Are Parking Lights an M.O.T. item?

[Scott S]

I tried calling a garage today, but didn't get very far with this.

I have (stupidly) left my parking lights on a couple of times since getting the bike, I try to remember each time to check it but both times I have forgotten, I flattened the battery. I was at work both times, so that makes it hard to get some jump leads.

I have tried bump starting the bike (tried it in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd), but there's only flat ground and when I pick up enough speed to jump on, the back wheel just locks up (I weigh just under 11 stone).

My 'solution' (however odd it may sound to some) is to potentially snip (and subsequently block off) the parking lights wire that comes from the bottom of the ignition barrel, but I don't know if it will be an M.O.T. failure.

Anyone know?

[coolevilangel]

dont you have to turn the switch further than normal to 'activate' the parking lights??
just dont turn it as far then take the key out bud

[Scott S]

dont you have to turn the switch further than normal to 'activate' the parking lights??
just dont turn it as far then take the key out bud

My key barrell is a bit odd to be honest, it's actually pretty hard to put the parking lights on intentionally, so whenever they accidentally go on, it's a suprise :oops:

[Dave20046]

I'm sure the general rule of thumb with MOT's is "if it's fitted, it should work".
But wait for a definitive answer!

[Dave Mac]

i beleive it is if its fitted it should work, but if you remove the light lense for parking, and replace it with something not translucent, then it shouldnt be a prob on an mot

[fizzwheel]

Why dont you just take the bulb out rather than cutting the wires... then when it comes to MOT time, its a 5 minute job to put the bulb back in again.

[Dave Mac]

Why dont you just take the bulb out rather than cutting the wires... then when it comes to MOT time, its a 5 minute job to put the bulb back in again.

sometimes the simplest ideas are the best, i tip my hat to you sir

[Scott S]

Can't remove both bulbs as the rear is the back light.

The front could come out as it's the front 'sidelight', but that wouldn't solve the problem, it would increase the time before the battery goes flat, but that's about it.

I do realise that I am making my own issue by not being able to remember a simple thing, so thanks for the patience.

[fizzwheel]

Sorry yes I had forgotten that the back light also comes on, was just thinking about the front sidelight. Still think you are mad to cut the cables though.

[SoulKiss]

Done that once, had to get Sid Squid out to jump start me.

Never done it again, always visually check the lights.

Get into the habit...

[Dicky Ticker]

Definitive answer---------Any light fitted should be in working order, cutting wires and removing bulbs to make the light inoperative while the actual fitting is still there is not acceptable
Think about it,IT IS JUST THE SAME AS HAVING A BROKEN WIRE OR A BLOWN BULB
which would be a MOT fail.
Rear parking light is also your tail light so by removing the front bulbs you only gain fractional reduction in battery drain
Like the man says---Checking to make sure your lights are off when you leave the bike is the easy solution:confused:

[lammypie]

i chain my bike up.. so its a little hard to not realise there isnt a light in my face when doing so, even a disc lock will make it easy and in doing so you make your bike more secure.. only remember to take it off before you start moving, failing that make sure nobody is watching

[SoulKiss]

Another suggestion, change the Sidelights to LED bulbs, that way if you do accidentally leave them on, the power used should be less than filament bulbs.

[mister c]

I'm sure the general rule of thumb with MOT's is "if it's fitted, it should work".
But wait for a definitive answer!
I took my curvy for an MOT with the std headlight fitted & sidelight not working (forgot to wire it up when I did a headlamp change) & the MOT guy told me it would fail if it isn't working.

Following MOT was with the Buell fairing fitted. It has no sidelight feature & it sailed through no problem :)

[Stig]

Surely after having the issues with a flat battery for leaving the side light on once is enough to prevent you from doing it again? I've only ever done it once. I've not needed to remove lights or fittings to prevent it happening again.

[yorkie_chris]

I've never seen a parking light feature tested at an MOT, that's not to say it's not technically required though.

You can disconnect one wire at ignition switch connector, pull the contact out of the connector by depressing the tang with a little screwdriver. Effective and easily reversible.

[Stig]

I've never seen a parking light feature tested at an MOT, that's not to say it's not technically required though.



A good point. But then he will have already checked the function of the bulbs with the headlights on anyway. Let's face it, who actually uses that function anyway? :)

[yorkie_chris]

People testing the deep cycle capabilities of their batteries? :-P


To attack the problem from a different tangent I'd actually recommend fixing the ignition switch.

[Scott S]

I know the easy solution is to check every time, but I was looking for a way that meant my stupidity wouldn't end up with me having to find someone at work with jump leads.

Looks like I have my answer.

I will probably do it again to be honest, but never mind.

[Scott S]

I have a new key (bike only came with one key, but got the local Suziki dealers to cut ne a new one), so tried that yesterday and it's loads better, I don't have to fight the key to get it to turn. I can now feel every click fully, so no more going too far I think.

I will be getting another new key and binning the original as compared to the new one, it's never been right.

[SoulKiss]

Done that once, had to get Sid Squid out to jump start me.

Never done it again, always visually check the lights.

Get into the habit...

Well I now retract this statement...

Wonder how long the AA will be ;-)

[Dicky Ticker]

A little bit off topic but I have replaced the original bulbs on my bike with LED's.Admittedly it does not alleviate the problem but a lot less drain on your battery

[leebex]

another bonus for me fitting a pointy rear light to the curvy :p:p:p

[hindle8907]

I have tried bump starting the bike (tried it in 1st, 2nd, and 3rd), but there's only flat ground and when I pick up enough speed to jump on, the back wheel just locks up (I weigh just under 11 stone).



Don't try jumping on it, just get the bike in second gear and run with it let the clutch out and it will fire up quickly pull in the the clutch....
I'm not a very fast runner and have a dodgy left leg and weigh around 14 stone, I've managed to do it many times without the bike pulling me off ect ect.

**disclaimer if you do happen to hurt yourself its not my fault ;)**

[NTECUK]

In MOT speak side lights are called position marker lamps.
And as long as when you out the light switch on to its first position and they work . The MOT man can't fail it.
Well not ligitamy.

[DJFridge]

We use LEDs on rolls in some of the stuff we make so I've just nipped a small length home (about 9 little LEDs) which I'm planning to fit instead of the parking light bulb. If it looks any good I'll post some pics. If it doesn't, obviously I'll never mention it again!

[stormingjoe]

'side light(parking/position)' and 'main beam+ dip' if fitted must work front and rear, this has no association to ignition switch position other than with ignition on and light switch on, so disconnect the parking circuit at switch aka Yorkies suggestion.

[beabert]

I disabled mine, not sure what bike you have, ive a curvy sv, see below post.

http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=164336&highlight=parking&page=2

[leebex]

We use LEDs on rolls in some of the stuff we make so I've just nipped a small length home (about 9 little LEDs) which I'm planning to fit instead of the parking light bulb. If it looks any good I'll post some pics. If it doesn't, obviously I'll never mention it again!

i`ll be interested to see that if it works, looking for my next little project on the sv :p

[NTECUK]

Audi style running lights now.?
You can get The strips of e bay and in halffords.

[leebex]

you cant beat making your own stuff though. DRL are ok on a car, but most bikers ride with dipped headlights anyway dont they?

[NTECUK]

Yes but dipped lights are not as effective as a dtrl. They spread the light .

[DJFridge]

Audi style running lights now.?
You can get The strips of e bay and in halffords.

As long as it looks better than the low-end A3 models which have running lights that look like cheap Xmas rope lights, I'll be a happy bunny!

Yes but dipped lights are not as effective as a dtrl. They spread the light .

They are also a more noticeable light, I think it's the fact that they are one pure colour (quite a bluey white) rather than normal bulbs.

Anyway, hopefully that's this weekend's little project. Plus fitting my new, blue levers (if they arrive in time, Moto-777 are sending me the tracking number tomorrow so fingers crossed).

[Lozzo]

Simple answer is -

"A motor bicycle (with or without a side car) fitted with a headlamp need not have a front position lamp (but must have one on the side car, if a side car is fitted)."

Quote taken from the MOT Testers Manual

http://www.motuk.co.uk/mcmanual_110.htm

The full manual is available here:

http://www.motuk.co.uk/manual/mc_contents.htm

In short, as long as you have a headlight you don't need a sidelight (front position lamp)

Btw, on machines registered or built after a certain date only 50cc bikes can get away with having no provision for lights to work when the engine is stopped, i.e. some enduro style bikes with no battery. This is a part of the Construction and Use Regs 1988 and not relevant to the MOT test.

HTH

[ThEGr33k]

Cut wires and put a switch in there. Switch off for everything but MOT, sorted :D

I aint read all the thread as its far too long and I dont have time so sorry if this has been said already.

[Dicky Ticker]

My translation of the manual is--If it is fitted it must be in working order.
What is to be gained by its removal providing the OE switches are in working order
Being pedantic a tester or VOSA can make you have the bike re-registered for daytime use only if the removal does not meet the original type approval. This all seems a bit of hassle for a front/rear side light than you can switch off any way.

[NTECUK]

The park function on the ignition barrell is not part of the test.
So not a testable item.

[Murph]

http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/repository/Motorcycle%20MOT%20Inspection%20Checklist%20(VT%20 40M).pdf

Is a handy checklist for short reference.

[NTECUK]

My translation of the manual is--If it is fitted it must be in working order.
What is to be gained by its removal providing the OE switches are in working order
Being pedantic a tester or VOSA can make you have the bike re-registered for daytime use only if the removal does not meet the original type approval. This all seems a bit of hassle for a front/rear side light than you can switch off any way.

Information Method of Inspection Reason for Rejection 1. With the front and rear position lamps switched on, check the lamps.

This inspection applies to: all machines, except those which have neither front nor rear position lamps, or have such lamps permanently disconnected, painted over or masked that are · only used during daylight hours, and · not used at times of seriously reduced visibility If this situation occurs the machine presenter should be issued with a VT32 (advisory notice) recording the above.
So only an advisory is issued not Re Registered.This is taken from the official tester manual.
see ;-http://www.transportoffice.gov.uk/crt/doitonline/bl/mottestingmanualsandguides/mottestingmanualsandguides.htm

[Red Herring]

What Lozzo said. The "parking light" facility provided by turning the ignition switch beyond off on some bikes is only there to allow you to leave the bike locked and unattended in a position where you are required to display lights, for example at the side of any road with a speed limit over 30mph after dark (like anybody would!). If you disable it from the ignition then it should still work when you turn the ignition on and put the lights on (on some bikes you don't even have a light switch so the headlight comes on anyhow) so it should still pass an MOT as it is fitted and works, but it might be a bit of a bugger to see a little position lamp through the glare of a headlamp!

[NTECUK]

[QUOTE=Red Herring;25769 should still pass an MOT as it is fitted and works, but it might be a bit of a bugger to see a little position lamp through the glare of a headlamp![/QUOTE]

Pass and advise .

[Dicky Ticker]

Lights that are painted over masked,permantly diconnected and the next bit-----
Only used during daylight hours which means they would be required for a full MOT
As has been commented parking lights are required by law in certain circumstances and an unattended vehicle with headlights on and engine switched off will sort of defeat the object apart from being illegal
Like I said before ---What is the point if you have a switch already on the bike that controls their operation---why disconnect them---why fit a different switch/

Surely the ignition switch parking mode is designed so that you can leave the bike with parking lights on,key removed, when necesary without somebody turning them off. I am presuming we are talking about the SV

Form VT32 is issued at the discreation of the tester for a non compliant and he can still issue the MOTcertificate ---------read the back of the VT32,the part that explains you can still be prosecuted for the non compliance

[NTECUK]

Yes that is right . But you can do it .
It's only the bod who keeps flattening his battery .
No issue with it on my sv.
But he has that option .
Same if you want no lights on your bike at all.

[Dicky Ticker]

Wrong wording in earlier post ---should be re-tested not re-registered---as in for daylight use only---sorry for the mix up

[Red Herring]

You don't need to get the bike re-tested (MOT) if you decide to adapt it for daylight use only, or if you decide to replace the lights for night time use. In fact the MOT certificate is exactly the same, the only difference is that when presenting a bike for MOT without any lights you usually get an advisory to the effect that it is for daytime use only, which isn't recorded on the certificate.

[NTECUK]

Thing about MOT is it realy only means pass at that moment .There's nothing stopping the presenter going away that morning ,putting on his race exhaust ,cut slicks,taking off the body work fitting there fiberglass race body with no lights and ridding it round ulting bends that afternoon.

[Lozzo]

I think you are all missing one main point. If you have a headlight fitted that complies with the MOT test, you do not need a front sidelight to be fitted as well. That is clearly stated in the wording of the MOT Tester's Manual. Red Herring may have misinterpreted that bit, because there would be no need to go searching through the glare of a headlight to see the sidelight.

I only know this bit because we had to check with our local MOT tester (who is mega strict) and VOSA to see if some Rieju 50s complied with C+U 1988 because they have no battery and the lights only work when the engine runs. They have no sidelights fitted either, but the headlights are on full time when the engine runs. Apparently they do comply with all regs and the MOT tester gave us a run down of the rules regarding other machines as well.

[Dicky Ticker]

Presumably to do with the original type approval certification when granted as all vehicles vary.

[Red Herring]

I think you are all missing one main point. If you have a headlight fitted that complies with the MOT test, you do not need a front sidelight to be fitted as well. That is clearly stated in the wording of the MOT Tester's Manual. Red Herring may have misinterpreted that bit, because there would be no need to go searching through the glare of a headlight to see the sidelight.

A solo motorcycle fitted with a headlight does not have to be fitted with a front position lamp. If however it is fitted with a front position lamp then it needs to work. In this thread we are discussing the issues with disconnecting a front position lamp that is fitted, and if that will then fail an MOT. There is a clause in the Road Traffic Act that says a lamp shall not be considered to be fitted if it is not provided with a system of wiring by which it could be readily connected, but I'd have to submit to your MOT expertise as to wether cutting the wire at the ignition would count under that....?

[NTECUK]

As a tester you have to ask your self this.
1.does the light come on when I turn it to position one..
well its going to do that as the wire that is cut is only at the ignition Lock.
2. is there anywhere in the testers manual that states in methods of inspection that states,
engage the ignition Lock, and turn it to the park position.
.
I can't find that, so its not even part of the test.

[Red Herring]

So would it be fair to conclude then that is nothing to stop you disabling the parking light function on your bike provided you can still get the position lamp to work off the light switch, and of course accepting you won't be able to legally (and securely) park your bike anywhere you are required to display lights after dark.

[NTECUK]

That is about it.
Why anyone would trust the ignition Lock to secure your bike is another set d questions that deserves its own thread.