SV650 99-01 Fork Emulators - these look like a good deal

[SVGeorge]

Hello All,
Years since I posted here so good to see SV650.org is alive & well. I have had the SV since new in 99 and now it needs a front end overhaul - steering head bearing, fork seals + oil change, caliper seals.
Stripped the forks last night and started thinking of fitting racetech emulators while I have them apart (already have done the racetech spring upgrade) and found this when googling http://forum.svrider.com/showthread.php?t=112643 which seems to suggest that these emulators are very similar, drop in fit and much cheaper ($65 delivered to Dublin) http://www.debrix.com/41mm-Fork-Damper-Valve-2000-up-Harley-FXST-Softail-p/24-0361-vt.htm.
Anyone on this forum heard of them or fitted them? I have ordered as it seems from the svrider.conm thread they will work ok.
SVGeorge

[mikerj]

Yep!

http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=144722

[SVGeorge]

Hello All,
I have received the emulators and now need to rebuild the forks - I don't have instructions for fitting the emulators but here is what I think I need to do - bearing in mind I already have the racetech spring setup & just need to add the emulators:
*Drill out the existing 4 larger holes in the damper rod to 11mm (I gather racetech say to drill 2 extra holes but from what I see in posts a lot of owners just drill the existing holes to a larger diameter)
*Block off the very small hole in top of the damper rod
*Set the emulator to 2 turns preload
*Cut the spacer by the amount the emulator adds to the overall length (I guess this is only a small cut)
*Use 20wt fork oil (I can't remember what I used when I upgraded the springs but I think I have seen posts that say 20wt should be used for '99 SV's when using emulators?)
*Fork Oil level = 125mm with the emulators in, spring+spacer+washers not fitted
*The "Bottom out cone" or "Oil lock piece" - the white plastic coneshaped fitting at the bottom of the damper rod - I see a post on svrider.com re fitting Traxxion emulator kit that this piece should be removed. Anyone know the score on removing it?

Have I got the list right or am I missing anything?

Thanks,
George

[johnnyrod]

Right about drilling, don't bother blocking the rebound hole. Emulator is about an inch high so not much to cut off the spacer tube, just make sure it's a good square cut and they are equal. Yes to the preload, with a daft 193/425ths or whatever Imperial size Allen key. Just be careful seating the bolt - the spring is very soft so you have to watch carefully for when the little bolt has no more slack in it, because you won't feel it by hand and you'll end up with them set differently because of this. 20W is a bit heavy but fine I guess. Oil level I thought was 105mm, compressed, emulator in but no spring, it's in the manual anyway. I've never taken the lock piece out, can't see why you would.

[mikerj]

I would certainly leave the lock piece in place, this part stops your forks viciously bottoming out when fully compressed. Someone mentioned what a pain this part was to re-assemble, but on the pointy at least it was very simple; put the damper rod into the fork tube and temporarily install the spring, spacers and cap and you can then put the lock piece on the end of the damper rod and slide the alloy fork lowers over the assembly and bolt it up. Takes seconds.

As JR suggests, have the emulator in place but springs removed when measuring oil height. The allen key is 9/64" I think, no standard metric size key will fit and it's also not a common size to find in standard AF key sets unfortunately. I found a very cheap (and nasty) set of allen keys in a plastic roll I bought in my teens that just happened to have the right size. About time the Yanks embraced the metric system really :D

Personally I did block up the rebound hole, but then again I'm using 15W oil at the moment (not one bike shop in Plymouth stocked 20W!).

[SVGeorge]

Thanks for the reply & good tips.

I think you are right about the 105mm oil level for standard (I will check the manual) but I thought the level changed when you fitted different springs? Where I got the 125mm from was this write up on fitting the Traxxion kit http://forum.svrider.com/showthread.php?t=78075
"Use the following guidance depending on the model and year of your motorcycle:
’99-’02 SV650 Suzuki using 35x340mm springs – 125 mm
‘99-’02 SV650 Suzuki using 35x270 OMNI springs – 105 mm
’03-’06 SV650 Suzuki using 35x270 OMNI springs – 110 mm
’06 EX650 Kawasaki using 35x270 OMNI springs & OEM Fork Cap – 105mm
’06 EX650 Kawasaki using 35x270 OMNI springs & Traxxion Fork Cap – 115mm"

The Racetech springs I have are 35x340mm linears. The same link says you should take the lock piece out but maybe that is specific to Traxxion except I thought Traxxion kits were essentially damper rod supplied so should be same fitting intructions.
What do you reckon? Does the oil level stay same as standard when you have Racetech springs? Now that you mention it, I still have the original instructions for the fitting the Racetech springs and they assume you are not changing the oil so basically take the original spring+spacer out, drop in the new spring+spacer & no instruction to change the oil level.

Also what would you recommend on oil wt - Should I go for 15wt instead of 20wt?

George

[SVGeorge]

The allen key is 9/64" I think, no standard metric size key will fit and it's also not a common size to find in standard AF key sets unfortunately.
If I can't get the correct allen, can I adjust using a small long nose vicegrips on the knurled outside edge of the adjuster?\George

[yorkie_chris]

I would certainly leave the lock piece in place, this part stops your forks viciously bottoming out when fully compressed.

But you get 25mm extra travel.
If you going to set it up for perfection in braking then take it out. I bypass them and put big O ring in bottom of forks to soften bump a little bit, it works fine. Metal-metal bottoming, on occasion, does not do much harm.


You should close rebound hole. The forks need all the help they can get in rebound.

[johnnyrod]

So the stanchion bottom thumps into the plastic bit (lock piece) at full compression? Also what do you reckon on oil level?

[yorkie_chris]

yeah that's how it works.

Oil level is tuning parameter. 125mm is a good start. You want it to be as low as possible without bottoming much.

[johnnyrod]

Cool ta. Usualy story of must get thumb out and set things right... George, do it, the emulators feel loads better than the stock setup. I think I tried 4 turns on the emulator but it was a bit harsh so went back to 2 or 3. If you don't have fork-top preload adjuster caps then this is a good time to put them on as you need to shorten the space tube for them too. They're not essential but make life easier. They are pretty much essential if you buy progressive springs...

[mikerj]

But you get 25mm extra travel.

That's a fair point, in which case the OP would need to make sure his fork tubes are in good condition 25mm further up from the normal end point - they often start to pit above the wiped area.

[mikerj]

So the stanchion bottom thumps into the plastic bit (lock piece) at full compression? Also what do you reckon on oil level?

The plastic bit is tapered so as the bottom of the fork tube approaches it you get rapidly increasing damping over a small amount of travel until it hydraulically locks. It's still quite harsh if if it does bottom, but not as bad as solid metal-metal contact.

[yorkie_chris]

Worth noting that is rapidly increasing damping both ways. So once you're into the oil lock, it's harder to get out of it than if you'd just gone down another 10mm say.

[SVGeorge]

Hello all again,
Thanks for all the useful tips - only thing I am not sure is oil wt - I was going for 20wt based on other posts I had searched but now not so sure if it might be too heavy. I am 14st on '99 curvy with Racetect linears + will be adding emulators - any thoughts on oil wt?\George

[yorkie_chris]

Depends on brand, some 20w is heavier than others.
http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm

What springs?

[SVGeorge]

Springs are Racetech linears .85

[yorkie_chris]

Bit light for you IMO. Try some 15w, what brands do you have available? I would go 15w for putoline.

[SVGeorge]

Decided on 15wt in the end - Rock Oil from Megabike.ie in Dublin.

Hope to finish polishing the forks + mod the damper + re-assemble this evening.
George

[SVGeorge]

When I was putting it all back together I realised the bushings looked a bit worn and there seems to be a pit of play between the leg & slider. It was only when I double checked the manual that I saw the bushes are teflon coated & if they are worn down so you can see the metal surface it means they are worn and need to be replaced.

So decided to order new ones from Fowlers in Bristol and will fit these before I re-assemble - a bit of a delay but better to do the job properly while the whole front end is stripped.

George

[SVGeorge]

Hello all,
Finally got it all back together a couple of nights ago and front end feels good - haven't really pushed it yet as am just getting used to being back in the saddle after a long lay off but front end definitely feels a lot better - a combo of new steering head bearings, internal fork bushings, new fork oil + emulators.

Now I just need to overhaul the calipers which is what I set out to do before it ended up in almost a full front end overhaul!

Thanks again to all the SV650.org support team.\George

[johnnyrod]

No problem. When you ride over roads that look like someone has been at them with a cheese grater you'll really feel the difference!