Johnny Rod's "What Bike" thread brought to you by Hitler

[johnnyrod]

Can we stand yet another "what bike after the SV" thread? Soon find out...

I've had the curvy 10 years and it's been great. But which of the following should I buy...

GSXR750 - all the bottom end torque of the SV but with proper handling out of the box. Pity it's a four.

RSV1000 twin - bigger motor than I wanted as I don't get loyalty points at A18 Tyres. Otherwise everything I'd want, but not Japanese, and neither is the...

Ducati 848 -will it fall to bits and cost a fortune to service?

I've ruled out the Triumph 675 because now my bike feels like it does, only it has a longer rev range. Not really worth it to me.

I'm getting some test rides in soon, it's the only way really to know. I might even plump for a new SV and go the GSXR front end/700cc kit route, let's face it the price difference would pay for it. Am I worrying too much about the Italian bikes?

[_Stretchie_]

Blackbird

[Drew Carey]

My Daytona 955i in the for sale section!! :D

[yorkie_chris]

GSXR750 - all the bottom end torque of the SV but with proper handling out of the box. Pity it's a four.

RSV1000 twin - bigger motor than I wanted as I don't get loyalty points at A18 Tyres. Otherwise everything I'd want, but not Japanese, and neither is the...

Ducati 848 -will it fall to bits and cost a fortune to service?


I'm getting some test rides in soon, it's the only way really to know. I might even plump for a new SV and go the GSXR front end/700cc kit route, let's face it the price difference would pay for it. Am I worrying too much about the Italian bikes?

GSXR 750 :thumbsup:
Great bikes, I prefer the older ones but YMMV

RSV can have niggly issues but are pretty good bikes.

848 will cost a fortune to service but might not fall to bits.


I would go for other tuning rather than 700cc, and if I was looking pointy, I'd look for a mint pre-twin plug one (K6 IIRC)

[Dicky Ticker]

You are the one who knows what you want and its your dosh.

Peeps always praise up what they have as it is the best thing since sliced bread but loads of test rides and reading other forums can give you a good indication of what to expect from a particular model. There is no use on buying on other peoples recommendation if it doesn't make you happy.

[Mr Speirs]

You are worryng too much about Italian Bikes.

Ducati 848 is renowned to be the better bike than the 1098/1198.
Servicing isn't far off the jap prices however every 2 years or 12,000 miles you will need to fork out the extra expense of the timing belts.
They have suffered from leaky radiators but Ducati are well aware of the issue and normally replace under warranty.

The 848 is quite a leany forward bike however and whilst I can't talk for others I struggle to find roads that both myself and the ducati like. I like tight twisty scratchy roads but my 749 prefers long open sweeping (track type) bends. That said the 749/999 is far more a focused riding position as the tank is a lot narrower making it difficult to take weight through your legs. The 848 has a wider tank making it much easier on your back and wrists although going from the SV still might take some getting used to.

When ever I ride an SV again its like I'm riding a touring bike and it makes me chuckle when people complain of the 'sporty' riding position, they need to come ride my torture machine!! :)

Just somethings to help you make your decision on the Ducati or not.
But definately test ride one, the are amazing bikes.

[rob13]

GSXR 750 :thumbsup:


848 will cost a fortune to service but might not fall to bits.
)

According to local Duke dealer, this is no longer the case. 7500 mile service intervals, and average servicing prices (They quoted £130 for a standard service) doesnt sound too bad. This was based on the 796 Hypermotard.

[yorkie_chris]

They would say that wouldn't they ;)

How much is a belt change and valve clearance check?

[dizzyblonde]

How much is a belt change and valve clearance check?


A bloody fortune! My mates selling one of his Ducs cause the belts/valves/service cost a fortune, and he gets an ex Ducati bloke with his mobile service do his, which is cheaper than a dealer.

Anyway I think JonnyRods new bike should be ....

a trike;)

[johnnyrod]

Ta for the replies! Where to begin...

Blackbird - nah, 955, no chance!

848 - ta for the griff, I'm going to find out about servicing etc. because there is a lot of press about how Ducati have made it a lot easier and cheaper with the latest round of bikes - a quick Google found Ducati Glasgow offering big and small services for about £200 each. As I last paid for a service in 2000 I assume this isn't too bad for a main dealer? (I would plan to keep the FSH for a couple of years I think).

SV - YC what would be the essentials of your "ideal" SV? When I said 700cc kit it was going to have a few more goodies in it than just bigger pistons.

Bloody trike, I don't fall off that often. Oh, hang on...

[yorkie_chris]

My ideal SV, I would stick with stock bore for reliability but fit 'busa pistons.

I would use curvy frame OR a pointy frame with one of those custom shock knuckles for a linear rather than progressive motion
Penske shock, no contest. Maybe ohlins on pointy.

Engine, carb or injected doesn't matter. Either FCR39 carbs or TWF racing big throttle bodies on injected*
Port heads
Thin head gasket
Full leo pipe.

BDK racing genny
minimalise electrics, single 35W HID headlamp, LED other lights

Late GSXR front end, spring and valve to suit

Brace swingarm and machine some trick GSXR-esque adjusters, maybe use GSXR wheel, maybe not.



*I personally would use carbs, as the wiring is SO much simpler and flatslides sound great :)

[Skip]

My ideal SV, I would stick with stock bore for reliability but fit 'busa pistons.

Engine, carb or injected doesn't matter. Either FCR39 carbs or TWF racing big throttle bodies on injected*
Port heads
Thin head gasket
Full leo pipe.

BDK racing genny
minimalise electrics, single 35W HID headlamp, LED other lights


*I personally would use carbs, as the wiring is SO much simpler and flatslides sound great :)

What sort of rough BHP would that setup be netting? Just out of idle curiosity...

[yorkie_chris]

realistically 85 or so, build one and see :)
Maybe a bit more with fancy cams or more head work.

Oh yeah, add cam swap to that list for cheap option

[johnnyrod]

Hmm interesting... more thoughts on the alternatives though? 848/GSXR/RSV/other?

[andrewsmith]

ZX10 04-05 or 08 onwards
a late ZX636

[Sean_C]

Versys for me.

[yorkie_chris]

Hmm interesting... more thoughts on the alternatives though? 848/GSXR/RSV/other?

I wouldn't have one of the wops, but that's just a personal thing. I like the jap thing of readily available spares and things designed to be easy to work on.

I'd definitely have a GSXR, I had one on loan from a mate and it was great, owned another which was nuts, and still own another waiting some TLC. You can definitely do anything on one and they're lots of fun. TBH though the new ones don't inspire me and are a completely different experience from a sports twin.

I'd definitely take RSV instead of 848, as the money saved will allow you to do the important thing of RIDING the bugger!

[johnnyrod]

Well I test rode the GSXR and Mille... and ... um...

The gixxer was okay, pulled a bit at low speed, lit up at around 6k and went into warp speed not unlike a firework in the trousers. Seemed to vibrate a lot through the bars though (buzzing), I'm sure the 600s I've ridden don't do that. Also seemed to be fairly whirring even at e.g. 50mph in 5th when you'd think it'd be chugging or happy (gearing is about the same as the SV but the longer rev range takes it up to higher speeds - just seemed to be squealing). Great handling of course, but the riding position is pretty radical. No question it's fun but I ride my bike all year round, take it on holiday etc. and I don't think I could do that on the gixxer.

The Mille was kind of the same. I like the engine more, pulls a lot harder than I remember the TL doing so. Suspension seemed good but was set up so hard it was difficult to really get a feel of it. Really did vibrate like a road drill (gixxer vibes were high-frequency). Truly useless mirrors, not just in the metaphorical sense. Similar riding position though. Crunchy gearbox.

I got off them both and I wasn't sure I wanted to change. I don't think I want a four, though might try the new R1 with the crossplane crank to see if it works, but I think I'm set on a twin. 848 gets only 80 miles to a tank so forget it, that's on top of all the other things, I do getting on for twice that just on a track day. Probably has the same foetal riding position as it's a race bike anyway which is part of what spoiled the other two for me.

Bugger.

[johnnyrod]

So I rode a few more, if you wanna know...

GSXR1000. Quicker than the 750, bit more comfortable, still seemed to be missing something. Heavy steering at low speed for some reason.

BMW R1200S, which for the normal people who've never looked at a Beemer, is a boxer with some sort of sporting pretensions. Shaft drive using their clever Paralever back end, and wishbone-type Telelever front. Very stable, surprisingly chuckable, excellent brakes. Engine of a tractor, vibrated like a road drill. Rubbish fuel injection linked to how fast you open the throttle, so bad that if you do it gently, you have to open it more than a quarter before it picks up off tickover, I kid you not. Blipping on downchanges? Think about it, crap gearbox, crap throttle response, miles of slack in the transmission, big twin engine... Great build quality and the dealers treat you like a human being too.

BMW F800S, parallel twin with conventional suspension. Something like an SV if you took all the fun away.

Next up, crossplane R1, 675 and new SV. Sometime.

[petevtwin650]

848 only gets 80 miles to a tank :confused:

3 1/2 gallon tank and they do more than 40 mpg.

Rather than rely on test reports and other peoples prejudical comments, you really should get a test ride on one. Remember servicing is at 7.5 and 15k or every year. It's also got a wet clutch so it lasts longer and sounds quieter. If you can hear that over the Termis.

I ride with a guy who has a late model 848. It did have the rad go. Sorted within a week. He much prefers it to his Gsxr600 that he had before it.

[fizzwheel]

The gixxer was okay, pulled a bit at low speed, lit up at around 6k and went into warp speed not unlike a firework in the trousers. Seemed to vibrate a lot through the bars though (buzzing), I'm sure the 600s I've ridden don't do that. Also seemed to be fairly whirring even at e.g. 50mph in 5th when you'd think it'd be chugging or happy (gearing is about the same as the SV but the longer rev range takes it up to higher speeds - just seemed to be squealing). Great handling of course, but the riding position is pretty radical. No question it's fun but I ride my bike all year round, take it on holiday etc. and I don't think I could do that on the gixxer.

Yep they are a bit vibey, my K5 vibrates the mirrors during hard acceleration.

As for comfort, you'd be surprised, I have an older K5 750, and its way more comfy than my SV ever was.

I've done 4 decent trips on it now.

1 x Trip around Republic of Ireland
1 x Trip to Scotland for GM1, including riding from Loch Lommond all the way back to somerset in one day
1 x Trip to Normandy
1 x Trip through france to Spain

OK on the spain trip I was tired, but I didnt really ache that badly.

I've commuted to work on it and had some brilliant Org rideouts on it to. The only thing I havent done is a track day on it.

You need to approach riding a 4 in a different way and get out of the "twin" mentality. It does take a little while to get your head around it though. Dont right off the IL4 just yet, maybe go get another test ride.

You looking to buy new or 2nd hand, if so you can get a K4/K5 750 for sensible money now and its hell of a lot of bike for it.

I'd echo the comments on the Duke servicing, do your research, talk to some owners and dealers before you right them off as being unreliable or expensive to run. My g/f has a 749S, sublime bike to ride.

[mikerj]

RSV1000 twin - bigger motor than I wanted as I don't get loyalty points at A18 Tyres. Otherwise everything I'd want, but not Japanese, and neither is the...


Firestorm SP2? It's a V twin and fixes your "not Japanese" problem (which isn't a problem at all for the Aprilia IMO), though obviously it's still a 1 litre bike.

[rob13]

I didn't think the 675 felt like the SV at all. The brakes and suspension are light years ahead and the engine is more like an electric bike as the power seems so linear. It does love to rev but it pulls from low revs too. Had a massive grin after i had ridden the R variant.

[fizzwheel]

Firestorm SP2? It's a V twin and fixes your "not Japanese" problem (which isn't a problem at all for the Aprilia IMO), though obviously it's still a 1 litre bike.

Thirsty beasts though arent they... ragged hard returns about the same as the 848 does to a tankful...

[davepreston]

due to the thread title
bmw gs ;)

[ethariel]

Surprised no one has pitched in with the 'Join the Trumpet Club' yet :)

[pookie]

Why not stick with an sv and get a sv1000s. Its pointy, better suspension and also a vtwin. Great bang for buck plenty of support on the forums. Ride is more upright compared to the supersports and loads of torque :)

[Tim in Belgium]

Out of interest what age GSX-R 750 was it? The K6 on have adjustable pegs, those few cms of adjustability make a huge difference to comfort, much more than I expected.

Personally I find the 750 a bit too much on the road, great on track, but rarely on the road do you get to WOT (wide open throttle) it. I used to love spanking the SV within an inch of its life to get anywhere.

For my next road bike I'd consider something in the 80-100 ish horse range but torquey, an 1100 monster, perhaps the new Norton, a Griso, Ducati 749, Speed Triple, I don't know, I'll worry about that bridge if and when I come to it.

[johnnyrod]

Holy resurrected thread, Batman! Thanks for your thoguths guys. I'm only going off what I find, and trolling forums e.g. Ducatisti, so from peopel who own them. Where to begin...

GXSR750 was a K9 or L0 (not sure, same thing), I hear the K5-ish is better but ideally am after something almost new. BMW GS, no way, if the engine is anything like the R1200S you can keep it, plus it isn't anything like a sports bike. I know some people love them, I don't, ta though anyway! 675 feels like my SV, which is fairly breathed upon all over. You're right, the 675 isn't much like a stock SV. SP1/2, maybe but they're like hen's teeth, not too new, and from reviews (yeah I know, can't find one local to see), "single minded" i.e. take your ass home in a carrier bag after a couple of hours. 848 yes better than the older Dukes but the fuel range figures are fom the Ducati forum, people seemed pretty well agreed on the sub-100 range, and some of th build quality stories were a big worry. I'm with you Tim in that I do like a bike that you feel you can ride hard, when I've had fast bikes before you do feel a bit like you're wasting your time unless you're well into three figures!

[fizzwheel]

GXSR750 was a K9 or L0 (not sure, same thing), I hear the K5-ish is better but ideally am after something almost new.

I know what you mean, but I've seen alot of 2nd hand K5's in dealers with low miles on, I'm talking 3 - 5K on them.

The motors are pretty much bullet proof and I've found with mine it seems alot less corrosion resistant than my SV was, but then I have looked after it a little better and it hasnt seen so many salty roads.

The motor in my K5 didnt really begin to feel loose and run in till I'd put some miles into it, if you find one, I'd really recommend you get a test ride.

Liz's 749S gives roughly a 100 miles to tankful. Ridden a little more gently or when she was commuting on it, it will give 120 miles to a tankful so not all bad, just depends on how you ride it.

[LJH]

Firestorm SP2? It's a V twin and fixes your "not Japanese" problem (which isn't a problem at all for the Aprilia IMO), though obviously it's still a 1 litre bike.

Exactly what I was going to say, but probably too "hardcore" the riding position?