pot hole- car damage- anyone claimed off council

[Quiff Wichard]

as the title says

hit a massive pothole inthe road today - buckled my wishbone and car not drivable..


anyone successfully claimed off the council for pothole damage.?

[DarrenSV650S]

Is it deeper than 4 inches? If not don't waste your time




....waits for sexual innuendo.....

[suzsv650]

Not me but my Mate, brand new Astra VXR, took a chip out of the alloy wheal and popped the tyre, he got a brand new wheal and tyre.

The wheal wasnt even damaged that much, still perfectly useable. The council had the hole filed within the day

[svrich]

A member of my family did but I'm not too sure of the details as it was a few years ago now. As far as I'm aware you have to make sure that the council knew about it and had therefore neglected to fix a known problem. Their defense could, and probably will be, they didn't know about it so couldn't fix it. Good luck though, there are loads more about since we had all the snow.
Sorry I can't help any more.

[Quiff Wichard]

it is massive- I took pics..

and it is on the left side of road as you approach a tiny bridge with give way the other way- a back road- unlit country road.. so a queue of cars facing you at bottom of the hill.. down the hill over the wee bridge see the pothole and boom ! in it - you cant do a thing .. unless you steer straight in to the static traffic that HAVE to give way to you - only way to miss it is to go on other side of road when no traffic there...

it is quarter mile from home so whilst I waited for RAc mandy daughter brought tea and my camera and I took pics.. and ued torch as a measure- willgo back in morning and take more pics. called police local number and they said they will inform the highways- me said it needs a warning-! or there will be a head on fatality .. but - nothing.. just a log number for me for insurance..

so RAc man putspace saver on.. as it is a bent wishbobne etc etc fouling onthe inner of the alloy- space saver - it misses. and me have to be off to the alfa garage tommorow and call the council etc etc etc/.

[Quedos]

having just done the same with Stirling council and the £800 damage to the bike.
Claiming compensation will only happen if the council leagally has to. Quoting from my letter - "You must prove that the council was at fault. Usuallu you need to show that the council did not take reasonable care broke a contract or did follow a written law. The council must maintain certain roads and pavement. However you are not likle to prove liability if they operate a reasonable inspection systems to identify defects."

Mines then has the cheek to say that at last inspection there were no defects - so last inspection must have been about 3 years ago and they say that a repair was carried out the same day which I also know is bull*** as i went to the same car park at GM2 two weeks later and the hole was still there!
do it yourself first see what they say and then get a lawyer.
Take pictures in the next coupel of days too with an international paper with the date clearly shown - it means least you can prove how long it took to fill!

Good luck

[rowdy]

Quiff, check out this website www.potholes.co.uk (http://www.potholes.co.uk) , some useful advice on there about this subject.
Heard about it on a radio phone in show the other week, some people saying there councils seem to pay out without too much bother, others having to take it to court, including one bloke who caused £4000 worth of damage to his three week old bmw, and went back the next day to photograph the pothole only to find a police car had hit it and caused similar damage to the patrol car.

Did a similar thing myself the week before Christmas. Hit a pothole around a manhole cover at night, couldn't see it. The following day the pothole had been filled in. All seemed ok with the car, but the tracking had been badly put out of line, and it wrecked the inside of the tyre. Went to get a new tyre fitted and the tracking sorted about a week later and discovered the wheel had been cracked on the inside edge. All in all about £400 damage, but I've no way of proving it's the councils fault.
At least you were able to photograph the pothole, and have a police log number.

[Quiff Wichard]

cheers all..

had already registered on potholes UK.. look at cw2 area- and wistaston green road .. I marked it up.


my brother is a solicitor so it may help..

[beabert]

however unfortunate, they cant be everywhere at once, sure if told and then not fixed in a reasonable amount of time then they should be liable, otherwise its a case of keeping your peepers peeled.

good luck!

[Bluepete]

Should have gone to specasvers!

Pete ;)

[timwilky]

Having bust my leg last year on a pot hole, it is my understanding that councils have a statutory defence against claims, unless you can prove they were negligent in not identifying and repairing the defect.

In my case they were able to prove the road was inspected 9 months earlier and no defect found. At that point the legal people said I had no chance of a claim unless I could prove the defect was older and they had been negligent in their inspection

[Captain Nemo]

the council will have a maintenance schedule set up for all its roads, it will ha e an inspection schedule where they record how often a certain road needs to be inspected and when it was inspected, they will also have a policy on intervention, eg, if a pot hole is 25mm then it should be monitored at the next inspection, if its 50mm and off the wheel track its say 28 day repair, if its 50mm and in the wheel track its a 24hr repair, things like that, you should be able to find out when the last inspection was carried out and if it was recorded as a defect then,

just a word of warning, local authorities now are very much aware of their responsibilites and keep very good records.

the council will have to have not carried out its repairs to its own schedule to be liable, also the ammount of salting thats been needed in the past month will have accelerated any faults within the surfacing, pot holes can open up overnight and quickly become dangerous, the council cant be held liable for a defect that they ouldnt reasonably have been expected to know about or repair within a reasonable time, they know this and play on it,

and i should know , i work for a highways authority..............good luck.

[keith_d]

Yep - you've only got two chances.

1) Council was informed and failed to rectify the problem in a accordance with Highways Agency recommendations.

2) Council failed to follow the guidelines from the Highways Agency regarding inspection and repair.

I hit an elephant trap which was camouflaged by a puddle and wrecked both left hand wheels on my ST220. But I don't expect to get anywhere with the council, so I just bought some wheels on Ebay.

Keith

[Grinch]

Anyone know if there is a time limit on claims?

[Quiff Wichard]

cheers again folks.. beenreading up on it - and yea I need to apply for a Disclosure of information.. after they standard refused my claim under section 52 nonsense paragraph tos$$ers so it says..


Blue pete- couldnt avoid it- me off to take daylight pics in a min so me show you laters- just for interest.

[Quiff Wichard]

well well well.. been to take pics.. just-

they have filled it in!

8pm last night I went down it- well 7.20pm.. reported it to police at 8pm they told highways and it filled in by 10am today - so surely that good for me?? says they deemed it bad enough to fill in. but they still have their 3 month checks and "it wasnt that bad last time we checked" due dilligence I suppose.

[philbut]

I damaged my push bike, and also my leg when my tire blew out on a big pot hole. Informed the council and took photos. They inspected the hole and sent me a claim form. Months later I get a letter back telling me that because the council didn't KNOW the pot hole was there, they had done their duty by ATTEMPTING to keep the roads in good condition so I wasn't entitled to compensation. I bet the legal guy who spent time working out how they could get out of it cost more than my £15 claim for a new tyre :-(

[Captain Nemo]

its nowt to do with the highways agency to be honest, the HA are responsible for trunk roads and motorways only, they have no poweres or influence over local authorities who are the the "highways authority", the local authority sets its own inspection frequencies and as long as they arent something stupid like "we will inspect this carriageway by speedboat every 1000 millenia" then theyre generally in the clear, it is true that they stick pretty close to highways agency standards, but amazingly these standards are only guides for non HA organisations.

Dave, you would think that them fixing it is an admission of guilt , but in reality they would argue that once they wer informed of the defect then they acted promptly and carried out a repair,

one deffinate thing to ask, if you have to for a freedom of information request, is how often repairs have been carried out on that section of road, wether there is any planned maintenance for that section,

if you can prove that road is generally in poor repair and is regularily being repaired, perhaps in the same location, then you can argue that the Highway authority is aware of the condition and is attempting to save money by attempting temporary repairs,
this is especially applicable if for example the same man hole keeps sinking and they just keep patching it up rather than replacing the cover and frame or the brickwork on the gully or chamber.

[Quiff Wichard]

cheers Mark . appreciate your time there- ..

me off in minute to putinmy complaint in writing- deliver by hand.

pop me pics up in a min

[Quiff Wichard]

here you go- clearly see the pothole position.. the road.. the giveway for oncoming cars.. the damage to my car.. and the fact they filled it in.. ha ..!

you are right nemo i thought ahaaa admission of guilt filling it in... maybe not then- I have legal protection on my insurance and they said they would assist me if it has to go further.. .. we will see



approach this bridge - pot hole after the bridge on the left .. cars on right give way

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3098.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3099.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3100-1.jpg


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3071.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3078.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3070.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3079.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3089.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3101.jpg


then this morning- at 9.30am.. filled in.. ( my accident was 7.30pm last night !)


http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3092.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3093.jpg

http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b326/sigourneysbeaver/DSCF3095.jpg

[rowdy]

one deffinate thing to ask, if you have to for a freedom of information request, is how often repairs have been carried out on that section of road, wether there is any planned maintenance for that section,

if you can prove that road is generally in poor repair and is regularily being repaired, perhaps in the same location, then you can argue that the Highway authority is aware of the condition and is attempting to save money by attempting temporary repairs,
this is especially applicable if for example the same man hole keeps sinking and they just keep patching it up rather than replacing the cover and frame or the brickwork on the gully or chamber.
Imho the councils are negligent of maintaining our highways to a decent standard anyway. The amount of times I see in my area the councils employing contractors to just skim over what seems an ok piece of road with a thin layer of asphalt, that within weeks has been pulled up by lorries is beyond me. Guess they pay number crunching monkeys over inflated wages to cut corners.

[Mogs]

I think you are on to a loser there Quiff. Council staff are not stupid, they will put the case that it is avoidable, but Council staff are pragmatic they will attempt to balance out the cost of fighting the case opposed to paying out.

[Quiff Wichard]

it isnt avoidable! if there is a line of cars giving way on the right..

[Captain Nemo]

Imho the councils are negligent of maintaining our highways to a decent standard anyway. The amount of times I see in my area the councils employing contracters to just skim over what seems an ok piece of road with a thin layer of asphalt, that within weeks have been pulled up by lorries is beyond me. Guess they pay number crunching monkeys over inflated wages to cut corners.

Thanks for that.as one of those number crunching monkeys you speak of I take great pleasure in trying to cut corners and generally doa shoddy job whenever I can after all it's not like the knackered roads are going to effect me is it my wheels are bomb proof and dontbend my bike has stability control and is unaffected by holes or surfacing with no scrim left.
Or maybe the spending decisions are made far higher than the engineers and we just try to do the best with what we have . To suface dress 1km of road might cost 5k to replace 40mm of the surface course would cost 25000k to do a "proper" job as people see it would cost maybe 70k. Ring the council and tell them which nursing home you want them to shut so they can do a 'proper' job.....it's all down to money from what isee some authorities are worse than others but the good ones do a great jobconsidering the ammount of roads they manage and the growth in traffic......

[Shellywoozle]

My Mum was on about this today, was on local news, if you have damaged caused by pothole then take a pic and you make your claim.

Don't know when and where she saw it but was on about the snow / weather damaging the roads ... you may be ok :)

Good luck

[Girth]

Guy at work is claiming off the council for cracking two of his alloys from a pothole, puncturing one tyre.

The day after it was filled as they had a few complaints, he got the job number for it etc and put a claim in. He just needs a quote for replacement and then he has a payout hopefully.

Hope this gives some hope.

[5hort5]

If it was after the snow they will claim mitigating circumstances and that'll be the end of it m8, if it was there before the snow and reported then you'll win IMO.

[Bibio]

they will just say you should not drive italian crap.





runs and hides...

[kwak zzr]

there was an episode of 5th gear on about this, the pot hole has to be a certain depth 6cm i think rings a bell, you also need pictures and whitnesses.

[Quiff Wichard]

If it was after the snow they will claim mitigating circumstances and that'll be the end of it m8, if it was there before the snow and reported then you'll win IMO.


well the man in th ebig house/farm at top of road says it was there bfore the snow.. so I could get a statement off him if need be I suppose

[Quiff Wichard]

there was an episode of 5th gear on about this, the pot hole has to be a certain depth 6cm i think rings a bell, you also need pictures and whitnesses.


loooadss of pics Daz.. and Mandy was in car with me.. but she biased- but RAC towed me home so got their call out note- and the man in the farm at top I had to knock on his door cos me car was parked on his drive waiting for rac man

[Mogs]

it isnt avoidable! if there is a line of cars giving way on the right..

Playing Devils advocate (because I hope they recompense you). You must have been travelling too fast for the conditions, you should have been able to stop within the distance you can see, thus avoidance. If the hole is so big to cause damage then you must have been able to see it. It's a road with no footpaths potentually there could be pedestrains in there.

Good luck with your claim, I hope the figure you put in is below the councils threshold for fighting the case.

[Quiff Wichard]

Mogs the figure I put in will be the figure it costs me at the garage with receipt to prove it- I just want my car back the way it was before the damage not intending to make on it ..

I was travelling at the speed hat is indicated on the road and had cars behind me so couldnt stop anyway - it is a right little rat run that road links 2 main arteries in crewe..plus twas at night .. dark and pot hole full of water.

[rowdy]

Thanks for that.as one of those number crunching monkeys you speak of I take great pleasure in trying to cut corners and generally doa shoddy job whenever I can after all it's not like the knackered roads are going to effect me is it my wheels are bomb proof and dontbend my bike has stability control and is unaffected by holes or surfacing with no scrim left.
Or maybe the spending decisions are made far higher than the engineers and we just try to do the best with what we have . To suface dress 1km of road might cost 5k to replace 40mm of the surface course would cost 25000k to do a "proper" job as people see it would cost maybe 70k. Ring the council and tell them which nursing home you want them to shut so they can do a 'proper' job.....it's all down to money from what isee some authorities are worse than others but the good ones do a great jobconsidering the ammount of roads they manage and the growth in traffic......
So you work for the Highways Authority or the Highways Agency?
I'm not having a pop at the people that do what they are asked to do, but the people that make the decision in the first place. And while it might save x amount by doing a p!ss poor job (if roads were properly laid instead of just skimmed over, water wouldn't be able to get underneath the surface and then freeze and create potholes in the first place) in effect it costs people more in the long run, but I suppose if it's not costing the council more they don't give a toss, because it's the tax payer that has to fork out and the government will recieve even more money off us in tax/vat for all the repairs we need to make.

And why should we, don't we pay enough anyway? given the fact we pay road fund license, taxed at around 70% on fuel, taxed on insurance, cost of MOT, and taxed on every other consumable to keep the car running.
Personally, the average annual mileage myself and my wife run up is around 25,000mls. Ok, so both our cars aren't the most economical and thats our choice (about 25mpg), but that equates to over £3500 a year going to the government in fuel duty alone. We have three cars to tax at £180 each a year, so thats a further £600+ with the bike tax as well.
It then costs us about £1000 to insure all the vehicles so the government is getting £175 of that. Mot's at £50 a go and £25 for the bike (I don't know how much the government take of that but it's a big chunk). Then the vat on servicing, tyres, brakes etc. So all in, the government take the best part of £5000 off of me and the missus every year for the privelige of driving our cars. Motoring, for the governments coffers, is a massive portion of their income, why shouldn't they do things properly.

Like I said at the beginning of this rant, unless your one of the people that pushes pens and cuts corners, don't take this personally. If, however you are responsible then f***ing sort it out.

As for closing nursing homes (are there any state owned ones left for them to close) maybe councils would do better by not investing their money into icelandic banks.

[Quiff Wichard]

chill chill-

I didnt want it to be a row rowdy .. a rowdy row even..


and ps dont fall out with the captain- he is 6 foot and a big lad. ! (less of a big lad now since he is a slimmer big lad- but still big.. scary big.. - ) but a softie

[rowdy]

chill chill-

I didnt want it to be a row rowdy .. a rowdy row even..


and ps dont fall out with the captain- he is 6 foot and a big lad. ! (less of a big lad now since he is a slimmer big lad- but still big.. scary big.. - ) but a softie
Oh, only 2" shorter than me then :rolleyes:
Not trying to fall out with anyone, tis just a subject that p!sses me off a bit, being in a similar situation to you. And yes, I do blame the higher authorities, not people further down the chain.

And in response to an earlier post, you can't always see the potholes, well not at night with the glare of oncoming traffic. Being a courier I drive a lot and the state of the roads at the moment is absolutely diabolical.

[Quiff Wichard]

took to garage today .. 8 miles away - and rode me push bike back.. (well to the railway station 2 miles down road ) then caught the train - ha ! ..no guard van! , had to take bike in the carriage with em - surreal.


anyway - it booked in for friday - he says should be about 80 quids if it the top doo da and 110 if it the bottom wotsit.. so not like I trying to get **** loads off the council eh.. we see. he not checked the wheel/alloy/tyre yet..

[Quiff Wichard]

update -

garage says its the alloy thats buckled..!

so I need to source a 15 inch lusso alloy now..! only find sets of 4 at £180 .. !

dam dam dam

[rowdy]

update -

garage says its the alloy thats buckled..!

so I need to source a 15 inch lusso alloy now..! only find sets of 4 at £180 .. !

dam dam dam
£45 per wheel doesn't sound too bad Quiff, at least you can find some and you'll have some spare if it happens again. The ones for my car are few and far between, so the most likely option for me is £250 for one wheel from the dealer :(.

[mattSV]

Quiff

Big breaker yard near me has 3 147s that they are breaking at the moment - these wheels look the same as yours:-

clicky (http://www.silverlakeautoparts.co.uk/breakerdetails.aspx?ID=9823)

and this one (http://www.silverlakeautoparts.co.uk/breakerdetails.aspx?ID=9055)

Might be worth a phone call - if you need me to go & pick one up just let me know mate.

[Quiff Wichard]

ya matt me e mailed them -

looks like they sell the complete damaged vehicle though

[Quiff Wichard]

OH FOLKS
guess what


they filled the hole in as per previous pics.

today- it is there again- all sraped out with car tyres accelerating up the hill -

back exactly as it was. holey

[fizzwheel]

today- it is there again- all sraped out with car tyres accelerating up the hill -

Have you reported it, if not do so now, might save some poor other b*gger getting stuck like you did.

I've read before somewhere about how winter temporary patches sometimes dont repair well as the new tarmac doesnt fit in the hole well especially due to the cold temps during the winter...

[Seggons]

one deffinate thing to ask, if you have to for a freedom of information request, is how often repairs have been carried out on that section of road, wether there is any planned maintenance for that section,

if you can prove that road is generally in poor repair and is regularily being repaired, perhaps in the same location, then you can argue that the Highway authority is aware of the condition and is attempting to save money by attempting temporary repairs,
this is especially applicable if for example the same man hole keeps sinking and they just keep patching it up rather than replacing the cover and frame or the brickwork on the gully or chamber.

OH FOLKS
guess what


they filled the hole in as per previous pics.

today- it is there again- all sraped out with car tyres accelerating up the hill -

back exactly as it was. holey

Have you thought about getting more pictures Quiff and then following up Captain Nemo's advice?

[Quiff Wichard]

me pictures??


already done.


me letter went in for claim day after the accident ..

reported it- they filled it- now it back..reported it again

[mattSV]

Guess what.

MrsMattsv has had a slow(ish) puncture for a few days.

She took it to get it repaired today, to be told that the rim is damaged - was on the inside of the rim so we could not see it. I tried to get the wheel off yesterday to have a look but the f&*^ing nuts had been torqued to about 15bn Nm.

She did smack a big pot hole the other week, so looks like that knackered it, although not as bad as yours Quiff.

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs131.snc3/17843_460691960462_895840462_11032472_4698811_n.jp g

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs131.snc3/17843_460691975462_895840462_11032473_182594_n.jpg


Luckily I have found a place locally that can repair it for "about £30". Not sure exactly where she did it so no point going to the council...

[Quiff Wichard]

I feel your pain ...

and I feel Anita's rim.

[mattSV]

I feel your pain ...

and I feel Anita's rim.

In your dreams :rolleyes:

Get home tonight and she looks really pi55ed off - has left the buckled rim to be repaired, and got another puncture in another tyre on the rear - FFS
:nomore: