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Not sure if this is posted elsewhere (am on my phone) but WTF?!
Why has FIFA banned us from wearing a poppy on the English shirt?
Also, where is the petition, I want to sign it.
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Specialone
08-11-11, 05:47 PM
Actually i was fuming at first, but after hearing the reasons and giving it some thought, i fully agree with their decision.
What's the reasons? I tried searching earlier but couldn't find anything...
Personally I think it is disgusting, if others are offended (which I'm guessing they are?) then they have to deal with that.
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Specialone
08-11-11, 07:18 PM
It's mainly about politics, if they allow it for us, other countries will want to follow suit so warring nations could use it as a political tool.
I haven't explained it very well tbh but when I heard it on the news explained in a FIFA statement ( I think) it made a lot of sense.
Specialone
08-11-11, 07:25 PM
Best I could find for now...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/15643295.stm
JamesMio
08-11-11, 07:31 PM
It was along the lines of, what if England happen to have to play Germany around the time of Remembrance Day.
It's not necessarily something that's likely to happen, but it 'is' possible - and I suppose, for that reason it's probably among the very, very few sensible decisions ever made by Fifa.
That's PC gone crazy once again.
Schools aren't teaching what they should about the wars these days, one day it will all be forgotten.
FIFA shouldn't even have a say over this sort of thing. If its political, then lead it to the politicians.
All england shirts (regardless of which sport) should have a poppy or some sort of remembrance symbol on it!
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I can see Fifa's point of view, but I would rather see it whereby a nation can declare an intent to wear a symbol of rememberance and then other nations have a fortnight to oppose it.
That's PC gone crazy once again.
Schools aren't teaching what they should about the wars these days, one day it will all be forgotten.
FIFA shouldn't even have a say over this sort of thing. If its political, then lead it to the politicians.
All england shirts (regardless of which sport) should have a poppy or some sort of remembrance symbol on it!
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Well, no it isn't really when you think it through. If our teams were allowed to wear a poppie on their kit, then it logically follows that teams from other nations would be allowed to wear their own iconography/emblems/symbolism on their kit. We might take offence at whatever it is that their symbol is supposed to represent...it suddenly becomes a bit political on the playing field which by extension adds an extra layer of political shenanigans and xenophobic headlines in the press etc etc.
Lets just not have any of this whilst we're having a game of footie - that way, we can concentrate on the game, without the politics and hatred. After the game has finished, the players can wear whatever they like...it's only for ninety minutes.
Specialone
09-11-11, 11:57 AM
Well, no it isn't really when you think it through. If our teams were allowed to wear a poppie on their kit, then it logically follows that teams from other nations would be allowed to wear their own iconography/emblems/symbolism on their kit. We might take offence at whatever it is that their symbol is supposed to represent...it suddenly becomes a bit political on the playing field which by extension adds an extra layer of political shenanigans and xenophobic headlines in the press etc etc.
Lets just not have any of this whilst we're having a game of footie - that way, we can concentrate on the game, without the politics and hatred. After the game has finished, the players can wear whatever they like...it's only for ninety minutes.
100% agree and I'm a massive patriot.
Can you imagine what effects it would have if two unfriendly middle eastern sides meet and they use shirts as a taunt or something, could cause further conflict, it's not like they need much excuse.
Drew Carey
09-11-11, 12:26 PM
Well, no it isn't really when you think it through. If our teams were allowed to wear a poppie on their kit, then it logically follows that teams from other nations would be allowed to wear their own iconography/emblems/symbolism on their kit. We might take offence at whatever it is that their symbol is supposed to represent...it suddenly becomes a bit political on the playing field which by extension adds an extra layer of political shenanigans and xenophobic headlines in the press etc etc.
Lets just not have any of this whilst we're having a game of footie - that way, we can concentrate on the game, without the politics and hatred. After the game has finished, the players can wear whatever they like...it's only for ninety minutes.
+2.....this was what I was in the middle of typing but couldn't make it sound correct....so cancelled my post. lol
Coming from a military family I have nothing but respect for what those in the forces have done and will continue to do. I have family and friends that have passed away in forces and served their lives for this country. It is a shame that footballers cannot wear a poppy, but 100% agree that with the real risk of turning it political / even more confrontational than it is is not worth it. In fact, I am suprised that the FA took it that far and made it such a media storm.
BigBaddad
09-11-11, 12:30 PM
I agree with FIFA on this one....but just a thought can The British Legion sponsor the team, say for £1
Drew Carey
09-11-11, 01:17 PM
I see camerons view is now available for all to watch
Personally, think we should all get on with remembering and not worrying about 11 other men wearing them.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15657467
We aren't talking about having the poppy on the kit forever, just one game...
Other countries can do the same (temporary, for one match only)
I dont see how this can even become a problem... It's a matter or remembrance, any team found to be doing anything other, would not be allowed to do it.
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Biker Biggles
09-11-11, 06:23 PM
Looks like FIFA have done a u turn in the face of cameron and royalty telling them off
maviczap
09-11-11, 06:40 PM
We aren't talking about having the poppy on the kit forever, just one game...
Other countries can do the same (temporary, for one match only)
I dont see how this can even become a problem... It's a matter or remembrance, any team found to be doing anything other, would not be allowed to do it.
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I agree with the reasons for doing this, and to put it simply as I can think
then if we were allowed to wear the poppy eblem then if another Adolf Hitler came along he'd be able to say he wanted his team to wear a swastika or SS skulls head eblem, especially if he was playing the Isreali national team
I agree with the reasons for doing this, and to put it simply as I can think
then if we were allowed to wear the poppy eblem then if another Adolf Hitler came along he'd be able to say he wanted his team to wear a swastika or SS skulls head eblem, especially if he was playing the Isreali national team
Well, not really..
If the swastika was an emblem of remembrance, then yes, fine, for that game. It wouldn't be permanent.
However,
They used that during the war, we didn't use the poppy...
The poppy is a post war emblem, therefore completely different and nothing to do with trying to stir up hatred of any type.
Any other country would be the same.
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maviczap
09-11-11, 07:42 PM
Yes, but other countries might see the poppy emblem as remembering the war, not the fallen soldiers and therefore might find it offensive and imflamatrory, the same way as we would see anyone wearing a swastika now.
We know what the poppy is for, other countries may not, so to save problems, not allowed
dizzyblonde
09-11-11, 09:20 PM
Funnily enough the Germans were in support of wearing the poppy during the match, so I think that puts that sort of arguement to bed.
maviczap
09-11-11, 09:31 PM
Yes, I'm aware of that, but I was using the swastika as a good example of an imflamatory symbol
It could be any image, a picture of George W Bush on the american teams shirt for another example
I understand what you are saying but the swastika was a symbol used DURING the war, used as a threat, therefore that would be unacceptable.
If Germany wanted to remember their dead from the war by wearing a picture of, let's say... A polar bear (I'm currently watching frozen planet!) then who are we/FIFA to say no?! And I, for one, would definitely not disagree with any country doing such thing.
Honour the dead who made us who we are, don't hide it.
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DJFridge
09-11-11, 11:03 PM
Oh FFS! It's 22 very, very stupid people being paid vast sums to chase a bag of wind around for 90 minutes. Who really gives a ****? Personally I thought the idea of wearing poppies for the line up and have the armed forces represented on the pitch beforehand seemed like a perfectly sensible solution.
Littlepeahead
10-11-11, 12:30 PM
The England Cricket team left for the Ashes just before 11/11 last year and we did an official team photo here at Lord's. The England & Wales cricket board sent someone over to get poppies from our shop for the team to wear, which was a great idea, but they took about 20 poppies and put £1, yes just £1 in the pot in total.
I spoke to their media manager and the team director and suggested they increase that donation a bit or I might just casually mention the ECB's meanness to the media who were there that day. More cash was then sent over.
It wasn't the players' fault, they were all keen to wear the poppy and they all do loads for Help For Heroes, RBL and visit the injured service men rehab centres regularly.
I understand what you are saying but the swastika was a symbol used DURING the war, used as a threat, therefore that would be unacceptable.
If Germany wanted to remember their dead from the war by wearing a picture of, let's say... A polar bear (I'm currently watching frozen planet!) then who are we/FIFA to say no?! And I, for one, would definitely not disagree with any country doing such thing.
Honour the dead who made us who we are, don't hide it.
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I see your point, however the Swastika as far as Germany was concerned at that time was not actually used because it threatened people. It was only later that it became controversial, and that was in part because it was associated with what Nazi Germany did - the symbol itself initially was akin to the Red rose of the labour party (UK) or the hammer and sickle of communist Russia...
In 1920, Adolf Hitler decided that the Nazi Party needed its own insignia and flag. For Hitler, the new flag had to be "a symbol of our own struggle" as well as "highly effective as a poster." (Mein Kampf, pg. 495)
On August 7, 1920, at the Salzburg Congress, this flag became the official emblem of the Nazi Party.
In Mein Kampf, Hitler described the Nazis' new flag: "In red we see the social idea of the movement, in white the nationalistic idea, in the swastika the mission of the struggle for the victory of the Aryan man, and, by the same token, the victory of the idea of creative work, which as such always has been and always will be anti-Semitic." (pg. 496-497) Because of the Nazis' flag, the swastika soon became a symbol of hate, antisemitism, violence, death, and murder.
see here...
http://history1900s.about.com/cs/swastika/a/swastikahistory.htm
Ok perhaps not used to threaten people, but show someone that symbol during the war and that person (not German) would feel threatened or at least know what it meant and what it meant.
The poppy wouldn't mean anything to anyone at the time.
Anyhoo, argument over.... We are going to wear them!
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