View Full Version : One for the suspension buffs- Cartridge internals
andrewsmith
23-09-12, 08:16 PM
Righto
Whats the setup of a set of cartridge forks.
Am I right in thinking there is the one set of springs (like in a conventional front) and they can be swapped with another set.
An Image would be helpful as I'm trying to get my head round something I've got planned for winter :smt040
yorkie_chris
23-09-12, 08:20 PM
http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/217734_1958228044086_1779431_n.jpg
HTH
andrewsmith
23-09-12, 08:24 PM
Haha
Daft thing I did look in the Minitwin thread to find the answer.
These are wonderbucket levels of voodoo
yorkie_chris
23-09-12, 08:45 PM
There is reason I didn't put answers on there, figure people can either pay me large amounts of money or figure it out themselves.
There are other ways of cartridge conversion that are all out there in public.
andrewsmith
23-09-12, 08:55 PM
There is reason I didn't put answers on there, figure people can either pay me large amounts of money or figure it out themselves.
There are other ways of cartridge conversion that are all out there in public.
Fair point
yorkie_chris
23-09-12, 08:59 PM
So why ask question on here that you could answer by looking for 5 second in workshop manual or parts fiche?
andrewsmith
23-09-12, 09:11 PM
Was wanting to confirm it before I start stripping the front and taking parts to be fitted
yorkie_chris
23-09-12, 09:15 PM
With the least intention to insult, if you can't figure out the springs then you're not ready to go bodging in different damping components.
If you gave some detail of what you're trying to do with what parts then someone may be able to help as your question is as approximate as American artillery support...
andrewsmith
23-09-12, 09:33 PM
With the least intention to insult, if you can't figure out the springs then you're not ready to go bodging in different damping components.
If you gave some detail of what you're trying to do with what parts then someone may be able to help as your question is as approximate as American artillery support...
Ever tried translating italian?
Its a andreani cartridge conversion (ohlins/ktech) I'm just getting my head around the last few things on the conversion
andy. you need a cartridge spring compression tool for a start.
check spring length against the cartridge.
remove the cap from one of the new cartridges and make sure that it fits on the top of your stanchions.
remove all the old internals from your forks.
remove the caps form the cartridges
insert the new cartridges into the bottom of your forks and tighten bottom bolts.
install the spring and cartridge tops (using the tool). now this is where it gets tricky as you have to set the hight of the rebound valving needle/rod or in your case rebound as well as if you don't it will hit the valve and burger the orifice/needle.
pour oil in and set hight.
put cap on and install into bike the tighten bottom bolts and caps. don't tighten the top yoke until you tighten the caps or you will burger the caps.
your doing the exact same thing as any other cartridge forks so have a look at the manual for the gsxr600k1-3 forks to get an idea.
yorkie_chris
24-09-12, 09:03 AM
You're missing a few facts there bib.
Spring compression tool... not needed on typical right way up forks, the installed preload is not done on the cartridge, just by pressing cap down like conventional fork. On this application it depends on top out spring location as to what is required.
Not so simple as to drop cartridge into leg... reason for this will be apparent when you try...
i thought you needed spring tool for cartridge forks to be able to take cap off damper rod no matter if it's RWU/USD as you have to push the spring down to get at nut?
as far as i'm aware he has aftermarket cartridges designed for the SV that are comp on one fork rebound on other.
i know that when i strip my forks apart i have to set the rebound needle hight. aaahhhh yes set the hight but not to screw cap down... lol. yes i'm a dumbass :-)
yorkie_chris
24-09-12, 09:47 AM
Depends on installed preload in cartridge. For example on 600K1 you can press spring down with your finger to get at nut it's not hard.
Where in USD installed preload is given by rod length, spring length and top out spring inside cartridge... externals of fork are having no top out control... all installed preload is on cartridge assy.
There are different ways to do damping. You can have split damping... I have this in SV for testing at moment in SRAD fork... all comp in one side all rebound in other... all adjustment from top.
Or you can have more normal setup of rebound and comp in both... rebound only adjustable comp by fixed bleed at base valve (same as early SRAD600). Tried this in bucket mk2.
Or damping in both sides... adjustment for reb in one comp in other...adjustments at top... this was setup in Berlin's bucket mk1.
It is not voodoo... but it can get quite involved.
speedyandypandy
24-09-12, 11:49 AM
http://sphotos-g.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/217734_1958228044086_1779431_n.jpg
HTH
What kind of fork oil is that? :smt081
yorkie_chris
24-09-12, 12:50 PM
Multigrade :) Sauce for cold weather beans for hot
Dabteacake
24-09-12, 01:14 PM
Is the tea to help flush the bean juice dregs?
andrewsmith
24-09-12, 02:32 PM
Multigrade :) Sauce for cold weather beans for hot
And Gammeldansk for heat control :smt081
andrewsmith
24-09-12, 07:51 PM
as far as i'm aware he has aftermarket cartridges designed for the SV that are comp on one fork rebound on other.
They are the comp/ rebound in one cartridge.
The fork cartridge kit for Suzuki SV 650, consists of 2 hydraulic cartridges complete with compression
and rebound piston, the belonging shim sets, 2 fork springs and the fork tops.
The english version of the instructions turned up from the manufacturer this morning. Better than the litteral translation I was reading.
YC, you know any good alternatives for Ohlins for fork oil? Don't fancy paying what prices I've seen it for!! :shock:
yorkie_chris
24-09-12, 09:40 PM
I would 50/50 mix fuchs silkolene pro RSF2.5 and RSF5. That should get you in ballpark of the 16.5cSt that is supposedly the viscosity of the ohlins No5 fork fluid.
andrewsmith
24-09-12, 09:52 PM
I would 50/50 mix fuchs silkolene pro RSF2.5 and RSF5. That should get you in ballpark of the 16.5cSt that is supposedly the viscosity of the ohlins No5 fork fluid.
Excellent.
I've seen 16.5 and 22.5cSt quoted for Ohlins 5 (22.5cSt was in ohlins M/X section), still would not pay £60 a litre for it
yorkie_chris
24-09-12, 09:59 PM
Well see if you can find out more surely which you should be using.
Ohlins No10 is 22.0cSt apparently.
Viscosity unless you go mental and put 20w in will just change the adjusters range with these differences but should be about rideable.
Any chance I could have an inspect of this kit :-P
andrewsmith
24-09-12, 10:20 PM
On the way good man. Bib's will want a nosey as he spotted these
http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/539315_708793732288_1769359915_a.jpg
http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/10543_708793812128_2010339342_n.jpg
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/398420_708793752248_228895842_n.jpg
is the compression adjuster on the bottom bolt?
andrewsmith
24-09-12, 10:34 PM
You looking at the tops?
no. rebound is on tops i was wondering how the give you adjustable comp if comp/rebound are on both legs.
yorkie_chris
25-09-12, 07:53 AM
i was wondering how the give you adjustable comp if comp/rebound are on both legs.
It is possible that top adjuster adjusts compression.
andrewsmith
25-09-12, 08:26 AM
It is possible that top adjuster adjusts compression.
The one with the white spacer is in compression out the box
yorkie_chris
25-09-12, 08:35 AM
What is diameter of cartridge?
andrewsmith
25-09-12, 08:41 AM
Without getting the verniers out about 25mm
where are the comp/rebound adjusters located?
yorkie_chris
25-09-12, 09:22 AM
Most likely comp on one top rebound on other... that is best way I found and way traxxion ones do it...
SV650Racer
25-09-12, 09:35 AM
We are helping K-Tech develop a full cartridge kit for the SV over the winter. Will use the rebound and comp adjustments on seperate legs.
andrewsmith
25-09-12, 10:28 AM
They are the last pair of internals K-tech had for the SV and had one pair left of ER6's left.
YC you will probably hate me if I told you how much they cost
yorkie_chris
25-09-12, 10:35 AM
Nah I'll just tell you how much I could have done you a set of GSXR mod cartridges for...
andrewsmith
25-09-12, 10:36 AM
Go on
yorkie_chris
25-09-12, 10:37 AM
PMd
speedyandypandy
25-09-12, 10:49 AM
And Gammeldansk for heat control :smt081
JägerMeister is better for heat control
Nah I'll just tell you how much I could have done you a set of GSXR mod cartridges for...
I wouldn't mind a little pm about this and why this would be better than traxxion or that italian cartridge thingy. And no I will not upgrade my forks :-$ I'm going to do some german minitwin races in the future with my roadgoing SV :D
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