One less thief.

[BigBaddad]

Just seen this on the news........can't help thinking he got what he deserved.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-13885457

[Reeder]

Perhaps a bit harsh mate...

[tigersaw]

Shame the others got away

[BigBaddad]

Perhaps a bit harsh mate...

aww poor criminals.......they have it rough

[grimey121uk]

If I'm at home and a burglar happens to break in I will use any means to defend myself, I would not wait around to find out his intentions.

In my opinion scum like him are better dead

[Holdup]

If I'm at home and a burglar happens to break in I will use any means to defend myself, I would not wait around to find out his intentions.

In my opinion scum like him are better dead

Your not allowed to though, you have to make them a cup of tea, have a chat with them and tell them where everything is

[Reeder]

I think he deserved a good thrashing and many years in jail, however death is quite harsh. Fair enough if the person didn't meant to kill them as it was his fault for trying to break in in the first place... but if they did it's perhaps a bit extreme.

[bigchris]

Just seen this on the news........can't help thinking he got what he deserved.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-13885457

Too right he got what he deserved, if more people reacted like this to scum taking people's property, thieves might think twice before doing it.

This country's backwards, people expect victims of crime to just lay down and take it.

I suppose they should have offered him a cup of tea while he was trying to break into there house paid for through honest graft????

F%#king winds me up this, people work hard for the things they have and then some vile rotten scum of the earth just take it away??
Oh but it's ok though because they had a bad childhood????????

To%#ers!

[grimey121uk]

Your not allowed to though, you have to make them a cup of tea, have a chat with them and tell them where everything is

Well your allowed to use equal force on a premptive basis
"yes office he said he would stab me with his screw driver, so I stabbed him first"

[BigBaddad]

I think he deserved a good thrashing and many years in jail, however death is quite harsh. Fair enough if the person didn't meant to kill them as it was his fault for trying to break in in the first place... but if they did it's perhaps a bit extreme.


So there's a gang a thugs in balacava's forcing their way into your home, your kids are in bed........if you hit one then they can get up again, pull a knife and kill you.

[Owenski]

If I were the officer involved with this there would be a lot of paper work going missing.
Fair play to the home owner.

The alternative is what happened up here in quiet old Yorkshire a few weeks back:
Home owner catches another bloke in his house at night,
wrestling match follows,
homeowner manages to restrain burgular until police arrive.
Police take burgular away,
Police release burgular with caution. --- Yup, your great justice system at work there.

[Dave20046]

Hope the householders don't face any proper charges.

[Luckypants]

What I find difficult to comprehend is that the Police have arrested the people in the house and are treating the death as murder!

Murder FFS! For defending your home from thugs wearing balaclavas? Only in this country... My only hope is that there is more to this than meets the eye from that story.

[husky03]

tony martin thing again-reasonable force vs excessive force-you need to kill them with the first blow when their facing you.

[hindle8907]

passed the scene on the way to work.
if somebody came into my home where me and my partner are sleeping I wouldn't hesitate to do the same thing.

[Bluepete]

Talk about "Honour amongst thieves"

"The other three suspected burglars are believed to have dragged his body out of the house as the householder rang 999 for help.

Police were called to the scene and discovered the injured man at the base of a tree on nearby Hospital Road."


Didn't they realise the hospital on Hospital Road shut years ago?

Who knows exactly what happened? Certainly we don't. It'll all come out in the wash eh?

Pete ;)

[hindle8907]

Didn't they realise the hospital on Hospital Road shut years ago?



lol Pete . 8-)

[TamSV]

you need to kill them with the first blow when their facing you.

And then stick a weapon in their hand.

Cry a bit when the police turn up, at the senseless waste of it all.

[paiste]

Too right he got what he deserved. He made the choice to break into the house and paid the ultimate price. Maybe it should happen a few more times. It will save the taxpayer money for jail costs and also act as a deterrent to other thieving scum. I work with a Philllipino guy who says that back home he has a gun and is quite within his rights to shoot someone breaking and entering into his house.:)

[Milky Bar Kid]

Talk about "Honour amongst thieves"

"The other three suspected burglars are believed to have dragged his body out of the house as the householder rang 999 for help.

Police were called to the scene and discovered the injured man at the base of a tree on nearby Hospital Road."


Didn't they realise the hospital on Hospital Road shut years ago?

Who knows exactly what happened? Certainly we don't. It'll all come out in the wash eh?

Pete ;)

I liked the part where they dragged the body before dumping him....:rolleyes:

All we are seeing at the minute is media speculation. God knows what really happened!

[Reeder]

So there's a gang a thugs in balacava's forcing their way into your home, your kids are in bed........if you hit one then they can get up again, pull a knife and kill you.

Fair enough, I see your point. Don't you see mine though?
All I am saying is no one needed to die. By all means incapacitate them or mash them up big time... however no one needed to die. Like I said, if they didn't mean to kill them then fair enough. If they did stabbed them repeatedly(sp?) then they're just as bad as those trying to break in. I admit I would probably attack in this situation but I'd like to think I could restrain myself after giving them one quick stab... hopefully not somewhere it would kill them.

[Rossie]

Well I've a baseball bat beside the bed and as the saying goes "I don't know Karate, but I know Kerr-azy and I'm willing to use it".

[Owenski]

Fair enough, I see your point. Don't you see mine though?
All I am saying is no one needed to die. By all means incapacitate them or mash them up big time... however no one needed to die. Like I said, if they didn't mean to kill them then fair enough. If they did stabbed them repeatedly(sp?) then they're just as bad as those trying to break in. I admit I would probably attack in this situation but I'd like to think I could restrain myself after giving them one quick stab... hopefully not somewhere it would kill them.

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

[Milky Bar Kid]

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

LOL! As would most I think....

[hindle8907]

All we are seeing at the minute is media speculation. God knows what really happened!

Living quite close the the area and knowing lots of people from swinton, there are a few stories going around as to what happend and why, and it is a little bit different from what the news reports.

[TamSV]

A gang in balaclavas is not your average burglary to be fair. More information to come out no doubt.

[Reeder]

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

Hence the probably:p (that's the manly side of me trying to come out).
It would probably fail miserably, if it did happen at all, but I would like to think I'd have an attempt at protecting my family and property.

[Bedhead]

A gang in balaclavas is not your average burglary to be fair. More information to come out no doubt.

Sounds pretty average for over here, people see balaclava they think they're gonna get shot or baseball batted so they tend not to confront the scrotes.:rolleyes:

[TamSV]

Aye, different rules for NI.

[hindle8907]

A gang in balaclavas is not your average burglary to be fair.

very true

[DJFridge]

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

Now there's an honest man! I'm not sure I could even find anything remotely impressive to run around screaming with - all the knives are at the other end of the house!

As a few people have said, more than just a simple burglary possibly, but you can see the temptation to go all Iranian and chop thieves hands off.

[timwilky]

must be kids as they dumped him where the childrens hospital was.

It is not a bad area of Salford. 4 trying to "burgle" a place stinks a bit.

[Bluefish]

So is it acceptable to have a bat or suchlike beside your bed just in case?, we just have our killer cocker spaniels :rolleyes:

[Specialone]

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

Matt, most people say they'd do this or that, but the fact is when faced with situations like this you'd probably cak your pants or get into a panic.
I'm not sure how I'd react, depends how many were in my house, I'd like to think a man of my size while in attack mode would scare the average run of the mill burglar into scarpering pronto.

Thing that stays in the back of my mind is a lot of burglaries are done by desperate drug addicts who are not always of sound mind so when backed into a corner are capable of anything.

[maviczap]

Thing that stays in the back of my mind is a lot of burglaries are done by desperate drug addicts who are not always of sound mind so when backed into a corner are capable of anything.

No only this, but they have unbelivable strength, just ask any paramedic or Police officer who've tried to restrain an out of control drug addict or drunk.

[yorkie_chris]

If I were the officer involved with this there would be a lot of paper work going missing.
Fair play to the home owner.

Yeah. Why have they been nicked for murder when it was 4 against 2 and attacking a house at night?

tony martin thing again-reasonable force vs excessive force-you need to kill them with the first blow when their facing you.

I reckon he should have got a medal and a fresh box of cartridges too. Only pikeys, what was problem?

There is nothing in there to suggest it was excessive force, I can't see any reason why using whatever weapons are to hand in a case like that where some people are very plausibly going to kill you. 4 people don't try and break into a house to make a brew do they.

[Seandesy1]

Yeah. Why have they been nicked for murder when it was 4 against 2 and attacking a house at night?



I reckon he should have got a medal and a fresh box of cartridges too. Only pikeys, what was problem?

There is nothing in there to suggest it was excessive force, I can't see any reason why using whatever weapons are to hand in a case like that where some people are very plausibly going to kill you. 4 people don't try and break into a house to make a brew do they.

Playing devils advocate, but someone died, therefore the arrest of those involved is the quickest and easiest way of establishing exactly what the course of events was.

Whose to say this chap wasnt running away and then the householders got him and stabbed him to death? Theres reasonable force and then theres excessive force. Smashing someone round the head with a bat whilst in your house might be reasonable, doing it whilst they are running away or cornered in one room might not be.

Giving people free reign to smash/stab/beat someone to death without the fear of investigation is the start of a long slippery slope.

[yorkie_chris]

How does arrest lead to turning up fact that "questioned in relation to" or whatever does not? Personally I think arrested on suspicion of murder is a bit harsh for someone who's just been victim.

I am not suggesting no investigation, but like with Tony Martin it later came to light they are a) habitual criminals b) habitually burgling one house c) pikeys That has got to be enough to say "yes he probably said something threatening as he ran off, or something, be right... what... oh yeah 2 sugars mate..."

[Seandesy1]

I take it you mean the difference between arresting someone and interviewing them, and some voluntarily attending a police station to be questioned?

Arresting someone allows the police to detain them until all necessary and timely evidence has been gathered, the accused/defendants can be held incommunicado and those arrested are allowed free legal advice. Those requested to attend a police station voluntarily can disappear and never turn up, speak to other involved to get a story straight and must pay for their own legal advice.

As much as I'd like to agree that they are the victims of a masked burglary gang theres far too little information out there to assume any is innocent or guilty. Once the available evidence has been collected and those arrested interviewed if it is established that their actions were reasonable they will be NFA'd.

I'll happily admit that the courts and CPS are too lenient these days. In my line of work locking up a prolific burlgar with over 40 previous convictions who I caught after he was seen on CCTV smashing into a pub, located by myself with £500 in coins on him and arrested, followed by 6 hours of paperwork only to be given 4 months in the pokey makes me wonder why I do what I do sometimes.

[Biker Biggles]

I take it you mean the difference between arresting someone and interviewing them, and some voluntarily attending a police station to be questioned?

Arresting someone allows the police to detain them until all necessary and timely evidence has been gathered, the accused/defendants can be held incommunicado and those arrested are allowed free legal advice. Those requested to attend a police station voluntarily can disappear and never turn up, speak to other involved to get a story straight and must pay for their own legal advice.

As much as I'd like to agree that they are the victims of a masked burglary gang theres far too little information out there to assume any is innocent or guilty. Once the available evidence has been collected and those arrested interviewed if it is established that their actions were reasonable they will be NFA'd.

I'll happily admit that the courts and CPS are too lenient these days. In my line of work locking up a prolific burlgar with over 40 previous convictions who I caught after he was seen on CCTV smashing into a pub, located by myself with £500 in coins on him and arrested, followed by 6 hours of paperwork only to be given 4 months in the pokey makes me wonder why I do what I do sometimes.

You do it for the money and that gold plated public sector pension like that nice man in the government said.;)

As for the OP I'm sure it was all a big mistake.The four intruders were all going to a fancy dress party but got the wrong address.The householders were having a bring and buy sale but one was dyslexic and thought it was a ring and die sale.:notworthy:

[timwilky]

Playing devils advocate, but someone died, therefore the arrest of those involved is the quickest and easiest way of establishing exactly what the course of events was.

Whose to say this chap wasnt running away and then the householders got him and stabbed him to death? Theres reasonable force and then theres excessive force. Smashing someone round the head with a bat whilst in your house might be reasonable, doing it whilst they are running away or cornered in one room might not be.

Giving people free reign to smash/stab/beat someone to death without the fear of investigation is the start of a long slippery slope.

Playing devils advocate here myself. You don't attempt to burgle a house with your mates, you can spend the night at home with your loved ones. Don't do the crime if you don't want to lie on a slab.

Believe me everyone has the instinct to kill, it just needs bringing to the surface. Been there and suppressed the urge after 3 hours of looking for the scroat/vandal/thief.

Maybe if we applied victorian punishment to petty thieves their offending ways would be nipped in the bud.

On my property without permission you have abdicated any rights

[daved407]

If someone is in my castle uninvited, they deserve what they get. Its not rocket science. Death is a high price to pay but touch my property and thats what you may get. Minimum force or twenty stab wounds they were not where good boys should be at that time of day.

[bigchris]

Well I've a baseball bat beside the bed and as the saying goes "I don't know Karate, but I know Kerr-azy and I'm willing to use it".

Lol :-) made me chuckle this did, are you a black belt in Kerr-azy? I may have to give it a go!!

[martin15s]

It sounds as if there is lot more to this. Four masked men commit a burglary before midnight???

[Kenzie]

I agree that this country is completely geared to the criminal. You never have this troube stateside because if you rob someone you know full well you may get shot by the owner. You step on my property univited with the intention of robbing me all your human rights should be revoked. All too often I see in the news where someone has stood up to these scum and has had the full weight of the law brought against them while the "poor little crim" who has had a hard life and his mother didn't love him enough gets a slap on the wrist. I'm sick of it and there needs to be change. Guy gets electrocuted stealing copper from a substation, family says he was a good guy etc and didn't deserve to die. Well maybe if he wasn't a theiving pikey he would still be alive! Going to leave it at that as I may rant for a while as things like this make my blood boil.

[grimey121uk]

I agree that this country is completely geared to the criminal. You never have this troube stateside because if you rob someone you know full well you may get shot by the owner. You step on my property univited with the intention of robbing me all your human rights should be revoked. All too often I see in the news where someone has stood up to these scum and has had the full weight of the law brought against them while the "poor little crim" who has had a hard life and his mother didn't love him enough gets a slap on the wrist. I'm sick of it and there needs to be change. Guy gets electrocuted stealing copper from a substation, family says he was a good guy etc and didn't deserve to die. Well maybe if he wasn't a theiving pikey he would still be alive! Going to leave it at that as I may rant for a while as things like this make my blood boil.

We had a young lad around here who stole an off road bike with his mate on the back with no helmets, driving around on the road with no lights at 2:00am and then he came off and died. The local paper said it was tragic and he was described as cheeky. I describe it as a good thing he killed himself before he carried on stealing bikes and killed some innocent pedestrian, if someone stole my bike I'd pray to god they killed themselves

[Kenzie]

Usually when they are killed the parents come out and say "oh little Timmy was such a good boy, we don't know why he would do something like this" or they say he has adhd and learning problems etc. It's just bad parenting when it comes down to it. If they can't dicipline their children when they do wrong they won't fear the consequences. When I were younger (lol coming from a 27 year old) I knew if I did wrong I would get a hiding from my dad. There is none of this now and the little buggers run wild saying if you touch me I'll call social on you.

[Stenno]

Wowser. If you play with fire, expect to get burnt!

[The Idle Biker]

It sounds as if there is lot more to this. Four masked men commit a burglary before midnight???

^^^^^^^^
What he said.

[timwilky]

And it turns out the "victim" of the alleged murder or one of the alleged perpetrators of the attempted burglary was already on bail for (yes you have guessed it ) burglary (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-13900285)

starting to sound as if he was at it again

[FG1]

There may well be more to this than we are all aware of but my view is that if you live by the sword you die by the sword.
OK, so there were 4 masked crims in the house. If the owners werent being burgled and it was a more sinister intention then the dead guy still got what he deserved.
The bottom line is the dead guy was walking on thin ice doing what he was. He lost and died, tough titty.
Wether the householders are guilty or innocent will come out later but the dead guy definately got what he deserved.
Anybody who thinks its harsh should have their property broken into while they are in the house. This rule of minimum force is bolx. If you are going to drop somebody you do it so they dont get back up. Why on earth somebody thinks that a scared, panacking person can use controlled force in a situation like that is beyond me.
Anyway, rant over.
Rot in hell dead guy.

[Kenzie]

Karma, he got what he deserved.

[maviczap]

I agree that this country is completely geared to the criminal

Yes just look what happened today in the Levi Belfield trial, the trial on the 2nd murder hes supposed to have committed was stopped after his defence team complained that he couldn't have a fair trial because of 'adverse publicity' :mad:

Plus the defence barrister ripped into Milly Dowlers parents accusing them of this and that, as if it was their fault she was killed. How do these lawyers sleep at night.

At least Levi got his just deserts too, life imprisionment, with no parole

[Milky Bar Kid]

Yes just look what happened today in the Levi Belfield trial, the trial on the 2nd murder hes supposed to have committed was stopped after his defence team complained that he couldn't have a fair trial because of 'adverse publicity' :mad:

Plus the defence barrister ripped into Milly Dowlers parents accusing them of this and that, as if it was their fault she was killed. How do these lawyers sleep at night.

At least Levi got his just deserts too, life imprisionment, with no parole

I am really glad that Milly's sister spoke out about this. I hope the lawyer has a hard time sleeping.

[maviczap]

I am really glad that Milly's sister spoke out about this. I hope the lawyer has a hard time sleeping.

I very much doubt it, in all my dealing with the other side they don't have a concience, just £ signs in their eyes from the legal aid money they get for defending hopelessly unwinable cases.

[Balky001]

I very much doubt it, in all my dealing with the other side they don't have a concience, just £ signs in their eyes from the legal aid money they get for defending hopelessly unwinable cases.

Ha ha can you imagine Cherie Blair and her elitist crew losing sleep over there methods. The guy didn't invite 4 masked robbers to his house. Is one supposed to find out just how bad they will hurt you and family before acting. They brought it on themselves and I doubt they had anyone's feelings except their own greed in their minds. The country is run by lawyers who prefer technicalities and criminal defence than quality of life for law abiding people.

[maviczap]

The country is run by lawyers who prefer technicalities and criminal defence than quality of life for law abiding people.

Agreed, quote from the BBC's legal correspondant this morning said it all. As an ex defence lawyer himself, he said that if their client said they were innocent, they were duly obliged to defend their client to the limit, even if that meant some unpleasant questioning techniques.

So they go along with the strangely warped mind of a killer like Levi Bellfield, who says he's innocent?

I couldn't as a layman see the relavance of of questioning Millys mum & dad as to who was the favourite child in their household, which may have caused her to run away at somepoint.

FFS, she was abducted on her way home, how is the above question relevant :confused:

[Specialone]

I know it's derailing this thread a bit but the milly dowling trial details that I heard about this morning makes me sick.
Her parents shouldn't have even been in the dock IMO, as MBK said, I'm glad their daughter named the fecking scumbag of a defence lawyer.

What really sickens me is they said it upset them more than hearing the news of millys death, that's terrible, I hope one day the defence have to go through similar pain and see how it feels.

[Red Herring]

I've been in the dock numerous times when the defense start throwing mud just hoping some of it sticks and discredits your evidence. As a "professional" it's easy for me to work around and I usually throw some of it back but I really do feel for the civilian witnesses, especially if they are also the victim. A good prosecution, clerk or judge (depending on the court) should step in and control it, and from I've read about this latest case there is some flak due their way as well for not doing so.

Back to the OP, not a lot of sympathy for the burglar going to come from me and I can only seek reassurance that the real victim here will be judged finally by his peers, that's you and me folks. History has shown us that even with the legal profession jumping through all their politically correct hoops eventually justice does seem to prevail, it's just not a very pleasant journey for those involved.

[metalangel]

A bit of Devil's Advocaat: I invite you into my house. I brutally stab you to death. I tell the cops you broke in.

[Red Herring]

Yeah, but I'm not on bail for burglary, I haven't bought a knife with me, or three other friends with their faces covered....

[Owenski]

A bit of Devil's Advocaat: I invite you into my house. I brutally stab you to death. I tell the cops you broke in.

Did you also ask 3 blokes to wear masks and wait around the back of your house then pay them a substational amount of money to dump a body before disapearing?
If your been super sceptical its not a "terrible" way to give yourself a fair shout at getting away with murder.

Personally though Im a bit dim and I'll just see it for what it seems, that is until evidence suggests otherwise.

[Balky001]

A bit of Devil's Advocaat: I invite you into my house. I brutally stab you to death. I tell the cops you broke in.

any law is open to absue. I invite myself to your house, stab you to death and say it was in self defence.... Did make me think of Sleeping with the Enemy though!

[metalangel]

@Owenski and RH, I'm not applying my statement just to this one case, stop trying to deflect it with comments about there being three other criminals with balaclavas or that you were carrying a knife I could easily have planted on your body. The point I'm trying to make is that if you allow lethal force against intruders then there is the very real risk that you could just kill people and claim they were an intruder, 'reasonable force' seems like a cop-out but at least it stops murderous vigilantism.

[Owenski]

I can see how you read it that way following on from RH's post, however I was actually mirroring your sentiment. Maybe if I'd written it more like this:

" If your been super sceptical its not a "terrible" way to give yourself a fair shout at getting away with a murder.
Pay 3 blokes to wear masks and wait around the back of your house and let them know there will be a nice cash payout if they can dump a body anywhere that its going to be found quickly.

Saying that I'd rather not believe people could be so crappy so I'll wait until we're told different from what we currently have been by the media."

If I had said it like that then maybe you'd have seen it more as it were intended, but I didnt and alas you now have an appology.

[Balky001]

you'd be better paying three blokes to do the deed for you and have no 'connection' with it at all (although the 3 will go canary if caught no doubt)

It's better to lead an honest and virtuous life, just like all of the Org'ers do

[-Ralph-]

as the saying goes "I don't know Karate, but I know Kerr-azy and I'm willing to use it".

+1, I once opened my front door to confront a burglar as I was woken by the door being kicked in, turns out it was my neighbor after 12 pints trying to kick what he thought was his door in, after he couldn't get his key to turn in the lock. It was the type of anger that means I would have done anything though.

Matt, most people say they'd do this or that, but the fact is when faced with situations like this you'd probably cak your pants or get into a panic.
I'm not sure how I'd react, depends how many were in my house, I'd like to think a man of my size while in attack mode would scare the average run of the mill burglar into scarpering pronto

really? Im pretty sure I'd **** my pants grab the nearest object to me and thrash around screaming like pufter in a titty bar and if I managed to hit anything other than the fridge, freezer or microwave I'd be pretty damn pleased with myself.

Whilst I do know how I'd react, because it's happened, what Owenski has posted is very valid. The anger and the intention to kill the barsteward would be there, but I'm no trained killer and may end up getting more hurt than I do the hurting, but I'd definitely have a go.

So scaring the sh!t out of the burglar is probably the best defence your average person has, especially when you are 6ft, 15 stone, fair white skin, ginger and you sleep naked! ;)

The day I confronted my neighbor, I did charge towards the door naked and realised that about 2 ft from the door, so went back and grabbed a dressing gown, then charged back towards the door again, but if he had already got through the door, he wouldn't have been faced with a pretty sight. When I got out of bed there was nothing on my mind except "there ain't no barsteward going to get away with kicking MY door in". Had I not been knocked off my perch when I opened the door and recognised my neighbor, somebody would have been going to hospital, either him or me.

Your average bloke is not a trained killer, or particularly mental enough to grab a knife stab somebody to death, so gut instinct and the arrest for murder tells me the 'victim' in this was probably a bit of a psycho and had a bit of practice in a fight or two, so he was probably into something himself, he probably knew the attackers and they didn't go in there to get his TV they went in there to get him. They maybe didn't count on his son being there, who from the sounds of it can handle himself too.

[BigBaddad]

Just a thought, the 3 other scroats that carried him off, are they guilty of causing the death for carrying him off and dumping him rather than either leaving him put or getting him medical assistance.

[Red Herring]

Your average bloke is not a trained killer, or particularly mental enough to grab a knife stab somebody to death, so gut instinct and the arrest for murder tells me the 'victim' in this was probably a bit of a psycho and had a bit of practice in a fight or two, so he was probably into something himself, he probably knew the attackers and they didn't go in there to get his TV they went in there to get him. They maybe didn't count on his son being there, who from the sounds of it can handle himself too.

I don't know why we bother with investigating anything these days, or having trials.

[metalangel]

I can see how you read it that way following on from RH's post, however I was actually mirroring your sentiment. Maybe if I'd written it more like this:

" If your been super sceptical its not a "terrible" way to give yourself a fair shout at getting away with a murder.
Pay 3 blokes to wear masks and wait around the back of your house and let them know there will be a nice cash payout if they can dump a body anywhere that its going to be found quickly.

Sorry, I understand now.

[-Ralph-]

I don't know why we bother with investigating anything these days, or having trials.

Precisely, you should just ask me! Duh! :D ;)

[Red Herring]

Precisely, you should just ask me! Duh! :D ;)

You haven't been at any music festivals over the weekend have you...?

[-Ralph-]

You haven't been at any music festivals over the weekend have you...?

Worse mate, the GM.

Go on, read it again and admit it! It was a damn good bit of rhetoric wasn't it? ;)

[Luckypants]

and common sense prevails..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-14248097

What's the betting the three charged with aggravated burglary will be let out on bail and they pay this bloke a visit?

[timwilky]

Interesting to read what we were not originally told that one of the intruders was carrying machete. The right decision

[maviczap]

Interesting to read what we were not originally told that one of the intruders was carrying machete.

Yes, but his defence brief will come up with a story that he'd come round to clear some excess vegitation in the back garden. :mad:

[DJFridge]

Interesting to read what we were not originally told that one of the intruders was carrying machete. The right decision

That's only because the police don't sell EVERY detail to the media, only some of it. If they gave everything away, all trials would get thrown out as mistrials due to prejudiced juries and nobody would be convicted of anything anymore.