Rain Main & Autism

[thulfi]

I saw this film for the first time yesterday, 22 years late I know!

Dustin Hoffman is immense, as is Tom Cruise. I found this a very moving film, whilst witty and funny in some places. Absolute classic, and I think its great at conveying the 'brotherly love' message and perhaps more so that health is wealth.

I have a little cousin who suffers from quite bad autism. She is the cutest little thing, the way she grinds her teeth and flaps her hands (very characteristic of autism). I really feel for her parents though, because as hard as they try to make eye contact for more than a few seconds with their daughter, nothing. When I would play with her, I tried my best to get her to look at me, but it sadly never happened for any significant period of time. Put the TV on though, and she'll run to it, laugh, jump and flap her hands.

I think sometimes its easy to forget what a lifetime illness really entails for the affected person, and that some simply don't even have the chance for a normal life. Makes you appreciate the lot you have all the more.

[Woz]

If you watched it on Sky Anytime (as I did for the first time last night - spooky), watch the documentary 'The Real Rain Man' too. It's very good.

[littleperson]

Autism is harsh to live with. So many different forms and traits exhibited by those that suffer. Families need support but have to fight to get it when they shouldn't.

Unless you have experienced a life long illness its hard to appreciate what you've got aand there's always someone worse off than you

Life is for living and getting the best from what you have

[Alpinestarhero]

The mental illnesses get a bum deal from the NHS i feel. Maria often mentioned how crap mental health wards were when she had to visit them - worse than some prisons she had seen on the TV.

How are you supposed to get better when the environment around you is as depressed as you feel and things?

Anyway, I havn't had any contact with anyone autistic, but there was a lad in my computing classes at college who had some behavioural traits of someone with aspergers. He was a good lad, but took everything quite seriously. I spoke to him alot though, and sometimes he was kind enough to help me out a little, but i never asked anything of him

[Messie]

Kim Peek, the real man on whom the film was losely based, died less than a month ago.

Obituary here

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/obituaries/article6965115.ece

There is some ongoing doubt and discussion about his diagnosis of autism

[FG1]

My 9yr old son is diagnosed with ASD (Autistic Spectrum Disorder). We are fortunate as he appears to be mildly affected by it but as he is getting older the difference between him and his schoolfriends is becoming more apparent.
If you fancy reading an interesting book which gives a good insight as to how their brain works try " The curious incident of the dog in the night "
It reads as if written by an autistic young lad. Very funny in places but a great way of getting the message across of the way ASD chidren interpretate things.

[beabert]

Im diagnosed with aspergers, although i have nearly all the classic symtoms i personally disagree with the diagnosis, as i have one key skill suffers dont have (i think), just another case of doctors over diagnosing a condition i feel.

Saying that i have nearly all the symtoms, I do find it near impossible to make friends, i much prefer people online than in real life. I also understand the eye contact thing too, theres people ive known indirectly for months/ years without directly looking at them, to the point where i recognise their voice but not their face!

[sunshine]

Anyway, I havn't had any contact with anyone autistic, but there was a lad in my computing classes at college who had some behavioural traits of someone with aspergers. He was a good lad, but took everything quite seriously. I spoke to him alot though, and sometimes he was kind enough to help me out a little, but i never asked anything of him

Aspergers is fun means you can be a complete **** and get away with it, be boring not being able to have a laugh and joke tho.

Autism affects more people than you realise because the people with the mild forms can go undiagnosed for many years or all there life, but autist people get great at one thing which like rain man and maths you would just love to be able to count cards like him wouldnt you really im not quick enough to use it in a casino unnoticed yet.

[Richie]

I just watched the Real Rain Man, quite a touching story, and now just found out that Kim has passed.
Tis a strange world. rip Rain Man.

[Nikkih]

Aspergers is fun means you can be a complete **** and get away with it, be boring not being able to have a laugh and joke tho.

Autism affects more people than you realise because the people with the mild forms can go undiagnosed for many years or all there life, but autist people get great at one thing which like rain man and maths you would just love to be able to count cards like him wouldnt you really im not quick enough to use it in a casino unnoticed yet.

I'm gonna say my piece here and gonna try and do it without coming across as a total b1tch.

Aspergers is fun - No way in a million years would anyone who has aspergers or a child with aspergers ever say it is fun.

Autistic people get great at one thing - some do but only a small minority, a very common misconception. Most people with autism struggle every day to do the normal daily things that everyone else takes for granted. Even if some do have a 'special talent' in most cases this will be totally useless in everyday life.

My son is 13 years old and autistic, having been diagnosed at 3 1/2. As he has got older we do now have a fair few good days, but life is always hard for us. He is only just learning to shower himself, he has major problems with food and can only eat in a select few places, he has a major fear of high ceilings, he can't eat if he sees pink, his emotional age is around 8 years at the moment but I wouldn't change him because the autism is part of who he is. His 'special talent' is a fantastic memory for things that interest him which is cars and has been since he was 4 years old. He knows every make of car, the horse power etc. and will talk for hours on end about cars. Not a conversation, just him talking and you pretending to be interested but to be honest he doesn;t care if you are or not. However, this doesn't transfer very easily into real life and he asked me the other day what did I think he could do when he leaves school which involves cars and I just didn't know what to tell him.

Sorry if I've gone on, but sometimes the public misconceptions about autism get to me and most people just don't appreciate the impact it has on our lives.

[CoolGirl]

Aspergers is fun means you can be a complete **** and get away with it, be boring not being able to have a laugh and joke tho.

Autism affects more people than you realise because the people with the mild forms can go undiagnosed for many years or all there life, but autist people get great at one thing which like rain man and maths you would just love to be able to count cards like him wouldnt you really im not quick enough to use it in a casino unnoticed yet.

Really? That's not our experience. We live with Aspergers every day and believe me, it's no fun at all. Yes, high functioning autism has some very good things going for it (I'm trying to persuade Mike that a trip to Vegas would be a good tihng - he's already banned from playing cards at work). But whilst he's unique and I wouldn't change a thing about him, I wouldn't wish the ignorance, bullying, the anxiey, the vulnerability, and all the other heartache on anyone.

[FG1]

Nikkih, well said. I can see your points 100% and with my son I can totally relate to what you are going through.
I think having contact with others affected by Autism can help a lot. My wife and I went to a few meetings with other parents (the children didn't go) and it was amazing what you can learn from others in a similar suituation.

[Milky Bar Kid]

I'm gonna say my piece here and gonna try and do it without coming across as a total b1tch.

Aspergers is fun - No way in a million years would anyone who has aspergers or a child with aspergers ever say it is fun.

Autistic people get great at one thing - some do but only a small minority, a very common misconception. Most people with autism struggle every day to do the normal daily things that everyone else takes for granted. Even if some do have a 'special talent' in most cases this will be totally useless in everyday life.

My son is 13 years old and autistic, having been diagnosed at 3 1/2. As he has got older we do now have a fair few good days, but life is always hard for us. He is only just learning to shower himself, he has major problems with food and can only eat in a select few places, he has a major fear of high ceilings, he can't eat if he sees pink, his emotional age is around 8 years at the moment but I wouldn't change him because the autism is part of who he is. His 'special talent' is a fantastic memory for things that interest him which is cars and has been since he was 4 years old. He knows every make of car, the horse power etc. and will talk for hours on end about cars. Not a conversation, just him talking and you pretending to be interested but to be honest he doesn;t care if you are or not. However, this doesn't transfer very easily into real life and he asked me the other day what did I think he could do when he leaves school which involves cars and I just didn't know what to tell him.

Sorry if I've gone on, but sometimes the public misconceptions about autism get to me and most people just don't appreciate the impact it has on our lives.

You certainly didn't come across as a b1tch, the opposite infact.

I am glad you commented on the Aspergers is fun comment.

I know a young boy, about 5 who, although not diagnosed, shows some autistic traits. He must eat the same thing for dinner EVERY night, at the same time. He must have his bath, followed by yoghurt drink and biscuit followed by brushing his teeth before bed. You can't change the biscuit for a small cake or anything else. His routine must be rigid, he cannot cope with even the slightest change and goes off his head. He appears to display the mental age of a 3 yr old and he rarely makes eye contact.

Whilst I realise these are very mild traits, his parents still find it very difficult so I have nothing but the utmost respects for parents who have to deal with much worse.

[Nikkih]

You certainly didn't come across as a b1tch, the opposite infact.

I am glad you commented on the Aspergers is fun comment.

I know a young boy, about 5 who, although not diagnosed, shows some autistic traits. He must eat the same thing for dinner EVERY night, at the same time. He must have his bath, followed by yoghurt drink and biscuit followed by brushing his teeth before bed. You can't change the biscuit for a small cake or anything else. His routine must be rigid, he cannot cope with even the slightest change and goes off his head. He appears to display the mental age of a 3 yr old and he rarely makes eye contact.

Whilst I realise these are very mild traits, his parents still find it very difficult so I have nothing but the utmost respects for parents who have to deal with much worse.


To be fair compared to a lot of kids with autism our sons difficulties are mild too, but it's the constant nature of the problems that wears you down and I can totally sympathise with the parents of the little boy you know. I often think our house is like ground-hog day as I prepare the same thing for breakfast and lunch every day and we only have 3 things that he will have for dinner, our lives are bound by his routines. Sometimes you would just love to be spontaneous, and maybe even decide to just go out for dinner, but never mind.

[Mogs]

I have a daughter with high functioning ASD (Aspergers). Getting information relevent to a girl is incredibly difficult. I wouldn't change her, but I wouldnt wish ASD on anyone.

[timwilky]

Aspergers aint fun. Ask my mate who had to grind all the points off the kitchen knives when his kid threatened to stab him. Or having to drive to strange parts of the country to recover him from police stations when his train/bus fascination takes over.

An old school friends family made the local papers when his Aspergers son (I had no idea the lad had problems) got an internet friend to try to kill his parents.

Aspergers or as Richard calls it the A word is such a wide condition that most normal well functioning individuals would be considered to have at least one of the classic indicators. When does an interest in something become an obsession etc?

Also getting proper funding/support from your LEA and health authority is head bangingly difficult. An excellent School is one down south called Southlands at Lymington, getting someone to pay when your LEA use the mainstream argument etc means you want to do your best for the kids and the system doesn't want to let you

[Bri w]

Summer '08 I took my usual week off and spent it working with 'special needs' children. Imagine spending a week with a child, read next to because you are rarely 'with' them. I used to spend hours telling him what I was doing, e.g. "I'm going to colour this picture green. Do you think you could too?" Each morning break I'd roll a ball to him, and ask him to roll it back. On the Thursday morning he stopped the ball before it reached him and rolled it back, and I filled up.

On the Friday I told him I wouldn't be there the following week as I had to go back to my other job. He said "bye" - maybe he was glad to see the back of me. The only word I'd heard him utter all week, and apprarently the only word he'd uttered in the 5 mths he'd been there. The week I was there was the only time he'd had full time one on one - I'd like to think I made a difference, if only for that week.

I saw some spectacular tantrums, usually started by the most obscure things. For example, the unit had had to change the ring tone.

The saddest thing for me was their inability to 'connect' with the other children, yet 1/2 an hour later they'd be doing whatever they'd been invited to join in with but on their own in the corner when all the others had moved on.

I'd love to do it full time but I fear I'd get too involved.

[sunshine]

I ment it would be fun to have aspergers syndrome because the few i have meet are the rudest *******s in the world which from what i know means it a very bad form of it.

Bri: I spend 9-12 weeks a year starting last year working on the camp America systems, I was given the choice of normal kids or a group of autistic child including those with aspergers. i was E-mailed about 2 months ago asking if i was returning this year which i will be and a parent had called in to ask if i was going to be there because there autist son asked if he was going rock climbing with Chris at camp. I had done in weeks what there parents couldnt do in 15 years with there son, its not impossible for them to form a bond and socially interact but dont ask me how it happened. He was one of 5 in the group which i was looking after for 4 weeks I dont remember him saying anything to me or anyone else who tried to speak to him.

[Milky Bar Kid]

I ment it would be fun to have aspergers syndrome because the few i have meet are the rudest *******s in the world which from what i know means it a very bad form of it.

Bri: I spend 9-12 weeks a year starting last year working on the camp America systems, I was given the choice of normal kids or a group of autistic child including those with aspergers. i was E-mailed about 2 months ago asking if i was returning this year which i will be and a parent had called in to ask if i was going to be there because there autist son asked if he was going rock climbing with Chris at camp. I had done in weeks what there parents couldnt do in 15 years with there son, its not impossible for them to form a bond and socially interact but dont ask me how it happened. He was one of 5 in the group which i was looking after for 4 weeks I dont remember him saying anything to me or anyone else who tried to speak to him.

Seriously, if you have worked with kids suffering from Aspergers and other forms of autism then I cannot believe you would make a comment like "It would be fun". :rolleyes:

[CoolGirl]

I ment it would be fun to have aspergers syndrome because the few i have meet are the rudest *******s in the world which from what i know means it a very bad form of it.


+1 to MBK

No really, it's not fun. Perhaps you should think beyon your limited experience and the sheltered environment in which you've come into contact with these young people. Imagine what its like trying to do everyday stuff and come into contact with people who don't realise you've got the condition, nor understand what it means.

And what you describe as rudeness could well be the direct way that people with ASD have of expressing themselves and often their inabilty to read and respond to others' body language and emotions. Which is fine if you're at kids camp, but not so good if you're an adult at work having to interact with people you don't know and who don't know you - I can assure you it won't be so funny and they won't be so understanding.

I imagine the reson you and Bri have had postitive responses is becasue you've been able to spend the 1:1 time intensely interacting with the young person on a single issue. Not everyone, even parents and partners are able to do that in the course of daily life - no matter how hard we try, we're back at square 1 more often than we would like to be.

Oh, and you don't have to have Aspergers to be rude to, or about people.

[wyrdness]

My son is 13 years old and autistic, having been diagnosed at 3 1/2. As he has got older we do now have a fair few good days, but life is always hard for us. He is only just learning to shower himself, he has major problems with food and can only eat in a select few places, he has a major fear of high ceilings, he can't eat if he sees pink, his emotional age is around 8 years at the moment but I wouldn't change him because the autism is part of who he is. His 'special talent' is a fantastic memory for things that interest him which is cars and has been since he was 4 years old. He knows every make of car, the horse power etc. and will talk for hours on end about cars. Not a conversation, just him talking and you pretending to be interested but to be honest he doesn;t care if you are or not. However, this doesn't transfer very easily into real life and he asked me the other day what did I think he could do when he leaves school which involves cars and I just didn't know what to tell him.

Interesting post. That rang a few bells for me. Quite a few years ago now, I had a brief relationship with quite an attractive blonde. She didn't look weird in any way, apart from having particularly big tits. I dumped her very quickly when I discovered that she had nazi sympathies. Not neo-nazis - she hated them, I mean your old fashioned 'send the Jews to the gas chambers' type.

Anyway, I digress. I would never have considered her to be autistic, but she actually had a lot of similar symptoms to what you describe. She was phobic of the colour yellow and she would start talking and then talk for hours. Not in a conversational way, she'd just go into this strange state where she'd just talk and talk about whatever was going on in her mind. She also had a 'special skill' that's very like those seen in autistic people. She had an amazing memory and was memorising the railway timetables of eastern European countries.

[Bri w]

+1 to MBK

No really, it's not fun. Perhaps you should think beyon your limited experience and the sheltered environment in which you've come into contact with these young people. Imagine what its like trying to do everyday stuff and come into contact with people who don't realise you've got the condition, nor understand what it means.

And what you describe as rudeness could well be the direct way that people with ASD have of expressing themselves and often their inabilty to read and respond to others' body language and emotions. Which is fine if you're at kids camp, but not so good if you're an adult at work having to interact with people you don't know and who don't know you - I can assure you it won't be so funny and they won't be so understanding.

I imagine the reson you and Bri have had postitive responses is becasue you've been able to spend the 1:1 time intensely interacting with the young person on a single issue. Not everyone, even parents and partners are able to do that in the course of daily life - no matter how hard we try, we're back at square 1 more often than we would like to be.

Oh, and you don't have to have Aspergers to be rude to, or about people.

I think Sunshine maybe made a bad choice of words, and one or two are understandibly taking them too literally. Not having quite such a personal involvement I read the comment a little differently.

As for my experience/interaction; I used to go back into the unit every week, sometimes several times a week, before we moved house. The child concerned didn't once show any signs of recognition.

I feel very much for the children but even more so for the parents. The parents, at the very least have an expectation for their children when they are born. To have that so cruelly dashed, and then week in week out as they apear to make ground/connect only for the return to square one...

If I won £10 million on the lottery, I know where most of it would go.

[CoolGirl]

I would never have considered her to be autistic, but she actually had a lot of similar symptoms to what you describe.

Once you've aware of it, you see it everywhere - I can think of one or two senior managers I work with who show signs (all First Class Oxbridge degrees as well, where I think you'll find a lot of aspies hiding in the science departments). All undiagnosed, I expect.

[davepreston]

I have a daughter with high functioning ASD (Aspergers). Getting information relevent to a girl is incredibly difficult. I wouldn't change her, but I wouldnt wish ASD on anyone.
my mrs works with people with asd and other problems (male and female) if you need some info im sure she would be happy to help, she is mrs giggles on here but if you want send me a pm and she can give you a phone
dave

[Messie]

I'm so glad others with much more day to day and personal experiences have responded to the misguided and ignorant comments made about those with Autistic Spectrum Disorders. I read some of the initial comments with increasing irritation but didn't have the chance to repsond at the time. I'm glad because my response has now been tempered by time and the anger I felt has died down a bit.
What Coolgirl and others have said about living with someone with this type of difference is so true, and even though I did my post-grad research with teenagers with autism, they can express the reality better than me.
Just one misunderstanding to redress though. The vast majority of people with autism or Aspergers do not have one special skill. The occasional examples you see are known as 'savants'. It is true that ASD people can be very good at focussing complete attention on one things, and so can become very good at it (read obsessed) but the genius skills shown by Tim Peek et al are very rare. It is not a normal feature of ASD.

[thulfi]

Sorry about the way this thread may have swayed,

My intentions were purely to bring to light the way such illnesses affect many people. I'm very sorry for the experience people here have because of the conditions their children may suffer from, etc.

From what I have seen from my uncle and auntie, I only hope that any parent that has experienced such first hand only has the best support they can find!

[Nikkih]

Sorry about the way this thread may have swayed,

My intentions were purely to bring to light the way such illnesses affect many people. I'm very sorry for the experience people here have because of the conditions their children may suffer from, etc.

From what I have seen from my uncle and auntie, I only hope that any parent that has experienced such first hand only has the best support they can find!

You have absolutely nothing to apologise for, and my thanks go to you for posting about a issue which you felt should be brought to the attention of others.

I'm trying not to be too judgmental on some others who have posted in this thread because I think they have an inaccurate view of autism/aspergers and how people affected by it can come across. Yes they may seem rude but I think the issue here is that they are not trying to be rude or are even aware that they are, they are just trying to communicate and deal with a very confusing and often frightening world in the best way they can.

I think that anyone who is aware that an individual has an ASD shouldn't then say that they are rude or ignorant because that is the only way they know how to be and for a lot of individuals with ASD it is only through a lot of hard work and frustration that they are even able to communicate at all, so I feel that there should be recognition that there is a big difference between being rude and struggling with a communication/social disability.

[Alpinestarhero]

The guy i talked about back on page one who i was at college with, he was polite and nice. He was very bound to following the rules though, and I got a thick ear when I challenged him (jokingly) to a race one day from college to home (he only lived around the corner from me)

I think people with aspergers and autism have the ability to be polite, but from what I've seen they just get frustrated and stressed out so easily that you can forgive them for getting upset

[Nikkih]

The guy i talked about back on page one who i was at college with, he was polite and nice. He was very bound to following the rules though, and I got a thick ear when I challenged him (jokingly) to a race one day from college to home (he only lived around the corner from me)

I think people with aspergers and autism have the ability to be polite, but from what I've seen they just get frustrated and stressed out so easily that you can forgive them for getting upset

Our son is also bound by 'the rules', which is a good thing in a way as I would hope that he will never steal or break the law, however like the guy you know, he does get extremely upset if others break the rules. This is one thing we are working on with him, that he has no control on others behaviour and he has to try and let it go.

He is also extremely polite to the point where he will always always say thank you for everything, the only drawback on this is that he needs an acknowledement, a you're welcome or even just ok. So much so that if he doesn't get an acknowledgement he will just keep repeating thank you getting louder and louder each time until he does...!!!:D

[FG1]

Sticking to the rules can be a right pain at times...
You would be surprised how awkward it can be.
An example is, My son loves his psp, wii playstation etc and as such got a few games for christmas. Now, he is 9.......
How many 9 year olds do you know that will not play games that are 12+....
He got Super Smash Bros for the Wii but persuading him to play it was very difficult. As I have said in earlier posts, he is very mildly affected but it does affect everyday life.
To an outsider, I don't think it is easily understood how a "normal" lifestyle can be affected by autism.

Mind you, I have to say that looking at the bahaviour of a lot of other kids I am really lucky to have a son who is as well behaved as he is.

[rpwoodman]

One thing I didn't like about the film was that it made a lot of people who have had no first-hand experience of autism think that autistic people can perform amazing feats. Sure, a very small %age can, and a very small %age of those can do more than one feat (a la Kim), but it's rare. Most autistic people (such as my nephew, and his family) suffer because of it - it's totally sh*te.

Born on a blue day is also an interesting book.