136 miles of cash cropping

[Bibio]

http://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/a9-to-get-136-miles-of-speed-cameras-1-3016746

so what happens when you get the flat cap sunday drivers driving at 45mph on the single carriageway parts or the caravans that plague the area doing 30mph. frustration and tailbacks that what and more accidents due to people being scared to do a proper overtake. this is nothing but a revenue gatherer :mad:

[andrewsmith]

thermite grenades

[Bibio]

no thousands of bikes doing 30mph every weekend.

[andrewsmith]

No thermite grenades on every other one

[maviczap]

Similar situation down here on the A14 between Cambridge & Huntingdon. Average speed cameras were installed in a bid to cut down on accidents, but whenever you hear of problems on the A14, 9 times out of 10, it'll be on this section.

They replaced fixed cameras, but IMHO, its made no difference. There's a lot of slow moving vehicles, lorries, tractors caravan's etc, people just get frustrated or bunch up & a lapse in concentration causes the accidents on this stretch of road.

I loathe it

[Bibio]

the thing is if you gridlock the A9 after Perth you gridlock the M90 northbound, the A90 west bound and the A85 east bound as well due to them all merging at Perth. the public will get pizzed off so the letters will start to drop threw MSP's letterboxes demanding something be done :-)

[Jayneflakes]

Why not just make the road bigger and safer? But no, the Nanny state must step in and ruin it for every one again.

[Bibio]

they plan to do that but wont be complete till about 2025 i think. once they gather all the revenue from the speeding then the new road should be made of gold.

[andrewsmith]

so now the procliamers got the song right for the A9 (well the pace lol)

tM0sTNtWDiI

[Matt-EUC]

It has been said before and I'm sure it will be said a further million times, but the problem is speed. Not excessive speed, but too little of it. Long distance driving takes it's toll, a momentary lapse in concentration and the car in front of you is now buried in your chest because you assumed he'd be doing more than 35/40 in a national.

[Biker Biggles]

Now there's a good reason for you jocks to vote for independance.Get away from the nannying English who just love to impose their oppressive state on everyone else.Get out now while you still can.

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

Try driving an HGV you are restricted to 56mph however powerful your engine is, this means that you sit with your foot flat on the floor whilst your brain goes walkabout. Now IMHO that is much more dangerous than people speeding, but then maybe it is just me singing away like a loon to keep myself occupied.

[Matt-EUC]

Not all HGVs are necessarily restricted anymore. I was trundling along at 70 and got overtaken by an artic.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

[andrewsmith]

Not all HGVs are necessarily restricted anymore. I was trundling along at 70 and got overtaken by an artic.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

If UK registered they are! The law is 95kph
The ones doing 70+ are from Ireland and europe where the limit isn't governed

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

It is 56mph because of the EU this is 80kmh. The only ones who were not restricted are Post Office lorries, they fall through a loophole, or at least they did when they were Royal Mail and government owned, I am not sure where they stand now. The rest of Europe is exactly the same as us, if they get caught unrestricted whatever country they come from they will end up with problems.

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

Another thing to note is that HGV's are restricted to only 40mph on single carriageway routes, very boring on A roads and yes the cameras can get you for it.

[Matt-EUC]

It weren't Irish, it was on French plates.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

It can still be done under British laws, they are the same in France, anddwe all know how a French policeman can commit perfectly legal highway robbery (including the use of a gun to help you speed up the process) if you are caught speeding in France, they very kindly escort you to the cashpoint so that you can pay the fine.

[Matt-EUC]

I was following one at 65 the other day on English plates.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

Police can do the driver for speeding and the owners for not maintaining the vehicle.

[Matt-EUC]

All they need is a magnet.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

[andrewsmith]

Cant bypass a limiter like that. Paper tacho's yes

[Matt-EUC]

Meg. It happens.


Sent via the medium of interpretative dance.

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

Many years ago now we had a driver who used a pencil and a ruler to up his hours on his tacho so that he got paid extra, you need a really good H2 pencil to do that, driver cards are much better, but I do look like Myra Hindley in the picture, not in real life I hope. We really did have a driver who use a magnet to slow his tach to allow him to drive further, can I just comment that we have not and never would condone any sort of tachograph amendments. This was the same driver who done for going over 40 mph on a single carriageway road.

[munkygunn182]

Used to look after a fleet of lorries...driver cards are great, but paper tacho's are err...'useful' in that they can be made to disappear (not by me obviously, drivers decision). Average cameras won't achieve much...picture the scene:

HGV + Irate BMW/Merc/Audi driver pass through camera on single carriageway at 40mph, Irate driver overtakes at 70/80/90mph to clear the HGV in a small stretch of road

Irate driver then sits at 45mph until clearing the next camera set so as to drag down the average speed.

The dangerous overtaking is still in there - just needs executed with a little extra thought

[SIII]

There's a much easier solution - Ban all HGV's during the day. They can only use it from 8.00pm to 6.00am. Problem solved.

As for 40mph limits of HGV's on A roads - every single one on the A75 does more than that and most still doing 40+ mph thru my village. I hate them and wish I could sit with a speed camera and a 50 cal.

[Bibio]

i'm sure the people responsible are the same people who cant drive properly and do 40mph everywhere. so to make themselves feel better about holding everyone up they cut the speed limits.

within 5 years roads round my way have dropped from a NSL to a 40mph with no accidents ever taking place on the roads.

we need to vote the main political parties out and put others that don't have a clue in power that way they will be chasing their tails on more important stuff like healthcare and education to make stupid decisions like the A9.

i wonder how much annual profit the camera safety partnership make.

[munkygunn182]

Ah but without trucks, Britain stops. True story. I go over to Ireland monthly with work, if the boys are on a single carriageway they'll sit at about 65mph to keep everyone happy. Only exception seems to be Stobarts, who'll still sit at 50+.

I'm very much sympathetic to truckers having worked around them so long. It's not their fault the government pins their vehicle back, it's not their fault they take time to get up to speed and it's not their fault that they take so long to get out at junctions/roundabouts.

[Bibio]

so if it's only the single carriageways that are the dangerous parts why are they putting ASC's up on the dual sections?

so what happens if the ASC's dont save lives but increase deaths due to frustration? are the camera partnership going to be held responsible?

there has also been no news as to the switch on date of the ASC's

[munkygunn182]

Just thinking....isn't there some piece of legislation that says police speed traps are not allowed to operate in average speed zones?

Ie the A9's about to become a 2 wheeled expressway to the North?

**The more I look for this piece of info, the more I think I've made it up.

[Bibio]

i was wondering this myself but they say that the have a system for catching all vehicles inc motorcycles (if the cameras are forward facing then i cant see how). i dont know about the speed traps.

[munkygunn182]

If they're forward facing then I don't really see how they'd catch bikes. Also seems impractical to spend the monies fitting extra cameras to catch such a small percentage of the road users

[Bibio]

i have a feeling that they are going to be using all the redundant ones they have in storage from places like the M80, M74, M90 etc.etc upgrading they done a few years ago and if so then yipeeeeeeeee :-)

[munkygunn182]

That'll do mate, that'll do!

[Mrs DJ Fridge]

Lovely idea lorries only driving at night, but who is going to stay at work to take the deliveries?

[DarrenSV650S]

The nightshift dooshbags?

[TamSV]

They seem to be using the "success" of the A77 scheme as justification. That's where you use a historically bad period to justify all the money you wasted.

It reduced deaths by 2 thirds, there's no doubt. 3 years before SPECS 3 people died. 3 years after 1 person died. Can't argue with the numbers eh? Don't stretch them out any further though, or else it might get a bit less convincing. You can prove what you like with statistically insignificant numbers.

Part of that stretch is a dual carriageway where, post SPECS, an unmarked traffic car caused a fatal at a junction doing 120mph. As a result the fatal accident enquiry concluded the road was really dangerous but this hadn't been noticed before due to the complete lack of accidents.

So the speed limit was reduced from 70mph to 50mph. A Transport Scotland review recently recommended 70 was fine but didn't want to contradict the existing safety measures. Since the new 50 limit was imposed no police officers have crashed at 120 so it must be a good thing.

500% increase in SPECS detected speeding offences since that limit was imposed. That's another measure of success for the system by the way. 5 times more people were caught speeding last year than were caught in the first year of SPECS.

Could someone check this? I've had a couple of pints. I must be making this up.

[Dipper]

Just thinking....isn't there some piece of legislation that says police speed traps are not allowed to operate in average speed zones?

Ie the A9's about to become a 2 wheeled expressway to the North?

**The more I look for this piece of info, the more I think I've made it up.

Unfortunately this is not the case unless Scottish Law is different on this. I got a ticket from a fixed fully hidden camera set up in an ASC zone, there are guidlines but at the end of the day the Police don't have to follow them if they feel it's in the public interest, this one was set up to deter speed at a local weekly summer bike meet.

[peterco]

Average speed camera sites
http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo62/petercorsar/A9-average-speed-camera-map_zps363c8891.jpg (http://s362.photobucket.com/user/petercorsar/media/A9-average-speed-camera-map_zps363c8891.jpg.html)


First installed camera
http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo62/petercorsar/Average-speed-cameras-on-A9-660x496_zps12d100dc.jpg (http://s362.photobucket.com/user/petercorsar/media/Average-speed-cameras-on-A9-660x496_zps12d100dc.jpg.html)

[andrewsmith]

They're front facing :mrgreen:

[Skybaba]

They're front facing :mrgreen:


They look so close together.......perhaps they could be dual-purpose (front and rear).

[Dipper]

They're front facing :mrgreen:

Have a go at a section and let us know how you get on...

[punyXpress]

What about the bit that's part single, part dual carriageway?
If you average 69 mph, do they do you for breaking the 60 or the 70?
Or is andy going to test that as well?

[Bibio]

to be dual purpose they need two per lane as a single cam cant focus on two plates at the same time.

[andrewsmith]

to be dual purpose they need two per lane as a single cam cant focus on two plates at the same time.

and I nominate Bibio to test

[Dipper]

and I nominate Bibio to test

Seconded, I'd do it but it's a bit too far away for me :p

[punyXpress]

. . and ride down the white lines so neither scamera can do the dirty on you, Andy ;)

[Teejayexc]

to be dual purpose they need two per lane as a single cam cant focus on two plates at the same time.


Looking at the pic there are two per lane :(

[Bibio]

i dont think they are as they are using one gantry per gate. unless there is another gantry across the other side of the road. i'll have to go and take a look at some point.

[Jason H]

Bibio, the org would like a full write up by month end.:thumright:

[Bibio]

eerrrmmm. no fekin chance :-)

[muzikill]

Well thats the boring A9 gubbed :) plenty of more interesting routes either side of it. With all these cameras the scottish gov has just INCREASED that roads frustration.

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