GSXR 600 SRAD 98' Brake Upgrade

[CAhmroiss]

Recently bought a 98' GSXR SRAD 600 and the brakes scare me, they're either on or off there's no squeezing the lever to increase the breaking force.
Feels like it's going to get me in a bad situation this time of year.

Tried looking on the GSXR forum directly (the SV forum is clearly better) and from what I've seen most people seem to change the master cyclinder to a more recent 'radial' one? for the best improvement.

Thought about taking the bike to local Suzuki garage and asking for a 'brake rebuild' if that's the right thing to ask? (tell me if I'm wrong)
Clean brakes, new seals, new fluid and providing them with a new master cylinder.
I'd like to get HEL braided lines front and back as well but I don't know where to start with which master cylinder or anything else for that matter.

Chris

[Sid Squid]

If they're truly rubbish then they're not working right, and not even the bestest master cylinder in the world is going to help. As standard those brakes are still good even nowadays amongst more modern stuff, not the best you'll ever get it's true - things have moved on, but they really shouldn't be poor at all.

Work out what's wrong before fitting different parts.

[wideguy]

Your description- "they're either on or off there's no squeezing the lever to increase the breaking force" is confusing.
Brakes ARE either on or off. How much they're on depends on the hydraulic pressure applied to the pads, and the condition of everything in the system
Does some brake pressure get you some stopping force? Does it remain weak no matter how hard you squeeze? Is the lever firm initially? Does the lever go to the bar? Have you looked to see if the friction material on the pads is within limits? What pads are in it?

[CAhmroiss]

If I gently squeeze the lever it won't move, squeeze it a bit harder and the lever jumps towards me and the brakes are firmly on.
There's no middle ground as if I was filtering in traffic, I can't gently introduce the brakes.
Haven't particularly looked at them to be honest and I've only really sat down today and thought about it when I got home from work (by which time is was dark)
I've only had it since Thursday so still getting to grips with everything but it certainly doesn't feel right. I'm going to pop into the garage tomorrow and ask if they can have a look at the brakes seeing as its getting a few bits fitted as well as a service

[Tomor]

Personally sounds like sticking pistons?

[Sid Squid]

Sounds more like the lever isn't moving freely, try lubricating the lever pivot, also check the end of the lever where it presses the piston, if it's worn and has a flat on it rather than a neat radius, the brake action can get odd.

[Mikey360]

Sounds more like the lever isn't moving freely, try lubricating the lever pivot, also check the end of the lever where it presses the piston, if it's worn and has a flat on it rather than a neat radius, the brake action can get odd.

+1

[otaylor38]

I think id strip the caliper n rebuild anyway, even if it is the lever. Cant do it any harm on an old bike!

[wideguy]

I think id strip the caliper n rebuild anyway, even if it is the lever. Cant do it any harm on an old bike!
Quite a lot of damage is done to calipers during rebuilds.
I'd look them over well for leaks, clean them up, check the piston action, make sure they aren't dragging, then bleed new fluid into the system, which is a good time to look for dirt in the reservoir. Checking the condition of the boot around the M/C piston is a good idea too. If you find something that needs fixing, fix it.

[Sid Squid]

Quite a lot of damage is done to calipers during rebuilds.
How so? If it's done properly there should be no damage at all, if one is not capable of doing it properly one should not try to.
Brake calipers are very simple assemblies, it should be within most people's abilities to make a suitable job of it.

[wideguy]

How so? If it's done properly there should be no damage at all, if one is not capable of doing it properly one should not try to.
Brake calipers are very simple assemblies, it should be within most people's abilities to make a suitable job of it.
Many people start into it with no idea at all about how to do any of it properly, the don't consult a maintenance manual, and they ruin things.
Hard as it is to believe, people round off the heads of caliper mount bolts and strip the threads out of the calipers- and that's just from removing and replacing the calipers to change the front tire...
The OP sounds like he's not likely to do it on his own, so he isn't likely to ruin anything, but neither should he run off to a shop and ask them to rebuild his calipers, simply because they are "old".
Especially if his problem is with the brake lever as sounds likely.

[otaylor38]

How so? If it's done properly there should be no damage at all, if one is not capable of doing it properly one should not try to.
Brake calipers are very simple assemblies, it should be within most people's abilities to make a suitable job of it.

My thoughts exactly mate. No damage at to my calipers after i rebuilt them, and im a plumber haha.

[SV650Racer]

Many people start into it with no idea at all about how to do any of it properly, the don't consult a maintenance manual, and they ruin things.
Hard as it is to believe, people round off the heads of caliper mount bolts and strip the threads out of the calipers- and that's just from removing and replacing the calipers to change the front tire...
The OP sounds like he's not likely to do it on his own, so he isn't likely to ruin anything, but neither should he run off to a shop and ask them to rebuild his calipers, simply because they are "old".
Especially if his problem is with the brake lever as sounds likely.

See that alot, common one is people not using a torque wrench to do up caliper bolts and therefore doing them up way too tight and stretching the bolt. Have also seen pistons that have been scored or looking like they have been attacked by a screw driver where they have been removed. Not everyone is mechanically skilled.:cool:

Id say inspect the master cylinder first. I would also suspect the pistons in the calipers are not in the best condition, same with the seals. Not many bikes have their calipers cleaned out properly when people change brake pads..

[otaylor38]

I guess it comes down to whether your a practical person or not. Its not exactly rocket science though is it, is what i was trying to get at haha.

Defo worth looking into a guide of how to do it, before running off anywhere i think. Then make a decision off that.

I only said cos theyre old, as mine were full of crud and crap + seals were knackered.

[CAhmroiss]

After reading this the idea of getting a new M/C has gone out the window. I'll just get the brakes fixed (hopefully back to working order)
Bikes in garage tomorrow for heated grips, scottoiler and crash bungs so popped in there today and mentioned the brakes and they said they'd have a look at them,
if it's something little they'll just do it for the sake of me not crashing, if it's anything major they'll ring me.
I dare not doing anything myself because I always think I'd ruin it, don't get my wrong I'd love to be able to do loads of bike related things myself I just don't trust myself. Nor do I have an extensive range of tools/knowledge or space in which to do stuff.

Chris

[otaylor38]

Perhaps a wise move mate. Better that than making a fluff up.

[wideguy]

After reading this the idea of getting a new M/C has gone out the window. I'll just get the brakes fixed (hopefully back to working order)
Bikes in garage tomorrow for heated grips, scottoiler and crash bungs so popped in there today and mentioned the brakes and they said they'd have a look at them,
if it's something little they'll just do it for the sake of me not crashing, if it's anything major they'll ring me.
I dare not doing anything myself because I always think I'd ruin it, don't get my wrong I'd love to be able to do loads of bike related things myself I just don't trust myself. Nor do I have an extensive range of tools/knowledge or space in which to do stuff.

Chris
If you are interested in doing it, and there's lots you can do without too many tools or much room (I did a lot of work outdoors in the past), it can be quite gratifying. I started teaching myself by working on gas powered lawn mowers and various small appliances. Some people take to it naturally, some just can't do it, or never very well. Start with small things that are broken already. Take them apart, put them together, get an idea of what's involved in maintenance work and see if you have any aptitude for it. Then buy special tools if you like it and want to continue.

[Whitty]

Hiya, just spotted this thread. I race a 600 srad. I agree with sv650racer, probable main fault is in mc. When I first got my srad brakes were ok one minute then coming to lever next. Rebuilt calipers, fitted hel hoses, putoline 5.1 fluid and SBS race sintered pads. On first outing(trackday at cadwell) felt great then half way through session lever starts coming to bar again! Tried bleeding again, seemed fine. Kept lever pulled in with elastic band between sessions to help get micro bubbles out but was same all day. Few laps fine then scary. Got a kit for mc and when i stripped it there was a tiny ridge down the bore which I wasn't happy about so I got another which was ok and put kit in that. They were really good after that. I've since fitted a reconditioned 750 srad mc, the piston is bigger, they are cheap as chips(thread is also different so get the banjo aswell if you ever do it) which equates to less lever travel. Slight drop in actual stopping power but they are still good enough to lift back wheel with two fingers. Have stuck with SBS pads but they may not last that well commuting so I'd probably get some ebc hh pads(which is what I have in rear but I don't use it!)

[wideguy]

After reading this the idea of getting a new M/C has gone out the window. I'll just get the brakes fixed (hopefully back to working order)
Bikes in garage tomorrow for heated grips, scottoiler and crash bungs so popped in there today and mentioned the brakes and they said they'd have a look at them,
if it's something little they'll just do it for the sake of me not crashing, if it's anything major they'll ring me.
I dare not doing anything myself because I always think I'd ruin it, don't get my wrong I'd love to be able to do loads of bike related things myself I just don't trust myself. Nor do I have an extensive range of tools/knowledge or space in which to do stuff.

Chris
What did they find at the garage?

[CAhmroiss]

Looks like getting a new M/C is back on the table now then

Garage looked at the brakes and cleaned up the lever and possibly the calipers because they brakes are useable now and don't scare me so think it was a just a case of cleaning the crap out. Garage said they're binding slightly and if I wanted to fix that then get new seals etc