View Full Version : Focussed events chrono timing to sort groups on trackdays
For those who don't get the Focussed events newsletter:
FOCUSED EVENTS GOES CHRONO!
*
WE ARE BRINGING 'CHRONO DAYS' TO THE UK AFTER EXTENSIVE TRANSPONDER TESTING AT EUROPEAN EVENTS, A MOVE WHICH WILL ENHANCE THE ENJOYMENT AND SMOOTH RUNNING OF TRACKDAYS.
*
Some of you may know that we have been testing this for past 6 months at our European events and the feedback we received from you, was a resounding 'YES'. We are currently rolling this out at selected events this year but believe in the future it will be at all our trackdays.
*
On these days Riders times will be monitored and they will be allocated into the correct groups, something that is particularly important to build up the confidence of newer riders, so there are not faster riders in their groups.
*
Ex-World Superbike Champion and committed Focused Events instructor Neil Hodgson has assessed the new system, "Transponders add another dimension to a trackday. Ultimately there is a massive range of ability on trackdays and this helps group riders accordingly"
I think it's a good move.
Discuss.
maviczap
28-01-11, 01:25 PM
Agreed, as one who'd love to do a track day, I'm put off by being in the novice group with blokes who're turning up with tyre warmers and full factory support
Nobbylad
28-01-11, 01:30 PM
I can't see any downside
sandman
28-01-11, 01:32 PM
I think this is a great idea and would love to do a day but i have already booked to a track day this year with another in the pipeline
@ Maviczap
I was just like you about doing a track day but then took the plunge and it was great.
I found most others were just the same and we all walked away with a big grin on our faces thinking why did we not do this before
What is the main thing that puts new comers off? I'm just curious as i couldn't wait to get out on track...
Binning your bike or just being swallowed up by lots of faster riders or something else?
[QUOTE=Binky;2470465]What is the main thing that puts new comers off? I'm just curious as i couldn't wait to get out on the track[/qoute]
I think it's the misconception that someone turning up on a race preped bike with tyre warmer is actually going to be fast. Sure there is potentially going to be people in the wrong group but it's never that big adeal.
I think transponders would be awesome though, wonder if they let you know your times, would probably invalidate the insurance and planning conditions though :(
_Stretchie_
28-01-11, 01:55 PM
So what's the idea, they put it about your person or under your seat (If you are lucky enough to have a bike that has space under the seat that is) ?
hardhat_harry
28-01-11, 02:15 PM
A couple of things on this, they were asking for £500 deposit on one of the Euro trackday for the transponders in case they were damaged which is a bit much for something thats enforced.
They were also charging £1.50 for a timing sheet which flies in the face of this is a trackday not a timing event or race.
They have have words with people in the past for timing from the pit wall and having timing gear on their bikes.
It doesnt help people on slower bikes who have faster corner speed.
I'm fairly sure any timings won't be made available to the riders but I've firedoff an email to ask.
My main problem with having much faster riders in the same group as myself is close overtaking and general p*ss taking that may be fine with more experienced riders.
hardhat_harry
28-01-11, 04:05 PM
I am just relaying whay the guys on throttlemonkey found last year when going on the FE eurotrackdays.
The deposit thing only happened once and they realised that is wasn't going to work when they were told by all riders politely feck off.
The timings where available on all there transponder trackdays for a fee, the feeling was that they were using this charge to offset the outlay of the transponders but they would have to sell alot. If 20 in each group thats 60 riders and a new transponder is £300 thats £18,000. I would imaging that FE have introduced transponders to reduce liability and therefore insurance costs
I can't see any downside
So how does it work?
In the first session of the day on cold tyres everyone goes AS FAST AS POSSIBLE to avoid the embarrasment of being placed in the novice group?
No, can't see anything wrong with that :smt102
SoulKiss
28-01-11, 04:53 PM
to avoid the embarrasment of being placed in the novice group?
Maybe if thats someones attitude then they really shouldn't be doing trackdays...
He he. Nice.
I've sent off a few enquiring emails which I will post the answers to when I receive the replies.
hardhat_harry
28-01-11, 05:21 PM
Im out with FE on end Feb so I'll know then
Here are the answers from Focussed Events:
You will be timed throughout the whole day on the Chrono events. You will
be put into the correct groups according to your ability. However if you are
very uncomfortable about moving up a group they won't make you move.
Will the timings be made available to riders?
They will be but after the event has finished. You won't have access to
them throughout the day.
For a charge or included in the price of the trackday? Will riders initially
book into the group they think they should be in or will the groups be
determined after the first sessions?
No that's at no extra charge, its included in the event price. You will book
as normal into the group you would like and the first part of the day will
be timing everyone and then after lunch you will be put into the correct
groups.
So there we have it. I think they should do the timing and group sorting sooner rather than more then halfway through the day as a lot can happen in half a day.
Looking to do Brands on the 3rd which is a Chrono day.
Should be interesting.
Cool stuff, so when are doing a .org track day? :D
Cool stuff, so when are doing a .org track day? :D
3rd March - unofficial! ;)
keith_d
13-02-11, 10:37 PM
I suspect the real problem is that the intermediate group fills up fastest, and soon intermediate riders are picking between fast and novice. Before long the fast group has filled up with the quicker intermediate riders and everyone else ends up in with the novices.
After lunch the top 33% should be in 'fast', the next 33% in 'inters' and the rest of the intermediate riders in with the novices. Once riders recognise this I'd expect the number of accidents just before lunch to increase as riders push that bit harder to make the cut for 'inters'.
Cynical or logical? You decide!
Keith.
I suspect the real problem is that the intermediate group fills up fastest, and soon intermediate riders are picking between fast and novice. Before long the fast group has filled up with the quicker intermediate riders and everyone else ends up in with the novices.
After lunch the top 33% should be in 'fast', the next 33% in 'inters' and the rest of the intermediate riders in with the novices. Once riders recognise this I'd expect the number of accidents just before lunch to increase as riders push that bit harder to make the cut for 'inters'.
Cynical or logical? You decide!
Keith.
Definitely cynical. That's a mental proposition IMO.
crisis95
15-02-11, 10:08 AM
Why would anyone feel the need to "make the cut" for inters?! Are the novice group lined up and shot after lunch or something? You're there to have some fun and explore your bikes performance in a safe(er) environment than the road.
Grouping people roughly by ability is going to make it more likely you'll have a safe and enjoyable day, although I take the point that the smaller capacity machines make that lap time in a different way, you can't please everyone I guess.
If you're such a competitive, willy-waving ego maniac that the thought of having the wrong coloured sticker on your bike makes you want to set fire to race control then you need to forget trackdays and come racing, as it's probably more suited to your temperament.
Why would anyone feel the need to "make the cut" for inters?! Are the novice group lined up and shot after lunch or something? You're there to have some fun and explore your bikes performance in a safe(er) environment than the road.
Grouping people roughly by ability is going to make it more likely you'll have a safe and enjoyable day, although I take the point that the smaller capacity machines make that lap time in a different way, you can't please everyone I guess.
If you're such a competitive, willy-waving ego maniac that the thought of having the wrong coloured sticker on your bike makes you want to set fire to race control then you need to forget trackdays and come racing, as it's probably more suited to your temperament.
=D>
Couldn't have put it better myself! Unfortunately i've seen far too many lads treat the novice group like the plague when infact its probably the best place for them. Unless i'm ridicuosly fast compared to the rest in my group I don't give a shiny ****e what group I'm in, i'm there to have fun. done 3 in the novices with no problems.
Advanced to me is the fast group, inters is the fast and inconsistent lot. i've had a few :toss: try nerfing me onto the grass into a corner in the inters, thats where I normally like to go but the best day i've had on track was at snetterton in the advanced. All good riders, no stupid overtakes and good fun trying to run with the guys on trackbikes :mrgreen:
...copied from another thread.
Hi Everyone,
We noticed a lot of discussion in the Cafe section regarding Chrono days and thought our response might be worth including in this section to help you with your understanding of the format.
Thankyou and we welcome your comments.
So how will they work?
After signing on you will go to the fitting area where we will fit a transponder to your bike (the bracket fitted to your bike can be kept for future events).
We will then run the normal day, with briefing and sighting and groups
At 11am we will stop for the usual 1 hour lunch where we can study the collated data and then place the riders in the groups where there times are similar.
What you will find on these days is that we will now have groups 1, 2 and 3 and these will be based on your level on that event.
As many of you will know we have been testing this system for over 6 months on our European events and it has been given a big thumb’s up!
Once we’ve re allocated the groups, the riders are on circuit within a group of probably around a 6 to 8 second split from the slowest to the fastest of the group, and this means that you get far better track time and it completely removes the problem of having riders in a group that is too fast or slow for them
The day will recommence at 12pm and run again as normal. The only change to the timing of the day being that lunch will be from 11am to 12pm. It will then run as normal to 5pm
What we can also forsee in the future is that we can help the riders build an accurate picture of their history at the circuits they use.
And the day after the event we will send every individual (by email) a record of their day
At Focused Events we are always trying to improve the service we give and if possible bring forward new and innovative ideas. We have looked at this for some time and feel that this will be a really major step forward for the future of the activity you and we all enjoy. We hope that having experienced this with us you will feel the same as the customers on the European events did.
Finally we have noted that one or two comments from TDR members showing concern that they may lose track time.
We are confident enough to offer a FULL credit if you do not get the usual 6-7 sessions due to the transponder system!
If you do have any questions then feel free to call the office on 0845 0267272, or email info@focusedevents.com (info@focusedevents.com)
Thankyou for your time in reading this
Focused Events
Please check our site for more information:
http://www.focusedevents.com/chrono_days.asp (http://www.focusedevents.com/chrono_days.asp)
vBulletin® , Copyright ©2000-2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.