CAT C write off - back on road questions.

[Chris Bird]

My SV has been written off as a Cat C cosmetic damage. My Insurance company say they need a new MOT and an Engineers Inspection. They don't however know what is meant by an Engineers inspection and can offer no advice of where to get it done...

I looked into VIC testing but apparently this doesn't apply to motorbikes...

One MOT station said they could do it after the MOT and another said it's not necessary, especially as I still have the LOG book.

Any ideas...

[davepreston]

any bike designated cat c or d just needs a mot to be put back on the road, a mot by defination is a inspection of road worthyness therefore if it pass's a mot its safe for the road and therefore fit for to be insured as such

cars are different they need a sva (if memory serves) to be road worthy from a cat c, just a mot for cat d

[Bibio]

engineers inspection is more than likely an inspection by a 'motoliner' if that's the right word or inspected at a VOSA station like you would with a Q plate.

[davepreston]

probably bibio but its not required as its not getting reregistered
i know your not saying it is btw

[TamSV]

They don't however know what is meant by an Engineers inspection and can offer no advice of where to get it done...

That's helpful of them. :rolleyes:

What stage are you at with the claim? Is the report required to confirm it's a Cat C and get you paid out, or do they want it in order to re-insure you?

Have they already inspected the bike as part of the claim process?

[Chris Bird]

That's helpful of them. :rolleyes:

What stage are you at with the claim? Is the report required to confirm it's a Cat C and get you paid out, or do they want it in order to re-insure you?

Have they already inspected the bike as part of the claim process?


I've got the bike back plus 2 grand... I've still been paying my insurance premium every month. Accident happened in December.

[andrewsmith]

Unless your keeping it long term, I'd be tempted to get a HPI clear frame and rebuild it around it.

A 'Q' plate bike/ vehicle (if it ends up on it) is more or less un-re-sellable as people don't want/ touch them

[andrewsmith]

Unless your keeping it long term, I'd be tempted to get a HPI clear frame and rebuild it around it.

A 'Q' plate bike/ vehicle (if it ends up on it) is more or less un-re-sellable as people don't want/ touch them

[TamSV]

I've got the bike back plus 2 grand... I've still been paying my insurance premium every month. Accident happened in December.

Ah right. All they're doing is making sure you've carried out sufficient repairs to return the vehicle to the road. Your MOT (if still current) is valid but getting a new one is an easy way for insurers to make sure you've actually fixed it properly.

In this case the "engineers report" doesn't need to be anything more than a letter from the MOT garage confirming that the vehicle has been repaired to a roadworthy standard. The MOT certificate proves this of course and, as your brokers don't actually seem to know what they're asking for, part of me would be tempted to just send them a Twix wrapper. However, sometimes you just need to play the game :).

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but the bike might need a VIC test to prove its identity (they sometimes get a "VIC marker" after a write off, meaning a new V5C won't be issued until the VIC test is done). You can still use the vehicle with a VIC marker but it'll cause a problem if you change address or sell the bike. If you give VOSA a ring they can tell you if your bike's got a VIC marker. If not, no problem.

BTW, check this bit out as I might be out of date on that. My business customers can't usually be bothered dealing with salvage so I've not had to deal with this first hand for a while. VOSA will keep you right anyway.

Unless your keeping it long term, I'd be tempted to get a HPI clear frame and rebuild it around it.

A 'Q' plate bike/ vehicle (if it ends up on it) is more or less un-re-sellable as people don't want/ touch them

It won't need a Q plate. The economics of a Cat C can work out if you can fix the bike yourself. Pocket 2 grand from the insurance, fix the bike up with used parts for £750 and ride it to work for a year. Sell it on with a £500 discount because it's a Cat C and you've still got your nose in front.

[leebex]

My Insurance company say they need a new MOT and an Engineers Inspection. They don't however know what is meant by an Engineers inspection and can offer no advice of where to get it done...

Any ideas...

Had a similar thing with a cat c car I bought last year, my insurance company insisted the vehicle was checked by a competent vehicle engineer to make sure the repairs to get it back on the road had been done by a competent person, to a safe condition. I was annoyed as it had only just passed an mot, so must be safe.

I was stumped, as who the hell should it be, turns out any mot tester is a competent vehicle engineer, half the mot fee, 20 mins later and the chap wrote me out a short letter to say he was satisfied with the vehicle.( it hadnt even been repaired, was just dented)

The insurance company were satisfied too, kept the letter and passed it on when I sold the car early this year. mention it to your local bike mot place and see what they say.

Lee

[andrewsmith]

It won't need a Q plate. The economics of a Cat C can work out if you can fix the bike yourself. Pocket 2 grand from the insurance, fix the bike up with used parts for £750 and ride it to work for a year. Sell it on with a £500 discount because it's a Cat C and you've still got your nose in front.

Stand corrected and have learned something.

Cheers Tam

[Grant66]

Thought Cat C was repairable frame damage. Isn't Cat D for cosmetic/uneconomical repair.

Source: Linky (http://www.motorcycledirectory.co.uk/articles/write-off-or-not-write-off.html)
Category C - Repairable salvage. Usually applies to motorcycles with significant frame damage, where cost of repairs exceeds book value. Can be sold complete to Motorcycle Trade or Public. Recorded as "Category C" at DVLA. Category C vehicles' V5 documents are returned to DVLA. You re-apply, to DVLA or at your local VRO, for registration on the original identity once you have fixed it up, MOTed it and want to Tax it. Re-registration removes the Category C classification, but evidence it was at one time Category C remains on the vehicle's record at DVLA (and HPI and AA and the others). There is a difference between cars (and presumably vans, lorries, caravanettes..) and bikes when re-registering. Motorcycles do not need a VIC inspection, cars do. Cars (and vans...) sold for repair but must now have VIC inspection before returning to the road. VIC inspection - Straight from VOSA's web site "[The VIC] will involve comparing the vehicle presented against information held by DVLA, such as the vehicle identification number, make, model, colour and engine number.
The VIC will also compare the record of previous accident damage with evidence of damage repair as well as checking other components to confirm the age and identity of the vehicle." Officially, the VIC does not check roadworthiness. If any significant defects are present, they can prevent it being used, but it is not a check of vehicle condition or roadworthiness. VIC tets centres in major towns, list on VOSA's site. It costs £35 (early 2005). Motorcycles do not need this VIC inspection. (Lets not get into whether this is a good or bad thing - you probably have a view somewhere between 'one less hoop to jump through' and 'so do they not care about stolen bikes being rung !'). Whatever, bikes do not need a VIC inspection. It used to be unclear, but VOSA have recently (late 2005) re-written some of the pages on their web site. Some of their pages still say 'all vehicles', but some pages now say 'cars need....'. From 2 sources, we now have clear evidence of people being told, one in writing, that "Motorcycles do not come under the Vehicle Identity Check Scheme therefore your vehicle will not require one.". Having said that, when you go to insure it, the Insurance Company will obviously know it was Category C, and may insist on an Engineer's Report on the quality of repairs and the roadworthiness of the vehicle. Some do, some don't.

Category D - Repairable salvage. Minimal damage, probably not structural, but insurer does not want to repair, even though it might be economic to do so. Often stolen and recovered after claim has been paid. Or for unusual models or grey imports where the difficulty of obtaining new parts hinders a quick repair. Does not need VIC inspection to return to road. Recorded with HPI, AA, and the like. Category Theft - Reported stolen, and the insurance company has paid out, but nobody has found the bike yet. (Once it is found and taken to a salvage yard, it probably becomes Category D(or ABC...)) Category F - Damaged by fire. Should be repairable. If not safely repairable, it should be called Category A or B.

[hindle8907]

I have a cat D that's on the road, the engineers inspection has always been in my case, the report that was created by the engineer who deemed the bike a CAT D.
Its some paperwork with photos of damage and what would be required/cost for repair.

Each time I change insurance company they ask me for a copy of this along with MOT

[mikerj]

Thought Cat C was repairable frame damage. Isn't Cat D for cosmetic/uneconomical repair.


There an awful lot of crap written about total loss categories on the internet (amongst other stuff!). The simple truth is that the category is determined by the total cost of repair vs the value of the vehicle. An insurance assessor I know explained it like this (in car terms, but same for bikes):

A Category C is awarded when the total cost of repairs exceeds the value of the car. e.g. A scabby old Ford Escort worth £200 with a dent in a panel could easily be a Cat C. A more expensive car could be a Cat C even with relatively minor damage if the parts are not readily available, since the insurer will have to pay for a hire car whilst the parts get sourced.

A Category D is awarded when the repair costs exceed the value of the car less the salvage value. e.g. if a £500 car would cost £350 to repair, but the salvage is worth £200, then it would cost the insurance company £300 to write the car off, but £350 to repair it.

[Chris Bird]

Cheers guys. I have the original damage report. Had the bike mot'd the other day and it all passed okay. I've been paying my insurance premium the entire time since the accident and haven't sent the mot certificate to them yet.

The log book still remains in my possession. It never left. I don't think my insurance company have done everything there supposed to.

They gave my bike a cat c classification and called it damage repairable. After seeing the report they sent me they included the cost of replacing the front wheel, swing arm all the body work including the tank. As soon as I saw the report I asked if it was cosmetic or if something was bent. It was cosmetic damage so all I've done is buy some nice new giles rearsets and mot'd it and now I'm riding it around like a boss!

Not sure if I the 'cosmetic damage' they saw is nothing to worry about. The wheel and swing arm are missing a little paint but the body work is sound. Some of the damage was just water marks.

But then the lady pulled right out in front of me and tried saying it was my fault for, and I quote, 'driving into her.' because sometimes, that's just what I like to do for sh1ts and gigs!

[startrek.steve]

Mine was a Cat D write off and just needed a fresh MOT. Had to re-insure though, bit annoying, and my insurance wouldnt re-insure me, they dont do Cat D's!

[veenee]

Hi, I just had similar situation, van driver backed into me, total cost of repair was bigger than value of the bike, so I decided to get the money and do on the road repairs (I did not replace the exhaust can, for example, as it just got few more scratches).
Bike has been fixed beautifully, but as I only had to deal with van driver insurance company, (they paid me and they put C category on the bike), do I have to inform my insurance company about category change? Or I can wait until they pick it up when I renew my insurance (if they do). What from the legal point of view do I have to do?

[davepreston]

mot it and ride it, you only need to point out its a cat c if in another accident (they arent worth as much obviously) and adjust the value of the bike accordingly, you would also do this new insurance time , eg what is the value of your bike sir, id say £1300 (cos a mint one would be £2000) next question please

[veenee]

thanks, that's what I am going to do.

[Dicky Ticker]

I can't quite get to grips with this-----you have the bike and documents and providing you do the repairs yourself where does the cat c come into it. This is placed on the COST OF REPAIRS AGAINST VALUE OF THE BIKE and if the repairs are cosmetic only[i.e.plastics and levers] no special engineers report is necessary. Having a new MOT is sufficient and for the little bit of cost also gives you a new MOT

I have always repaired any bike myself after putting it through the insurance and never had a catagory rating placed on any of them when they have been HPI checked.

I only say this through personal experience and I may be wrong depending on your circumstance

[davepreston]

the cat c/d is put against the bike for valuation purposes a cat d bike is worth more than a cat c bike but both are worth less than a uncrashed bike, half the time the insurance companies dont bother to put the tag on the reg