View Full Version : Intake balancing with milk
Just balanced the intakes on my pointy with 3m of plastic tube and some milk! I connected the tube from one intake to other and rigged it to maximise the height and half filled it with milk so as to make it easier to see. Worked perfectly with very little 'pulsing' and wasnt far out however u MUST EXERCISE EXTREME PRECAUTION TO AVOID MILK IN ENGINE. I clamped the tube to start with and I think ideally a longer length of tube is necessary....:king:
The Idle Biker
19-04-13, 08:14 PM
This post must not die without comment. Outstanding use of milk my fellow biker. Excellent!
milky milky.
often wondered if using a ball bearing would do the same.
I tend to use Dom Perignon 1995, it's a bit darker in colour than the 2000 vintage, better value and the little bubbles iron out the pulses.
andrewsmith
19-04-13, 09:13 PM
I like to use a bottle of 1947 Moet in the tubes
And have a pint glass full as the side to drink while doing it
garynortheast
19-04-13, 09:33 PM
milky milky.
often wondered if using a ball bearing would do the same.
I have a balancer kit which uses exactly that method. One of these....
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-MOTORCYCLE-CARB-BALANCER-VACUUM-GAUGE-TOOL-/330908238271?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item4d0bab01bf
yorkie_chris
19-04-13, 09:42 PM
milky milky.
often wondered if using a ball bearing would do the same.
I'd be far happier about having milk in the engine than ball bearings.
BBs, I reckon would not. You need a fluid... Pressure = density x height of column
I like to use a bottle of 1947 Moet in the tubes
And have a pint glass full as the side to drink while doing it
Pah '47 Moet ditchwater, wouldn't clean dog poo off the tyres with it. Now you can't beat a pint of Laurent Perrier rose '90 with a shot of blackcurrant.
andrewsmith
19-04-13, 10:06 PM
Pah '47 Moet ditchwater, wouldn't clean dog poo off the tyres with it. Now you can't beat a pint of Laurent Perrier rose '90 with a shot of blackcurrant.
I'm offended by this comment!! Surely babysham with a shot of lime is far better drink than a 90 with black
I'm offended by this comment!! Surely babysham with a shot of lime is far better drink than a 90 with black
Bit off topic don't you think Mr Smith, I was talking about the serious subject of carb balancing!
andrewsmith
19-04-13, 10:18 PM
Bit off topic don't you think Mr Smith, I was talking about the serious subject of carb balancing!
Touche
<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GaTRyHxvneY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaTRyHxvneY
aesmith
20-04-13, 08:52 AM
Back to the original topic, I wonder "why milk?". I guess any liquid that wouldn't be harmful to engine or to the rider could be used, the denser the better. I'm expecting the Bibio "plumbing in" kit in the post any day, and I don't have a set of vacuum gauges so I might try the milky method.
As a further even more whacky idea, the SV only needs to be balanced by comparing the two vacuums, not by measuring their absolute values. So could something be permanently plumbed in that would read whether they were in balance or not?
Grant66
20-04-13, 10:43 AM
I've used old engine oil for mine, bit denser than milk and a nice dark colour.
Dicky Ticker
20-04-13, 04:14 PM
Clear plastic tube with a coloured liquid-----used to do that with Redex 50 years ago..
Still one of the best ways to balance multi carb engines.
Don't suppose you filmed the actual balancing? It is the next task I want to learn how to do.
Don't suppose you filmed the actual balancing? It is the next task I want to learn how to do.
Sorry no vid but it really was as easy as I described. Also milk used cos I had no syringe so filled the tube by mouth.....
It was more the procedure I was concerned with.
The guides I can find assume you know how to do it. the service manual doesn't help me. I don't even know which is tb1, the front or back.
Once I can borrow/buy/beg/steal a gauge, it might make more sense once I start to dig in. I'd just prefer to have a clue before starting to mess with it.
aesmith
21-04-13, 12:51 PM
I don't think it matters, but Cylinder 1 is the front, so presumably TB1 is front as well. That's the one that's a real PITA to get at. I've just spent an age fitting Bibio's extension pipes onto both TBs, so next time I want to have a try all I need to is lift the tank up. Those pipes are worth their weight in gold so if you're going to have a try I seriously recommend investing in the set.
Which part of the procedure are you unclear on? In essence you connect the pipes from the two TBs to your gauge or whatever, run the engine and twiddle the adjuster screw until the readings balance. The balance screw is accessible with the air box in place by the way.
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e320/GandyGoose/Tech/BalanceScrew_zpsca9d8aad.jpg
More specific instructions will depend on your choice of gauge. I've had a go using the milk method, but actually using engine oil. Mixed results.
I've got some of Bibio's extensions to fit.
The manual goes on about setting the throttle to 1300 rpm then balancing and then setting the idle to 1300 rpm. Do I just need to check the balance on idle or at a range of engine speeds?
I think I need to check my fast idle too, idle rpm was 1000 on the really cold days over winter until the bike warmed up.
yorkie_chris
21-04-13, 03:40 PM
I've used old engine oil for mine, bit denser than milk and a nice dark colour.
Actually probably not, most oils are about 800kg/m^3 where milk being mostly water is probably near as damnit 1000kg/m^3.
So actually, more accurate, but you need a longer pipe.
aesmith
21-04-13, 05:28 PM
... The manual goes on about setting the throttle to 1300 rpm then balancing and then setting the idle to 1300 rpm. Do I just need to check the balance on idle or at a range of engine speeds? ...
That's a very good point. There's only one adjustment, so if you set it correct at 1300 and find it's wrong at 3000 then there's no way you can get both correct. That's what mine seems to do, the balance changes quite quickly when I rev above tickover, then seems to settle to a new steady relationship at and above 2500rpm. I ended up splitting the difference, but I'm not completely happy. On the other hand it's only maybe 30mm difference with engine oil, which would be only two and a bit mmHg. I was getting little bubbles forming in the oil, which again could be upsetting things.
I can sort of see a Carbtune in my future, but I'll have another go first. I need longer length of tubing, and maybe a tap or restriction of some sort.
So is the idea to balance at idle then rev and check they stay balanced? Any one in South Yorkshire area with some gauges to lend out on their driveway? I'll pre-fit my extensions from Bibio, so I think it is a 5 minute job after that?
aesmith
22-04-13, 07:34 AM
So is the idea to balance at idle then rev and check they stay balanced? Any one in South Yorkshire area with some gauges to lend out on their driveway? I'll pre-fit my extensions from Bibio, so I think it is a 5 minute job after that?
Pretty much. My adjustment, though not perfect, has made a worthwhile improvement. It's much smoother and quieter at low revs (30 in top for example). After balancing I should have rechecked the TPS which I haven't done yet.
Is there any need to disconnect sensors and stuff? I've been looking around the internet and some suggest disconnecting the TPS.
aesmith
23-04-13, 08:23 AM
I really don't see why. It's a mechanical adjustment, and I think you'd want to carry it out with the engine connected up normally. The only reason I could think would be if the TPS was so out of whack you didn't get a steady idle, and in that case it would be better to set the TPS first, then balance, then check and adjust TPS again afterwards.
Can you link to where you saw the recommendation to disconnect TPS?
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