Sleety/snowy riding

[missyburd]

Thought this might be a good place for those more experienced riders among us to share a bit of advice for the newbies about to embark on their first winters on bigger bikes...one of 'em being me. Sort of on a par with Motorpsych's nigghtime riding thread.

Although this is my second winter on my own bike, last year I was on a 125, so nice skinny tyres much better suited to the white stuff.

This year I'm better equipped with a Pinlock, heated grips I can have on more than the lowest setting and proper quilted textiles.

Last night I made the normal 10 mile commute home at about ten at night. I'd seen the snow coming down about half8. Also seen a gritter going up just minutes before. I work on a cobbled street and cobbles + snow do no mix well so I was a little worried but by the time I left to go home the grit had done it's job and the snow had stopped. Bike covered in snow (parked outside at work), she starts first time, heated grips on and away we go, me taking it very easy. I'd forgotten to stick my gloves on the heater after them getting wet on the way to work so unfortunately they were damp and hence my hands were frozen within 5 mins of me getting on the road :-(

All pretty much fine until I get to the higher bits of my way home, cold winds get up and I find these bits have not been gritted, oh the joy. Half inch to an inch in places. Not much I know but enough to make my back end fishtail round a particularly nasty bend at about 15mph (ironically next to the massive grit pile that provides for the area :p). So that shook me up a bit but hand was not going anywhere near the brakes and that's where it was staying. I was making sure to be in higher gears where possible and staying in the car tracks at about 20-25mph I kept going.

Then I come across a flock of about 20 sheep break away from a field on my left, looked like they'd just escaped. Great. I slow right down but really don't want to stop as there were crosswinds and I try not to stop at this bit because I nearly get blown over when I do. And I'd need to use brakes, don't do that if I can help it in these conditions! A few of the sheep stop to face me in the middle of my side of the road next to the traffic island but I ain't stopping. The snow is an inch to my right and I wasn't riding over it to go round them so I move slowly as far over to the right of my side as possible, slow enough for the stragglers to rejoin the flock and start 'em running on the left. I know there's a track on the left that goes to a cricket club, plenty of room for the sheep and sure enough they all dive down it and I can carry on, HUGE sigh of relief. I had a car behind me at this point but I can't pick up speed, the road is still covered and not many cars have been along here late on a Sunday night. The driver behind was pretty good and was giving me plenty of room.

I get home with no further hiccups, sticking to the main roads where possible. I find the ones closer to home have been gritted properly so can ride as normal. Then I just have to endure a very painful ten minutes with my gloves off, as the blood returns to my fingers :(



My bike's my only transport, obviously if the weather is real bad I wouldn't ride but in those conditions where you either feel it's not too bad and you can "give it a go" or you get caught out, how best to deal with it?

Riding in higher gears, changing gear as smoothly as possible to avoid sudden jerky movements, sticking to car tracks...What else can you do?

Cheers in advance,

MYC :-)

[Sally]

Be smooth, in every aspect.

Don't shut the throttle quickly, successfully locked my rear doing that last year and slid down the road.

Everything else seems bang on, keeping on the car tracks, low revs, engine braking blah blah

I have been known to ride when its really bad with my feet off the pegs and stretched out, like stabilisers when the back end kicks out so I can try to correct it. Looks silly, but I find it works and gives me more piece of mind too.

If you have to choose between riding on snow or slush, choose snow.

This is my 5th winter of riding through it, last winter I ended up taking the bus a lot of I wasn't as daft as I was when I was younger.

[Sally]

Most importantly, always carry a lighter.

When it gets really cold the ignition barrel can freeze/stick.

Heat the keys up, insert into ignition barrel, wait a while than try turning it again.

Repeat until it turns, you can't try any winter riding if you cant start the bike! :)

[NTECUK]

Your a God.
All the years I have had a bike as soon as it snows I fall off it.
I had to stick a side car on my RD in the days when I only had bike..and still crashed it several times .

[missyburd]

Most importantly, always carry a lighter.

When it gets really cold the ignition barrel can freeze/stick.

Heat the keys up, insert into ignition barrel, wait a while than try turning it again.

Repeat until it turns, you can't try any winter riding if you cant start the bike! :)

A very good point, not being a smoker I don't automatically have one with me, I shall remedy this.

Your a God.
All the years I have had a bike as soon as it snows I fall off it.
I had to stick a side car on my RD in the days when I only had bike..and still crashed it several times .

Not a god, far bloody from it. I just have no choice, got to work, got to ride. I did buses for years and believe me, it is a VERY last resort.

[plowsie]

Stay loose and calm.

Soon as you stiffen up, you start to twitch etc...if you get a twitch don't overthink it, move on and carry on, think about it when you get home, the road requires your concentration.

Apply forces gently (acceleration, braking, turning etc).

Loosey goose!

[Owenski]

Ice is worse than snow, if you can ride in the ice you'll do snow no trouble.

If you're coming off in snow its quite a slow process, your travelling slow already and I found I knew it was going wrong a good 10m before it went. Once you know its going, stay off the power and do your best to keep the bike perpendicular to the tarmac. You may be fortunate and roll/slide to a stop, stay on the bike and try and walk it whilist gently using the power to aid your steps.

[punyXpress]

If you haven't already, take spare levers ( old 'shortened' ones with a blob of plastic metal will get you home ) and a fixer-peg and you'll never need them.
Best of luck with it!

[Seggons]

When I went through 2 winters I found it best not to ride in the car tyre tracks. If enough snow comes down the cars compact it and that becomes ice. I found I had much better grip in the fresh snow in the middle.

[Jayneflakes]

I only rode in snow once on the SV and found it surprisingly firm footed. Corners were terrifying because I could feel the snow compacting under the wheels, but she stayed up right and did well. Riding while it was snowing was horrible, my visor froze, visibility was low and some car drivers drove like utter twunts, one even cut me up. If I get caught again this winter, the bike will be going home and being sat in the garage just like last year. Snow and Ice for me means crampons and walking. I wish you all luck if you have to ride in those conditions, you are far braver than I.

I rode home from Portishead along the M5 and then the A370, the snow was three inches deep by the time I got into Weston and I found that riding in the centre of the lane, away from car tracks, meant I had more traction. However, once it settled and went crisp, I was riding with my feet down like outriggers.

[Dicky Ticker]

Sounds silly ,but keep warm,even if it means stopping and having a stomp about to get the circulation going to all the extremities.When you are cold and frozen your reactions and "Feel" slow down drastically.Better to be a couple of minutes late than a lifetime dead.

I love my little airconditioned car:D

[STRAMASHER]

Was too slippy in the snow this morning for 1st gear (I found :pale::p ), so was bopping away from a stop in 2nd.

I'll don't avoid big puddles/floods and piles of grit or gravel, they are a relief in the snow.

Wish I had a trailie still though.

[hindle8907]

Slow,gentle,smooth.

thats its really, I've came off on ice a few times over the past 5 years, it doesn't Bother me its the ££££ that do for new gear/brake selectors. :p

[TSM]

Always carry a charged phone, in cold weather your battery dies very quickly.
Ride higher gears so it wont spin up as quickly if it breaks traction.
If you do stop dont take clothes off and try not to sweat or you will freeze.
Ultimatly if worried leave it at home or work and get different method of transport, its not worth the risks somtimes.

[Seggons]

Oh and enjoy that warm fuzzy feeling when you get to work on your motorcycle and find not many others there because "the conditions were too bad to get the car out". :lol:

[andrewsmith]

Always carry a charged phone, in cold weather your battery dies very quickly.
Ride higher gears so it wont spin up as quickly if it breaks traction.
If you do stop dont take clothes off and try not to sweat or you will freeze.
Ultimatly if worried leave it at home or work and get different method of transport, its not worth the risks somtimes.

This.

Like Matt's said if you can control it in ice snow is a breeze.

[missyburd]

When I went through 2 winters I found it best not to ride in the car tyre tracks. If enough snow comes down the cars compact it and that becomes ice. I found I had much better grip in the fresh snow in the middle.

I found that riding in the centre of the lane, away from car tracks, meant I had more traction. However, once it settled and went crisp, I was riding with my feet down like outriggers.

Aye, I agree with you about not riding in the car tracks when snow compacted. I could ride in the tracks in the conditions mentioned in my OP because the snow/hail fall was fresh.



Wish I had a trailie still though.

We supposedly have a DT125 on it's way to being ready for use this winter, I'm not holding my breath though ;)

Always carry a charged phone, in cold weather your battery dies very quickly.
Something I always make sure to do. Being female and naturally paranoid, I don't particularly want to break down on my own somewhere only to find my phone dead!

Ultimatly if worried leave it at home or work and get different method of transport, its not worth the risks somtimes.

+1, I'm not so stupid as to attempt heroics in thick snow, for a start I wouldn't be able to get up the drive ;)

[Dunn-y]

Once the snow and ice start I just put my bike away and use public transport. I would hate to drop it when I could have easily took the bus/metro.

[missyburd]

Once the snow and ice start I just put my bike away and use public transport. I would hate to drop it when I could have easily took the bus/metro.
Standing around waiting for buses in the cold is just as bad in my book, and a waste of my time. And the fact it takes 3 times as long to get anywhere, and costs 5 times as much in fares.

[Dunn-y]

I understand if it's the only/best way of getting to work. If I was in your position I would probably do the same.

[punyXpress]

[QUOTE=missyorkie_chris;2634335]

" Something I always make sure to do. Being female and naturally paranoid, I don't particularly want to break down on my own somewhere only to find my phone dead! " /QUOTE]

If you really are out in the sticks, check you get a signal. Changed my route back from GM and was glad to see a .org grease monkey approaching . . . and clearing off! :confused: ;)

[Spoonie]

Gotta give a +1 for feet out, they help with quick small corrections that you really don't want to make with the steering when it's snowy

As for snow, or car tracks - use common sense, either is fine as long as the base of it isn't ice - if it is, there is a good chance things will go sideways really quick

Anticipation is key, locking the front wheel is the worst thing I managed to do whilst I was out in snow last year. All because I was a bit heavy on the front brake slowing myself down for a T junction.

On the plus side, if they go down I find SV's don't pick up as much damage in the snow as they do in the wet lol

[AndyBrad]

Can you park off the cobbles? That to me seems the best idea. I got another pair of those anti freeze gloves and have hand warmers at the ready. I don't have heated grips. I'm not 100% sold on them tbh as my hands get so cold.

In the sloppy stuff you need to decide where to ride yourself. Going where you think there might be grip can sometimes be a bad idea. I good example is the roads on my commute the wheel tracks for cars are like polished tarmac making them very slippery.

Oh the other thing is start using your back brake both on its own and combined with the front. It will make you a lot safer in winter and more importantly quicker in summer ;)

[missyburd]

Can you park off the cobbles? That to me seems the best idea.
Parking on cobbles means parking on double yellers so I park very awkwardly on a bit of paving just wider than the bike, on a hill perpendicular to cobbles.

I got another pair of those anti freeze gloves and have hand warmers at the ready. I don't have heated grips. I'm not 100% sold on them tbh as my hands get so cold.
Tbh, when it's really cold the handgrips are useless but they do provide a bit of comfort as you naturally feel warmer than you would with just cold grips.

In the sloppy stuff you need to decide where to ride yourself. Going where you think there might be grip can sometimes be a bad idea. I good example is the roads on my commute the wheel tracks for cars are like polished tarmac making them very slippery.

Oh the other thing is start using your back brake both on its own and combined with the front. It will make you a lot safer in winter and more importantly quicker in summer ;)
True true, but then I already do this. Only at slow speeds.


:-)

[dizzyblonde]

Andy.......you ever been to Bronte country?

Its hill with cobbles, with hills and cobbles running off it.

With nice clampers that hide behind the bushes!

[AndyBrad]

Na, rode past it once when I was trying to find Halifax.... yea sense of direction isn't that great :)

[chrisinflight]

+1 stay off the cobbles! Thankfully all the cobbled roads around here are topped with tarmac.

[missyburd]

+1 stay off the cobbles! Thankfully all the cobbled roads around here are topped with tarmac.
Actually, compared to the little bit of paving I park on, the cobbles are probably the safer option. I have to be blumin careful backing the SV down this sliver of stone, it gets very slippy, usually with algae. I will be putting some grit down on it tomorrow.

[yorkie_chris]

So what is the best thing to do with your tyres on snow? Drop the pressures down to hopefully get more contact patch and spit-out of whatever snow sticks in the treads? Or keep them hard so they've got more chance of biting in?

[DJ123]

if you lower the tyre pressures (too much) the tread closes up and can't work as it was designed to do. it will probably make it worse to handle

[andrewsmith]

Higher PSI Chris. It give the grooves full shape and gives them a chance to clear the snow and ice before the tyre digs in. You thinking about the SV or XJ here?
Failing that buy a cheap 4 stroke 125 traile (or something that can run offroad tyres)*

Lower would be like riding with a road legal slick in the rain.
As a note on a car this is the reverse as a lower PSI opens up the treads more

*General Note as some 125's can run common size road and offroad tyres (I think the older CG/CB's can and possibly the EN's)

[yorkie_chris]

Either really

[andrewsmith]

Either really

Cheng Shung Bakalite rear won't help on the XJ.

The idea me, you and Berlin discussed would be the best idea (if you can get hold of the block tread pattern style)

[NTECUK]

Don't lower the pressure in cars either.
Makes the thing unstable.

[Teejayexc]

Actually, compared to the little bit of paving I park on, the cobbles are probably the safer option. I have to be blumin careful backing the SV down this sliver of stone, it gets very slippy, usually with algae. I will be putting some grit down on it tomorrow.


If you can ride up/down that *thing* you call a drive I don't think you need have any concerns about cobbles :notworthy:

[Dicky Ticker]

Try and get hold of a set of track day wets which would probably last though out the cold weather as the tyre will not be heating up.

[yorkie_chris]

Try and get hold of a set of track day wets which would probably last though out the cold weather as the tyre will not be heating up.

I am looking for some, maybe your lad has some? :D

After the block tread preferably. Will squeeze a 180 rear onto SV rim if needed.

[AndyBrad]

Cheng Shung Bakalite rear won't help on the XJ.

The idea me, you and Berlin discussed would be the best idea (if you can get hold of the block tread pattern style)

What idea was that then?

[andrewsmith]

Couple of 190 metzlers on ebay going for not much
Think you could shoehorn a 16.5" on?

[andrewsmith]

Andy See post 37

[The Idle Biker]

Yeah I kind of agree but, snow, sheep, cobbles, sleet, whatever. I know there are different circumstances for everyone but really(?) and I don't want to sound like a patronsing git, but try to find an alternative to riding in the snow if you can.

Tyre pressures, throttle smoothness, forward thinking, what ever you do, the odds are not favourable. If you have to, then hats off to you, but I just wouldn't bother and I hope you don't either.

[yorkie_chris]

Couple of 190 metzlers on ebay going for not much
Think you could shoehorn a 16.5" on?

No chance, diameter has to be correct. Other specifications can be bent a bit.

[The Idle Biker]

I am looking for some, maybe your lad has some? :D

After the block tread preferably. Will squeeze a 180 rear onto SV rim if needed.

Oh I have a 180 Pirelli Dragon rain, I got it with my trackbike, you can have it as I've since bought another front and rear. It's a good condition but not block tread. Any good?

[The Basket]

To the rider on the motorcycle in the snow today....

Shine on you crazy diamond....gotta love his enthusiasm. Common sense not so much but you got heart.

[andrewsmith]

No chance, diameter has to be correct. Other specifications can be bent a bit.

:lol:

Or pressurised into position

[yorkie_chris]

Oh I have a 180 Pirelli Dragon rain, I got it with my trackbike, you can have it as I've since bought another front and rear. It's a good condition but not block tread. Any good?

Worth a go!

Is it this pattern? Or similar one with some radial grooves in the middle?
http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/tire-tyre-guide/Pirelli-DiabloRainRear.gif

[missyburd]

If you can ride up/down that *thing* you call a drive I don't think you need have any concerns about cobbles :notworthy:
lol! As long as the street gets gritted then I'm happy :)

More bothered about the roads :/

[The Idle Biker]

Worth a go!

Is it this pattern? Or similar one with some radial grooves in the middle?
http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/tire-tyre-guide/Pirelli-DiabloRainRear.gif

Yeah hah ha like I need a picture. I know what radial groves are. (Yeah I do need a picture actually.)
Think thats the one. Let me know on pm where to send it and I'll get my couriers to deliver.

[yorkie_chris]

Wish I'd had those today, reckon they would have absolutely lanced through the slushy orrible crap on the road

[leebex]

its just friggin cold down this way, no snow and im getting well cheesed off on the bike, you got guts riding in snow as i certainly wouldnt.

The daily bike spotting commute has gone from double figures down to 0-1 bike a day now.

[kiggles]

tip for the men.

if your going to get stranded somewhere due to the icey weather on your bike. make sure its close to your gf's house, this is to ensure a nice warm drive back to a hotel. where food is provided and much care is given. and a good night sleep is in order.

[MotorPsych]

Hi Missyorkie_Chris,

Reading about how you managed to ride in that snow - you shouldnt be calling yourself newbie - you are way past being a newbie....=D>
By the way, where I live when it snows, it is more than 7-8 inches - so far I've never had the guts to ride in the snow...

[STRAMASHER]

Hi Missyorkie_Chris,

Reading about how you managed to ride in that snow - you shouldnt be calling yourself newbie - you are way past being a newbie....=D>
By the way, where I live when it snows, it is more than 7-8 inches - so far I've never had the guts to ride in the snow...


We are Brits mate. We love a good moan. Especially about our "bad" weather.

We can still generally ride all year....just like California but with more clothes on.

Have a nice day.:)

[SUPERSTARDJ01]

I have been known to ride when its really bad with my feet off the pegs and stretched out, like stabilisers when the back end kicks out so I can try to correct it. Looks silly, but I find it works and gives me more piece of mind too.


I do this too, and I was doing my motorbike lessons in the snow about 4 yrs back.

I decided against heated grips purely because they heat the part of the hand that stays warm, so I got heated gloves, they're 100% waterproof/windproof and keep you toasty warm and if your hands are warm the rest seems to be ok which makes for safer riding, oh and if you can use the rear brake gently.

Might be helpful?

http://www.ehow.com/how_2090059_ride-motorcycle-snow.html

[-Ralph-]

Buy the right bike and the tyre availability will encourage you to go out and play in the snow ;-)

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd82/colinbal4/XT600/SNC00039.jpg

[-Ralph-]

Other than that, gently softly on the back when you need the brakes.

Or go do an off-road riding course and learn to cope with the bike sliding around below you.

[missyburd]

Hi Missyorkie_Chris,

Reading about how you managed to ride in that snow - you shouldnt be calling yourself newbie - you are way past being a newbie....=D>
By the way, where I live when it snows, it is more than 7-8 inches - so far I've never had the guts to ride in the snow...

Lol, well my definition of a newbie on a larger bike is someone who's been riding it less than 6 months I suppose. I passed my test April, rode a 125cc for a year, then started on the SV in July. Ridden it since then but still feel like a newbie! So much to learn.
Buy the right bike and the tyre availability will encourage you to go out and play in the snow ;-)


Well we supposedly have a nearly back together DTR125 in the garage, bought for the difficult conditions...obviously they not close to difficult yet :-P

[STRAMASHER]

Monday I improved my snow skills.

Tuesday I improved my ice skills.

Wednesday I coped with hail.

Today we are all getting sent home cos of the storm (sideyways rain and 90mph gusts). Going to be Attack Of The Suicidal Wheeliebins again I reckon.

Never a dull moment on the bikes!


I'm outta here!!!!

[hindle8907]

Wednesday I coped with hail.



Hail was bad as well for me too the other day lol

[chrisinflight]

Well today was the first day I drove the car to work. The reason was not ice or snow but the high winds. I dreaded my bike being blown over in the staff car park. It turned out very gusty and was glad to make the decision!
Apart from the wind I only take the car when there is a real big freeze and dont let a frosty morning or a flurry of snow bother me.
What I learnt from last winter when I had my KLR650- Cars ditched in the hedgerow is a sure sign of black ice!

[-Ralph-]

Cars ditched in the hedgerow is a sure sign of black ice!

Most car drivers nowadays just don't understand the connection between tyres and tarmac. They get round a corner at a certain speed all year long, then drive exactly the same speed when the freezing weather comes, then they are shocked, surprised and upset, and genuinely don't know what went wrong when they end up in the hedge.

[ChrisCurvyS]

Too true.

Along similar lines, I was going to say that for me snow/sleet isn't the real danger as you're obviously aware of it and you slow right down and adjust your riding accordingly. (rode a 125 for almost two hours in fresh snow to get to my bike theory test, hilariously - didn't want to lose my money! 15mph and legs out either side all the way.)

Ditto for high winds - I commute 50 miles every day along motorways, high bridges etc and this week's weather hasn't been a problem - you just relax and it's pretty easy to compensate as the bike gets blown about.

The one thing I am paranoid about though is black ice - particularly isolated patches of it on an otherwise dry road, where you're feeling quite safe doing 60/70/80mph until you come round a bend and some dampness of a hedge or whatever has frozen solid. Also, if grit has been down on the roads for a few days it forms a sort of paste which is itself quite slippery (ironically) and tends to gather in the centre of the lane where bikers ride - my one 'off' so far was down to this.

They're my thoughts anyhoo.