View Full Version : The Covid19 thread
chris8886
19-02-21, 09:23 PM
Got my covid vaccine late this morning, feeling a little ropey right now, but some paracetamol and I'll be fine I'm sure :D
Dave20046
19-02-21, 10:41 PM
Got my covid vaccine late this morning, feeling a little ropey right now, but some paracetamol and I'll be fine I'm sure :D
You might be the first Org Guinea pig, don't forget to check back in.... if you survive!
garynortheast
20-02-21, 09:23 AM
I had mine a fortnight ago, the Astra Zenica one. Absolutely no side effects. :smt119
Got the second one on April 24th.
Craig380
20-02-21, 09:32 AM
Bill Gates now knows where you are at all times, and will KILL you if you criticise Windows 10 to any of your customers.
Dave20046
20-02-21, 10:23 AM
Bill Gates now knows where you are at all times, and will KILL you if you criticise Windows 10 to any of your customers.
That'll save a few quid on the GPS for you bike tours Gary
:tongue:
chris8886
21-02-21, 12:24 AM
You might be the first Org Guinea pig, don't forget to check back in.... if you survive!
Well, I felt like utter carp before bed last night and then first thing this morning, but am all good again now :D
12 carers in a nursing home up here all went down with covid but the tests cam back negative so they went ahead and immunised them. all 12 got/had covid and were off ill.
getting the jab does not stop covid just like the flu jab. its not a cure.
speaking of the flu jab i would like to see proper statistics of it actually working as i dont think it has reduced numbers of people catching the flu.
i suspect the covid jab/s will be the same. its here to stay just like the flu (its actually a strain of flu).
more scare mongering so the lying bunch of asswipe politicians can give golden handshakes to their buddies and get backhanders put into offshore accounts (which the BOE mostly control).
tell me..... before the covid pandemic how nay wars/conflicts were going on.. answer not that many...
your government HAS to spend money or the public want lower taxation/duty and we cant have that now can we....
i think its 600million vaticinations ordered and 70million people in the UK.. how does that work..
you are all being conned. yes its a nasty flu (the flu is and if you have ever had it you would know its not a cold or sniffle) but its killing the same amount that would normally die anyway. EVERYBODY is going to contract it but its a case of slowing it down so its manageable for hospitals.
i'll take my tin hat off now.
ooohhh and the left and right dont know what they are doing. it turns out that the wife should not have had the jab as she has had a subarachnoid haemorrhage.......
R1ffR4ff
21-02-21, 09:53 AM
Got my covid vaccine late this morning, feeling a little ropey right now, but some paracetamol and I'll be fine I'm sure :D
Got mine this Friday(OAZ) as well. So far no side effects :)
12 carers in a nursing home up here all went down with covid but the tests cam back negative so they went ahead and immunised them. all 12 got/had covid and were off ill.
getting the jab does not stop covid just like the flu jab. its not a cure.
speaking of the flu jab i would like to see proper statistics of it actually working as i dont think it has reduced numbers of people catching the flu.
i suspect the covid jab/s will be the same. its here to stay just like the flu (its actually a strain of flu).
more scare mongering so the lying bunch of asswipe politicians can give golden handshakes to their buddies and get backhanders put into offshore accounts (which the BOE mostly control).
tell me..... before the covid pandemic how nay wars/conflicts were going on.. answer not that many...
your government HAS to spend money or the public want lower taxation/duty and we cant have that now can we....
i think its 600million vaticinations ordered and 70million people in the UK.. how does that work..
you are all being conned. yes its a nasty flu (the flu is and if you have ever had it you would know its not a cold or sniffle) but its killing the same amount that would normally die anyway. EVERYBODY is going to contract it but its a case of slowing it down so its manageable for hospitals.
i'll take my tin hat off now.
In the interest of free speech I'll not delete this post. However, what you state is not supported by any evidence and indeed there is much evidence to contradict many of the points you make. I'd be much happier if you added 'in your opinion...'. On many social media platforms this type of post would be fact checked then deleted
Luckypants
21-02-21, 01:56 PM
getting the jab does not stop covid just like the flu jab. its not a cure.
I don't think anyone official has said its a cure. Just last night on the news I heard a government advisor stating that the Covid jab will most likely need topping up annually. So yes you are correct, but no one ever said otherwise.
i think its 600million vaticinations ordered and 70million people in the UK.. how does that work..
Well for starters everyone needs two doses, so we need 140 million doses to get everyone immunised. Ordering 600 million doses does not mean we get them all at once and these could be taken over the next 2-3 years? Given we need 140 million doses a year, having 600 million on order seems like good forward planning.
However, it is no where near 600 million doses on order. Just one quick google shows this...
https://www.itv.com/news/2021-02-01/deal-for-promising-covid-vaccine-puts-uks-total-dose-order-at-more-than-400m
you are all being conned. yes its a nasty flu (the flu is and if you have ever had it you would know its not a cold or sniffle) but its killing the same amount that would normally die anyway.
Now that is complete BS and is an insult to anyone who has lost a loved one to Covid. How can you even think that when the number of excess deaths clearly tracks the number of Covid-19 infections. Infection rate goes up, two weeks later the excess deaths increase proportionately. There is so much evidence for this from around the world I'm not even going to Google a rebuttal - just open your fecking eyes!
i'll take my tin hat off now.
I think you really should and look at some facts.
how can i get my facts right when everywhere you look there are more contradictions than the bible.
that was my whole point of the rant.
where are the flu statistics as they seem to be getting kept quiet. we can only go by the data we are given. how many people are dying that are being put down to covid that would have normally died anyway. can someone please find data that is older then 3 years of the UK national death rate and then compare it with this pandemic to see what the figures are over and above. there is a difference between confirmed cases and actual, most people who are getting covid dont seem to me that bothered so dont report it or go for a test so dont get included in the figures. which would put the cases/deaths statistics looking much better.
@ messie, no offence and you can delete my post if you like but you have had no contribution to this forum for a very long time so what gives you the right to be a moderator......
why has £35mil been spent on a test and trace app that does not even work. if it dont work then it should not be paid for its that simple..... or is it that the MD is and elite. jezuz a script kiddie could have done a better job for a bottle of pop and some crisps. £35mil is a new hospital or two or 20 schools or 100 drop in centres, you get the drift. why is the public not up in arms about this.. how much do you think it cost to develop something like ermm tinder or a dating app that could have been repurposed and done a better job.
am i going to be branded as a social outcast if i dont take the covid jabs..........
why has £35mil been spent on a test and trace app that does not even work. if it dont work then it should not be paid for its that simple..... or is it that the MD is and elite.
whilst I disagree with most of your covid related comments, this one gets to me and I've written several emails to my useless MP.
T&T was managed originally by Public Health England. John Penrose who is (don't laugh) in charge of anti corruption and NHS improvement, he wanted T&T pulled away from PHE and got his way. He wanted someone independent running it, so he proposed Baroness Dido Harding, who happens to be his wife.
She was in charge of TalkTalk when they had the massive data breach and has proved her incompetence a few times since.
The price tag on test and trace is now £22 billion
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-testing/uk-says-covid-19-test-and-trace-system-cost-to-rise-to-22-billion-pounds-idUKKBN2832FL
[QUOTE=Bibio;3125488]how can i get my facts right when everywhere you look there are more contradictions than the bible.
@ messie, no offence and you can delete my post if you like but you have had no contribution to this forum for a very long time so what gives you the right to be a moderator......
None taken! That's another reason why I didn't delete your post. I just contributed my opinion as anyone who reads this forum and is a member can. All the best x
.....where are the flu statistics as they seem to be getting kept quiet. we can only go by the data we are given...
They are published weekly if you want to see them. I suspect what you mean is that you are not being spoon fed the stats.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/962596/Weekly_Flu_and_COVID-19_report_w7.pdf
Someone from NHS said the other week that essentially there has been no flu season this winter because the measures taken to reduce coronavirus transmission have effectively stopped all flu transmission.
They are published weekly if you want to see them. I suspect what you mean is that you are not being spoon fed the stats.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/962596/Weekly_Flu_and_COVID-19_report_w7.pdf
Someone from NHS said the other week that essentially there has been no flu season this winter because the measures taken to reduce coronavirus transmission have effectively stopped all flu transmission.
Or Flu is being diagnosed as Covid . . . .
I'm waiting until after Winter/Flu season has passed and then will review the statistics for Flu cases & deaths for 2020/2021 vs the prev 5 years. It will give a good indication of what has been potentially mis-represented.
Currently deaths of Covid are not clearly being distinguished where it is;
Due to Covid
Or simply they tested positive for it within X days of passing
Luckypants
21-02-21, 04:53 PM
Someone from NHS said the other week that essentially there has been no flu season this winter because the measures taken to reduce coronavirus transmission have effectively stopped all flu transmission.
I've heard similar said about norovirus too. I think we had all forgotten about how effective being clean is at keeping diseases at bay.
We get to meet up with friends today as the local lockdown is lifted. Bars, restaurants and sports facilities open - max 4 people together. Municipal boundaries still closed for travelling but that will be reviewed on Thursday after yesterday's figures dropped to the required number to open up the towns within the region for travel. Still no travel beyond that to other regions.
With 30 years experience of working with and for the NHS, before retiring, I could give some harrowing facts about Covid and its impact but this is the happy, smiley thread.
To conclude, today we get to meet up with friends.
svenrico
24-02-21, 11:09 PM
The vaccine takes about 2 weeks to take effect (that is what they told me when I had my jab) so some people might catch Covid after they have been vaccinated.
What do some people need to be convinced of the seriousness of this virus ?! Everybody should have the vaccine (unless there is some medical reason for not having it ) as well as observing the hands, space, face precautions.
How else is this bloody thing going to be brought under some control and save us from going in and out of lockdowns. (as well as saving lives of course )
ps All in my opinion of course.
Luckypants
25-02-21, 08:09 AM
I have been called to get my vaccine, so I'll be jabbed a week today.
Mine is booked for Monday :)
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Craig380
25-02-21, 08:25 AM
Mine's tomorrow:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojP0BO6H4Qc
garynortheast
25-02-21, 09:24 AM
Had my jab a couple of weeks back and last night had a call from Bill Gates telling me he knows where I am and that I'm not allowed to go to bingo and I must go home and buy something from the Microsoft Store immediately as penance.
SV650rules
25-02-21, 09:36 AM
Had my jab a couple of weeks back and last night had a call from Bill Gates telling me he knows where I am and that I'm not allowed to go to bingo and I must go home and buy something from the Microsoft Store immediately as penance.
I was a bit concerned over our neighbour when he got the Oxford/AZ jab. Next day he was sitting on top of their car, eating bananas with the skin on and throwing handfuls of sh it at passers by. Not sure using a chimp virus was such a good idea.
Seriously though, in the Scottish study released a few days ago AZ vaccine was 94% effective in preventing serious illness, Pfizer 85%.
https://news.trust.org/item/20210222133620-9di3d
Went onto the vaccine site to book and I'm not recognised by the system. I know why, I haven't been to my GP for years and I've dropped off their register. Spoke to the practice today, re-registered and the admin lady said she'd phone me this afternoon to book a jab. Very efficient so far. Hope to feel a little "scratch"* in the next few days.
Other smile is a shiny new MOT for my 21yr old Yaris, no problems.
*(censor wouldn't let me put p-rick)
Edit PS - good to their word, vaccine booked for tomorrow. Excellent service from GP surgery.
I boarded the Astra-Zeneca train today. The doc said I may get a sore left arm - I told him that it would give me back my symmetry since the right arm aches. He said he liked my humour which is good because I told him that I was going to tell the waiting queue that his needle had broken my arm. :)
svenrico
25-02-21, 06:06 PM
am i going to be branded as a social outcast if i dont take the covid jabs..........
The sooner as many people as possible are vaccinated ,the sooner we can escape from lockdowns and restrictions . We all want to be allowed out and about and riding our motorcycles again, so should you be branded a social outcast, I'll leave that to others to decide !
how can i get my facts right when everywhere you look there are more contradictions than the bible.
that was my whole point of the rant.
where are the flu statistics as they seem to be getting kept quiet. we can only go by the data we are given. how many people are dying that are being put down to covid that would have normally died anyway. can someone please find data that is older then 3 years of the UK national death rate and then compare it with this pandemic to see what the figures are over and above. there is a difference between confirmed cases and actual, most people who are getting covid dont seem to me that bothered so dont report it or go for a test so dont get included in the figures. which would put the cases/deaths statistics looking much better.
@ messie, no offence and you can delete my post if you like but you have had no contribution to this forum for a very long time so what gives you the right to be a moderator......
why has £35mil been spent on a test and trace app that does not even work. if it dont work then it should not be paid for its that simple..... or is it that the MD is and elite. jezuz a script kiddie could have done a better job for a bottle of pop and some crisps. £35mil is a new hospital or two or 20 schools or 100 drop in centres, you get the drift. why is the public not up in arms about this.. how much do you think it cost to develop something like ermm tinder or a dating app that could have been repurposed and done a better job.
am i going to be branded as a social outcast if i dont take the covid jabs..........
Bib, the ONS Gov website shows excess deaths, and by cause. By week and by month/year. All the data is out there. You can search by flu deaths if you wish. And no, they are not being kept quiet. They're produced every week, and have been for as long as I can remember.
The ONS stats also break down the deaths that are wholly down to Covid, Covid as a mitigating factor and had Covid but it wasn't a contributing factor. There's nothing hidden, or spun, to make things sound worse or better than they are. Its a very easy Google search.
As for your comment about the number of people not reporting it; the hard figure is the number of deaths. Whether the percentage of those that have had it is up or down, who gives a flying fig when the number of deaths is a real number, not a percentage. I can't remember what the excess number is, though I have seen it, but though the number of Covid deaths is listed at 120k the excess is upwards of 80k I think...
Actually, the only spin is that being done, on occasion, by various media and Covid deniers.
There was an article out yesterday saying there hasn't been a flu death for 5(?) weeks.
As for social outcast; there's a whole spectrum of beliefs from rabid denier to those that haven't been outside their door for 11 months. Some will support your stance whilst others will ridicule it.
Adam Ef
25-02-21, 10:25 PM
I'm up next Friday. Hoping for the Phizer Beyonce one.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f6/dd/4c/f6dd4cd7e546cd8b99486729954b8370.gif
Irony - doesn't it seem ironic that Ursula von der Leyen, a German lady, is berating Astra Zeneca for not supplying sufficient vaccines whilst Germany has 1.4 million doses of the AZ vaccine and cannot get people to take it?
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/germany-covid-vaccine-stocks-unused-112008376.html
Would it be adding insult to injury to ask for them back so we can speed up our vaccination drive further? ;)
svenrico
26-02-21, 01:07 PM
Irony - doesn't it seem ironic that Ursula von der Leyen, a German lady, is berating Astra Zeneca for not supplying sufficient vaccines whilst Germany has 1.4 million doses of the AZ vaccine and cannot get people to take it?
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/germany-covid-vaccine-stocks-unused-112008376.html
Would it be adding insult to injury to ask for them back so we can speed up our vaccination drive further? ;)
No it wouldn't.
Irony - doesn't it seem ironic that Ursula von der Leyen, a German lady, is berating Astra Zeneca for not supplying sufficient vaccines whilst Germany has 1.4 million doses of the AZ vaccine and cannot get people to take it?
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/germany-covid-vaccine-stocks-unused-112008376.html
Would it be adding insult to injury to ask for them back so we can speed up our vaccination drive further? ;)
The equivalent of asking someone sitting at a table alone in a Restaurant "excuse me, can i take this spare seat?"
Irony - doesn't it seem ironic that Ursula von der Leyen, a German lady, is berating Astra Zeneca for not supplying sufficient vaccines whilst Germany has 1.4 million doses of the AZ vaccine and cannot get people to take it?
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/germany-covid-vaccine-stocks-unused-112008376.html
Would it be adding insult to injury to ask for them back so we can speed up our vaccination drive further? ;)
The issue between the EU and AZ was down to AZ not fulfilling their contract, simple as that.
Not sure what you are trying to imply by using the term "ask for them back". Those doses are nothing whatsoever to do with the UK, not our business what Germany or any other EU country does with them. There are certainly problems with public attitudes to the AZ vaccine in some EU countries, their media and press are just as bad as the UK press when it comes to stirring up bigotry and xenophobia, nationalism and prejudice. There are strong right wing groups and anti-vax brigades in many countries ready to adopt whatever inflammatory propaganda the media cares to publish. Just ignore them, it doesn't matter what Germany does.
Not sure what you are trying to imply by using the term "ask for them back".
humour only :) I am aware that the EU is upset (and suspicious) of AZ reducing shipments and that their vaccine stocks are nothing to do with the UK.
svenrico
27-02-21, 12:22 AM
'Just ignore them, it doesn't matter what Germany does.' That's what they said in the 1930's ! (just joking )
svenrico
27-02-21, 12:28 AM
'The issue between the EU and AZ was down to AZ not fulfilling their contract, simple as that.'
Previously when they were complaining in the EU about the UK getting preferential treatment on delivery of AZ vaccine ,it turned out the UK had ordered and paid for vaccines much earlier than EU.
Grant66
27-02-21, 07:59 AM
'The issue between the EU and AZ was down to AZ not fulfilling their contract, simple as that.'
Previously when they were complaining in the EU about the UK getting preferential treatment on delivery of AZ vaccine ,it turned out the UK had ordered and paid for vaccines much earlier than EU.The UK signed the contract with AZ a day later than the EU signed theirs.
It all comes down to how well the contracts were drafted. Spoiler: the EU didn't do a very good job of writing theirs.
Better and more in-depth explanation:
https://www.politico.eu/article/the-key-differences-between-the-eu-and-uk-astrazeneca-contracts/
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SV650rules
27-02-21, 09:23 AM
The UK signed the contract with AZ a day later than the EU signed theirs.
It all comes down to how well the contracts were drafted. Spoiler: the EU didn't do a very good job of writing theirs.
Better and more in-depth explanation:
https://www.politico.eu/article/the-key-differences-between-the-eu-and-uk-astrazeneca-contracts/
Way back in April 2020 UK government set up a deal with AZ to be a partner and coughed up £65million to set up better research and production facilities. While the EU haggled over price ( as if the AZ vaccine isn't cheap enough already ) the UK put their money where their mouth was... The UK contract was much more comprehensive than the EU one because UK was a partner in the research and production of the vaccine, which in the results of Public Health Scotland real world data published less than a week ago was more effective ( 94% vs 85% ) than the Pfizer one at keeping people from needing hospital care.
Extract from the linked article
Most important, however, is that it meant that the British government was “effectively a major shareholder” in the jab’s development as early as April. After Oxford and AstraZeneca agreed to team up at the end of April, for example, the British government filled seats on Oxford-AstraZeneca joint liaison committees.
svenrico
27-02-21, 02:21 PM
Way back in April 2020 UK government set up a deal with AZ to be a partner and coughed up £65million to set up better research and production facilities. While the EU haggled over price ( as if the AZ vaccine isn't cheap enough already ) the UK put their money where their mouth was... The UK contract was much more comprehensive than the EU one because UK was a partner in the research and production of the vaccine, which in the results of Public Health Scotland real world data published less than a week ago was more effective ( 94% vs 85% ) than the Pfizer one at keeping people from needing hospital care.
Extract from the linked article
Most important, however, is that it meant that the British government was “effectively a major shareholder” in the jab’s development as early as April. After Oxford and AstraZeneca agreed to team up at the end of April, for example, the British government filled seats on Oxford-AstraZeneca joint liaison committees.
Sounds like credit where it is due then in this case.
how do we know that a vaccine is more effective than b vaccine? answer we dont.
or is it a case that the virus has already infected most of the population but they dont know they have had it as there are different symptoms for different people.
from the people i have spoke to who have had positive covid tests the main symptoms seem to be:
just headaches and a little nausea for a few days.
no taste or smell for x days, weeks, months.
full blown flu symptoms like pneumonia.
no symptoms.
the most common of the above are no taste or smell and no symptoms with very few actually getting the so called full flu like symptoms.
also households who only one member has contracted covid while the rest haven't and we are talking about adults who sleep together....
i'm not against vaccination, far from it as history tells us we have already eradicated the smallpox virus but that took years and years of testing and global vaccination that was proven to work.
if the vaccine works then why are vaccinated people still being told to wear face coverings and keep social distancing?
svenrico
27-02-21, 02:37 PM
how do we know that a vaccine is more effective than b vaccine? answer we dont.
or is it a case that the virus has already infected most of the population but they dont know they have had it as there are different symptoms for different people.
from the people i have spoke to who have had positive covid tests the main symptoms seem to be:
just headaches and a little nausea for a few days.
no taste or smell for x days, weeks, months.
full blown flu symptoms like pneumonia.
no symptoms.
the most common of the above are no taste or smell and no symptoms with very few actually getting the so called full flu like symptoms.
also households who only one member has contracted covid while the rest haven't and we are talking about adults who sleep together....
i'm not against vaccination, far from it as history tells us we have already eradicated the smallpox virus but that took years and years of testing and global vaccination that was proven to work.
if the vaccine works then why are vaccinated people still being told to wear face coverings and keep social distancing?
Because the vaccine doesn't start to take effect for 2 weeks for one thing.
From the people you have spoken to you won't have spoken to the people who have died from Covid !
Don't you think though that the sooner more people get vaccinated the sooner we can all get out and about in a 'more normal' way ?
'The issue between the EU and AZ was down to AZ not fulfilling their contract, simple as that.'
Previously when they were complaining in the EU about the UK getting preferential treatment on delivery of AZ vaccine ,it turned out the UK had ordered and paid for vaccines much earlier than EU.
Yes, and the EU contract with AZ (published) specifically included a clause which required AZ to agree that no other contract would change/affect the EU terms as per their contract. If there was a third party contract which could affect the delivery schedule as agreed then it must be declared, and it wasn't. It would appear that AZ signed up to this despite having apparently agreed a preferential delivery to the UK.
The EU/AZ contract has been published, the UK/AZ contract has not.
The AZ/UK contract was fine if it specified preference, but it should have been declared by AZ.
The EU weren't really complaining about the UK getting preferential delivery, they were complaining that AZ were not fulfilling their contract.
humour only :) I am aware that the EU is upset (and suspicious) of AZ reducing shipments and that their vaccine stocks are nothing to do with the UK.
Apologies, I missed the tongue in cheek. I see your drift.
Grant66
27-02-21, 03:20 PM
The EU/AZ contract has been published, the UK/AZ contract has not.
Not true, it was published around November 26th, long before the EU started making a fuss.
If you want to read it (https://www.contractsfinder.service.gov.uk/Notice/SupplierAttachment/77bb967f-0194-452a-bdae-9999aecc753d)
Yes it's redacted, but so is the one the EU released.
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Full trial data and subsequent efficacy in those inoculated in each of the vaccines is readily available. The MHRA approval data is also readily available, as is the adverse reaction data. Adverse reaction to the annual flu vaccine varies between 1% to 3%. Reaction to the Covid vaccines is currently running at less than 1%. Obviously long term reaction isn't yet known BUT we're talking about 4 months worth of data, that's all and we're 3 months into any possible obvious side effect without anything of note showing. And bare in mind, the vast majority of those vaccinated are a lot over 55. Any hysteria about it is just that, hysteria!!
Why are the EU saying the AZ vaccine isn't safe for over 55's? They're not. They are saying it wasn't tested to a level they are comfortable with. They're not wrong. The trial group didn't have enough over 55's in it. That doesn't mean its unsafe, only that the data to support its safe use isn't there. Personally, I think the EU are making a big show of it in an attempt to deflect away from the absolute balls-up they've made of acquiring and distributing the vaccine.
2.5 million dead, not counting those in the developing nations that don't record exact cause of death. Countless thousands with long Covid symptoms who will die early because of the virus.
I'll happily have the vaccine when offered.
SV650rules
27-02-21, 08:13 PM
This makes uncomfortable reading that where a virus mutates a lot ( as coronvirus do ) rather than never mutate ( like smallpox and polio ) that vaccination can cause problems by enabling people with very dangerous killer strains to survive and pass the deadly strains on to others...
https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/journal.pbio.1002198
This makes uncomfortable reading that where a virus mutates a lot ( as coronvirus do ) rather than never mutate ( like smallpox and polio ) that vaccination can cause problems by enabling people with very dangerous killer strains to survive and pass the deadly strains on to others...
https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/journal.pbio.1002198
This has been going on since forever. At least a third of the population has MRSA. Not too much of a problem for healthy people but a potential killer in someone who is sick or old and infirm.
The alternative is to not vaccinate and let even more people die. Or, just like the annual flu booster, produce a new vaccine every year using the previous year's as a base.
This makes uncomfortable reading that where a virus mutates a lot ( as coronvirus do ) rather than never mutate ( like smallpox and polio ) that vaccination can cause problems by enabling people with very dangerous killer strains to survive and pass the deadly strains on to others...
https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/journal.pbio.1002198
It's the downside of a Vaccine vs a Virus which is able to mutate. You essentially make the Virus stronger, and create a super strain.
Not true, it was published around November 26th, long before the EU started making a fuss.
If you want to read it (https://www.contractsfinder.service.gov.uk/Notice/SupplierAttachment/77bb967f-0194-452a-bdae-9999aecc753d)
Yes it's redacted, but so is the one the EU released.
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I stand corrected, thanks.
Could we not create a Covid thread rather than fill up the Smile/Gripe threads?
Sent from my Xperia using TapatalkAgreed and done.
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chris8886
28-02-21, 01:34 AM
You might be the first Org Guinea pig, don't forget to check back in.... if you survive!
I'd completely forgotten about this..... :rolleyes: I'm still here and alive, I did feel pretty CRAP for 2 days after my jab, but I'm absolutely fine now.
My wife felt a bit rough for the first 24 hours but that was it. I'm getting my jab tomorrow.
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I had a very mild headache the day after my jab but no other issues.
The reason the AZ vaccine is unpopular in Germany is an article by a newspaper (Handelsblatt) which claimed the vaccine was only 8% effective on the over 65 yr olds.
BMJ article: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n414
I had a very mild headache the day after my jab but no other issues.
The reason the AZ vaccine is unpopular in Germany is an article by a newspaper (Handelsblatt) which claimed the vaccine was only 8% effective on the over 65 yr olds.
BMJ article: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n414Errr, I'm 63 so I should be okay then ;)
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Dave20046
28-02-21, 09:39 AM
I'd completely forgotten about this..... :rolleyes: I'm still here and alive, I did feel pretty CRAP for 2 days after my jab, but I'm absolutely fine now.
'forgot'...Nice try Bill Gates
Which jab did you get?
SV650rules
28-02-21, 09:46 AM
I had a very mild headache the day after my jab but no other issues.
The reason the AZ vaccine is unpopular in Germany is an article by a newspaper (Handelsblatt) which claimed the vaccine was only 8% effective on the over 65 yr olds.
BMJ article: https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n414
That was a massive jump of facts that the reporter made, the figure of 8% was the number of people over 55 in the AZ trials. Every vaccine is first tested on monkeys then on young fit people who are better able to survive any bad reactions. The testing time available for these vacines has been so rushed that some steps were shortened or missed out. The German government is now pleading with population ( including over 65's ) to take the AZ vaccine, but the damage was done by politicising vaccines by country of origin, basically the EU did not want to accept that the AZ vaccine was effective, simply because it was produced in UK. The real world data from the Scottish program were released early last week showing AZ was 94% effective and Pfizer 85% effective in preventing hospitalisation.
https://singapore.timesofnews.com/breaking-news/german-commission-may-do-u-turn-on-astrazeneca-jab-for-elderly.html
SV650rules
28-02-21, 11:32 AM
'forgot'...Nice try Bill Gates
Which jab did you get?
The Microsoft one :rolleyes: Worked as well as the rest of their products - 8% efficient, the Germans got mixed up between the Astrazenica and the Microsoft one ( AZ and MS must mean the same in German ). Turns out too many of the wrong viruses in the MS one.
The real world data from the Scottish program were released early last week showing AZ was 94% effective and Pfizer 85% effective in preventing hospitalisation.
https://singapore.timesofnews.com/breaking-news/german-commission-may-do-u-turn-on-astrazeneca-jab-for-elderly.html
what with 10 subjects. how can they give figures like that when the jabs have only been in Scotland for two or so months. its a load of borlocks.
or is it a Scottish company sorting worldwide data.
who can say if those people would have been hospitalised or not. companies cant make bold statements like that and if they do then they doing nothing but advertising false data.
This thread exemplifies all that’s best about the org for me. Civilised debate with lots of links to peer reviewed evidence. [emoji3]
I’ve just wasted an hour on Facebook researching some c***womble’s meme on this subject. Unsurprisingly he wasn’t bothered...
I’ll have a read through all this but it seems to me it’s too early to draw conclusions on almost anything to do with this virus. At best, we’ll maybe have a better idea what to do next time.
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I've just read a thread on FB were someone said "the stats say so" People asked for the stats and the OP said no. It just decends into an argument and **** flinging.
... The German government is now pleading with population ( including over 65's ) to take the AZ vaccine, but the damage was done by politicising vaccines by country of origin, basically the EU did not want to accept that the AZ vaccine was effective, simply because it was produced in UK. .....
The UK media would like us to think that EU countries have something "against" the UK, that we are picked on in some way, always useful to portray us as the plucky underdogs.
My experience of being in EU countries is that they are almost totally indifferent to the UK, we just don't feature on their radar most of the time. The national news in France or Germany or Austria scarcely ever even mentions the UK, and hasn't done in the 25 odd years I've spent any time there.
It's usually presented in our media as the UK vs EU, as though it's one to one. Germany for example has borders with 9 other countries, they spend every day working with "foreigners" from those countries coming in and out and it really isn't seen as much of a big deal. They saw the UK as one of 28 in the EU, not as one of one.
The Pfizer/BioNtech vaccine is developed by Turkish scientists working in Germany for a German/US combined effort and the doses are manufactured in Belgium. It's not an issue who and where. They really aren't bothered about stuff being made in the UK or Netherlands or wherever, but it appears the UK media like to think they are.
chris8886
28-02-21, 11:15 PM
'forgot'...Nice try Bill Gates
Which jab did you get?
I'm afraid Dave that the 'forgot' thing, unfortunately, is still very much a thing for me after my "mishap" 10 years or so ago (I'm fairly sure it was fairly well documented here at the time).
I've been given the Oxford jab (just looked at my card thing that they gave me....). I can report that I am still absolutely fine post jab too, after my initial poorly feelings after it.
if the jabs are claimed to be so effective then why are we still in lockdown. i would guess that 90% of the vulnerable have been immunised so why are we still having to wait till June ish to be set free.
Had the jab this morning. No drama or fuss.
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I've got my jab wednesday morning, hopefully no side effects as I'm supposed to be on nights :)
Funny thing was, I got an email telling me I'm in the critical risk group a few days ago, having just spent a year travelling in and out of London for work I'd probably have preferred not to know this :)
Craig380
01-03-21, 10:12 PM
if the jabs are claimed to be so effective then why are we still in lockdown. i would guess that 90% of the vulnerable have been immunised so why are we still having to wait till June ish to be set free.
The latest data shows the vaccine is very effective, but Governments are reluctant to lift restrictions too soon after the yo-yo-ing from lockdowns to lifting restrictions and back again.
Given the debacle we've had in the UK, I think that's wise.
Given the debacle we've had in the UK, I think that's wise.
Speaking of debacles, here's Cleethorpes' sea front at the weekend bearing in mind that our virus rate is above the national average and climbing.
https://www.grimsbytelegraph.co.uk/news/grimsby-news/were-not-out-lockdown-yet-5058088
Craig380
02-03-21, 08:45 AM
It does look silly, doesn't it? To balance, the chances of outdoor transmission are very low, it's better than them all crowding into Primark ...
Luckypants
02-03-21, 10:31 AM
North Wales police are still turning away people from the Midlands, Greater Manchester and even London from our beauty spots. People seem to think its OK to travel without a thought for the situation at their destination. Wales is still in lockdown. Crowds of people is asking for trouble, inside or out - I think the effects of last year's Cheltenham festival is testament to that.
Again its the wrong tone being set by the government. They're all "we're nearly through this, we'll open the pubs soon" instead of "the numbers are still higher than the end of lockdown #1, no change until the infection rates get down to those levels" - There are still more people being infected daily than at the peak of the first wave.....
keith_d
02-03-21, 10:35 AM
OK, I've had the Astra Zeneca vaccine according the card. That meant a sore shoulder and a day feeling slightly mouldy. No worse than the old Typhoid vaccinations.
Now we just have to wait and see if the Brazil/P.1 variant can out evolve the vaccine. For those people who are interested, there's a nice article from the lancet describing the resurgence of Covid in Manaus.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00183-5/fulltext
In an ideal world the second dose of vaccine would include the spike proteins from the E484K mutation, but I doubt any of the manufacturers will be able to get it approved and into production in the next 12 weeks.
I'm not saying the government are slow to act...
...well, yes I am.
They were questioned about responses to Brazilian mutation almost 7 weeks ago.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/boris-johnson-grilled-brazil-variant-163723306.html
North Wales police are still turning away people from the Midlands, Greater Manchester and even London from our beauty spots. People seem to think its OK to travel without a thought for the situation at their destination. Wales is still in lockdown. Crowds of people is asking for trouble, inside or out - I think the effects of last year's Cheltenham festival is testament to that.
Again its the wrong tone being set by the government. They're all "we're nearly through this, we'll open the pubs soon" instead of "the numbers are still higher than the end of lockdown #1, no change until the infection rates get down to those levels" - There are still more people being infected daily than at the peak of the first wave.....
With those figures i would say we are finding more cases now as we are testing more people, and there are also more symptoms recognised as Covid since a year ago.
So it's not a like for like comparison on true data for both circumstances.
svenrico
02-03-21, 09:39 PM
I'm not saying the government are slow to act...
...well, yes I am.
They were questioned about responses to Brazilian mutation almost 7 weeks ago.
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/boris-johnson-grilled-brazil-variant-163723306.html
I wondered a while ago, when they were showing people on tv waiting in airport lounges ,why so many people were still flying in and out of the country !
svenrico
02-03-21, 09:43 PM
The UK media would like us to think that EU countries have something "against" the UK, that we are picked on in some way, always useful to portray us as the plucky underdogs.
My experience of being in EU countries is that they are almost totally indifferent to the UK, we just don't feature on their radar most of the time. The national news in France or Germany or Austria scarcely ever even mentions the UK, and hasn't done in the 25 odd years I've spent any time there.
It's usually presented in our media as the UK vs EU, as though it's one to one. Germany for example has borders with 9 other countries, they spend every day working with "foreigners" from those countries coming in and out and it really isn't seen as much of a big deal. They saw the UK as one of 28 in the EU, not as one of one.
The Pfizer/BioNtech vaccine is developed by Turkish scientists working in Germany for a German/US combined effort and the doses are manufactured in Belgium. It's not an issue who and where. They really aren't bothered about stuff being made in the UK or Netherlands or wherever, but it appears the UK media like to think they are.
National news in EU countries must have been mentioning brexit during the years since the referendum !
ps Perhaps there should be a separate thread on here for EU related comments !
National news in EU countries must have been mentioning brexit during the years since the referendum !
ps Perhaps there should be a separate thread on here for EU related comments !
Of course, but not to anything like the extent UK media has, for obvious reasons. It has dominated our current affairs for 4 1/2 years, it hasn't dominated France's or Germany's etc. They have other problems of their own to deal with, stuff which is never mentioned in UK media, it's reciprocal.
svenrico
03-03-21, 09:52 PM
Of course, but not to anything like the extent UK media has, for obvious reasons. It has dominated our current affairs for 4 1/2 years, it hasn't dominated France's or Germany's etc. They have other problems of their own to deal with, stuff which is never mentioned in UK media, it's reciprocal.
I suppose the UK is too preoccupied with American politics to bother much about European countries !
svenrico
03-03-21, 09:53 PM
Of course, but not to anything like the extent UK media has, for obvious reasons. It has dominated our current affairs for 4 1/2 years, it hasn't dominated France's or Germany's etc. They have other problems of their own to deal with, stuff which is never mentioned in UK media, it's reciprocal.
I suppose the UK is too preoccupied with American politics to bother much about European countries !
p s sorry, posted twice
We're drifting off topic again...
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Biker Biggles
04-03-21, 04:46 PM
Had my jab this week,the Oxford one and hardly any side effects so I hope its actually working.:confused:
SV650rules
04-03-21, 07:46 PM
This is a worry, people in Brazil who recovered from covid infection last year got infected again by a new variant... Thanks China, for giving us a novel virus from you lab that just keeps mutating...
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)00183-5/fulltext
I suppose the bigger question is not about the mutations, but the effectiveness/deadliness of the Virus and the symptoms that go with it
Grant66
06-03-21, 01:44 PM
Had my AZ jab yesterday, arm is a bit sore but otherwise no side affects.
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Adam Ef
06-03-21, 02:33 PM
Had my AZ jab yesterday, arm is a bit sore but otherwise no side affects.
Same here
SV650rules
06-03-21, 02:45 PM
Same here
Most people I have spoken to who had AZ have had few side effects,, the ones who had Pfizer however - terrible. I have read that second dose of Pfizer can have side effects worse than the first shot - not much to look forward to.
Grant66
06-03-21, 02:54 PM
According to the Covid presentation I saw on Thursday (run by the org doing the research into side effects); both vaccines report side effects in the same range as placebos.
AZ one was higher on first dose and early indications are Pfizer one is worse on the second.
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If anyone wants to see what the adverse reactions reported to end Feb/beginning Mar via the Yellow Card scheme are, you can view them at
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/966631/COVID-19_mRNA_Pfizer-_BioNTech_Vaccine_Analysis_Print__2_.pdf
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/966183/COVID-19_AstraZeneca_Vaccine_Analysis_Print.pdf
daktulos
06-03-21, 09:48 PM
Most people I have spoken to who had AZ have had few side effects,, the ones who had Pfizer however - terrible. I have read that second dose of Pfizer can have side effects worse than the first shot - not much to look forward to.
My wife had a couple of days of illness with the first dose (AZ) but had been told that side-effects are worse if you've already had Covid (which she did over Christmas). I guess that could explain why the second dose is worse.
Maybe we were lucky in southeast Spain during the previous waves - guess we were when I think of how bad it was in Madrid a year ago. This current wave, finally dropping away, has seen a number of friends and neighbours catch it, several of which have died. Yes, the majority of our friends are of pensionable age, and in the more vulnerable bracket but flippin 'eck this last month has been bloody scary.
As for the jab; Andalucia have said if you're not registered on the Spanish Health System you have to go to your home country for the jab. As under 65's we don't qualify for the Health System, and pay for private health insurance. If we were on the System they're just doing the 80 to 84 age bracket.
svenrico
07-03-21, 01:04 AM
I had Pfizer jab a few weeks ago and haven't had any side effects so far, touch wood. My son had Pfizer jab the other day with no side effects .My wife had AZ today and hasn't said anything about any side effects.
case rates in NE Lincs
http://forums.sv650.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16790&stc=1&d=1615646725
I took this graph from the BBC website. The case rates are reported for Lincs each evening on our regional BBC news channel. I find it odd that our rates have plateaued at 100 per 100k for such a long period. I put in some random postcodes for other areas and they don't seem to follow the same pattern.
It was suggested that because this is a low paid/deprived area that people cannot afford to isolate and are going to work whilst contagious.
BoltonSte
15-03-21, 01:13 PM
Had my AZ jab on Friday, was a little ropey on Saturday but couldn't say it was definitely the jab as I was getting a little run down anyway.
Back to normal Sunday, all good.
Ste
Dave20046
17-03-21, 09:19 AM
I know a couple of people who have had the vaccine and have been headachey and sicky for a day or two and then suddenly back to normal.
Just read the suspicions over blood clots lastnight, hopefully more info on that before I get it! :smt073
case rates in NE Lincs
http://forums.sv650.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=16790&stc=1&d=1615646725
I took this graph from the BBC website. The case rates are reported for Lincs each evening on our regional BBC news channel. I find it odd that our rates have plateaued at 100 per 100k for such a long period. I put in some random postcodes for other areas and they don't seem to follow the same pattern.
It was suggested that because this is a low paid/deprived area that people cannot afford to isolate and are going to work whilst contagious.
It's plausible, I've read about countries who acted quickly and gave all residents a generous welfare package did very well at containing the virus.
It's plausible, I've read about countries who acted quickly and gave all residents a generous welfare package did very well at containing the virus.
It's also 3 weeks since we had that warm, sunny weekend and Cleethorpes' sea front was packed...
Biker Biggles
17-03-21, 09:59 AM
It's a couple of weeks since I had my AZ jab------no problems at the time(if I tried really hard I could detect a slight arm ache next day) and now I feel really good about it. I observe the current rules but no longer worry about at all. I recommend everyone who can have it does so. I am appalled by what I consider the criminal negligence of the leaders of those countries who are banning/suspending it.
Luckypants
17-03-21, 10:09 AM
I had AZ vaccine. No side effects at all.
What annoys me about this storm in a teacup is that the number of reported cases of blood clots in people who have received the vaccine is what you would expect in the normal population. There is NO variation from the norm as far as I'm able to ascertain.
Grant66
17-03-21, 10:09 AM
Especially as:
Healthcare products Regulatory Agency’s (MHRA) vaccines safety lead Phil Bryan said: “We are closely reviewing reports but given the large number of doses administered, and the frequency at which blood clots can occur naturally, the evidence available does not suggest the vaccine is the cause.”
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Adam Ef
17-03-21, 10:24 AM
I had mine a week and a half ago now and have had the occaisional day feeling lethargic and a bit run down. A couple of nights of feversish sleeps too. Yesterday I felt awful. Very run down and had that feeling where your chest aches a bit and you can really feel where your lungs are. Also an achy neck and shoulders. Hopefully means it's having some effect.
Grant66
17-03-21, 10:56 AM
Hopefully means it's having some effect.
Apparently there is no correlation between side effects and your immune response.
So you could get loads of side effect symptoms and not get an immune response when exposed to the virus.
Alternatively you may have no side effect symptoms and then be fully protected from the virus.
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