a 675. Loved both TBH and will try and test a few more before too long.
Was also wondering what people do about buying track bikes as you can never really try one before hand. You could end up buying a dog of a machine or even a Daytona 600. =;
You will be able to pick up a very good 600 easy enough. That's the route I would go, more than enough and probably more fun. Easier to start racing on too if it came to that.
speedplay
04-01-10, 09:43 PM
You could end up buying a dog of a machine or even a Daytona 600. =;
Its hard to try a trackbike unless its been road registered (or still holds the v5,mot etc)
I know when I found my old dog, I spent ages looking for a smashed up, 2 tone, battered, old curvy but gave up looking as I think you got the last one:(:kiss:
the_lone_wolf
04-01-10, 09:49 PM
I'm biased but if I were looking for a track bike I'd be looking at a 675...
I know when I found my old dog, I spent ages looking for a smashed up, 2 tone, battered, old curvy but gave up looking as I think you got the last one:(:kiss:
http://doblespiral.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/touche3.jpg
personally i would stick to a 400 or a 600 but then again im as heavy as a flee and pretty much anything goes like stink.. I think you could have just as much, if not more fun on a 400 or 600 than on a 750/1000
punyXpress
04-01-10, 10:58 PM
Berlin was selling ( trying to ) his 750 about a month ago - it's got your name all over it, Binkmeister!
Red Herring
04-01-10, 11:54 PM
I've got an SV650 and a GSXR1000 and I jump between the two quite regularly on track days. On tracks like Lydden, Cadwell or even Brands Indy there's surprisingly little between them in terms of lap times. The big difference from a riders point of view is that the SV can be pushed really hard and provided it's set up well it's smooth, accurate and really neat, where the GSXR continually wants to wheelie, powerslide and throw you off. Both are great fun in their own way. The other thing to consider is running costs. The SV can make a set of tyres last several track days. The GSXR will do a set of slicks a day, and two rears if it's hot or at Lydden!
An IL4 like an SRAD 750 is almost the perfect compromise, and there are loads of interchangeable bits if you go for the GSXR range.
If you need the speed to get the high then go for it. Otherwise I'd get another SV like you have already just for the track and upgrade bits. Spares alround if you need eitherway.
Otherwise I always liked Blue Sv's old youtube vids on the track with his curvys. Seemed cooler to go fast on a slow bike than fast on a fast bike, or even worse, slow on a fast bike if you know what I mean...
fastdruid
05-01-10, 01:01 AM
Personally if you think the SV is too slow[1] then I'd say get a 600, an old CBR6 steelie can be picked up for pennies, loads of tuning goodies, loads of spares and ace handling.
Of course if just straightline speed is what you're after then go buy a I4/1000, just don't come crying when someone on a 400/650 stuffs you on the brakes and loses you through the twisties. ;)
Er. Want to buy an RVF400R track bike?
Druid
[1] More likely you aren't fast enough. ;)
600's are better on the track than 1000 IMO. will let you know how i get on with the R1 on track compared to the ZX6. But 600's can lay more of their power down quicker without risk of highsiding etc.
A 400 can provide cheaper and quick thrills if you are just looking for a bit of fun, Granted it starts to get more expensive when if you were looking to start racing on one. My first zxr (The one i crashed at mallory recently) cost me £800 last winter and it didnt need anything doing to it, You should be able to pick up one for around that money or less now. Failing that I would look around for a cheaper 600, maybe something pre-injection or steel framed, again a cheap and cheerful way to get involved and at the end of the day, something you aren't really going to fret about when you throw it at the scenery :).
mister c
05-01-10, 09:35 AM
I'm biased but if I were looking for a track bike I'd be looking at a 675...
I'm not biased, but my friend won the Triumph Triple Challenge this year, he reckoned it was an awesome bike to race.
675 all the way :)
Nick_69
05-01-10, 10:17 AM
I would day get a nice 600 of some kind like a R6, amazing bike and pretty much ready for the track.
Of course if just straightline speed is what you're after then go buy a I4/1000, just don't come crying when someone on a 400/650 stuffs you on the brakes and loses you through the twisties. ;)
not likely to happen with the binkmeister lol
robh539
05-01-10, 01:04 PM
not likely to happen with the binkmeister lol
+1
the binkmeister can ride :D.
chris8886
05-01-10, 01:18 PM
from my experience of my bike below and if i did it again i'd probably go for a 600. the blade is great fun and amazingly quick, but i reckon i'd have more fun on a 600. if you're really after a 1000 though i'd do you a deal on my blade. it's nearly fixed, just a couple more bits to get and it's good to go.
from my experience of my bike below and if i did it again i'd probably go for a 600. the blade is great fun and amazingly quick, but i reckon i'd have more fun on a 600. if you're really after a 1000 though i'd do you a deal on my blade. it's nearly fixed, just a couple more bits to get and it's good to go.
Why do you think you'd have more fun on a 600? Just curious, i'm not set on getting a 1000.
To be honest before this thread, i was leaning at getting a 600, mainly because of financial constraints, but also to go up the ladder slowly and steadily.
I couldn't get a new bike just yet, still only looking for ideas in the future. Couple of years maybe, or if i'm lucky maybe start of 2011.
If I'm on a trackday with you again at some point I'll let you have a run around on my ZXR if you fancy a go, obviously on account if you break it you pay for it.
Also are you talking in terms of just a trackday bike for the odd trackday or more than ten a season? are you contemplating getting into racing if the bug takes you?
fastdruid
05-01-10, 01:46 PM
not likely to happen with the binkmeister lol
Major difference between being able to ride a 650 fast and being able to ride a 1000 fast.
The kind of things you'll get away with on the 650 will see you spat into the middle of next week on a 1000
Druid
If I'm on a trackday with you again at some point I'll let you have a run around on my ZXR if you fancy a go, obviously on account if you break it you pay for it.
Also are you talking in terms of just a trackday bike for the odd trackday or more than ten a season? are you contemplating getting into racing if the bug takes you?
Well i'd most definately like to get into racing at some point in my life. Sooner rather than later.
But if i got a track bike, i'd try and get accustomed to it before hand.
I also have no idea of the rules/regs and i don't yet have an ACU license. Let alone no idea which series to join...
Surprising how many people are saying to ignore a 1000.
fastdruid
05-01-10, 04:49 PM
Surprising how many people are saying to ignore a 1000.
A 1000 just encourages laziness, anyone and their dog can put in an okish laptime on a litre bike because they are *so* fast in a straight line. Still doesn't stop me catching and passing them. :)
For someone (ahem) overtaking a GSXR1000 on a RVF400R, see from 5m21s ish in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7a9Exx3o8s
Druid
A 1000 just encourages laziness, anyone and their dog can put in an okish laptime on a litre bike because they are *so* fast in a straight line. Still doesn't stop me catching and passing them. :)
For someone (ahem) overtaking a GSXR1000 on a RVF400R, see from 5m21s ish in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7a9Exx3o8s
Druid
But it's simple enough to overtake a couple of slower litre bikes (there are plenty of them around) on the SV as it is. I'd like to get and do justice, to a litre bike, not just get a litre bike and fanny about.
Although saying that, getting and doing justice to a 600 would probably be the first step.
fastdruid
05-01-10, 04:59 PM
But it's simple enough to overtake a couple of slower litre bikes (there are plenty of them around) on the SV as it is. I'd like to get and do justice, to a litre bike, not just get a litre bike and fanny about.
Although saying that, getting and doing justice to a 600 would probably be the first step.
It gets trickier in the fast group. ;)
Well if you can I take my hat off to you but I would start with the 600 or 750 first before you jump to the 1000.
If you're going to to want to push it then you *will* fall off and something cheap like a steelie CBR6 is far better than something nice but slightly faster like an R6/675[1].
Druid
[1] Not to mention that I tried both a '97 CBR6 and '99 R6 round cadwell and preferred the CBR6.
[1] Not to mention that I tried both a '97 CBR6 and '99 R6 round cadwell and preferred the CBR6.
Do you only ride at cadwell :confused: to be fair it is fairly easy to run rings around a big 1000 on a smaller bike at cadwell, for obvious reasons.
fastdruid
05-01-10, 05:06 PM
Do you only ride at cadwell :confused: to be fair it is fairly easy to run rings around a big 1000 on a smaller bike at cadwell, for obvious reasons.
No just that's where I've done the majority of my trackdays, most of my blagging of other bikes and also the only place I've properly crashed (I don't count ending up bolt upright buried to the axles in the kitty litter as a crash ;))
Oh and the youtube footage was from Donington anyway. :)
Druid
I was told when taking my ACU licence that the best thing you can do to introduce yourself properly to the track is to get yourself a friendly bike. Not a rip snorting god knows how many bhp monster that will rip you limb from limb half the time, The case in point being a friend of the instructor who bought a tuned up 750 and then wrapped it round a barrier.
When he eventually got his confidence back, he hopped onto a standard 750 a friend lent him, knocked 2 secs of his laptimes and took it as a lesson learned.
In my short racing life I've not yet left Mallory park which is an ideal circuit for small bikes anyway, But I've found my little 400 to be more than enough to teach me right from wrong. My main race bike is a 72bhp tuned ZXR400, and in capable hands able to lap mallory in 57-58 seconds. I've managed to tuck into 1min 2secs on it after about 2 full days of tracktime (1 trackday and 2 race days) and each time I've been out I've knocked laptimes down by two seconds or so after each day.
You were at mallory park when I high sided my wet bike on my first time out in the wet, and It has kind of knocked the wind out of my sails a bit but I'm still going to race and get back out as I still can't find anything nearly equal to the feeling of lining up on a race grid and firing off the line, But the way is littered with an awful lot of people that have spent an awful lot of money to ride, Binned it and decided it wasnt for them.
So even though I've blabbed an awful lot about myself, I'll offer you what I think is the best advice i can give and the reasons why:
1. Don't get a litre bike - There is a reason there is a huge amount of 600 and minitwin rookie classes, they are a great place to start and I honestly feel you will learn an awful lot more on a 600 than a 1000, and if you do make a mistake, I honestly think the 600 will be a little more gentle with you.
2. Don't spend too much money on your bike - Keep an eye on Motoforum.net and E-bay for a pre-injection/steel framed 600, You should be able to pick something up between £1000-£1200.
3. Be prepared to catch the bug and sell everything you own to fund a habit. Tis worse than heroin.
If you ever want any info on race stuff, acu licence etc send me a pm and I'll be more than happy to have a chat, or I'm sure we'll probably bump into eachother at mallory again. Failing that there are plenty of other lads/ladys on here that can help.
Dave20046
06-01-10, 06:52 PM
My main race bike is a 72bhp tuned ZXR400, and in capable hands able to lap mallory in 57-58 seconds. I've managed to tuck into 1min 2secs
impressive
Tim in Belgium
07-01-10, 02:41 PM
600 if only UK/short tracks.
750 AND road legal if Spa and Nurburgring as well.
Job jobbed
Stuff
Lot of good points in there. Thanks for the pointers.
600's are better on the track than 1000 IMO. will let you know how i get on with the R1 on track compared to the ZX6. But 600's can lay more of their power down quicker without risk of highsiding etc.
I'll be interested to hear how you get on Neio. Let me know what the new Silverstone is like too. :thumleft:
Son of a beesting
07-01-10, 02:50 PM
So which would you choose for a novice trackdayer with at least a daytime MOT:
CBR600 <1999 - Cheap but might be higher mileage
SRAD 600 - Bit more expensive but better 'track' suited?
Curvy - About the same cost of a SRAD but might be newer.
So which would you choose for a novice trackdayer with at least a daytime MOT:
CBR600 <1999 - Cheap but might be higher mileage
SRAD 600 - Bit more expensive but better 'track' suited?
Curvy - About the same cost of a SRAD but might be newer.
Depends how long you've been riding. If a while, then probably the SRAD.
If new to riding then the curvy IMO. They are easy to ride, and easier to get to the maximum potential, rather than the other two.
My main race bike is a 72bhp tuned ZXR400, and in capable hands able to lap mallory in 57-58 seconds.
Lats time I was up at Knockhill there was a white bike in front of me that I just could not catch and I was riding the bejesus out of my Gixer 6 that puts out 100 bhp at the rear wheel. I was trying so hard I actually got a stitch after three laps of trying to keep up!! :)
I pulled in to find out what the hell he was riding with such a small rear tyre and it turns out it was a very well sorted FZR400RRSP with a guy on it that must have weighed 6 stone in wet leathers. Christ he was quick!
Turned out the bloke I was standing next to on the pit wall was his spanner man and that was putting out about the same as your ZXR. with that kind of power you've got a very potent weapon.
Binky, I'd seriously look at an Ex Hornet cup bike. You can get them in full racing trim and fully sorted for around £1500 and there's no fairings to replace when it goes down the road. Very easy to make them road legal again too.
The GSXR 750 SRAD is going to be split next week so last chance before it end up in pieces on Fleabay. :)
C
Son of a beesting
07-01-10, 04:31 PM
Depends how long you've been riding. If a while, then probably the SRAD.
If new to riding then the curvy IMO. They are easy to ride, and easier to get to the maximum potential, rather than the other two.
Thanks for the info.
I have had a license for about 2 years and have been commuting to work for about 6 months (about 300 miles a week).
So an SRAD??
N8te rider
07-01-10, 04:54 PM
I'd also like to get into racing next year. From reading the posts it seems skill and body weight has a big part to play when racing. Want to go CSS this Aug/Sep to improve as I'm still novice.
fastdruid
07-01-10, 05:06 PM
I'd also like to get into racing next year. From reading the posts it seems skill and body weight has a big part to play when racing. Want to go CSS this Aug/Sep to improve as I'm still novice.
Body weight means nothing in comparison to skill :-)
Yes a lighter rider has a slight acceleration advantage but they also have less weight relative to the bike to use.
Druid
I'm saving as hard as i can while still allowing for the odd beer, unfortunately your bike is still out of my reach Berlin. :(
Thanks for the info.
I have had a license for about 2 years and have been commuting to work for about 6 months (about 300 miles a week).
So an SRAD??
Have you tried riding your SV on track yet? Give it a pootle out in Novice if you're nervous about binning it. Then, make a better, more educated decision after that?
I'd also like to get into racing next year. From reading the posts it seems skill and body weight has a big part to play when racing. Want to go CSS this Aug/Sep to improve as I'm still novice.
No way. It's definately more about rider skill than anything. The bike helps, and being 6 stone will obviously make you slightly quicker, but nothing beats a few bravery pills and XXL cajunas. ;)
Knowing about racing lines/capability of your bike etc helps too. But then that's all down to the rider isn't it...
Son of a beesting
07-01-10, 05:13 PM
The only thing that worries me is that I have brand new fairings on the bike and I need it everyday to get back and forth from work. so cant afford to stack it.
N8te rider
07-01-10, 05:15 PM
I defo need to learn what my bike can do. I managed to overtake about 4 people on bigger bikes at mallory and it felt amazing, but they were being cautious as it was wet
I defo need to learn what my bike can do. I managed to overtake about 4 people on bigger bikes at mallory and it felt amazing, but they were being cautious as it was wet
Just practice. Get out on your bike as much as possible, especially on track.
N8te rider
07-01-10, 05:21 PM
Just practice. Get out on your bike as much as possible, especially on track.
Absolutely. Will be aiming to do trackdays once a month when I'm back from travelling :D
N8te rider
07-01-10, 05:36 PM
Binky have you seen this website: http://www.trackdayriders.co.uk
Might be useful for stuff
Personally if you think the SV is too slow[1] then I'd say get a 600, an old CBR6 steelie can be picked up for pennies, loads of tuning goodies, loads of spares and ace handling.
[1] More likely you aren't fast enough. ;)
I agree 100%.
I'm not a slow rider and I find my CBR600 is more than enough on any trackday I've taken it on. It's quick enough and handles well enough to embarrass a few litre bike riders in the fast group, and when my 2 No Limits instructor mates (one's an ex-Bemsee 400 Champion and raced a ZX10R for years, the other was RS250 Aprilia Challenge champion) have borrowed it they've been the fastest on track in the fast group.
If they can go that quick on a 32,000 mile 1998 steelie CBR600 with knackered stock suspension, then an identical bike will be plenty fast enough for the likes of you or me.
mike_avfc
10-01-10, 09:22 AM
ZX7r and ZX6r are quite cheap if you look at a mid 1990's model, should pick one up under a grand.
have you thought about how you would get the bike to the track ?? as i am assuming you'll probably pick up a bike with no mot and with full race fairings. and also, after time you'll get a lot of spares for it.
so not sure if you have a car / trailer or a van...
Son of a beesting
11-01-10, 12:31 PM
I was looking at the zx7r but I thought they would to heavy for track use ( I am not very heavy ) or that is what I am after? I.e. something a bit slower steering? And I have yet to see one under a grand.
I thought early zx6r did not have great geometry for track use?
I also thought about the availability of spares etc.
I would get a trailer as I have golf 4motion which should be pretty good at towing and it even has a 12v boot socket!
I've found this thread quite interesting as I'm looking at going back to doing trackdays. I ride a 2007 Tuono on the road. In the past I've had a ZXR400H2 / Suzuki TL1000 and an 2001 R6 as track bikes the ZXR was the most fun but you soon get cheesed off with the bigger bikes passing you again as soon as you get to a straight, The TL was nice and grunty but just didn't suit my riding style the R6 was the best compromise. A friend of mine also had a TL which he also used on the road so he knew the bike really well. When we did Snetterton last year he was so much faster it was unreal A few months later we did Brands Indy and he couldn't get close.
The thing I always look at is weight the lighter the bike the better as it takes less effort to throw around and you can out break alot of litre bikes and they also have to wait until the bikes more upright before piling on the power.
But I guess most of this will come down to budget, for me I also have to consider weight and seat heigh (being a short ****) :smt101
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