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Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:15 PM
Thoughts???

Quedos
22-06-10, 12:19 PM
whats the basis so far - we don't have access to anything -
how bad are the public sector cuts!! Do i need that bottle of vodka for tonight

AndyBrad
22-06-10, 12:20 PM
Go one what do you know we dont?

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:21 PM
20% Tax from April 2011 is expected. Quite happy with it so far I suppose.

Not adding tax on alcohol, fuel, tobacco...YET!

Personally, I like what they are doing with the housing benefit. I like what they are doing with cutting benefits for those earning over £40,000....it's not ideal if you're in that bracket, but it does make it fairer.

Oooh, just said that Cider duty is being reduced.......:-)

600+
22-06-10, 12:21 PM
20% VAT!!!

Remind me who voted for them??!!!

So they've stopped projects which means that companies that depend on government projects have already started laying off people.

I'm so crossed that I can't even type properly!!

And how Labour was worse than them. At least we had a job and could pay taxes! Now with no jobs who will pay taxes?

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:22 PM
I've not seen a lot but basically, they are freezing duty on things but VAT is increasing to 20%. They are also cutting tax for 880,000 who are classed as being on the lowest income but they are taxing higher earners more. Missed the public sector cuts...I will have a look.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:23 PM
Q - They are asking for a pay freeze for 3 years in the public sector. I think it was 3 years...might have been 2.

Public sector pensioners will be worse off £250 a year
Public sector workers will be worse off £240 a year

Royal income frozen for a few years

Government income frozen for 2 years

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:23 PM
20% VAT!!!

Remind me who voted for them??!!!

So they've stopped projects which means that companies that depend on government projects have already started laying off people.

I'm so crossed that I can't even type properly!!

And how Labour was worse than them. At least we had a job and could pay taxes! Now with no jobs who will pay taxes?

HA! If labour hadn't gotten us into this mess then they wouldn't have had to take such drastic action with the budget!

EssexDave
22-06-10, 12:24 PM
Meh.
It was all expected. It's not as bad (as of yet) for me as I expected. I work in the public sector and we have a lot of cuts coming, but are still unsure as to what exactly it means for our office and how it will directly affect us.

The increase in personal tax allowance is a bit blah because of the VAT increase obviously it's not a large help.

I personally wouldn't have minded a little more duty on cigarettes, alcohol and fuel. When I say a little I'm talking maybe 1p on fuel and cigarettes and 2-5p on booze. Purely because, look at the amount of debt. The faster you pay the debt, the less interest you pay. (And I am a smoker/drinker)

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:25 PM
I've not seen a lot but basically, they are freezing duty on things but VAT is increasing to 20%. They are also cutting tax for 880,000 who are classed as being on the lowest income but they are taxing higher earners more. Missed the public sector cuts...I will have a look.

Yep...and basic rate tax payers will gain about £170 a year.

Quedos
22-06-10, 12:28 PM
I love the outrage on 20%vat - howmany people felt the change from 15% to 17.5% - its going to be the same again - besides its lower than Ireland and other places. Yes its effectively means that we're going to pay more.
We've got a pay freeze for two years - Oh joys - so that will totall probably excess of £10k drop for me in the past 5 years

454697819
22-06-10, 12:28 PM
I dont agree with the VAT rise but we need to cut back on spending, though its gonna hurt...

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:29 PM
To be honest, it could have been a lot worse.

I am relieved they haven't put fuel duty up as we are already paying £1.23 a litre for petrol and even if they had only put it up a penny, well that would still cost businesses such as haulage a fortune and they are already struggling.

EssexDave
22-06-10, 12:31 PM
I love the outrage on 20%vat - howmany people felt the change from 15% to 17.5% - its going to be the same again - besides its lower than Ireland and other places. Yes its effectively means that we're going to pay more.
We've got a pay freeze for two years - Oh joys - so that will totall probably excess of £10k drop for me in the past 5 years


Because hardly any of the shops lowered their prices when the VAT dropped, they just pocketed the extra 2.5% and then played the "No VAT increase" when it went back up, when really, it was just staying the same price that the consumer paid.

Now it will either be the companies losing that 2.5% profit, or us. And guess what... It'll be us.

I don't mind though, it's a tax on spending, so now is clearly a good time to save. Don't get me wrong, we all like low taxes, but I'd rather we stop paying £10,000 interest a minute or whatever stupid figure it is.

timwilky
22-06-10, 12:33 PM
Well fuel will go up as a result of the extra vat.

But remember that is recoverable by business. So it only joe public that will endure that. Increases in duty instead would have had an impact upon business

600+
22-06-10, 12:34 PM
The way I see it MBK is that with Labour more people had a job! This means they could pay tax and less were on the doll!

The increase in spending was a must to keep the GB market going.

Bare in mind that people without a job will become depressed!! Remember from history the Thatcher years? And I say from history as we are not that old to have lived through it.

I personally prefer to have a job and a house and pay higher taxes than no job, no house and higher taxes.

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:34 PM
Well fuel will go up as a result of the extra vat.

But remember that is recoverable by business. So it only joe public that will endure that. Increases in duty instead would have had an impact upon business

Yeh, that's what I was getting at.

600+
22-06-10, 12:35 PM
Well fuel will go up as a result of the extra vat.

But remember that is recoverable by business. So it only joe public that will endure that. Increases in duty instead would have had an impact upon business


And lets not forget the majority of us work for someone!! So it's me that's gonna hurt

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:36 PM
Meh.
It was all expected. It's not as bad (as of yet) for me as I expected. I work in the public sector and we have a lot of cuts coming, but are still unsure as to what exactly it means for our office and how it will directly affect us.

The increase in personal tax allowance is a bit blah because of the VAT increase obviously it's not a large help.

I personally wouldn't have minded a little more duty on cigarettes, alcohol and fuel. When I say a little I'm talking maybe 1p on fuel and cigarettes and 2-5p on booze. Purely because, look at the amount of debt. The faster you pay the debt, the less interest you pay. (And I am a smoker/drinker)

It's not that they are not increasing tax on fuel/alcohol and tobacco....they are just not doing it yet, they will be looking at this again in more detail. I think they said September.

To be honest, it could have been a lot worse.

I am relieved they haven't put fuel duty up as we are already paying £1.23 a litre for petrol and even if they had only put it up a penny, well that would still cost businesses such as haulage a fortune and they are already struggling.


They are also looking at doing something to cut any increases that are due to come in rural areas to help farmers smaller rural businesses.

600+ - The VAT hike was well to be expected and yes, you'll probably notice it a little, but what you'll find is that stay competitive, a lot of retailers will start sales and cuts and pay the VAT for you on a load of things, just to keep people going in the shops next year, so you won't just suddenly notice it go up, just like you probably didn't notice it going back up to 17.5% from 15%.

It could have been a lot worse, so don't be too angry. Not doing this could mean a second recession and then you'll be looking at us having a higher national debt, more unemployment and it will take even longer to get out of.

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:36 PM
The way I see it MBK is that with Labour more people had a job! This means they could pay tax and less were on the doll!

The increase in spending was a must to keep the GB market going.

Bare in mind that people without a job will become depressed!! Remember from history the Thatcher years? And I say from history as we are not that old to have lived through it.

I personally prefer to have a job and a house and pay higher taxes than no job, no house and higher taxes.

If Labour has come into power this time round, the jobs would still have gone. Tories and Lib Dem are just trying to clean up the mess left behind.

EssexDave
22-06-10, 12:37 PM
Well fuel will go up as a result of the extra vat.

But remember that is recoverable by business. So it only joe public that will endure that. Increases in duty instead would have had an impact upon business


Of course, I was merely saying that I wouldn't have minded, if it means we clear out debts faster.
I'm not by any means saying whatever I put forward should be what happens, I am not an expert and this is pretty much the first budget I've actually followed properly.

Quedos
22-06-10, 12:37 PM
that was the conversation we had this morning 600+ pay more to keep the job etc. As long I still have a job - ha ha ha - I'm just playing the waiting game till my authority tells me in black and white I'm gone! got the nod in December and still waiting

600+
22-06-10, 12:38 PM
If Labour has come into power this time round, the jobs would still have gone. Tories and Lib Dem are just trying to clean up the mess left behind.

Not sure how?? The budget had been published and there were no similar points mentioned.

I might have missed it though so I'm happy to be corrected.

lily
22-06-10, 12:39 PM
It could have been a lot worse.

Think me and Drew will benefit for once with this budget. An extra £1000 tax free from next year. Council's being supported to lower council tax, no rise in duty on cider and wine etc

The VAT may effect us a bit, however as VAT is only payable on non-essential, and we hardly put fuel in the car now thanks to a change in circumstances, we don't have any children or receive any benefits.

So I'm quite happy!

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:41 PM
Not sure how?? The budget had been published and there were no similar points mentioned.

I might have missed it though so I'm happy to be corrected.

We were told long before the election that public sector budgets were getting cut and that they were cutting the number of officers too.

My point was that, although the coalition have stopped projects and are getting rid of public sector workers, with Labour, more and more businesses were on the verge of collapsing. The coalition are trying to prevent this IMO.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:42 PM
I hear what you're saying, but unfortunately, we need the businesses to recover and start making money and creating jobs again before we can start to recover, that is why corporate tax is being dropped and the grants for small and new businesses are being protected.

When business booms, so does everything else.

We'll all feel it a little bit, yes, now is the time to save not spend. Labour made it too easy and gave banks too much license to give people massive credit. No need to go back far to remember what happened with Northern Rock!

It's very unfortunate, but it's a case of us all having to take a short term hit in order to help the country get back on its feet.

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:44 PM
I hear what you're saying, but unfortunately, we need the businesses to recover and start making money and creating jobs again before we can start to recover, that is why corporate tax is being dropped and the grants for small and new businesses are being protected.

When business booms, so does everything else.

We'll all feel it a little bit, yes, now is the time to save not spend. Labour made it too easy and gave banks too much license to give people massive credit. No need to go back far to remember what happened with Northern Rock!

It's very unfortunate, but it's a case of us all having to take a short term hit in order to help the country get back on its feet.

Erm, I'm not arguing against that, I am agreeing with it.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:49 PM
We were told long before the election that public sector budgets were getting cut and that they were cutting the number of officers too.

My point was that, although the coalition have stopped projects and are getting rid of public sector workers, with Labour, more and more businesses were on the verge of collapsing. The coalition are trying to prevent this IMO.

Yes Nic...I think the Lib Dems have got a lot of their way in regards to the lower income households......who are getting a good deal from this. The higher your earnings, they more you'll pay, this budget is making that clearer which is a good thing in terms of fairness.

As for businesses on the verge of collapse...bang on, this budget is supporting business. The tax cuts for businesses will directly alow them too afford to keep people on and even create jobs.

Yes, it's a hit for public sector, but private sector have been hit for a good few years now. Start with the corporate regeneration and the rest will follow.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 12:49 PM
Erm, I'm not arguing against that, I am agreeing with it.

Wasn't aimed at you hun :-)

timwilky
22-06-10, 12:50 PM
So I need to work it out,

I will get an extra grand of tax free allowance, but they are not moving the higher rate threshold, so swings and roundabouts there for me. less 20% but more 40% tax to pay.

VAT, as a tax is strange. I like the idea of taxing expenditure rather than income. However, I fail to see how basic clothing can be considered a luxury. and strange rules about hot/cold food, dining in/out etc. cake or biscuit etc.


When the company I worked for found itself in a financial mess, we employees were forced to endure a pay freeze and restructuring to aid in the recovery. I see little difference in public sector employees having to endure similar when their employer is in financial poo

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 12:52 PM
Yes Nic...I think the Lib Dems have got a lot of their way in regards to the lower income households......who are getting a good deal from this. The higher your earnings, they more you'll pay, this budget is making that clearer which is a good thing in terms of fairness.

As for businesses on the verge of collapse...bang on, this budget is supporting business. The tax cuts for businesses will directly alow them too afford to keep people on and even create jobs.

Yes, it's a hit for public sector, but private sector have been hit for a good few years now. Start with the corporate regeneration and the rest will follow.

Exactly. And to be honest, the public sector cuts aren't anything like as bad as we thought they were going to be.

I think this has been damage limitation more than anything. No matter what they did, some jobs were going to be cut but I think doing it this way, they have minimised it as much as they can.

Wasn't aimed at you hun :-)

Start quoting things then!!!

Quedos
22-06-10, 12:57 PM
Yes, it's a hit for public sector, but private sector have been hit for a good few years now..

just a shame it won't hit the right people in public sector! we knew the cuts were coming but it devastating and its frontline services.

council supported to lower council tax?? is that for scotland too?

Biker Biggles
22-06-10, 12:59 PM
There is a massive gamble going on behind this budget,and that is the private sector reinvesting in Britain plc to produce economic growth well ahead of anything most people expect.Time will tell if it happens.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 01:02 PM
So I need to work it out,

I will get an extra grand of tax free allowance, but they are not moving the higher rate threshold, so swings and roundabouts there for me. less 20% but more 40% tax to pay.

VAT, as a tax is strange. I like the idea of taxing expenditure rather than income. However, I fail to see how basic clothing can be considered a luxury. and strange rules about hot/cold food, dining in/out etc. cake or biscuit etc.


When the company I worked for found itself in a financial mess, we employees were forced to endure a pay freeze and restructuring to aid in the recovery. I see little difference in public sector employees having to endure similar when their employer is in financial poo

Yep, hence my earlier post. I honestly don't think the impact will be felt as badly as we thought it might. As for VAT....I know, really strange. No VAT on school uniforms for kids....so are they going to create "work ranges" for adults so we don't have to pay VAT on our work clothes? It's nt like work is a luxury is it ;-)

just a shame it won't hit the right people in public sector! we knew the cuts were coming but it devastating and its frontline services.

council supported to lower council tax?? is that for scotland too?


Hmmm, I'm waiting on this one! I think we might be pleasantly surprised as much has been done in this budget to create fairness.

454697819
22-06-10, 01:03 PM
love the BBC website quote, bloke ranting about cutting the housing benifit to £400 "that will make thousands homeless" no you idiot its being capped at a £400 per week!

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 01:20 PM
love the BBC website quote, bloke ranting about cutting the housing benifit to £400 "that will make thousands homeless" no you idiot its being capped at a £400 per week!


Haha, I have to say, I loved what was said about this. At present, thanks to Labour, there are families getting £107,000 a year in housing benefit. This IS being scrapped.

The cap is there and will be means tested, as with all the benefits now to ensure that families are only placed in appropriately sized houses and I think the cap is more than generous. It means a family needing a 4 bed house couls almost afford a house like ours when they could easily get a 4 bed for half of that money.

It's not exactly going to have people living in poverty!

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 01:22 PM
Haha, I have to say, I loved what was said about this. At present, thanks to Labour, there are families getting £107,000 a year in housing benefit. This IS being scrapped.

The cap is there and will be means tested, as with all the benefits now to ensure that families are only placed in appropriately sized houses and I think the cap is more than generous. It means a family needing a 4 bed house couls almost afford a house like ours when they could easily get a 4 bed for half of that money.

It's not exactly going to have people living in poverty!

:smt103 WTFĴ!!! £107,000 a year....thats like 4 x my wage!!

Drew Carey
22-06-10, 01:26 PM
There is a massive gamble going on behind this budget,and that is the private sector reinvesting in Britain plc to produce economic growth well ahead of anything most people expect.Time will tell if it happens.

This is a very good point about this budget, in that labour were very much relying on EVERYONE spending more and getting the whole economy to improove. However, as has been seen accross Europe, this simply won't work in the current climate.......hence the need to do what the Concrats have done.

600+ - I know it seems worse, but probably would have been exactly what labour would have done in the long run anyway. Many European countries who were also happy to try the "spend our way out of debt" approach, which is easier for Joe Bloggs.....have now found it not to be sustainable. Hemce why this budget seems harsh, but is needed.

There is only one way to pay of debt in the long run, pay it back. I actually think this budget is one of the best in years. It effects everyone.....so rather than a few wealthy etc being better off, everyone will feel cuts. Plus, even though I work in Finance, the increase in CGT and the Banking Levy are long overdue.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 01:28 PM
Yep...there was a bit of heckling towards labour when that was said...lol. Not Labours finest moment! I think he said how many peoples income tax it took to equal that, but I don't remember the number. He just said that it was totally unacceptable and would not continue.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 01:30 PM
There is a massive gamble going on behind this budget,and that is the private sector reinvesting in Britain plc to produce economic growth well ahead of anything most people expect.Time will tell if it happens.

Yep. I have a good feeling about it though. I think that enough lessons have been learned lately to put the fear of god into the corporate world. Can't all be about number 1 anymore.

ophic
22-06-10, 01:31 PM
I will get an extra grand of tax free allowance, but they are not moving the higher rate threshold, so swings and roundabouts there for me. less 20% but more 40% tax to pay.
:smt017
How are you paying more 40% tax if the threshold is frozen? Unless you're talking about payrises.

anna
22-06-10, 01:32 PM
Well yes it could have been worse.

A cap on housing benifit though doesnt take into account the area of the country that the claimant is in. i.e London

Health to be cut by 25% not sure how that is going to be good.

Great news to increase the cap another £1000 for income tax is great for small business´s however, they arent the people that generally employee lots of others. (Still very good news for start ups).

But overall the most staggering thing here is that the debt is still not going to be touched during their term in government. The interest is still going to be going up, ok it is still a little less then previous government plans but, the whole reason of this emergency budget and their logic to bring this is in was to cut this debt. They have failed in this objection.

Im not sure that this budget is enough. They still havent told us where those cuts in the public and private sector are going to be .. I predict more bad news.

Swin
22-06-10, 01:38 PM
the cuts in the public sector are going to be announced October 20th - I think it was.

timwilky
22-06-10, 01:50 PM
:smt017
How are you paying more 40% tax if the threshold is frozen? Unless you're talking about payrises.

Exactly, as my salary increases, I will be paying a higher percentage at 40% as they have failed to increase the threshold in line with inflation etc.

Only one thing for it, I will have to throw more into my pension pot to reduce my taxable earnings. And let some one tax me on that if and when I finally get it.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 01:51 PM
Well yes it could have been worse.

A cap on housing benifit though doesnt take into account the area of the country that the claimant is in. i.e London

Health to be cut by 25% not sure how that is going to be good.

Great news to increase the cap another £1000 for income tax is great for small business´s however, they arent the people that generally employee lots of others. (Still very good news for start ups).

But overall the most staggering thing here is that the debt is still not going to be touched during their term in government. The interest is still going to be going up, ok it is still a little less then previous government plans but, the whole reason of this emergency budget and their logic to bring this is in was to cut this debt. They have failed in this objection.

Im not sure that this budget is enough. They still havent told us where those cuts in the public and private sector are going to be .. I predict more bad news.


Nope, this term won't see the debt being touched much, but it is a very delicate balance that needs to be found to prevent further recession. It will be dne eventually but I have always said and always believed that very little can happen in one term anyway. Any government needs at least 2 terms to be able to realise the strategies.

Problem we have with this government though is that it's a coalition, so who knows what's going to happen.

As for the housing benefits cap...it's perfectly acceptable IMO to put a family that needs it into a 4 bed house/flat in areas like London for £1,600 a month.

I think you're right though. This was his first budget, so not surprising that it's not too horrible. Lots yet to be announced and that's where it will get worse if it's going to.

rowdy
22-06-10, 01:53 PM
I love the outrage on 20%vat - howmany people felt the change from 15% to 17.5% - its going to be the same again - besides its lower than Ireland and other places. Yes its effectively means that we're going to pay more.
We've got a pay freeze for two years - Oh joys - so that will totall probably excess of £10k drop for me in the past 5 years
Everyone felt the increase on VAT the last time and they will again this time.
My wife has a VAT registered business, when your paying the inland revenue approx 4 grand every three months for a small business with a relatively low annual turnover, and this goes up by around £500 or so every quarter, then yes, it is quite noticable.
There are many small business that just manage to stay afloat as it is.

timwilky
22-06-10, 01:53 PM
As for the cap of £400/week on a 4 bedroom house, you could get mortgage repayments of far less than that round here for a 5 bedroom house.

So simples, move the housing benefit claimants out of expensive houses. The landlords either find private tenants willing to pay extortionate rents or lower their rents to what the the public purse is willing to pay.

ophic
22-06-10, 01:54 PM
Exactly, as my salary increases, I will be paying a higher percentage at 40% as they have failed to increase the threshold in line with inflation etc.

Only one thing for it, I will have to throw more into my pension pot to reduce my taxable earnings. And let some one tax me on that if and when I finally get it.
Ta. Thought I might have majorly missed something there. I don't think I'm going to be overly concerned about payrises in the immediate future :(

thulfi
22-06-10, 02:00 PM
pfft, yeh good one tories.

They've already axed NHS waiting list targets, set by Labour for people to be see a GP within 48hours, and a specialist within 18 weeks of their referral. They're also gonna axe the maximum 4-hour wait to be seen when you go into A&E.

But then again they all probably have private health care, so no loss to them eh!

anna
22-06-10, 02:04 PM
Nope, this term won't see the debt being touched much, but it is a very delicate balance that needs to be found to prevent further recession. It will be dne eventually but I have always said and always believed that very little can happen in one term anyway. Any government needs at least 2 terms to be able to realise the strategies.

Problem we have with this government though is that it's a coalition, so who knows what's going to happen.

As for the housing benefits cap...it's perfectly acceptable IMO to put a family that needs it into a 4 bed house/flat in areas like London for £1,600 a month.

I think you're right though. This was his first budget, so not surprising that it's not too horrible. Lots yet to be announced and that's where it will get worse if it's going to.

I appreciate the balance of the economy, but this government has already proven that it doesnt fully appreciate this when they cut the budget for forgemasters.

I dont really understand the concern in the fact that you now have a coalition, some of the best things in this budget were brought about because of the lib deb influences here.

I perhaps jumped at the housing benifit a little too soon and after looking up London house for rent prices I think your right a house in london is a reasonable price at that amount, but other parts of the country are weighted at the same amount.

ophic
22-06-10, 02:05 PM
pfft, yeh good one tories.

They've already axed NHS waiting list targets, set by Labour for people to be see a GP within 48hours, and a specialist within 18 weeks of their referral. They're also gonna axe the maximum 4-hour wait to be seen when you go into A&E.

But then again they all probably have private health care, so no loss to them eh!
No point having targets when no-one can meet them. 18 weeks to be seen by a specialist? That's already a ridiculously long time. On the flip side, if a major emergency has just happened, 4 hours in A&E with a minor injury is totally reasonable.

Owenski
22-06-10, 02:07 PM
When the company I worked for found itself in a financial mess, we employees were forced to endure a pay freeze and restructuring to aid in the recovery. I see little difference in public sector employees having to endure similar when their employer is in financial poo

Bingo IMO Tim!

Over a year ago I went down to 4 days, (so took a 20% pay cut). A month or so ago a meeting was held and it was decided that we could all;
a, Have our jobs 5 days a week at full pay for a couple of months bleed the company dry and all be out of jobs in a few months.
or
b, come back to work for 5days to be able to take on more work but remain on the 20% reduced salary...

So.... I'm not 20% a year worse off than I was a year ago, I dont see that happening to many teachers/bobbie. MissOwenski is a teacher btw so dont think I'm picking fights with anyone Im just stating that Tim's spot on.

Side note/rant: Pi55es me off that I've been careful with money. I've no credit card no loans etc my only dept is a mortgage which been a homeowner at 25 is a given. So I've not got many "nice" things, no LCD telly, I dont even have a car, for me it was either the bike or a car, not get a loan and do both.
Now because every norman and his wife tried keeping up with the Jones' and got a visa so they could get thier telly, get thier 2nd car and take a holiday.
Its f'kin muggins here thats got to pay increased taxes to pay back the money they couldnt afford to. Sickens me.

timwilky
22-06-10, 02:09 PM
So what is wrong with prioritising on need instead of making the urgent wait because other non urgent cases that have been waiting now have priority. Seemed a bit daft.

As for A&E. Most of the problems their are because the public are now treating it as an alternative to their GP practice and turning up with non A&E complaints expecting treatment.

thulfi
22-06-10, 02:13 PM
No point having targets when no-one can meet them. 18 weeks to be seen by a specialist? That's already a ridiculously long time. On the flip side, if a major emergency has just happened, 4 hours in A&E with a minor injury is totally reasonable.

Yeh 18 weeks is long, but they can (in general)be met. All that's gonna happen now is some people won't be seen for 40-50 weeks. Regardless of your problem, that's too long for anyone.

4 hours in A&E is reasonable. Without a target though, people will be waiting much longer. Doctors acknowledge that target are good and help people get seen quicker.

Luckypants
22-06-10, 02:13 PM
Everyone felt the increase on VAT the last time and they will again this time.
My wife has a VAT registered business, when your paying the inland revenue approx 4 grand every three months for a small business with a relatively low annual turnover, and this goes up by around £500 or so every quarter, then yes, it is quite noticable.
There are many small business that just manage to stay afloat as it is.

You only pay over VAT that you have charged. If your wife's business has 'relatively low' annual turnover, then she should be on the 'cash accounting scheme' whereby you pay the Revenue only VAT you have been paid. If she is on the invoiced VAT system (not sure what it is called) then yes, she may notice a lag where she is funding increased VAT payments before the money comes in off invoices, but this is intended for large VAT concerns which your wife's business should not be.

In general business just acts as unpaid collectors of VAT for the Revenue and only pays what it has charged (less what it has paid out in VAT) it's clients. It has minimal effect on cash-flow, unless of course you forget to save the VAT collected...

thulfi
22-06-10, 02:15 PM
So what is wrong with prioritising on need instead of making the urgent wait because other non urgent cases that have been waiting now have priority. Seemed a bit daft.

No that's not true. Urgent referrals are always urgent referrals, regardless of whose been waiting for how long.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 02:20 PM
I appreciate the balance of the economy, but this government has already proven that it doesnt fully appreciate this when they cut the budget for forgemasters.

I dont really understand the concern in the fact that you now have a coalition, some of the best things in this budget were brought about because of the lib deb influences here.

I perhaps jumped at the housing benifit a little too soon and after looking up London house for rent prices I think your right a house in london is a reasonable price at that amount, but other parts of the country are weighted at the same amount.

The concern over the coalistion is what will happen in the next general election? I think, as I said before that a government needs more than one term to make a difference. If this coalition government gets 2 terms, great, but it's up to the country and the lib dems & tories to decide if they'll do that.

And yes...without going and looking for it, one of my posts definitely credits the Lim Dems in this budget. I said that I think they have had a massive influence on the protection of the lower income families.

rowdy
22-06-10, 02:29 PM
You only pay over VAT that you have charged. If your wife's business has 'relatively low' annual turnover, then she should be on the 'cash accounting scheme' whereby you pay the Revenue only VAT you have been paid. If she is on the invoiced VAT system (not sure what it is called) then yes, she may notice a lag where she is funding increased VAT payments before the money comes in off invoices, but this is intended for large VAT concerns which your wife's business should not be.

In general business just acts as unpaid collectors of VAT for the Revenue and only pays what it has charged (less what it has paid out in VAT) it's clients. It has minimal effect on cash-flow, unless of course you forget to save the VAT collected...
Personally, I don't really know the workings of it, but my wifes business is a hairdressers, so unless she increases prices every time there is a VAT increase she will feel the difference, and two fold as well as she is paying higher prices for the stock that she buys.

Edit; She has only just put the price up recently to cover the last VAT increase.

EssexDave
22-06-10, 02:32 PM
Personally, I don't really know the workings of it, but my wifes business is a hairdressers, so unless she increases prices every time there is a VAT increase she will feel the difference, and two fold as well as she is paying higher prices for the stock that she buys.



You can claim back the VAT you pay for business expenses..

rowdy
22-06-10, 02:35 PM
You can claim back the VAT you pay for business expenses..
You can claim some VAT back for business expenses, the 4 grand a quarter mentioned earlier is the VAT bill recieved from inland rev after the accountant has sent all the relevant reciepts etc for VAT reduction.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 02:58 PM
Personally, I don't really know the workings of it, but my wifes business is a hairdressers, so unless she increases prices every time there is a VAT increase she will feel the difference, and two fold as well as she is paying higher prices for the stock that she buys.

Edit; She has only just put the price up recently to cover the last VAT increase.

She should be claiming back the VAT on expenses and there are ways to ensure that your wife can keep prices the same by cutting on overheads. Just have to get savvy for a while. Now is the time to reassess all the suppliers, shop around for alternatives that will offer a better deal.

Find a USP (Unique Selling Point) for the Salon. Come up with some new offers for clients.

Your wife could look into studying part time (some tax relief may come from that too) and start producing her own products for the salon and even selling them externally.

Sounds crazy, but an ex marine that Dan knows was stationed out on an oil rig after leaving the forces I think. He was bored, so did an OU degree in chemistry and when he got home, started producing hair products in his conservatory. He's now a millionnaire and his products are sold in Harrods and all over America.

Where there's a will, there's a way.

punyXpress
22-06-10, 03:08 PM
[QUOTE=anna;2302195]I appreciate the balance of the economy, but this government has already proven that it doesnt fully appreciate this when they cut the budget for forgemasters.

So, the previous P.M. promised to give Forgemasters a loan when he didn't have the cash?It's amazing, but predicatable, to see the usual suspects threatening strikes etc when it is THEIR MAN who caused so much of the problem!

Dave20046
22-06-10, 04:31 PM
I'm not pregnant , I don't buy things and I work for a private company...have I dodged the bullets?

yorkie_chris
22-06-10, 06:40 PM
The way I see it MBK is that with Labour more people had a job! This means they could pay tax and less were on the doll!

The increase in spending was a must to keep the GB market going.

Bare in mind that people without a job will become depressed!! Remember from history the Thatcher years? And I say from history as we are not that old to have lived through it.

I personally prefer to have a job and a house and pay higher taxes than no job, no house and higher taxes.

A completely unnatural state of affairs though,

It is better to have a million people on the dole at £50/wk than working for the council and adding no value to Great Britain for £300/wk.

completely goes against all principals of the creation of wealth.

dizzyblonde
22-06-10, 06:46 PM
I'm moving to France.

That is all.

Bluefish
22-06-10, 07:06 PM
Bingo

Side note/rant: Pi55es me off that I've been careful with money. I've no credit card no loans etc my only dept is a mortgage which been a homeowner at 25 is a given. So I've not got many "nice" things, no LCD telly, I dont even have a car, for me it was either the bike or a car, not get a loan and do both.
Now because every norman and his wife tried keeping up with the Jones' and got a visa so they could get thier telly, get thier 2nd car and take a holiday.
Its f'kin muggins here thats got to pay increased taxes to pay back the money they couldnt afford to. Sickens me.

Oi, i have a car bike both bought with loans a mortgage, and overdraughts, and another loan, and i have been paying them religiously for years, in fact on the 10th of next month one of the loans finishes that costs 378 quid a month, i don't think you are paying for those. Imo most of these depts were from the tossers that thought buy to let was a good idea and when they couldn't afford the repayments just went bankrupt, so there :smt071. Ps i have an Lcd tele as well.

yorkie_chris
22-06-10, 07:08 PM
Actually that's fine too, because then the bank owns and resells the collateral (the house!)

Problem comes from 100%+ mortgages and unsecured loans.

Bluefish
22-06-10, 07:10 PM
Actually that's fine too, because then the bank owns and resells the collateral (the house!)

Problem comes from 100%+ mortgages and unsecured loans.

Yeah but usually at a loss.

yorkie_chris
22-06-10, 07:14 PM
So lose £20,000 due to a drop in house prices and theoretically an interest only 100% mortgage.

Far better than losing £30,000 from somebody who did not pay his credit card bill from shagging hookers in Thailand!

timwilky
22-06-10, 07:23 PM
According to the BBC calculator I will be £208 worse off. However my wife will be £296 better off.

Should she sub me what the government have ripped me for.


then of course everything costs 2.5% more as well. Thank you Mr Osbourne I do like paying for others excess.

dizzyblonde
22-06-10, 07:25 PM
Debts(ie cards, mortgages and loans) that are managed correctly are of no concern to anyone but the people who have them.
I've owned my home since 23 mr Owenski, I have lived a single parent for 8 years, have worked full time, paid my taxes like anyone else, have had credit cards, loans etc too. However I am the only accountant of the house and therefore manage my house affairs down to the smallest detail, I do not live beyond my means, yes I have had tax credits in the past, but haven't had them since Peg moved in, even though we are entitled.

You cannot blame the public for spending lots of money, its the banks etc that have lent so freely to those who shouldn't be having loans, cards and mortgages without cutting their throats financially, and the banks have known this.

Oh and I don't want a fall in house prices, or I won't move to France, and live like a hermit, swig wine, and wave sticks like a senile old boot in comfort without being put away for being mad!

Bluefish
22-06-10, 07:42 PM
So lose £20,000 due to a drop in house prices and theoretically an interest only 100% mortgage.

Far better than losing £30,000 from somebody who did not pay his credit card bill from shagging hookers in Thailand!

Hey i have never been to Thailand. ;)

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 08:04 PM
Bluefishman.....the problem is not with people that have credit and make all the payments, it's with people that have credit with everyone that will give it to them and don't make payments. The government has to step in and help.

You've seen all the adverts for wiping out 75% of your debt......the minimum debt to qualify for this is £15,000 and just going on how many of these companies advertise gives an idea of how many people there are in the UK that are wiping out 75% of debts worth more than £15,000. That adds up to a lot of money.

Unfortunately, there are to many people that almost need to live in a nanny state as they have zero self control.....and we good people end up paying for their greed and the bankers irresponsible lending.

Bluefish
22-06-10, 08:20 PM
Yeah i know GG, i am bombarded with emails phone calls etc about wiping out all my depts, doesn't tell you though that they will take your house car and bike to settle as much dept as they can, fair doos if you're going down that road, but i want that stuff otherwise i wouldn't have bought it in the first place, so you have to pay for it. I could have written of all my dept ages ago and may have been better off for doing it now, ie jumped on the band wagon, however it is a matter of principal, you borrow you pay it back no matter how long it takes. I can now see the light at the end of the tunnel, probobly another train coming, lol.

punyXpress
22-06-10, 08:22 PM
AR11 at yours, then dizzyblonde?
'tis time there was an away match.

dizzyblonde
22-06-10, 08:22 PM
Just to be pedantic a few keep posting the word 'dept' which is short for 'department', its DEBT ;-)

yorkie_chris
22-06-10, 08:36 PM
Unfortunately, there are to many people that almost need to live in a nanny state as they have zero self control.....and we good people end up paying for their greed and the bankers irresponsible lending.

A nanny state is nowhere near the same thing as banks with a modicum of restraint!

A nanny state requires far more tax to administer all the BS and encourages borrowing, whereas a more liberal state would encourage personal responsibility.

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 08:40 PM
A nanny state is nowhere near the same thing as banks with a modicum of restraint!

A nanny state requires far more tax to administer all the BS and encourages borrowing, whereas a more liberal state would encourage personal responsibility.

It was a general "some people are incapable of responsibility" statement Chris...not a serious one :D

yorkie_chris
22-06-10, 08:46 PM
Aye but with the same general attitude if there was less government meddling then people would not expect to be pulled out of the clinging sh*t puddle of their own stupidity!

What's the phrase... "just because you can, doesn't mean you should".

Milky Bar Kid
22-06-10, 08:47 PM
Just to be pedantic a few keep posting the word 'dept' which is short for 'department', its DEBT ;-)

That was bugging me too!!:smt071

gruntygiggles
22-06-10, 08:51 PM
Aye but with the same general attitude if there was less government meddling then people would not expect to be pulled out of the clinging sh*t puddle of their own stupidity!

What's the phrase... "just because you can, doesn't mean you should".


Agreed, but make them pay for it, not us.

If you have to go on an IVA, fine, but when you earn a certain amount again.....you should have to pay it back. Students get money from the govt. but they have to pay it all back.

Oh and this " clinging sh*t puddle of their own stupidity" is just the best phrase ever! :-)

Bluefish
22-06-10, 10:32 PM
That was bugging me too!!:smt071


Sorry girls :(

Triv650
22-06-10, 11:34 PM
As a young man looking to go into public sector employment, the budget is gonna hit me hard when I find a proper job.