View Full Version : Newbie Hi, and braided lines question
Hi everyone, just joined yesterday and haven't been able to stop searching through threads since! Some great help and advice on here. I'm not a great one for fiddling with too much on the bike, but hopefully I can contribute somewhere along the line, although I know I'm going to get more out of this than I can ever put in!
I've searched through some threads regarding braided lines, but there didn't seem to be too many recent ones so hopefully you won't mind if I ask again.
I'm considering fitting HEL or Goodridge lines to my pointy K6, but do you think it will make much difference to stopping power?
I have the adjuster set to 1 on the brake lever and it's still coming in too close to the bar for comfort. I figure I probably need the lines bled and new fluid, so might as well upgrade the lines while I'm at it.
Does anyone know if there's any difference between the 2 manufacturers?
Thanks in advance,
Dave.
barwel1992
06-08-10, 04:59 PM
goodridge are expensive and HEL are just as good in my opinion but for less, have HEL lines on my front brakes (not sv brakes) and make a pretty noticeable difference over the standard spongy things.
ohh and it sounds like your brakes need bleeding any way so you might as well get some braided lines
dizzyblonde
06-08-10, 05:06 PM
I have Goodridge hoses on one SV and Hel on the other. Both are equally as good as the other. Either are much better than the old stock hoses that bend like yer elbows when you pull on the lever! Have a look over your clocks down the front and do it....you'll see what I mean if they are ready for renewal:-)
Shall be replacing my Raptor lines at some point, even though they come with braided as standard, they're a bit plop.
BTW I do have a braided rear line on one SV, have to take slight more care on the old foot on that one, but you soon get to not be too heavy, as it can be a bit sharp!
Yea the cable does bounce a bit, was looking at that the other day. Swapped bikes with a mate for a run last week - I knew my brakes were bad, but he got off my bike white as a sheet, all he said to me was 'brakes!'
Thanks for the info. much appreciated. Looks like HEL at the dealers then....
hardhat_harry
06-08-10, 05:34 PM
I prefer Venhill ones personally with detacheable banjos
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stainless-steel-braided-brake-lines-100-800mm-VENHILL-/180538274131?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2a08eb7153
I prefer Venhill ones personally with detacheable banjos
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stainless-steel-braided-brake-lines-100-800mm-VENHILL-/180538274131?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2a08eb7153
Wow, nice price :D - I'll have to look into this a bit deeper then....!
Thanks again.
hardhat_harry
06-08-10, 05:52 PM
They do kits for bikes too so you don't need to measure the lines just ask for an SV kit.
They are being used by a few race teams in the BSB paddock as I found out when I was wandering round the garages at Oulton.
Sid Squid
06-08-10, 09:22 PM
Braided hoses are much of a much, they're all better than knackered standard hoses, buy the ones that suit your pocket/you like the sticker that comes with them the best.
As to whether they will make much difference to stopping power, the answer is a definate maybe.
If your bike's brakes have not received attention since they were constructed they may be suffering from ailments other than hose degradation. A common problem can be as simple as fluid that's past its best, it's often found when fitting new lines that the brakes improve, but, in a significant number of cases, all that was required was the new fluid that will obviously be used when the hoses are fitted. But this seems to pass many people's appreciation by.
Also the brake calipers themselves can become gunged up, the SV uses low tech, (relatively), sliding calipers, unless these move smoothly the brakes can be very spongey and won't perform well, the pistons can get stuck and the outer seals are well known for getting stuck in the gunge on the pistons and get dragged out of their grooves. Are the pads good? if they and the discs are not perfectly clean braking power will be seriously affected, rub a finger over the disc face lightly, black gungey stuff on your finger? That's between the pads and disc that is - not conducive to good braking. Clean out the holes in the discs too - they fill up with the gunk and are a surprisingly useful reservoir for said muck - causing a constant supply of goo to make a very slidy paste when combined with rainwater. If the pads are very contaminated often replacement is the only effective remedy, even if they're not worn out.
I'm not suggesting against replacement of the hoses, but bear in mind there is much that can be amiss that won't be addressed by new hoses.
Suzuki recommend periodic replacement of all the rubber parts of the system, hoses included, and by the time four or more years have passed the lines will not be at their best, but if you're on a tight budget changing the fluid, (if it's never been changed of course), and cleaning the calipers, discs and pads, (if they're not perfectly clean), will make a big difference for a minimal outlay.
Hi Sid, I did clean the discs before a trip to Silverstone last weekend for the WSB, but I have to admit it was more of a cursory wipe. The brakes did seem to get worse throughout the trip, so maybe it helped immediately but I didn't get enough of the gunge out to make a lasting difference. I'm not technical/confident enough to remove the calipers to clean them and the pads though.
I think I'll leave it into the dealers to get the lines changed, and they'll have to do the fluid anyway. I'll be sure to ask them to clean the calipers and pads too.
Thanks for the great advice, it's comforting to know people will help you out if you ask the right questions.
Spanner Man
07-08-10, 06:11 AM
Good morning all.
Ditto Sid's advice on caliper maintenance.
There's little to chose between the makes of braided hoses on the market.
However, HEL often get it wrong when it comes to length, & have been known on more than one occasion to send out a pair of 'skipping ropes' or ones that are way too short.
I have my hoses made by a local Automotive plumbing specialist. However, the Venhill ones with detachable banjos are very good, & they also allow you to get the orientation of the bajos spot on, & the curve of the hose away from the fork legs, & mudguard etc.
Cheers.
warrenhewitt10
07-08-10, 07:27 AM
cdtrim are you from belfast in NI? im just up the road in carrick :) nice to see someone else from this side of the pond here lol
Wow, nice price :D - I'll have to look into this a bit deeper then....!
Thanks again.
Careful, that is a single brake line with no banjos or banjo bolts - you will have to pay more than that for something you can actually bolt on and use.
You can get a full set of HEL with stainless fittings from Banditmania for about £75 delivered if you get in touch with them and use the SV650 forum 10% discount.
cdtrim are you from belfast in NI? im just up the road in carrick :) nice to see someone else from this side of the pond here lol
Hi Warren, I'm from Glengormley but sometimes online it's easier to say Belfast as most people know where that is! :D Thanks for the welcome!
You can get a full set of HEL with stainless fittings from Banditmania for about £75 delivered if you get in touch with them and use the SV650 forum 10% discount.
Hi Rob, thanks for this - is there anything I need to do to be able to use the discount?
There's a garage just up the road who was mentioned in the Rider Power survey as a favourite independent garage, maybe I'll take the bike up to him and see what his thoughts are too. As I've said before in this thread I'm not confident enough with brakes to try this myself - although I might be able to find someone who will fit the lines if I buy them separately.
Gotta go and clean my discs properly first though......
Thanks again to everyone for their help and advice.
I think you have to call them and order over the phone and mention that your an SV650.org member. heres a link to the page http://www.sv650.org/www_sv650_org%20-%20banditmania%20offer.htm
barwel1992
07-08-10, 01:12 PM
my HEL lines were only £35 from M&P (for the fronts)
Only ones that i can see on there at the moment is goodridge and there £69.99 for the front set (standard 3 line set) for a SV
barwel1992
07-08-10, 02:03 PM
LINK (http://www.mandp.co.uk/productinfo/571268/Braking/Brake-lines/Hel) two line set up £40 + what ever delivery is
just state the model when paying thats how i got my black tuono lines
Still £60 for the 3 part setup and £20 for the back one. Plus whatever postage is. Do they come with plastic sleeving it doesn't mention it on the site? am i right in thinking the standard set up for the SV is 3 lines at the front?
Still £60 for the 3 part setup and £20 for the back one. Plus whatever postage is. Do they come with plastic sleeving it doesn't mention it on the site? am i right in thinking the standard set up for the SV is 3 lines at the front?
Yea 3 lines seems to be the standard - one from the lever to the splitter, one from the splitter straight to the right hand caliper, then one from the splitter round the back of the mudguard to the left hand caliper. I've heard that the 2 line race kits are better with one complete line going to each caliper, but surely there's a splitter somewhere as only one line comes out of the lever?
There's also a small hose from the lever to the brake fluid reservoir, would this stay as rubber even if I got the lines changed to braided?
Sorry about the orientation of the pic, couldn't seem to get it right when using the preview post option!
barwel1992
07-08-10, 06:20 PM
Still £60 for the 3 part setup and £20 for the back one. Plus whatever postage is. Do they come with plastic sleeving it doesn't mention it on the site? am i right in thinking the standard set up for the SV is 3 lines at the front?
why would you want the 3 part ? and the back is pointless
... but surely there's a splitter somewhere as only one line comes out of the lever?
There's also a small hose from the lever to the brake fluid reservoir, would this stay as rubber.
With the two line set up you'll get a double banjo bolt so you can fit both lines to the master cylinder (at the lever).
The hose from your reservoir doesn't need to be anything fancy as it's just providing fluid to the master cyclinder - it's not under pressure.
Sid Squid
07-08-10, 06:43 PM
Does your bike have a single piece front brake line? If yes, you'll see only one banjo connection at each caliper and the master cylinder. Also you'll notice that the lines on the piece you refer to as the 'splitter' are not demountable, it is essentially a lengthy 'Tee' piece. If this is the case with your bike a three piece front line will not be readily usable. There is no splitter in the ordinary sense, which is a tube threaded at both ends into one end of which a short upper line from the master cylinder and a line to one caliper is fitted, and at the other end is a line to the second caliper.
Replacements most commonly are two lines, and will either be one line to each caliper direct from the master cylinder, or, as in my preferred layout, one from the master cylinder to a caliper and another short line linking the calipers together. Neither works better, I just find the latter a neater system.
There's also a small hose from the lever to the brake fluid reservoir, would this stay as rubber even if I got the lines changed to braided?
Yes, that hose simply carries the fluid, (under gravity), the short distance from the reservoir to the master cylinder itself, this is not a pressurised line and does not affect brake operation*.
*Well, if you didn't connect it, the fluid you put in the reservoir would wee all over your bike, but short of doing something daft like that it doesn't affect brake operation :D.
why would you want the 3 part ? and the back is pointless
I'm not saying i want the 3 part setup i haven't looked into what i want properly yet, just thought that standard was 3 lines at the front. I'll probably change the back aswell as the hose looks a little scruffy now and if i'm changing the front i might as well do the whole lot. I'd be changing the fluid in the back anyway so the only extra work really is bleeding the back.
Sid Squid
07-08-10, 08:14 PM
Standard on Curvy front is three seperate lines.
Standard on Pointy front is one piece, three end line.
Replacement front usually two pieces, either double banjo at master cylinder and one line to each caliper, or one line to right caliper with double banjo, and short line across mudguard to left caliper, (IMO neatest system).
Standard on Curvy front is three seperate lines.
Standard on Pointy front is one piece, three end line.
Replacement front usually two pieces, either double banjo at master cylinder and one line to each caliper, or one line to right caliper with double banjo, and short line across mudguard to left caliper, (IMO neatest system).
Don't suppose you know the lengths needed for either of these options?
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