Democracy, The Elections and Voter Apathy

[the_lone_wolf]

Well it's that time again (late I know) - we get to take half an hour of our lives and pretend we can make a difference to the way this country I was once proud to be a citizen of is run

I can't be the only person who feels their vote is completely useless, with the system meaning the IOW will almost certainly retain it's Tory seat because the average age of the voter has four digits

So I'm obviously not going to vote Labour, Gordon Brown, that inept, smug, winking **** could pull his pants down at a press conference, turn around and demonstrate to an assembled group of world renowned Physicists that the sun does, if fact, shine out of his **** but I could still never vote for him. I find the guy so repulsive in every single way, the way you can see him in past videos where he's making promises that he knows he's going to break in a few months time, that ****ing smile that says he knows it's all a load of crap, but it doesn't matter 'cause the retards'll hear the soundbyte and think he's doing something good

So I could play it safe, add my vote to the ranks of Blue bar graphs that will dominate the IOW polling results, but Cameron, who I could just about stand a year ago, has done his absolute best to please every single voter in the UK all he's managed is to alienate them - his policy of being frank and stark about the ****storm our national finances are in seems to have dissolved in the face of the fact that the majority of voters are too stupid to realise continual borrowing will only get you debt. Until the IMF starts up the equivalent of IVAs we're gonna have to stop spending the money

Then there's the Lib Dems, I quite like Cleggy, he's semi-local and his policy so far seems to extend to waiting, not very long I'll add, for "Winky Brown" or "**** wouldn't stick" Cameron to say something stupid and simply disagree with them, you could put a cat in his place and it would look intelligent simply by the merit of it not saying anything stupid. Of course the first problem with that is that as soon as you're in power you have to speak first and the others get a chance to say "I disagree" - the second massive problem with taking your vote to the Lib Dems is that it might just give Labour enough support by %age to keep them in power for another five years

How can you express your dissatisfaction with the poor choice of reasonable candidates? A choice so poor even with the "First past the post" system that encourages single party winners every election leaves us with nothing but a bunch of MPs who get paid 3x the average wage to argue and whinge all day and they still take the **** with their laughably unreasonable expenses. What do you do when the system is so broken that it means someone who lives in a "safe" seat effectively has no vote

I believe in democracy, I truly do, but my faith in this country and it's ability to elect a leader who won't perpetuate the current farce of rampant bloated government and a climate where lying and spinning the truth is considered normal behaviour.

So what do you do? Spoiling the ballot seems like a tame way to protest, all the big protests are about single issues that I mostly couldn't give two ****s about. Where is the protest for apathetic voters? For people who couldn't give a rats ass who wins the election because no matter who it is nothing's gonna change, I still won't be able to enjoy an evening out because it'll be full of people so uncivil I could go to the zoo and watch monkeys throw their crap at each other to simulate the experience, I still won't be able to park my car or bike anywhere without the niggling fear someone will either try to steal it, or vandalise it simply out of jealousy that I've worked hard to afford my things or sheer bloody mindedness

Sorry for the long post, can't sleep and wondering if I'm the only person so disillusioned with the system?


Oh, and if Labour win the election I'm moving to Australia, I'm not even joking, I've checked and I have 120pts on their scoring system so can simply move there without any sponsorship or anything


:smt109 <--Just me or looks like Richard Nixon?

[gettin2dizzy]

How can you express your dissatisfaction with the poor choice of reasonable candidates?

So what do you do?
Stand for election.



Or poo in the ballot box :rolleyes:

[davepreston]

feel exactly the same and agree that there is pretty much f all we can do to fix it
we are a tamed people who worry more about their tv's and microwaved meals than who is running the country, even after that if we choose someone else we all know they will just act like the last lot anyway
we live in a buracrat's dream surounded by cctv and health and safty crud

move id love to but where, the world is pretty much the same everywhere same inept leaders same stupid rules ,european laws, pc attitudes, be afraid is what they tell us and we belive them and hope they will make the monsters under the bed go away, cos its all for our protection of course

tbh the world can go to hell in a hand basket for all i care these days, i did my bit got spat on for the privilage, so now i look after me and mine, i will do what i deem nessesary to control my world after that, meh!

one final statement just to finish venting, why bother sure even when we know said person in charge has done wrong and got caught all they will do is spend more cash on a pointless enquiry with no outcome or punishment for the offending party

hth :)

[warg60]

Sigh, it the old joke; don't vote - the government will get in :)
On one hand you have voter apathy, the biggest problem they have is whether their bins will get emptied every week - or perish the thought - every other week. On the other hand you have very complex issues, which if they were simple, someone would have fixed them by now (people falsly claming they can't work as they are disabled in someway).
Personally, I would vote for the party that would pass a law allowing me slice and dice (with sharp sword), the git that keeps trying to break into my house :)
Fundamentally, current politics are all about trying to please everyone, and in the process pleasing no one. Brown had a great chance to change things with the "credit crunch"; he could have annouced some big captial project to generate renewable energy etc. off the back of the crisis. He could have slapped at 95% tax on bonus over 100K, to take effect immediately. And perhaps more controversially removed funding for lawyers representing asylum seekers.
As a lifelong labour voter, even I can see that the party might do well for a few years in the wildness to get their act together again. Although I shudder to think what the tories will do, as I remember last time they were in power; and they still think Thatcher's 3 Million unemployed was the best of time :(
Of course, we could get involved in politics and try and make the system a better place - but I guess we are all too busy working for a living.

[Bri w]

We get the Govt we deserve because, as DP says (nice one by the way) we've been tamed. And we live in fear, both individually and collectively, because of the cr@p that politicians spout, "vote for xx or else the sky will fall down." Or amongst ourselves we talk of change but we then vote mainstream so as not to waste our vote, or worst still we don't vote - I would much sooner see all the disillusioned turn out in the droves to vote for one of the fringe parties if only to scare the sh!t out of the smug ..........

Whoever is in power come May will inherit a pile of...... and will get slagged off from day one for not riding in on a white charger (don't know that bike) and saving the country. And will they be able to change things? I'd say the answer is barely at all. How does any incoming Govt change an infrastructure which is so invasive in so many aspects of our lives?

And as to the elctoral system and do we want/need to change it?

As it stands we have a first past the post system that has seen a political party rule the country with a big majority of seats yet only won 37% of the vote. But at least first past the post gives us decisive Govt, even if some of us don't like who's in power, because of the majority.

And then there is proportional representation which will give us (fear factor kicking in because of years of being fed ballcocks) a hung parliament who won't be able to be decisive. But it does bring about compromise, and it does do away with one party running madly off with extreme policies they can get away with because of the majority a first past the post system gives us.

And then there's Gordon's new gimmick voting system; knowing they probably won't win the coming election, and probably by some margin he now wants to dis the system he's been happy with for years for something that will give them a large bite of the cherry in 5 yrs time.

So just where do we go from here? That one is up to you. I will vote, as I have at every election, for the party who's policies I feel are most appropriate for my perceived needs of the country as a whole. If none of the mainstream parties come up with anything decent I will vote for who I perceive to be 3rd or 4th choice in the country so that there may be a chance of a wake up call for the 2nd choice party.

If you don't vote, don't moan. If you do vote, don't vote like sheep by voting for xx coz they're gonna win anyway or coz my Dad did, vote with your head.

And if you feel strongly enough go and lick stamps at the local party headquarters. You don't have to be an MP to make some difference.

[Ed]

TLW - as a lifelong Conservative voter, I share your pain. They all suck.

[yorkie_chris]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQkActP-isE

:smt077

[the_lone_wolf]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQkActP-isE

:smt077

Anarchy's better than no government at all...

[yorkie_chris]

Call me a survivalist nutjob but there are few citizens in this country because of the firearm laws anyway

[Kuze]

Its sad i know.

I'd vote for a party that had the balls to say what it wants to do and actually do it. Who arent afriad to **** some people off (for example i'd instantly vote for any party who cut benefits and made career dole dossers/baby machines ****ing work instead of sponging off my taxes. Or who actaully deported illegal immigrants and enforced border rules n regs n got rid of the humans rights PC bull****!).

Anyway i'm with Dave on this one, i vote but like OP stated nothing will change and i regard politicians as the lowest form of pond scum who only line their own pockets. Saying anything and everything to cluctch onto that golden meal ticket that is being a scumbag/MP.

[ophic]

Everyone has the right to vote. Middle classes tend to have a small number of kids. Working classes tend to have more. "Not-working classes", more still. So now these kids are old enough to vote, who owns the demographic score board?

[davepreston]

starship troopers time
service = citizenship

[ophic]

starship troopers time
service = citizenship
I can see a flaw in that system. You get to vote :p

[Messie]

Vote, vote, vote. It's so important. In a way I don't care who you vote for (well I do, but that's a different issue) but I so strongly believe that it's not just everyone's right to vote, it's everyones DUTY and RESPONSIBILITY to vote.
And I think you should vote whatever you believe in. IMO it really matters. We deserve the best democracy we can achieve (yes I know our system isn't the best. Yes I know what we get will be less than perfect) BUT

We should all vote!!!!

Too many people, in too many countries and places CAN'T vote. They would die for the chance to vote. We can all (over 18, not in jail) vote, so we ust.



Did I say yet? You really MUST use your vote !!!!!

[yorkie_chris]

Or at least show up to wipe your rse on the ballot paper

[Messie]

yeah OK, if you must. It's better than doing nothing IMO


(Stop it YC - I've agreed with you twice now)x

[Bri w]

Or at least show up to wipe your rse on the ballot paper

Do you know, as a political comment, if you could hand it straight to one of the theiving ones I'd go for this - nice shout YC

[davepreston]

Vote, vote, vote. It's so important. In a way I don't care who you vote for (well I do, but that's a different issue) but I so strongly believe that it's not just everyone's right to vote, it's everyones DUTY and RESPONSIBILITY to vote.
And I think you should vote whatever you believe in. IMO it really matters. We deserve the best democracy we can achieve (yes I know our system isn't the best. Yes I know what we get will be less than perfect) BUT

We should all vote!!!!

Too many people, in too many countries and places CAN'T vote. They would die for the chance to vote. We can all (over 18, not in jail) vote, so we ust.



Did I say yet? You really MUST use your vote !!!!!

i will use my democratic right to sit on my ar5e and do nothing :)

[Ed]

Vote, vote, vote. It's so important. ...

Did I say yet? You really MUST use your vote !!!!!

+675

It really is so important to use that democratic right. Often I don't like all the candidates and I think that the voing system is flawed anyway - we should have a directly elected PM, I think, like the US system. But Messie is so right, our constitutional right to vote is something we should treasure. It's too easy to whittle it away, like promising and then denying a referendum on the Treaty of Lisbon, it's the only way we will ever get a message across.

[Bluefish]

Its sad i know.

I'd vote for a party that had the balls to say what it wants to do and actually do it. Who arent afriad to **** some people off (for example i'd instantly vote for any party who cut benefits and made career dole dossers/baby machines ****ing work instead of sponging off my taxes. Or who actaully deported illegal immigrants and enforced border rules n regs n got rid of the humans rights PC bull****!).

Anyway i'm with Dave on this one, i vote but like OP stated nothing will change and i regard politicians as the lowest form of pond scum who only line their own pockets. Saying anything and everything to cluctch onto that golden meal ticket that is being a scumbag/MP.



+1 googleplex, politicians are scum, they do nothing, get rid of them.

[zsv650]

what's the point we've already been signed over to the eu anyway the government's bassically just a pr exercise now no real power too do anything democracy was flushed down the pan with it so it really make's no difference.

[keith_d]

I can see this thread is going to run and run, so I'll stick my 2d worth in now, then keep my head down.

In this country we've seen a massive growth in the public sector, without a corresponding growth in tax revenues. As you might expect, this has resulted in huge government deficits. I'm half hoping that Labour will get in, so they have to deal with the consequences of their spending spree, but I don't think it's likely.

Whoever wins the next election will have to make some fairly unpalatable decisions. They will need to cut costs throughout the public sector, and there's going to be a lot of squealing as snouts are pulled from the taxpayer's trough. Tax revenues will also have to rise to balance the budget. Given that the poor don't have any money and the rich can take it abroad it will be the middle classes that get squeezed again. So, I guess the choice is between swingeing cuts and modest tax rises, or modest cuts and painful tax rises.

I'm expecting the vast numbers of middle class owner-occupiers here in Ruislip & Northwood to be voting according to the dictats of their wallet. So it'll be blue through and through as usual.

I'd also put myself on the 'disenchanted with politicians' roster. It appears that both parties have myopically short term perspectives on everything and are only interested in the following morning's headlines. Perhaps parliament's motto should be, "Long term thinking, hard decisions -- no thanks!"

Just my thoughts,

Keith.