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missyburd
13-08-12, 08:43 AM
Do decent ones exist these days? Do they even cure ailments and illnesses any more or just have a quota of drugs to prescribe?

Please discuss and feel free to enlighten me.

littleoldman2
13-08-12, 08:59 AM
Mine are very good, when you finally get to see one.

Dicky Ticker
13-08-12, 09:16 AM
I dont think there is much difference between Garmin and Tom-Tom.



Ooops---Sorry,my defective eye sight again

Cheer up doll it will get better eventually XXXXX-----THERE ALL BETTER NOW

dizzyblonde
13-08-12, 09:42 AM
Minor ailments aren't their highest priority.
They are too busy with paperwork and red tape. They have five minutes to 'see' you in their surgery. If you call them, to diagnose over the phone, with your own prognosis, they're likely to decide, you aren't going to die.
On the otherhand, when you have something moir serious in your notes whilst on the phone, they want you in within the next hour.

I have one doctor I pretty much flatly refuse to see unless desperate, I'll see a locum over him any day.

Sir Trev
13-08-12, 11:09 AM
I have one doctor I pretty much flatly refuse to see unless desperate, I'll see a locum over him any day.

Same here. The sullen "I bet you're not really ill" receptionists, who get even more annoyed when you refuse to tell them why you want to see a doctor, go through the roof when you ask for a specific doctor. Both my wife and I have been misdiagnosed by more than one doc at our practice and I refuse to see anyone except my specific GP now.

gruntygiggles
13-08-12, 11:20 AM
This Maria is one of those occasions where the more fuss you make and the more annoying and demanding you are, the more you will get.

Get on the phone or go in to your surgery and get angry with them. Be polite, but don't back down until you get an appointment with another GP for a second opinion and that appointment should be within 48 hours. Don't let them fob you off...tune in to your inner battleaxe and front them out.

Good luck and I hope they get you feeling better soon.

xxx

Jayneflakes
13-08-12, 11:22 AM
I always ask to see one specific Doctor for my ailments when I head down to my GPs surgery. My Doctor is an old school scientist type, he understands that I don't care for kind words and sympathy. The surgery also has a newly qualified girl who barely looks old enough to be out of college, but she is all nice and does the whole "There there!" thing which I hate.

I recently had an interview with another Doctor who has said that I am facing being labeled as disabled. He was all sad and sympathetic, which really gets my goat. I don't need sympathy, I need to be out on my bike, I need to be having fun. Attitude goes a long way and some Doctors are miserable whining gits. When I last saw my GP he asked me if it hurt? When I said yes, he laughed! I like that... He is also a biker.

That is the answer, see a GP biker, they know best! ;-)

dizzyblonde
13-08-12, 11:23 AM
Same here. The sullen "I bet you're not really ill" receptionists, who get even more annoyed when you refuse to tell them why you want to see a doctor, go through the roof when you ask for a specific doctor. Both my wife and I have been misdiagnosed by more than one doc at our practice and I refuse to see anyone except my specific GP now.

I very rarely see a doctor tbh. I saw more of the insides of my gp surgery whilst I was pregnant, than any other time prior to that. The receptionists before tey moved my practise knew my voice, if calling for an appointment,but now its much bigger so more staff.,with more ignorance.
I'm not one to ring unless the kids are really ill, and therrs always a particular doctor I'm pleased to be seen by when it concerns the kids. He's been on hid way home before now and has taken one look, turned round taken his coat off with the words follow me.

The only time I go to the docs for myself is when it concerns a particular matter ongoing from pregnancy, which needs a little more need than when, for instance I had bad guts and other effects a couple of weeks back. One friend on Fb sais I should go to the docs, in my opinion, I certainly wasn't going to waste their time with a common complaint!

timwilky
13-08-12, 11:42 AM
I went to the docs, receptionist said are you registered here?
Yes?
when did you last come I cannot find you on our system.

25 years ago

Oh, we will have returned your file to central storage as we assume you have moved if we do not see you for two years.

Doc say you must have a problem to come here and treated me seriously from day one. I used to see him in the pub more than the surgery. When he put me on Tramadol he told me to take the with a good shot of scotch.

Main problem is not the GPs, it is the practice manager who is a snotty cow with if if you do not like it you can always go elsewhere attitude when you say things are not good enough, ie last evening appointments is at 6:00pm etc.

ahmedf
13-08-12, 01:02 PM
what do you expect them to do?? Wave a magic wand and cure you. They prescribe the drugs they see fit. They have a systematic approach to treatment. Surgery or the most strongest medicine is hardly ever the first line option, so they work their way up. This is pushed from the higher powers and the GPs just have to follow.

Also if someone comes to you with a problem and you have 10 minutes to find out the problem, how it affects you, come up with a diagnosis, treatment and managment plan. its not the easiest job.

Also, speak to the "GP principal/owner" if you have concerns. as mentioned practice managers are not the greatest but its in the GP owners interest to keep patients happy. patient satisfaction = more patients= more money!

tigersaw
13-08-12, 02:26 PM
I dont even bother registering anymore

missyburd
13-08-12, 02:47 PM
I'm one of those you speak of who only goes to the doctor when ther head is practically falling off, I hate the places. But when it comes to my eyes, well they're pretty bloody important and they earn me my money.

what do you expect them to do?? Wave a magic wand and cure you.
Don't be ridiculous, of course I don't, if I did I'd be registered to St Mungo's Hospital for Magical Maladies and Injuries ;) Are you somebody with an insight to the profession can I presume, perhaps, per chance per maybe??

What I expect is a certain level of respect and a bit of confident decision making and if they not a hundred per cent confident about diagnosing an ailment then refer me to someone who bloody well does! Don't just fob me off with that little green slip of paper thinking that will shut me up and sort me out cos I don't no my own ar$e from my elbow. Do doctors even talk to each other to get advice from more experienced practitioners or are they so far up their own ar$e they would rather diagnose wrongly than ask for an opinion?

Just because some stupidly large proportion of their patient list are hypochondriacs with nothing better to do than treat the surgery as their second home does not mean we're all there for the drugs. I hate drugs, just the idea of them makes me feel ill.

I have had to register to several surgeries in my time and all but one of them have had incompetent doctors. Don't get me wrong, clearly not all GPs are incompetent, I know the "general" bit is what it says on the tin but to have a little knowledge about all things is always going to be less effective than a broad knowledge about fewer subjects which is apparently the case as it stands at the moment in our NHS.

The nicest doc I had was while I was at uni, I had the loveliest Welsh lady doctor who saw me on a regular basis for a repeat prescription. I was very sorry to leave her behind. I often wish I'd not changed my address from there and just traveled the 170 miles down there for an appointment!

Owenski
13-08-12, 03:48 PM
My GP's a ***** too Maria, I hate going in to them - its the same old crap every-time.
"ok take some ibuprofen, drink plenty and rest up, if its no better in 4 days I'll see you again"
I can see that they need to weed out the drug seekers and Münchhausen freaks but if they don't know you by face then surely its reasonable to assume you're not the usual hyper.
I've never been the fan of GPs but when you see them fail to diagnose MS in your mother your view of a GP can be quite bias (it was actually the optician who caught it).

I've been with the Cleck surgery for nearly 5years and have had no more than 3 different visits, (2 different things) After the fun I had last year I now I prefer to see the Nurse, she seems very clued up and has been nothing but exact with me.
I don't doubt it helps that the first time I saw her I had an appointment for "been weazy", I hadn't slept in a few days and the journey from the car to the surgery was too much for me. Making my way from reception to her room set off an Asthma attack and left me pretty messed up as I arrived to her room, after I got my breath thanks to her urgently rushing for the gas trolly she told me off, like a mother telling off a kid.
"You're a stupid man, why have you let it get so bad before coming in?"
"I wanted to leave it 4 days as to not waste your time" was my jaw dropping response.

She appeared more shocked when as opposed to the usual work shy hyper's she must deal with who go in begging for a sick note. I chose not to be admitted to hospital and turned down the sick note. Some steroids and a return visits leading to a repeat for inhalers and an Asthmatic diagnosis was the result.
I admit though its a sad state of affairs if you need to be on the verge of passing out before they take you seriously.

Go to the hospital, they'll have an after hours GP he'll see you after a wait but they treated Nathaniel last year and much to our surprise sent him for checks there and then no messing about.

missyburd
13-08-12, 04:05 PM
My GP's a ***** too Maria, I hate going in to them - its the same old crap every-time.
"ok take some ibuprofen, drink plenty and rest up, if its no better in 4 days I'll see you again"

Ha, reminds me of the old school nurse, "Oh what's that? You've just collapsed/fallen down stairs/been knocked unconscious? That's all right dear, you just walk it off, be reyt." :lol:

It would just be so nice if it was like the old days, you knew where the doc's house was, you'd see him in the pub when you were well, he'd know your face and all your family/dogs/gerbils. I know it's not feasible these days and I'm an old-fashioned fool who should have been born 70 years ago but heyho :roll:

Your relationship with doctors sounds like mine Matt, a couple of visits in a handful of years, no use of sick notes and leaving stuff too late before wanting to waste time going in for an appointment. I left my conjunctivitis 2 weeks before going to the bloody surgery, I'd decided when the infection was spreading down to my cheekbones that perhaps it wasn't just dry skin allergies :rolleyes: Ya live and learn. Having never had skin complaints you'd think I'd be in straight away cos it wasn't normal. But then I've had a few things that just clear up in a few days without there ever being a need for professional help, the human body usually sorts itself and my immune system's always been up to scratch. But I guess with a house move, trip away and hard outdoor work I wasn't listening to my body :smt009

Winder
13-08-12, 04:39 PM
My old GP surgery had a complete cow on reception who thought she ran the place. Every time I called to make an appointment she would ask me what was wrong with me. What has it got to do with Miss Filofax? One day I said " I have green smelly stuff coming out of my penis.", that info was never passed to the doctor so it was just her being a nosey tramp.
It does seem the "rest up for a few days" is the answer to everything be it an ear infection or decapitation.
Your better of just googling it.
I went to my new surgery recently (moved house) as I needed some stronger anti Inflamitories and the receptionist seems normal. The doctor seemed ok too, I think, he hardly spoke a word of English and I had no idea what he was saying to me but he smiled the whole time and gave me the drugs I wanted. Can't complain really

Messie
13-08-12, 04:41 PM
To all those who so easily criticise one of the ,in my opinion, stalwarts of the free at point of service aspects of the NHS, I suggest you get the qualifications to get to medical school, successfully get through at least five years of University then add in a couple of years as a Junior Doctor then find a practice to take you on as a young and fresh GP.
If not, put it all into perspective and thank your lucky stars you live in a place where you can moan about such things. Or, diagnose and treat yourself via the internet and other alternative forms

Owenski
13-08-12, 05:07 PM
Not to be a stickler but I've never understood the logic behind that argument
"thank your lucky stars you live in a place where you can moan about such things"

Surely if the service was free and satisfactory then I'd thank my lucky stars, or similarly if I'd paid for it but it was poor then I'd be happy I have a right to complain. But free and unsatisfactory is no use to anyone other than on government posters.

Example:
I tell you I've got an apple available. I tell you its free, you're pleased with this offer.
I then pass you an apple core = You laugh it off as a bad joke.

I tell you I've got an apple available. I tell you its 20p, and you pay.
I then pass you an apple core = You whinge like buggery until I pay you back/give you a full apple.

Just because its "free at point of service" doesn't give it the right to be unsatisfactory unless you want to be laughed off as a bad joke.

Messie
13-08-12, 05:13 PM
Why do you assume that if you pay for something face to face, it will be better?

I also don't agree that the GP service is particularly bad. I say that we have expectations that are far too high and way above our level of knoweldge of what can be done

femaleacid
13-08-12, 05:37 PM
When something is free - its a privilege.
When you pay - you get what you pay for.

dizzyblonde
13-08-12, 05:38 PM
I don't think the GP service is a bad one either.
Sure as I said theres one particular one I don't go to out of choice, but thats purely because, hes not always listened to my needs correctly, and I need an interpreter and hearing aid for what he says, not because he can't speak English properly, but because he mutters, mumbles and his accent is so strong, I have to keep asking him to repeat everything, which in itself gets very tedious when you know there is only a short time for your appointment. He is actually a nice friendly chap, just not for me as a GP.

I do believe Doctors are well over stretched, but its because the population is huge and their books have far more patients than they should have, minor ailments like common coughs, colds and tummy upsets block the books for anyone who may have a more serious complaint. Children are never turned away IMO, they always make room for them, even if a parent is a little over alarmist.
However, a doctor cannot diagnose correctly if one doesn't give away information openly. Every detail you keep in your head, keeps him from diagnosing the problem correctly, even down to that marvellous question 'Have you been stressed lately?'

ClunkintheUK
13-08-12, 05:38 PM
I'll happily stick up for my GP. There are two or three doctors I will see there in preference to the others, and can always get an appointment with them specifically if I am prepared to wait a little longer. The reception team is always helpful and not nosey.

Admittedly the most common reason for me to visit is to get sign off for something or other. i.e. travel insurance won't cover an asthematic/medical insurnace won't let me send myself straight to a physio (that was the quickest trip to the doctors ever. "Me: i've hurt my knee I think its sprained or twisted. Doc: when does it hurt? Me: When i bend it and put weight on it. Doc: you've sprained it go see a physio, here's the piece of paper for your insurance.)

They have also been Extremely helpful with my Mum who has required not insignificant attention, and always been upfront about what they know and don't know.

Dave20046
13-08-12, 05:59 PM
Do decent ones exist these days?

Do they exist ? would be my question - impossibly hard to get to see!

I understand they may be busy and overworked (wondering if that's just by public sector standards though) and their job carries a lot of risk, but the way GPs are run round here is ridiculous and I'm surprised there aren't more court cases!

You can only ring on certain days of the week between certain times to make appointments, they'll often tell you to ring back at a certain time then when you do they're closed - you;re not allowed to discuss more than one ailment with them regardless if you think the symptoms are linked.
When I finally got to see one (after over a week of ringing) they sent me off for blood tests, I waited 3 weeks to hear back then spent a couple of days ringing them when I finally got through was told ' everything's fine , case closed' ...I rang back a bit miffed and made them get the GP on the phone - it was not alright!!!

The above is the first time I've got to see one in around 6-8years, tried several times in that time but either gave up and suffered or the symptoms subsided themselves.

Oh and another good'n is putting you though to non* english speaking 'sub' GPs to avoid you making an appointment!


*hyperbole

MattCollins
13-08-12, 06:03 PM
The second to last time I walked into a clinic it was with an infection. They wanted money up front (it was a bulk billing clinic) which wasn't a problem except that I did feel there was the possibility that I was being treated differently to everyone else in the room. I asked the woman behind the counter if there was that amount money to rub together in the full waiting room to which she responded that this was a "black only clinic"!!!! I politely asked her to be so kind as to point me towards the nearest "white only clinic" and the place nearly went up in flames as I walked out of the door.

Doctors seem to be a bit worse than half and half of the types who are okay and those I wouldn't p*** on if they were dying of thirst, but humanity in general doesn't fair much better.

littleoldman2
13-08-12, 06:35 PM
I do believe Doctors are well over stretched, but its because the population is huge and their books have far more patients than they should have, minor ailments like common coughs, colds and tummy upsets block the books for anyone who may have a more serious complaint. Children are never turned away IMO, they always make room for them, even if a parent is a little over alarmist.

My GP's have a rolling advert on the screen which advise's people of things that can be sorted elsewhere with out the assistance of a Doctor amongst the list are, teething, nappy rash, tooth ache, runny nose, and head lice. Yes I kid you not. I asked at reception and people do waste the Doctors time and NHS money with tooth ache.

ahmedf
13-08-12, 07:00 PM
I'm one of those you speak of who only goes to the doctor when ther head is practically falling off, I hate the places. But when it comes to my eyes, well they're pretty bloody important and they earn me my money.


Don't be ridiculous, of course I don't, if I did I'd be registered to St Mungo's Hospital for Magical Maladies and Injuries ;) Are you somebody with an insight to the profession can I presume, perhaps, per chance per maybe??

What I expect is a certain level of respect and a bit of confident decision making and if they not a hundred per cent confident about diagnosing an ailment then refer me to someone who bloody well does! Don't just fob me off with that little green slip of paper thinking that will shut me up and sort me out cos I don't no my own ar$e from my elbow. Do doctors even talk to each other to get advice from more experienced practitioners or are they so far up their own ar$e they would rather diagnose wrongly than ask for an opinion?

Just because some stupidly large proportion of their patient list are hypochondriacs with nothing better to do than treat the surgery as their second home does not mean we're all there for the drugs. I hate drugs, just the idea of them makes me feel ill.

I have had to register to several surgeries in my time and all but one of them have had incompetent doctors. Don't get me wrong, clearly not all GPs are incompetent, I know the "general" bit is what it says on the tin but to have a little knowledge about all things is always going to be less effective than a broad knowledge about fewer subjects which is apparently the case as it stands at the moment in our NHS.

The nicest doc I had was while I was at uni, I had the loveliest Welsh lady doctor who saw me on a regular basis for a repeat prescription. I was very sorry to leave her behind. I often wish I'd not changed my address from there and just traveled the 170 miles down there for an appointment!

Indeed, i am currently studying medicine and work in a GP surgery as a receptionist, so I have not only been in consultations and been debriefed by doctors after the patient leaves, i know the admin side of things inside out!

Its easy to assume the doctor knows or should know whats wrong with you immediately from what a patient describes (yes the doctor must also ask the right questions to extract this information but thats a different topic). While they generally have a pretty good idea, sometimes they wont and thus the uncertainty can come across.

Also, GP's get penalised for OVER prescribing and must be careful in what they prescribe. Yes not all patients are hypochondriacs, but put yourself in doctors position and imagine if you had to see 25-30+ patients a day and decide whether they are telling the truth or pulling your leg, its bloody difficult as one mistake could turn around to bite you in the ****.

GP's do discuss SOME cases in my experience however not every patient. And yes, i've had many of our patients been told to come back the next day or wait 5/10 minutes so the GP can talk to another doctor as hes not entirely sure what plan of attack they should take. But again this is dependant on the integrity and honesty of the doctor.

Personally, i think its better to have a little knowledge on more subjects than more knowledge on less. Purely on the fact, that i would hope that that little knowledge on a small obscure topic could come in use in noticing the signs/symptoms of an uncommon condition thus raising the doctors suspicion. But if they were to have no knowledge of this it could go unnoticed. This is just a hypothetical and purely my own opinion :)

I would say try finding another doctor, or better yet, ask to see the owner of the GP as mentioned earlier. Sometimes there are partnerships so you have to sus out which ones better. But almost always, the GP owner/principal is going to offer a better "service".

I find the biggest failing in a GP surgery to be the Admin side...but i wont go into it as i could probably right a book about it :rolleyes:

To all those who so easily criticise one of the ,in my opinion, stalwarts of the free at point of service aspects of the NHS, I suggest you get the qualifications to get to medical school, successfully get through at least five years of University then add in a couple of years as a Junior Doctor then find a practice to take you on as a young and fresh GP.
If not, put it all into perspective and thank your lucky stars you live in a place where you can moan about such things. Or, diagnose and treat yourself via the internet and other alternative forms

Thank you!! I dont like saying this, as im currently studying medicine but its bl**dy difficult and doctors are not miracle workers and as with everything there will be good and bad.

The NHS is great, and im proud to be a part of it. not perfect, but more than adequate!

timwilky
13-08-12, 07:38 PM
Things have moved on from when the NHS was founded and everyone was grateful that they now had access to medical care. To a service economy where the customer expects the best or to take their custom elsewhere. We are no longer in awe of doctors. Many of us have degrees and other post graduate qualifications and look at medicine as yet another profession.

The problem is I make a mistake and the company looses money A doctor apologising does not recompense a life ruined because the doctor was too arrogant to say, "I sorry I don't know, I will seek a second opinion".

As an example my sister in law age 26 and a nursing student kept going to her GP weekly complaining of bad headache. After a few weeks of this the GP suggested that perhaps her problems were elsewhere and prescribed anti depressants. She insisted on a referral to a neurologist. My wife was with her at her consultation, on the second exercise he asked her to do, she fell on the floor and a scan was ordered.

2 days later her GP phoned her on the ward to tell her she had a brain tumour that required urgent surgery. My brother stormed into the GPs surgery and put the arrogant ******* against the wall telling him his inaction and arrogance would have resulted in her death. He apologising for getting it wrong. They moved practice immediately. My sister in law has survived, but deaf in on ear and her face has dropped on one side. She finished her degree and is now working as a nurse. She is just glad she had the wisdom to say You are wrong I want a second opinion.

timwilky
13-08-12, 07:41 PM
BTW, I have a number of friends who are doctors. I respect the work they do and their commitment. Strange though that they all have personal issues of drink/drugs or mental health. Or is that a consequence of too much of my company.

missyburd
13-08-12, 07:47 PM
Its easy to assume the doctor knows or should know whats wrong with you immediately from what a patient describes (yes the doctor must also ask the right questions to extract this information but thats a different topic). While they generally have a pretty good idea, sometimes they wont and thus the uncertainty can come across.

Perhaps it's just the surgery I'm currently registered at but #in my experience# when trying to assess what my problem is, I end up asking all the questions, how I should treat/prevent the symptoms...no useful information is volunteered on their part, it's like squeezing blood out of a stone. Why is it just assumed I'll know what to do? Is it just because it's common sense/second nature to them and they don't think to tell you the silly details that prevent you having to make further trips to the surgery/prescriptions?


And thankyou for taking the time to post from the medical perspective ahmedf, it's very interesting to hear that side of things. I have a friend who is a medical student like yourself, I know how hard he works, the hours he puts in and the sheer volume of knowledge he is required to absorb, nobody denies that medicine is a hard slog. No disrespect to doctors is meant but at the same time, as in any profession, there are those who carry out their job to the best of their abilities and there are those who don't, simple as. It is those who don't that this thread is aimed at.

ahmedf
13-08-12, 08:04 PM
Its difficult and people prefer different styles. We have one patient saying the GP he just saw is totally sh*t but the next patient comes out and says hes amazing.

I dont expect people to bow down in front of me or any other doctor and step aside when i walk down the street because they are a doctor, but i do feel there is a real lack of respect for doctors these days and i feel patients are far too demanding. Yes some doctors are useless, but as i do with my surgery, i never ask to a see a locum, try to see one doctor (preferably the owner), and find one im happy with and stick with them.

Best thing i would say is keep seeing different doctors till your happy, but then there will come a time when even that doctor p*sses you off ;)

yorkie_chris
13-08-12, 08:28 PM
Strange though that they all have personal issues of drink/drugs or mental health. Or is that a consequence of too much of my company.

You'd need personal issues or 10 pints and an ounce of speed to stick much of your company, look what it's done to preston!

Dicky Ticker
13-08-12, 08:54 PM
I don't understand where the "Free NHS" bit applies-----we all pay for it, be it directly through taxes or otherwise. Does anybody know a poor doctor? I always understood that all the "Sacrifice" ended up as a bloody good salary be it as a practitioner doctor or on locum rates.
Unfortunately like every profession you end up with good and bad.

Biker Biggles
13-08-12, 09:21 PM
Im amazed anyone thinks the GP factory production line system would ever work properly.A few minutes per unit(sorry patient)can never be enough for a thorough assessment of what is wrong,hence the stoies of missed brain tumours and other cockups.I dont go to the GP very often but I can say that only once have I had my blood pressure checked (Goverment initiative at the time-GPs to get incentives to check it)and I have never had a diabetes check,despite this being one of the biggest medical issues around.If they dont routinely do basic checks like these how can they reach a correct diagnosis?Oh,and I have never had an ECG from the GP either.Another basic medical check that everyone over a certain age should get.
I worry that these are the people who are going to be running the NHS under this governments brave new world.

metalangel
13-08-12, 09:40 PM
I am rather fond of my GP, as he's a younger guy and so I think he's just relieved to have someone who isn't senile to talk to, and not yet another Mrs Brady the Old Lady on about the "thrushes on me vaginal L I P S".

He tells it to me straight and we have a good laugh most times so it's fine. Plus he remembers me which saves time!

Better than others I've had in the past (or indeed the older doctor in the same practice) who make you feel an idiot sometimes for coming in with a concern that they think is nothing. You know all those adverts for cancer or whatever where they say "think you might have this? Go see your GP, you WON'T be wasting their time." They must have skipped that day in medical school.