View Full Version : Clutch cable adjustmentioned help?!?
Hi everyone my clutch cable is all the way out on the lever end so I went down to try and adjust it at the clutch end. I have found that I believe and I hope you all can inform me otherwise is that the clutch end adjustment is all the way as well? If that is the case should I get a new clutch perhaps? Attached is a photograph.
http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t379/raecarter18/20151016_092242_zpsfpqglgtz.jpg (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/raecarter18/media/20151016_092242_zpsfpqglgtz.jpg.html)
Tamsen Cooper
16-10-15, 09:14 AM
Hi, Yeah that looks adjusted to the very longest length. I recently did my clutch cable too, I got it from robinsons foundry for about £10. I am uploading the video of the cable replacement now to youtube, I will post the link when it is done if it helps.
Red ones
16-10-15, 09:35 AM
I hope you are doing the adjustment correctly.
Before you adjust the cable you should be playing with either gubbins at the bottom end.
Search this forum for clutch adjustment, there is a really good post on how to do it correctly which is all about the clutch lifter mech ( see the part arrowed in the photo ).
I'd take a guess the lifter is shot ( it's made of cheese ). How many miles on the clock?
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/16/0ee5d17ec4aa3ccf44a333cbbdc0063b.jpg
Tamsen Cooper
16-10-15, 09:54 AM
Its uploaded, I am no expert, this is just how I did it using the Haynes Manual and taking a lot of advice.
Ucw5VFXdny8
millemille
16-10-15, 01:45 PM
At the moment your clutch actuator and cable are adjusted incorrectly, and that's why your cable has run out of adjustment at the clutch end.
Undo the lock nut on the actuator - highlighted by the red arrow in the pic above - and use a flat head screwdriver to back off the threaded rod in the middle of the nut.
Back off the cable adjuster on the clutch lever to make the cable as slack as possible.
Use a 12mm spanner on the top nut and 10mm spanner on the cable adjuster and slacken the adjuster at the engine end of the cable so that the angle between the arm and the actuator body is about 80 degrees.
Nip up the 12mm nuts.
Use the flat head screwdriver to wind the threaded rod in until it goes solid, and then back it off quarter a turn and lock up the lock nut.
Take any slack out of the cable with the adjuster at the lever end, until you've got about 10mm of free play in the lever when measured at the ball end of the lever.
This advice might buy you a week.
I bet you a pound to a penny it's a worn "clutch release screw", aka lifter.
Part: 23200-11D00
About £50 from http://www.robinsonsfoundry.co.uk/
Hi it's got 36k on the clock. I set up the rod correctly and have no issues with clutch dragging or changing gear? Why would I need to replace anything when everything is working.
Hi it's got 36k on the clock. I set up the rod correctly and have no issues with clutch dragging or changing gear? Why would I need to replace anything when everything is working.
Had to replace mine at a similar mileage. It's fine for a while but then wears more and you've run out of adjustment. You'll start finding it difficult to find neutral soon.
I can see I need to change just the cable but everything else seems fine so I'll just get one of them. Thanks
millemille
18-10-15, 12:40 PM
Hi it's got 36k on the clock. I set up the rod correctly and have no issues with clutch dragging or changing gear? Why would I need to replace anything when everything is working.
With respect my friend, if that picture is of your bike as it currently is then you haven't set the clutch actuator up correctly.
The actuator arm is pulled up way too much - this evident by the angle between the cable and the arm, by how much the actuator adjuster is wound out and by how much you've wound the barrel adjuster out.
It's ridiculous to suggest that a flat wound multi strand steel cable - that is under very, very little load - has streteched to the extent that you've run out of length adjustment.
I'd suggest either getting a manual or giving the bike to someone who knows what they're doing and set the actuator up correctly - as per my guide above - and then see what the score is.
I have a manual and it looks to be the 80 to 85 degrees in relation to the cable. That's what I can't understand. I appreciate your comment and am willing to adjust it. So you think I need to slacken the locknuts on the arm adjuster and move it so the spring is not under as much pressure?
Red ones
18-10-15, 01:20 PM
Seriously, I would look to revisit the clutch adjustment first.
Check the chain tension, then do the clutch adjustment as per the attached image.
36k is typical for the stupid little balls in the release screw to wear out, the effect is similar to a stretched cable albeit that it is less predictable. A stretched cable is equally carp at pulling the clutch every time, the worn release screw may be great for a few operations after adjusting, but can then go off very quickly.
In my experience the clutch cable rarely stretches that much, I've replaced one in 100,000 miles on one SV, and not at all on the other two. The one that got replaced didn't fix the problem. The release screws are a whole different story and seem to start packing in from about 25,000 miles.
The release screw only has to be slightly out of alignment and, because of that great long lever to the point where the cable connects, the cable adjustment has to be huge to make up for it.
I appreciate that the release screw is four times the cost of the cable, but the upside is that it is much easier to replace (so long as you get it all in the right way round).
So you think the bit with the 3 and 4 on it in your diagram needs replacing
millemille
18-10-15, 02:00 PM
I have a manual and it looks to be the 80 to 85 degrees in relation to the cable. That's what I can't understand. I appreciate your comment and am willing to adjust it. So you think I need to slacken the locknuts on the arm adjuster and move it so the spring is not under as much pressure?
It may just be a trick of the camera angle, but I doubt it given the other indicators, but I think you've got the actuator arm way past the 80/85 degree angle.
This pic.....
http://www.sv650.org/gallery/pic45/clutch1.jpg
....looks more how I'd expect the arm angle to look.
Maybe double check your angle with a pertractor?
Okay so it's the bolts above and below that adjuster I loosen to move it?
Okay so it's the bolts above and below that adjuster I loosen to move it?
No it's attached to the clutch lifter, which is worn, which is why the arm is at the wrong angle. Replace the lifter.
millemille
19-10-15, 09:25 AM
No it's attached to the clutch lifter, which is worn, which is why the arm is at the wrong angle. Replace the lifter.
I don't see how you can say that from looking at one picture, and fundamentally what you are saying doesn't make sense.
Whether the actuator is worn or not is irrelevant to setting the arm at the correct angle.
Back off the cable adjuster on the lever, undo the lock nut, back off the actuator threaded adjuster, set the arm angle correctly with the cable barrel adjuster, wind the threaded adjuster in until it goes solid and then back off quarter of a turn and take up cable slack with the lever adjuster.
Nothing to do with the condition of the actuator.
A worn actuator will be evident in lever feel and insufficient clutch actuation.
Sorry to bring this back. I have now replaced the clutch cable and cleaned and lubed the release mechanism or actuator as it is caused. I have all my bearings inside the actuator and it is not broken and is in good order too. I asked a competent person to confirm this who has a good understanding of motorbikes and maintenance. He now says if all these bits have been checked and changed it must be the clutch plates itself causing the slack in the cable.
garynortheast
01-11-15, 06:45 PM
I had exactly the same trouble as you. It has absolutely nothing to do with clutch plates. I replaced the cable first, which made clutch operation considerably less gritty but it still did not sort out the length of travel or adjustment required to operate the clutch. I replaced the clutch worm drive and then adjusted the clutch actuation screw as millemille describes and I instantly had a correctly functioning clutch.
If you want to spend your time arguing the toss with people who have some considerable combined experience with these bikes, or your money needlessly on clutch plates along with all the faff of changing them, that's your perogative and will probably help you to build up your own knowledge and expertise.
Personally I bought the worm drive and adjusted the screw properly. End of story.
I am not trying to argue with anyone on here just get to the bottom of the problem.
garynortheast
01-11-15, 07:06 PM
As has been said by a few people here, it's a combination of worn worm drive and poor adjustment of the actuator screw.
Okay I've looked at the part number that ophic kindly posted on page one called "clutch screw assy" is that the whole bit that is attached by the two 10mm nuts? If the screw is damaged what happens to it. Does it wear away inside so it isn't as long when you go to adjust? I will buy the bit for 46 quid but just wanted to understand what happens to the screw assembly to make it malfunction.
millemille
01-11-15, 07:30 PM
Whereabouts in the country are you tojo82?
In gosport near portsmouth. I'm constantly reading to try and get a good understanding of the bike. I've done a few maintenance bits using the Haynes manual but I improve by understanding instead of just doing. Is it item 18 on this picture that "is made of cheese" from what I can see I have all my bearings in the worm so it must be this part that's shot?
http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t379/raecarter18/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2015-11-01-19-27-30_zps9c8ycdd7.png (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/raecarter18/media/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_2015-11-01-19-27-30_zps9c8ycdd7.png.html)
garynortheast
01-11-15, 07:33 PM
There are lots of little ball bearings in a spiral retaining cage. The cage wears, the ball bearings slop about in the cage and you end up with a lot of unproductive movement of the actuating arm before it moves the clutch rod.
The bearings sit inside part 17.
Ah I see. So how does that create slack in the clutch cable? Thabks everyone btw for educating me
garynortheast
01-11-15, 07:44 PM
You are having to take all the unproductive movement out of the assembly by adjusting the clutch cable. The poorly adjusted screw and locknut and consequently poorly positioned actuating arm considerably worsen the problem.
Also with regards to the arm position, think about the effective range of leverage. Much more effort at the lever will be required with the arm in the position shown in your picture than would be needed if the arm was in the correct position.
Okay thank you then. I will purchase a new one this week. I'm assuming if I buy item 17 for 46 quid that's the whole unit. Thanks eveyone
millemille
01-11-15, 08:01 PM
What's the point of buying a new actuator if you haven't adjusted the current one correctly?
I have adjusted it according to the clutch mantra
millemille
01-11-15, 08:06 PM
I have adjusted it according to the clutch mantra
Humour me and post a picture of the actuator as it is now then....
It's night time now. When you say the actuator what part are you referring to. I have the screw so it just touched then I backed off 1/8th of a turn. The arm that the clutch cable attaches to is at its furthest lowest point. What else can I adjust?
millemille
01-11-15, 08:13 PM
The arm that the clutch cable attaches to is at its furthest lowest point.
I'm guessing, and if I'm wrong please forgive me, that English isn't your first langauge? I fear that something is maybe getting lost in translation....
If what you've said above is correct then you've not set the actuator up correctly - the actuator arm is set up correctly when the angle between the cable and arm centre line is 80 degrees.
That's why I'm asking if you can post a picture; as they say, a picture paints a 1,000 words....
Edit to add: for clarity the part being referred to as the actuator is officially called "clutch release screw assembly"
English is my first language and can i ask why are you being so rude. I can post a picture when it is not dark but I can assure you I have followed the points numerous times to try and fix my problem and the arm is in the correct place
It is in the same position as this as per the manual http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t379/raecarter18/Mobile%20Uploads/20151101_201932_zpsvrjbshgg.jpg (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/raecarter18/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20151101_201932_zpsvrjbshgg.jpg.html)
millemille
01-11-15, 08:33 PM
It is in the same position as this as per the manual http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t379/raecarter18/Mobile%20Uploads/20151101_201932_zpsvrjbshgg.jpg (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/raecarter18/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20151101_201932_zpsvrjbshgg.jpg.html)
Which is what you've been saying all along, even when you posted a photograph that quite clearly showed it wasn't, as was pointed out to you by several people earlier in the thread. So it's not unreasonable to ask you to post a picture - particularly as your most recent description of how you've set it up is still incorrect...
It's up to you whether you buy a new actuator or not, no skin off my nose.
It's also not an unreasonable suggestion, for which I already apologised in advance if it was incorrect, that English wasn't your first langauge given some of the slightly eccentric choice of words in your posts. No offence was intended, not should be taken.
I think the picture angle on page 1 makes it look like it isn't in place. I can take a picture tomorrow straight on. If it is at too high an angle as you state how can I make it lower? The only way that seems possible is to take off the whole bit, unwind the arm from the worm drive then put it back a bit. That makes the arm way off? I'm sorry I'm being a nugget and do appreciate that you are trying to drum into me that I have it wrong but I don't know how to adjust it to make it right?
millemille
01-11-15, 09:06 PM
Ok, I've just nipped out to the workshop and taken some pictures of an SV650 with a brand new actuator, cable and clutch pack.
This is the actuator arm in the lowest position it can get to with the cable fully backed off and slack...
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/905/DQNgno.jpg
...so does your arm go as low as this?
This is the actuator set up correctly, as measured with a pertractor, with the angle between the arm and cable at 80 degrees....
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/633/hIIaYW.jpg
As you can see there's not a massive amount of difference - it was only 4 or 5 turns on the cable adjuster to get the arm to the correct angle. Whether your actuator is worn or not is irrelevant to this part of the set up.
Does this help at all?
Okay so they do look similar. If I turn the screw in the middle does that move that arm down then? I adjusted the screw so that when I saw the arm move slightly I stopped and then backed off 1/8th of a turn. Are you saying I should continue to turn the screw in a few more turns than I am currently doing? I appreciate your continued help and will experiment tomorrow in daylight and post some pictures. Thank you
millemille
01-11-15, 09:16 PM
Okay so they do look similar. If I turn the screw in the middle does that move that arm down then? I adjusted the screw so that when I saw the arm move slightly I stopped and then backed off 1/8th of a turn. Are you saying I should continue to turn the screw in a few more turns than I am currently doing? I appreciate your continued help and will experiment tomorrow in daylight and post some pictures. Thank you
The screw in the middle should be wound out and not in contact with the clutch push rod whilst you are setting the arm angle.
Once you've got the arm angle set correctly then you wind the adjuster screw in until it goes solid - the actuator may "settle" slightly as the slack in the mechanism is taken out - and then back off the adjuster screw 1/8th of a turn and do up the lock nut.
Right so unscrewing the screw allows the arm to be moved. I will get on that tomorrow then.
millemille
01-11-15, 09:20 PM
yes, wind the screw adjuster out so you are absolutely certain it isn't in contact with the clutch push rod.
Then set the arm angle.
Then wind the screw adjuster in until it goes solid and then back it off slightly and do up the lock nut.
Okay so that may be where I've been messing up. I've been trying to move the arm lower as you wrote but couldn't. Obviously everytime I went to do that the screw was wound in.
Right millemille I've spent time on it doing everything you stated. I've taken out the rod and cleaned and greased it. I've cleaned the worm and greased it, unscrewed the screw entirely and greased that. I loosened everything and trying lowering the arm. I've then tightened the screw until it stopped then wound it back 1/8th a turn. (In the past this is the step that I did different as in the past I screw it until I saw the arm move then back it off 1/8th.) Is this right now? I will have to go for a ride tomorrow and hope it doesn't slip in the higher gears.
http://i1056.photobucket.com/albums/t379/raecarter18/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_155045_zpsl3ymkst8.jpg (http://s1056.photobucket.com/user/raecarter18/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20151102_155045_zpsl3ymkst8.jpg.html)
millemille
02-11-15, 05:29 PM
Looks ok to me, other than you need to do up the lock nuts on the clutch cable!
If the clutch is still slipping it's not because of the actuator....
I have done up the lock nuts. I think it is in the same position as the start but my initial camera angle made it look off. Just to confirm to turn the screw till it stops then back off 1/8th? Thank you for persevering with me also.
millemille
02-11-15, 06:35 PM
The adjuster lock nut on the clutch cable is clearly NOT done up in the photo.....
Sorry yes I am aware of that I just took the photo before I did it up.
johnnyrod
02-11-15, 09:22 PM
All sounds good. I would only do up the locknut at the handlebar end finger tight while you are trying it out so it's easy to adjust - I took the rubber boot off mine though and I also find that I need to do up the locknut with pliers it shakes loose. You'll need to adjust the cable from one or both ends (doesn't matter which) to get the biting point in a comfortable place.
millemille
07-11-15, 05:12 PM
And?
I've had a bad bug since and have been confined to the toilet so I still haven't been on it unfortunately
Hi millemille I've been out for 30 miles this morning and everything feels fine. It seems my mess up was that I didn't screw in enough on initial setups. I screwed in until it stopped then backed off like you said and I had no issues with the clutch slipping this morning. That you for your help.
millemille
10-11-15, 10:29 PM
Hi millemille I've been out for 30 miles this morning and everything feels fine. It seems my mess up was that I didn't screw in enough on initial setups. I screwed in until it stopped then backed off like you said and I had no issues with the clutch slipping this morning. That you for your help.
No worries....
yokohama
11-11-15, 09:06 AM
It's been an instructive thread at least. Now I've got a clearer idea of what to do when the time comes to adjusting mine,
I agree with you yokahama. Been having clutch adjustment issues, and this just breaks it down totally
SO I tried to do this adjustment this evening. I had the clutch adjusted as per the picture to try and get the 80 degree angle but I have to use all of the adjuster at the lever end and the bike still creeps forward in first gear. Is there something I'm missing? Thanks.
johnnyrod
18-11-15, 10:09 AM
The angle of the arm doesn't matter after you've set the screw in the middle. Slacken the cable right off, pull the arm down as far as it'll go (you're nearly there anyway), set the screw as described here, then adjust up the cable to get the biting point right, using the cable adjusters at top or bottom end of the cable - they both do the same thing.
The angle of the arm doesn't matter after you've set the screw in the middle. Slacken the cable right off, pull the arm down as far as it'll go (you're nearly there anyway), set the screw as described here, then adjust up the cable to get the biting point right, using the cable adjusters at top or bottom end of the cable - they both do the same thing.
Ok.Thank you very much.
Blapper
27-08-16, 05:06 PM
I dunno whether the policy here is to re-open old threads or start new ones, but I searched, found this and thought I would re-open it.
OK, 2001 curvy, 9500 miles. Ever since I have had it (1100 miles), the clutch has been unsatisfactory. My actual problem(s) with the clutch are that the bite point feels weird, and it drags. I have referred to this obliquely in another thread and been told it will be the adjustment of the clutch lifting mech. When I put it in gear it goes in with such a bang that I have to push it forward to try to minimise it. Once it is in gear, I start to let the clutch out and can feel the dragging getting worse, but no useful increase in friction happens until the lever is about 3/4 - 7/8 out then it is all in one place but to free the clutch to any noticeable extent I have to pull it in past the previous bite point. Bizarre eh? I have a theory and that is somebody has put the wrong JASO oil in it and pickled the plates so they are very slippery. That would explain it, but before I buy new plates for it I thought I would check the lifter adjustment out. The lifter adjustment wasn't as easy as I would have liked, because even with the handlebar and clutch end cable adjusters fully backed off, I struggled to get appreciably past the 90 degree position for the actuator arm/cable angle. In the end, I was just about able to get 85 degrees on it, tightened the screw, backed it off 1/8th turn and locked it. Then I centralised the clutch end of the cable and finished the cable adjustment at the handlebar end with 12mm movement at the lever end. Should be good eh? Dragged like before.
At this point I thought 9500 miles? Surely the lifter isn't knackered? Oh well, in for a penny I thought, so I removed, cleaned and dismantled it. The worm is the lowest quality part and shows a small amount of wear, but not enough I would have thought to give such a poor clutch action. What do you guys think? Has anybody else actually stripped and checked out enough of them that they know the difference between ok and knackered? Millemille? Personally I think it is OK, but that is off the back of no SV experience. Plenty of other bikes, but no SV's.
UPDATE:
I have packed the assembly with moly grease and reassembled it onto the bike with a better understanding of how the lifter works (maybe ;-) ). Now that it is all super slick, I find it hard to ascertain the exact 'stop' point where you back it off 1/8th turn and lock it off. I can see effortless compression of the rubber 'bearing' flange at the back going on while I am spinning the screw in, so I need to ask what is happening inside the clutch: Is there a chance that I am burning out a bearing by having too much pressure on the pushrod? I saw some rotation marks on the end of the lifter screw (in the pic below) - does this mean the pushrod is spinning right out to the lifter and there needs to be actual slop at the lifter to pushrod interface?
Even with the screw adjusted what must be too tight, I am still getting a very draggy clutch and in first gear I have to really struggle to break stiction by hand, engine off even the smallest amount. It is weird that I am getting both drag and a bite point that is a long way out.
Here are some snaps shots of all the parts before reassembly showing (I think) acceptable wear:
https://c7.staticflickr.com/9/8181/29234479406_3673ea5d22_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Lxmmdo)Clutch lifting mech.-1 (https://flic.kr/p/Lxmmdo) by Andrew Hayes (https://www.flickr.com/photos/spraynpray/), on Flickr
https://c4.staticflickr.com/9/8508/28647793683_f1ced21d4e_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KDvqZi)Clutch lifting mech.-4 (https://flic.kr/p/KDvqZi) by Andrew Hayes (https://www.flickr.com/photos/spraynpray/), on Flickr
https://c7.staticflickr.com/9/8293/28645699214_10e9cdac14_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/KDjGnL)Clutch lifting mech.-2 (https://flic.kr/p/KDjGnL) by Andrew Hayes (https://www.flickr.com/photos/spraynpray/), on Flickr
https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8068/29234473976_1e32c1927a_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/LxmjAL)Clutch lifting mech.-3 (https://flic.kr/p/LxmjAL) by Andrew Hayes (https://www.flickr.com/photos/spraynpray/), on Flickr
https://c2.staticflickr.com/9/8058/29190080841_2bcab71f9c_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/LtqN4T)Clutch lifting mech.-5 (https://flic.kr/p/LtqN4T) by Andrew Hayes (https://www.flickr.com/photos/spraynpray/), on Flickr
vBulletin® , Copyright ©2000-2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.