Beginners welder

[tigersaw]

What do you think of this as a welder to play and learn with, make a few interesting works of art, progressing to a useful tool?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/370656727258?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Seller has plenty of neg feedback, but none on this product - or recommend me something better?

[NTECUK]

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/pro-90-mig-welder?da=1&TC=SRC-mig
This is the new version of the one I have.
I've welded the mini floors ,side sills & A panels .
Welded several micra sill`s with it .
Its over twice the cost though.

[Bibio]

i would rather go for this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mig-Welder-/180996255686?_trksid=p4340.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D555001%26algo%3DPW.CURRENT%26ao%3D 1%26asc%3D29%26meid%3D2815106190578335813%26pid%3D 100009%26prg%3D1013%26rk%3D3%26sd%3D370656727258%2 6

fantastic little welders. nice smooth output and feed. i preferred using it to the big BOC one we had even though it was temperamental.

no matter what welder you get then get some decent argoshield universal.

[BanannaMan]

i would rather go for this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mig-Welder-/180996255686?_trksid=p4340.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D555001%26algo%3DPW.CURRENT%26ao%3D 1%26asc%3D29%26meid%3D2815106190578335813%26pid%3D 100009%26prg%3D1013%26rk%3D3%26sd%3D370656727258%2 6

fantastic little welders. nice smooth output and feed. i preferred using it to the big BOC one we had even though it was temperamental.

no matter what welder you get then get some decent argoshield universal.


+1
I'd go for a little bigger model that you won't outgrow.
I have one very similar to this and it works fab on any project you might encounter.

[Kenzie]

I bought one of these to weld my Camper van

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/mig130en-turbo-no-gas-mig-welder

Can easily be converted to gas by using an adapter pipe and a regulator. I would try putting an argoshield bottle on as they last longer than the rubbish little white bottles.

[yorkie_chris]

Depends what you want to do.

Don't bother with disposable bottles they work out hilariously expensive.

[hardhat_harry]

Dont get a no gas welder they are crap.

The Cedora one listed in ebay is the same as the Snap On and I believe BOC one too, they are very good.

Try to get one that doesnt have a permanent live feed wire I thought these had been phased out but I was surprised in machine mart the other day finding 2 gas welders with permanent live feed.

This might help

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/buying.htm

[tigersaw]

This might help

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/buying.htm

Thanks, thats a great help.
Looks like a £120 welder might still be a good intro price, but it wont be quality, the mask will be crap etc.

Might just put a watch on ebay for mig welder in my area and see what comes up

[yorkie_chris]

They're always supplied with crap masks, get a decent auto darkening one.

[hardhat_harry]

They're always supplied with crap masks, get a decent auto darkening one.

the all in one hobby welders usually come with hand held shields not masks and as Chris says they are fairly useless so budget about £30 off ebay for a decent mask.

They even come with flames and skulls on now.....groovy

[Sid Squid]

Dont get a no gas welder they are crap.
That's an extreme view, they have their uses - I still wouldn't choose one though.

Machine Mart/Clarke/SIP etc are all basic stuff, but depending on what you want to do, and as long as you appreciate the limitations will be just fine for the occasional wedging together of bits of broken motorbicycle.

Definitely get an auto darkening hat, it will make your welding much easier, particularly if you are a beginner. See here for a similar one to the brilliant and very cheap article I have, complete with flames up the side which is clearly much better. (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUTO-DARKENING-WELDING-GRINDING-HELMET-WELDERS-MASK-Solar-BLUE-Flame-/400328991874?pt=UK_BOI_ProtectiveGear_RL&hash=item5d3577a482)

[_Stretchie_]

I got my auto mask from the shop on the mig welding site mentioned earlier for about £40 if it helps

[Kenzie]

Defo on the auto mask. It really helps as you can see where you need to start welding, then they black out when you pull the trigger. Wouldn't be without mine, plus they charge when you weld.

[timwilky]

Face shields definitely crap. I ended up with arc eye years ago after using one.

for those who have never had a flash, imagine 6 inch nails being hammered through your eyes and into your brain with a toffee hammer. slowly builds to horrid pain

[Bibio]

Face shields definitely crap. I ended up with arc eye years ago after using one.

for those who have never had a flash, imagine 6 inch nails being hammered through your eyes and into your brain with a toffee hammer. slowly builds to horrid pain

you forgot to add the sandpaper eyelids.

[yorkie_chris]

Also if doing a lot of MIG work or any arc process, little burns from flying sparks are fine, what is not so f***ing funny is a hilarious hank hill T shirt shaped intense sunburn!

[hardhat_harry]

That's an extreme view, they have their uses - I still wouldn't choose one though.

Machine Mart/Clarke/SIP etc are all basic stuff, but depending on what you want to do, and as long as you appreciate the limitations will be just fine for the occasional wedging together of bits of broken motorbicycle.

Definitely get an auto darkening hat, it will make your welding much easier, particularly if you are a beginner. See here for a similar one to the brilliant and very cheap article I have, complete with flames up the side which is clearly much better. (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUTO-DARKENING-WELDING-GRINDING-HELMET-WELDERS-MASK-Solar-BLUE-Flame-/400328991874?pt=UK_BOI_ProtectiveGear_RL&hash=item5d3577a482)

No gasless really are crap and especially as they are being marketed as a cheap welder for beginners .

Their only use is there relative portability and suitability for outdoor (i.e. windy) use.

[yorkie_chris]

I'd rather have stick than gasless mig, way more versatile.

[Sid Squid]

I'd rather have stick than gasless mig, way more versatile.
Agreed. I don't like gasless, but I still think 'crap' is harsh.

[Specialone]

Also, be wary of open cuffs, the amount of red hot sparks ive had roll down my sleeve and leave a thin burn line about 8 inches long is amazing.

I always say, next time ill put elastic bands rounds my cuffs or something and forget, then ill get it again.

Ive got a biggish Sip turbo welder, it used to be decent but the wire drive mechanism needs improving as it slips terrible now and also the liner needs replacing as its a common thing on my welder apparently (above issues are related)
There is a common mod to do on them but i never get round to looking at it.

[yorkie_chris]

Agreed. I don't like gasless, but I still think 'crap' is harsh.

They've got a place, but I don't think it's for beginners or for general purpose use.
That's as much because the little gasless welders tend to be a bit weak too. Not much use for making proper stuff.

I'd go to a car boot and pick up a ten quid stick welder to learn a bit with. All the stuff about electrode angles, power selection, penetration, travel speed is all transferable skills to any welding for sod all money.

Also, be wary of open cuffs, the amount of red hot sparks ive had roll down my sleeve and leave a thin burn line about 8 inches long is amazing.

Get some decent length gauntlets, I have a few sets from big heavily lined ones for oxy cutting big stuff and casting and such where stuff is really feckin 'ot, to some super thin TIG gauntlets.

[SIII]

I wouldn't start with a stick welder - bloody hard work to get the hang of! especially if no one to offer help / assistance to get going.

With Bibio on this - find a decent large'ish 2nd hand unit and a friendly pub landlord to get gas from. The advantage of the cheap Machine mart welders is the easy access to disposable bottles.

Had a nightmare getting hold of gas bottles, all suppliers up here want rental & delivery etc - costs a fortune.

[Specialone]

I've used gauntlets loads of times, but tbh I don't like welding in them, lack of feel etc.
You can get Kevlar type sleeves which work ok too, but I prefer a thing glove if I'm gonna wear anything.

[Bibio]

I've used gauntlets loads of times, but tbh I don't like welding in them, lack of feel etc.
You can get Kevlar type sleeves which work ok too, but I prefer a thing glove if I'm gonna wear anything.

rip the linings out a pair of old leather bike gloves and use them.

[yorkie_chris]

I wouldn't start with a stick welder - bloody hard work to get the hang of! especially if no one to offer help / assistance to get going.

No gas bottles to mess with, cheap as chips, possibly lowest running costs going, can be used in windy conditions.

It's just as easy to make crap welds with MIG, just "getting the hang of it" happens a bit further up the learning curve as anyone can point and squirt.

It's not that hard to get the hang of striking an arc, 10 minutes of annoyance and that's about it, you'll spend more time fannying about with poor quality wire feeds and torches!
Even the chinese struggle to get 2 crocodile clips that wrong!

[Specialone]

Having done loads of stick welding using 4.8mm rods on some heavy steel and some lighter work too, stick for me was much harder to get decent at, long, even, attractive runs are much more difficult IMO as you have to feed in as well as along, whereas a mig or whatever with a feed you just have to worry about your run.

A nice stick weld though is bloody satisfying though (for me anyhow).

[tigersaw]

By stick welder you mean the old fashioned thing that goes bzzzzz bzzzzz crackle and you just have a short rod on a croc clip like the thing we used to mend the tractors back in the 60's?
By the sound of it for the silly price they cost it might be the way to start if all I want to do is play with some angle iron

[NTECUK]

Arc ??

[Bibio]

if your just doing angle/box/tube then stick welders are fine and easy to work with however doing light stuff like thin sheet is a mare and for that you are better getting mig or tig.

mig i would say is the most universal and easiest to work with once you suss out the amps-feed for given wire/material gauge.

[Sid Squid]

I'd go to a car boot and pick up a ten quid stick welder to learn a bit with. All the stuff about electrode angles, power selection, penetration, travel speed is all transferable skills to any welding for sod all money.
This. There's loads of useful boxes out there that won't cost much.
Get some decent length gauntlets, I have a few sets from big heavily lined ones for oxy cutting big stuff and casting and such where stuff is really feckin 'ot, to some super thin TIG gauntlets.
And don't wear slippers - trust me on this.

[yorkie_chris]

And do NOT and I mean NOT tuck your jeans into your rigger boots... wear them over the top.

By stick welder you mean the old fashioned thing that goes bzzzzz bzzzzz crackle and you just have a short rod on a croc clip like the thing we used to mend the tractors back in the 60's?
By the sound of it for the silly price they cost it might be the way to start if all I want to do is play with some angle iron

Aye don't think it's a low quality thing though, they still weld nuclear reactors and hard surface downhole drill heads with stick!

It's just the lazy mans MIG has taken over in most things because it's pretty versatile and fast.

You want some higher chromium rods to weld a unimog brake bracket back together? No problem, you try and find a roll of MIG wire that's the same alloy ;)

Arc ??

Yeah they're all arc processes MIG/MAG/TIG I mean MMA manual metal arc... coated rods.



Question is do you have a job in mind? If you want to do car body work get MIG or oxyacet. If you want to make BBQ frames get stick. If you want to make pretty stainless stuff get TIG.

[Teejayexc]

This might be a good place to start:

http://www.aldi.co.uk/uk/html/offers/special_buys3_27223.htm

[yorkie_chris]

Aye be alright for rods up to 2.4 maybe even 3mm.

Don't buy rods from aldi/B+Q if they do them or whatever find local welding supply as the mark up to buy 10 rods is hilarious. 10 rods for the same price as 5kg of them!

[tigersaw]

This might be a good place to start:

http://www.aldi.co.uk/uk/html/offers/special_buys3_27223.htm

I went oooooooooo until I read
Unit not suitable for standard domestic 13 Amp power socket

fecked if I'm fitting a 30A commando socket just for that

[yorkie_chris]

I've used similar welders and bigger on 13A

[Teejayexc]

I went oooooooooo until I read
Unit not suitable for standard domestic 13 Amp power socket

fecked if I'm fitting a 30A commando socket just for that

It'll be fine on *most* stuff unless you're reckoning on deep welding 1/2" plate !

Edit, bigger the stick more oomph required.