Anyone here owned a house that was listed - what kind of issues to expect?

[Tim in Belgium]

One of my possible home purchases is listed, apart from the issues of being old and knackered (1700's) what are the added issues of being Grade II listed? - Anyone dealt with such a property?

On the plus side it has a very large detached garage :lol: :thumbsup:

[orose]

I work in a Grade II listed building, and the landlords are certainly very fussy about what can be done - anything that affects the exterior is off for us, because the outside is the bit of interest (the inside is a later addition, so the rules are more relaxed for that).

What you would probably need to find out is why the building was listed, which might give you a clue to why it's knackered (it may not be allowed to make internal changes without great expense, if the floor is a mosaic or something stupid like that).

http://list.english-heritage.org.uk/ might give you an insight into the reasoning.

[Tim in Belgium]

It's not uber knackered, just not all spic and span like a new build!

[speedplay]

One of my possible home purchases is listed, apart from the issues of being old and knackered (1700's) what are the added issues of being Grade II listed? - Anyone dealt with such a property?

On the plus side it has a very large detached garage :lol: :thumbsup:


Walk away.

I've been working on listed buildings for a fair number of years and can honestly say, its a real minefield.
If you want to own a building where someone else can and will tell you what you can do to it, its great but actually owning one will be a pain in the a$$.
It will all come down to whatever moron you have in your local office as to how much (usually very little) you will be able to do with it.
Its not just new work but also maintenance that gets covered in the listing, even to the point of what materials you can use and often, where you must get them from.
Imagine having to repoint a wall using materials sourced from across the country as its where you are told to get it from....

That being said, some officers are ok and will be quite lenient (unlike the knobber in Daventry council who specified that the woodchip wallpaper that was put on the walls 20 years ago in a 16th century house had to stay as it was "part of the history of the building"....:rolleyes:

Me, personally with a good 10 years of specialising in heritage work wouldnt even consider buying one but others on here probably will argue otherwise.

[widepants]

I can remember working in a house once , in a village , where most of the houses were grade II listed . The client manage to source an original window to replace a softwood one that had been in the kitchen for years .He was told that was a big NO , as the softwood one had been there when the house was listed .
On the other had we did work here http://www.thehollybush.net/ and once the official in charge saw that we knew what we were doing , he pretty much left us alone .I guess it all down to luck.

[Stenno]

A guy in my apprenticeship year bought a listed building and sold pretty sharpish. I'm not too sure about the details but he couldn't fart without asking for permission. And even then local planning authorities would dictate how he had to fart.

Watching Grand Designs once I remember someone that had bought a wall that was left of some ancient building and he had nothing but problems and costs. It was like the local planning authorities would rather the remaining wall fell down than any sort of rebuild.

[Fallout]

I rented a 16th century gate house, so similar era. It had solid walls with no cavity and single glazing and was colder than Satan's heart without the heating blazing on full. Heating bills were astronomical (oil fired), and of course because the windows were single glazed they condensated and just rotted right in front of your eyes. Also it suffered from mildew/mould which is hazardous to your health. We ended up washing the walls with Milton solution to kill it, at least temporarily.

What else? More spiders than that film archnophobia too. It got to the stage where we just left them living in the various nooks and crannies in the corners of the rooms and used to feed them the various other insects that got in. We had a ladybird infestation in every window, because sash windows have lots of nooks and crannies for them to hibernate in. Attic was a no go zone. The first time we opened the loft hatch 4 wasps came out and basically it was full of creepy crawlies. We just wrote it off.

Can't give you any feedback on ownership and how it'd all be fixed, but it definitely put us off every buying one.

[johnnyrod]

We've got a listed house right now. It can be a minefield, and you do need deep pockets. Heating, as said, can be expensive, because you're limited in what you can do to stop the heat getting out. As speedplay says, it's mainly down to your local officer, but ours is very good. Definitely meet them at the house and have a long talk with them about what needs doing (even if it's just maintenance jobs), and how picky they will be, as it varies by area, house and job. The listing covers the whole site, and changes you want to make must be approved regardless of whwther it's the front, back inside etc. Internal decoration etc. isn't an issue for us, there isn't much of historical interest left apart from a few cupboards and some skirting. Re. repairs, we are mostly fine with like for like replacements, but we agreed that with the conservation officer. Stuff falls off now and again, and you need a cash reserve for it, but on the other hand you'll have (hopefully) an interesting house with some history, character etc. NB prices are still flat, as are volumes of sales, bone up on mouseprice.com, and hammer yourself a bargain

[suzukigt380paul]

its only a mine field if you try to get planning permission to do something,and if you do try then its a nightmare.so as long as they dont know about the repairs and you dont do anything to obvious,then just get on with it,if you go the correct route they wont even let you put double glazed wooden windows in to replace 70's windows that were done with planning but have rotted away since,or put plaserboard up when it would have been lath and plaster even if its old nackered plaster board now,gettting permission to do any thing is very very long winded and can be very expensive,and considering most 16th and 17th century building have had alterations done every century since they were built,but now it is wrong to make it warm and dry instead of cold and drafty

[shonadoll]

Depends on the listing etc. we owner a grade 2 (I think) conversion, and it demanded that the sash wooden windows were replaced like for like, which was more expensive obviously but I prefer old buildings anyway. HATE seeing old houses covered in UPvc. But I do know some headings are more demanding requiring original goats guts lathe and plaster applied in a Morris dancer stylee, so as with any building research is key. But you could get a bargain and a beautiful house to boot!

[andrewsmith]

Tim unless your a Building Surveyor or a very good friends with one, walk away.

They are a right pain in the a***.
The rule of thumb, everything requires planning permission (with the exceptions for some emergency work to save a feature or stop damage progressing).
Even redecoration!

Tim speak to the conservation office in the council where the property is, they will be able to assist and give you the merits of the listing

[Tim in Belgium]

Thanks for all the advice above, I'm off for a look, but with my eyes wide open and a builder mate.

[missyburd]

It can be a minefield, and you do need deep pockets.
+1. Got a friend who's recently bought a listed building, they're a professional couple with no kids and had already poured loads of dosh into it getting it properly surveyed and whatnot. Now they've bitten the bullet and got it but it needs properly gutting and it's a spiderweb of hurdles that they need to jump over. But once the kitchen's done they're planning on moving in (they'll need to sell a house to keep paying for this one's upkeep)...and living in a mess till it's right. Their first major hurdle was a giant tree that had been there before the house was built, they were told it was protected and couldn't chop it down, despite it being a danger to the house being so close to it. They've taken that risk but if you've got your heart set on something it's very hard to not keep positive and make the best of it.

Good luck Tim!

[johnnyrod]

Got a link to the house, Tim?

Redecoration doens't need planning permission or conservation approval unless there are internal things of significance, or it's the outside and you want to change the colour. Planning permission is broadly needed for the same things as a normal house, but conservation approval for various other things, this might be only a letter from the officer agreeing that such-and-such is a trivial change so the full application isn't required. We've refitted the bathroom, changed the back windows (like for like - were already UPVC, somehow), new boiler inc taking off a chimney pot, all with approval by letter after discussing with the conservation officer. Oddities though were one winodw, and the garage windows, were wooden (softwood) and from the 70s, but we couldn't replace them with UPVC even though the others on the back of the house were. The UPVC ones we did argue about but in the end it was a like for like replacement. Our case was, we would just do nothing, or refit good glass to the frames, so at least let us do it and we both make some progress. Years ago in Donny however you'd be mad to buy a listed place because the officer then was like a short guy from Austria who had his paints taken away from him.

[suzukigt380paul]

Got a link to the house, Tim?

Redecoration doens't need planning permission or conservation approval unless there are internal things of significance, or it's the outside and you want to change the colour. Planning permission is broadly needed for the same things as a normal house, but conservation approval for various other things, this might be only a letter from the officer agreeing that such-and-such is a trivial change so the full application isn't required. We've refitted the bathroom, changed the back windows (like for like - were already UPVC, somehow), new boiler inc taking off a chimney pot, all with approval by letter after discussing with the conservation officer. Oddities though were one winodw, and the garage windows, were wooden (softwood) and from the 70s, but we couldn't replace them with UPVC ,even though the others on the back of the house were. The UPVC ones we did argue about but in the end it was a like for like replacement. Our case was, we would just do nothing, or refit good glass to the frames, so at least let us do it and we both make some progress. Years ago in Donny however you'd be mad to buy a listed place because the officer then was like a short guy from Austria who had his paints taken away from him.if its old and listed,14/16 century.although it looks victorian with a 70s make over,then in my boses case they wont let him do f*ck all
the victorian sash windows had to be repaired,the 70's windows cant be replaced yet,18 months down the line have passed,not even like for like,all they want is it to be is inkeeping with what it was like 600 year ago bullsh*t,600 years ago it had no upstairs as it was a hall, and no windows just openings a thatch roof and no doubt a hole in the roof for the smoke,the house has been altered and improved in every century with the technolagy of the day to make it more livable in,but english heritage and the planning department couldnt give a fig about making it a better place to live in,or the thousands that have been spent just trying to get permission to replace rottern windows,and yes it must be several grand they have spent,so just bare that in mind,or just dont tell them and get on with it

[Quiff Wichard]

I can remember working in a house once , in a village , where most of the houses were grade II listed . The client manage to source an original window to replace a softwood one that had been in the kitchen for years .He was told that was a big NO , as the softwood one had been there when the house was listed .
On the other had we did work here http://www.thehollybush.net/ and once the official in charge saw that we knew what we were doing , he pretty much left us alone .I guess it all down to luck.

Thats up road from me ... !