Front end swap

[yorkie_chris]

Actually, I think it was Mavizcap.

I'm using a 120/70/17 Avon Storm Ultra

Ok just FYI I wouldn't recommend that without checking the limits of travel first.


Sorry for misunderstanding, by "that" I mean lowering yokes down forks not using a 120/70 tyre. Using a 120/70 is fine.

[Dave20046]

Not specifically front swap related but I have a (****ing awful) gsxr caliper that's seals seem okay, but the dustseals are either shagged or no where to be seen. Is there anywhere you can buy dust seals on their own as wemoto only seem to sell the seal + the dustseal.

edit: also; is the rubber sealing the wheel bearings supposed to look uneven like someone's ****ted it with a hammer? :rolleyes:

[Nobbylad]

OK - so took the bike out today for a quick blast to test out the TPS adjustment I had made. The adjustment makes the bike WAY smoother, however I have noticed that the front end really is quite light when accelerating hard, so much so that the front end shakes it's head quite noticeably when giving it fistfuls.

I appreciate the front end may actually be lighter, but it really is quite disconcerting, especially accelerating out of bends. Could it be a combination of poorly setup suspension (stock rear shock and springs in Gixer forks probably too stiff and definitely not adjusted properly for me)...or has my pointy all of a sudden got a new load of BHP that I wasn't aware of? :confused:

[barwel1992]

^ its because the front end now has less rake caused by shorter forks so it handles quicker than with the standard front end, it makes it less stable at higher speeds but drops into corners faster and better

quick explanation bout rake (assuming 0 deg is to the right and 180 to the left of this __ line and the turning of wheel is looking straight on top of it)

| < forks with 90 deg rake, turn steering 10o, wheel turn 10o left or right (looking straight down on the wheel)
/ < forks with 45o rake turn steering 10o, wheel only turn 5o left or right but also leans 5o to the left or right (i think not to sure on that(looking straight down on the wheel))
__ < forks with 0 deg rake, turn steering 10o wheel turn's 0 deg left or right but leans 10o left or right (looking straight down on the wheel)

LINK (http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=76)

a higher front end/lower rear shock or dog bones = slower turn in but more stable at speed
lower front end/longer rear shock or dog bones= faster turn in but more twitchy at speed or when on the throttle

ohh and a harder rear shock will make it easier to lift the bike's nose something to do with power not be lost through suspension movement (less of it) at the rear end. not sure on that though think it was YC that was talking about it

glad im not the only one that actually feels the sv shake its head under power

hope that helps some what

PS im not 100% on some of the stuf written as it has come from various source's, if im wrong dont bash me

[Nobbylad]

I think I follow what you're saying (just), however I have noticed that the bike seems slower to turn in, not quicker...i.e. when I'm going into a bend, it's harder to get the bike over, but then when it's over, the lean seems steeper.

Not sure if that makes sense, but basically on the twisties on the way to work, the bike definitely seems to want to run wider than normal, unless I'm really leaned over. Granted I haven't been able to do a close 'back to back' comparison of the new front end as it took me a few weeks to sort out, but I've done nearly 20k over the last 2 years on the bike, mostly to and from work so I reckon I have a pretty good sense of what it used to handle like.

Sounds like I should find somewhere that sets up suspension properly (or invite Chris over for a brew :rolleyes:)

[yorkie_chris]

Maybe slower to turn in as with those stiff springs you do not have much sag in front. Did you measure it?

[barwel1992]

^ could also be that and because ure on the stock rear shock. try and turn the preload up to max on the rear end and drop a bit of preload at the front (make sure u remember where it was if you need to set it back)

PS my last post i was half a sleep :p

[Nobbylad]

Maybe slower to turn in as with those stiff springs you do not have much sag in front. Did you measure it?

Errrrr....na.

Looks like I need to do some reading, some measuring and then some tweaking :(

[Dave20046]

Nobby, could it possibly more to do with the TPS adjustment? My standard front end often comes up on wide throttle openings and gives a handlebar squiggle as feedback. Very likely wrong but just thought I'd throw that in there :)

This wheel looks wrong:
6600
Could someone tell me what I should ....well, do with it lol (forgive the ignorance)?

...just trying to get the front end fitted before a rideout...

[Nobbylad]

Dave - nope...noticed it when I took the bike to work for the 1st time really. It definitely doesn't 'tip in' as quick on bends and almost runs wide on some. I have noticed as well that I seem to be leaned over more when cornering (to get turned in more, even when counter steering).

Hard to explain really, but have also noticed the front end 'skittering' about under hard acceleration, something that I only really experienced previously if I was going over bumps/crests etc.

[barwel1992]

^ the "skittering" will be because the suspension is to hard or the static sag is all wrong (not enough)

my front static sag is 20mm and 35mm with rider (no gear)

[yorkie_chris]

Could someone tell me what I should ....well, do with it lol (forgive the ignorance)?

...just trying to get the front end fitted before a rideout...

Those bolts bottomed in the holes? Do they go in further without the disc there? Probably wrong bolts, measure them :)

Either way don't ride it like that :-P

[yorkie_chris]

^ the "skittering" will be because the suspension is to hard or the static sag is all wrong (not enough)

Quite possibly, with not enough sag the wheel cannot follow the back side of bumps, so jumps.

Also with stock rear shock the balance will be quite wrong.

[Nobbylad]

Fancy coming round and sorting it out for me?

I'll make you a cup of tea...

[rowdy]

This wheel looks wrong:
6600
Could someone tell me what I should ....well, do with it lol (forgive the ignorance)?

...just trying to get the front end fitted before a rideout...
Buy a new bearing seal Dave, bout a tenner.

[Dave20046]

Those bolts bottomed in the holes? Do they go in further without the disc there? Probably wrong bolts, measure them :)

Either way don't ride it like that :-P
Doh, no they tightened up okay (although: copper grease or loctite?), I meant the black rubber which I assume is housing a bearing? It's not flush.

[Dave20046]

Buy a new bearing seal Dave, bout a tenner.
Ah brilliant, sorry didn't spot this a second ago - cheers. Wemoto here I come.

[yorkie_chris]

That seal is a standard one I think, take yours out and bob down to a bearing and seal supplier they should be able to find you one for less than wemoto price.

[Dave20046]

That seal is a standard one I think, take yours out and bob down to a bearing and seal supplier they should be able to find you one for less than wemoto price.
Cheers, dunno if we have any places nearby but I'll check out local bike shop - I want to see if they can supply 'just' dust seals too - the caliper seals look (*fingers crossed*) okay. I'll be genuinely surprised if a couple of the pistons work though...

[rowdy]

Doh, no they tightened up okay (although: copper grease or loctite?)
Supposed to loctite them Dave, I haven't bothered with mine, I just put them in dry and check them every so often.

[Dave20046]

Supposed to loctite them Dave, I haven't bothered with mine, I just put them in dry and check them every so often.
Ah thought you might have too, might back em out a bit and loctite 'em in that case.
Ta

[fastdruid]

Right then, back on to my front end swap :-)

Had a little play tonight with locks, Yes its a track bike but it is still road registered and even though on a switch still wired up to take a std steering/ign lock, I just need to unplug the switch and plug in an original ign switch. I want to keep my options open basically.

Firstly I tried as I think I said already the GSXR1000 K5/6 (and also 600/750) lock. The SISS circuitry in the bottom fouls on the front subframe mount. FAIL

So I tried my original lock[1] and it passes the front subframe mount but won't do up to both mounts, the GSXR bolt holes sits too close to the headstock. FAIL

Hmmm. Plan 'C' then.

Drilled off the security bolts in the bottom of the SV lock, removed the bottom of the GSXR lock (security torx bits, much easier!) and swapped the bottoms. If it wasn't that I'd cut the plug off I'd have swapped the wiring too as that looked as if it would fit. Cut the leed to the SISS Ariel and discard.

Re-try and result! The lock fits, looks like it belongs and doesn't foul anywhere. The actual locking bit of the lock doesn't work though, I think as there isn't as much steering lock as it originally was designed for the locking bar doesn't fit in the hole and hits on the frame, I might have a try at slimming down the end off the original locking bar and fit that see if it can be made to work.

http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/SV650/thumbs/640x480DSC05937.JPG
http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/SV650/thumbs/640x480DSC05938.JPG



Druid

[1] I'd have sold it with the rest of the road gear except it was well worn.

[CheGuevara]

So I tried my original lock[1] and it passes the front subframe mount but won't do up to both mounts, the GSXR bolt holes sits too close to the headstock. FAIL


I managed to get the SV lock to fit the K5 1000 top yoke (and clear the headstock) by filing the holes in the lock backwards and also I think splayed slightly outwards (they were slightly closer together I think than the GSXR mount). That gave me enough space to clear the headstock and the steering lock worked (with steering dead ahead). It was a pointy though, so may be different.

[fastdruid]

Yeah, its a tadge easier on the pointy as the lock hole is in the centre of the head (with the lock mounted to one side), if you were to do as I did but on the pointy the lock would work a treat.

Druid

[Preston]

could you not drill a new hole in the head stock for the lock to work?

[fastdruid]

I'd really rather not. I'm uncomfortable about drilling holes in the frame, especially for something I don't need.

I'm going to try swapping the GSXR1000 yoke with a GSXR750 yoke so the steering lock should then be in about a straight ahead position but should work.

Druid

[Dave20046]

That seal is a standard one I think, take yours out and bob down to a bearing and seal supplier they should be able to find you one for less than wemoto price.
Yep £4 from local bike shop, am I supposed to pack it with grease before fitting?


(sorry for the derail fast druid, we could do with a front end megathread...)

[fastdruid]

GSX-R600/750 yoke fitted (Thanks Nobbylad) and while it doesn't lock in the 'classic' position it does now lock.

This is 'locked'.

http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/SV650/thumbs/640x480DSC06089.JPG

http://www.fastdruid.co.uk/albums/SV650/thumbs/640x480DSC06090.JPG

Druid

[barwel1992]

looks good :D

just reminded me i need to think up a solution to my lock stop

[Dave20046]

looks good :D

just reminded me i need to think up a solution to my lock stop
My solution was a hack saw, any good?

[barwel1992]

lmao, na im posh my lock stops un bolt ..... ;) but i think i can make a bracket from the fairing mount on the front of the frame so i dont have to mess around with drilling the yoke

[fastdruid]

looks good :D

Thanks. :-) Now I've got the lock to fit its time to knock up a bracket for the plain switch that I'll normally have fitted!

just reminded me i need to think up a solution to my lock stop

Whats up with them?

Druid

[barwel1992]

well the tuono/rsv lock stop's are at the front of the yoke, unlike the sv ones so will ether drill and fit the lock stops at the back or make a bracket that uses the sub frame mounts at the front to act like the stock rsv stops

[yorkie_chris]

Drill and tap couple of bolts into top of bottom yoke.

[barwel1992]

^ thats what i will most likley do, i can use the RSV stop spacer things so should look like its meant to be there