Pointy not firing on rear.

[allantheboss]

My 2006 SV650S lost power whilst driving in dry weather. Revs seem just as responsive but power is very lagged, inciting that one of the cylinders wasn't trying.

I was testing the spark plugs for sparks just in case one was wet, and it turns out the rear plug (when sat on the bike) doesn't spark, regardless of what spark plug is in the socket (i.e. the plugs themselves work), so I presume it's something to do with the bike's electrics not provoking a spark?

What to do next? The FI light is constantly on.

[SoulKiss]

My 2006 SV650S lost power whilst driving in dry weather. Revs seem just as responsive but power is very lagged, inciting that one of the cylinders wasn't trying.

I was testing the spark plugs for sparks just in case one was wet, and it turns out the rear plug (when sat on the bike) doesn't spark, regardless of what spark plug is in the socket (i.e. the plugs themselves work), so I presume it's something to do with the bike's electrics not provoking a spark?

What to do next? The FI light is constantly on.

Until someone else with more knowledge comes along, could it be the coil thats at fault?

I think you can swap these over front to back and see if the problem follows it.

If it doesn't follow the swapover, at least you know your plugs and coils are ok and you then need to look elsewhere.

Hope this helps.

[Bibio]

could be a simple case of the coil connector is loose or you have pulled the cap of the HT but still attached.

stick the bike in dealer mode and see what the fault code is.

[allantheboss]

could be a simple case of the coil connector is loose or you have pulled the cap of the HT but still attached.

stick the bike in dealer mode and see what the fault code is.

Thanks guys. Is the coil the rubber bit which attaches to the plug?

What is the HT?

[allantheboss]

And what is "dealer mode"?

[allantheboss]

Stupid question- I googled it and checked the coils. They both work, what next?

Thanks guys. Still interested to know what HT stands for?

[SoulKiss]

Thanks guys. Is the coil the rubber bit which attaches to the plug?

What is the HT?

Yes its the bit on the HT lead - HT= High Tension which = High Voltage

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignition_coil

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_tension_leads

The coils could be ok and it could be one of the HT leads - so this is a 2 stage testing process, first the coils, then the leads.

How to take them apart I dont know.

Dealer mode is connecting certain pins on the ECU so that it displays diagnostic codes on the dash, don't know how to do that, but suggest a search on here.

[Runako]

Dealer mode - http://forums.sv650.org/showthread.php?t=55459&highlight=dealer+mode

Post 2 Pic 8.

[allantheboss]

I've made my very own special "Dealer Mode Tool" but am not getting the reciprocative dash indications?

[Runako]

I made the tool and put it in the adjoining holes (indicated in the picture). Make sure the tool has both positive and negative wires twisted together at each end and isn't touching the frame once inserted into the module. Ignition off before insertion. Then ignition on to give the code. That worked for me.

[allantheboss]

Got it. Code is c00, no fault...

[allantheboss]

Also, the FI light is on, but as pointy owners will know, below the light it depicts "FI", an oil canister, and a thermometer (3 things pertaining to that light). Could this mean that it's not actually particularly down to the FI being faulty? There is a picture of an oil canister on the dash also.

[allantheboss]

BUT that's when I just turn the bike on. When I try to get it to turn over, "FI" is also shown on the dash

[metalmonkey]

BUT that's when I just turn the bike on. When I try to get it to turn over, "FI" is also shown on the dash

Whats the oil level like in the bike?

[Bibio]

might be a faf about but you could try swapping the coils about then testing the spark that way it will tell you if it's the coil or before the coil (wiring)

[Sid Squid]

When you say you checked the coil, what did you do? Tell us exactly what tests you did at what contacts/terminals and what the results were.
The ECU can show a code for fault at the LT coil, not the HT, so the HT can be OC which means no spark.
With the ignition switched on, and the stand, clutch and gear etc in place such that the engine should run, check that there is a battery voltage at the LT + on each coil.
Then check the wiring on the other LT wires from coil to ECU, if continuous and not resistive, then swap coils over to see if the fault shifts from one cylinder to the other.

[yorkie_chris]

So you tell us coil is fine, but it does not produce a spark?


(N.B can you actually swap coils without swapping the HT leads between them too, does a rear HT reach the front pot?)

[allantheboss]

Whats the oil level like in the bike?

Perfect, I topped it up first thing.

might be a faf about but you could try swapping the coils about then testing the spark that way it will tell you if it's the coil or before the coil (wiring)

See next response by me! Here we go!...

When you say you checked the coil, what did you do? Tell us exactly what tests you did at what contacts/terminals and what the results were.
The ECU can show a code for fault at the LT coil, not the HT, so the HT can be OC which means no spark.
With the ignition switched on, and the stand, clutch and gear etc in place such that the engine should run, check that there is a battery voltage at the LT + on each coil.
Then check the wiring on the other LT wires from coil to ECU, if continuous and not resistive, then swap coils over to see if the fault shifts from one cylinder to the other.

Righty ho: As a spark was being stopped somewhere along the line to the rear plug, and I knew both plugs worked, I unattached the rear one of these:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Suzuki-SV650S-SV650-SV-650-S-04-Ignition-Coil-Rear-/120487080394#ht_932wt_1037

..and plugged it in to the front's wires, on the other side of the engine, and it produced a spark, so that led me to conclude that the above (in the link) pictured bits of both cylinders and both spark plugs were all working. Could I be very wrong? What is "OC"?

So you tell us coil is fine, but it does not produce a spark?


(N.B can you actually swap coils without swapping the HT leads between them too, does a rear HT reach the front pot?)

If I understand what you mean, they wouldn't have reached eachother's pots, but does my above answer to Supersquid answer your question too?



*IMPORTANT* Before any y'all reply- In dealer mode it originally said c00, but when I try to start the bike for a few seconds, it changes to c25 "Ignition signal #2 (rear cylinder) - Ignition coil, wiring/coupler connection, power supply from the battery"

So, where do I go from here? I am so grateful to all of you for helping me out. I will pass on your legacies to the next n00bs

[Bibio]

so you have established that your coil is fine so the only other thing it can be is between the ECU and the ignition. trace the wires back to see if there is a break/corroded connector somewhere.

according to the wiring diagram the colours of the wires you want to look at are.

black with white tracer (coil end) going into orange with white tracer = main power from ignition

solid black going to CDI.

[Sid Squid]

Well the coil obviously works if it sparks on the other cylinder's wiring.
You need to check for voltage at the LT on the duff cylinder, and for continuity from the ECU, (there is no CDI), to the LT on the same.
The C25 code means the ECU cannot 'see' the coil, which could mean the coil is duffed, (not in this case obviously), or there's no supply to the LT on that coil, or the wire/connectors between the coil and ECU is not connected, or the ECU itself has a problem.

[allantheboss]

Can you un-abbreviate please? What does LT stand for? Low tension?

[Runako]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_tension_coil

and

http://www.old-engine.com/maglco.htm

[Sid Squid]

Can you un-abbreviate please? What does LT stand for? Low tension?
Yes. Have you checked the voltage at the coil LT? One of the thin wires on the coil will be constantly live while the engine is set to run.
With the ignition switched on, and the stand, clutch and gear etc in place such that the engine should run, check that there is a battery voltage at the LT + on each coil.
Put a voltmeter set to 20ish VDC between the LT wires and the battery negative terminal, there should be one wire at each coil, (on a Suzuki typically the one that's orange, or with orange in it, your bike may differ but it doesn't matter), that has battery voltage when the ignition is on.

Have you done this yet?

[allantheboss]

I need to get a voltmeter first, and for that, I need a bike that can take me to Halfords! I will get there soon. I think a ~3 hour walk may be due tomorrow..

[allantheboss]

Turns out that after checking the ECU and voltage from battery, it was all good, so we (spanner_man and I) presumed that there was a bad connection somewhere in the loom. As a last-pitch effort, we replaced the concerned ignition coil (which you must recall, DID work, making sparks when attached to the other coil's wiring) with a new one, and everything worked!

So, despite the coil worked when attached to the front cylinder's ignition wiring, it was still broken! I rode away with no problems using the new coil.

Can anyone explain this?