Future of the bike test

[Ed]

On page 19 of tonight's Shropshire Star there's a piece on driving test price rises that take effect from today, bike test up to £51.

It says 'New European laws mean full motorcycle tests will be too dangerous to carry out on the road. As a result the DSA needs to build dozens of new test centres.'

Have I missed something? :-s

[coombest]

On page 19 of tonight's Shropshire Star there's a piece on driving test price rises that take effect from today, bike test up to £51.

Typical but it doesn't surprise me!

It says 'New European laws mean full motorcycle tests will be too dangerous to carry out on the road. As a result the DSA needs to build dozens of new test centres.'

WTF!!
Too dangerous!? Does that mean you won't be able to take lessons as well!!??
And how is that going to make roads safer? People taking their tests in a sheltered, safer than safe environment, only to be unleashed on the roads!!?? Messy!

Have I missed something? :-s

I bloomin' well hope so! :?

[Wiltshire7]

there must be more to it than that.

[ArtyLady]

It says 'New European laws mean full motorcycle tests will be too dangerous to carry out on the road.
:-s

Perhaps it includes wheelies, stoppies and burnouts :wink: :lol:

[Ed]

there must be more to it than that.

There is. I've just spent ages on the DSA's website and you can read all about it under 'Consultation papers' - appears not to have a separate page. But among all the stuff on there I couldn't actually find the changes to the test. There are high speed exercises - ie over 31mph (!) - but it doesn't seem to list them. Or have I had too much to drink tonight....

[chutz]

It says 'New European laws mean full motorcycle tests will be too dangerous to carry out on the road.
:-s

Perhaps it includes wheelies, stoppies and burnouts :wink: :lol:

Oh No!!! You're in trouble Tim!!!! I know you've done 2 stoppie attempts with no luck already. One in a car park in front of loads of sv riders and one over the bonnet of a car!!! Thank god you've passed already :lol:

[nuntius]

I know when I did my test a couple of months ago there was a notice in the test centre saying that they were looking for sites on which to put their new style test centres for bikes, due to be fully opertional by 2008, but i didnt know what it was refering to at the time.

[northwind]

I read a thing in the press a while back saying that larger training centres would be needed for CBTs in future, but nothing suggesting that the whole thing would be done off road... I think that's just hyperbole really.

Still, I'd say there's bound to be some changes, the system at the moment is a bit of a lash-up at best. I rode for 9 months on CBT and I don't think it's adequte for serious, regular road use- to allow it for 2 years, with resitting the only requirement at the end, just doesn't make sense to me. It's intended as a route into obtaining a full license, so why give it such a huge timescale? 6 months should be enough to get you up to a standard where you can pass the 125cc test, surely?

Then you have DAS... Pass your test on a GS500 and then go and buy a 499bhp turbo hayabusa, you'll be fine. Maybe more categories are needed, or compulsory training before you get on a higher output bike...

The general perception, or at least the impression I got talking to instructors and candidates, is that there's only 2 levels of qualification that riders want, DAS or CBT. The other test categories seem to be only for those who can't do DAS, or who lack the confidence or skill to do DAS. I'm not saying this is a hard-and-fast rule, but it's certainyl common, in my experience it's the majority. And that's a bit mad. DAS is the accelerated scheme, but now it's become the norm it seems.

The way a lot of people use the system, it works very well- I think I'm a reasonably good example, did CBT, spent 9 months on my orrible Yam then did DAS, before getting on a powerful but not ludicrous machine. But that's certainly not the way everyone's doing it.

One of my customers just did his DAS and now he's on a new Blade 2 days later. He's a good guy, and not a reckless kid, but I fear for him on that thing. There's plenty of experienced riders that'd find that bike too much.

[BaggaZee]

Bloody hell, does he work in insurance?! :o

[K]

Ahh, the joys of passing your test over a decade and a half ago, t'was mostly a load of bollards back then! :lol:

[ArtyLady]

Then you have DAS... Pass your test on a GS500 and then go and buy a 499bhp turbo hayabusa, you'll be fine. Maybe more categories are needed, or compulsory training before you get on a higher output bike...

The general perception, or at least the impression I got talking to instructors and candidates, is that there's only 2 levels of qualification that riders want, DAS or CBT. The other test categories seem to be only for those who can't do DAS, or who lack the confidence or skill to do DAS. I'm not saying this is a hard-and-fast rule, but it's certainyl common, in my experience it's the majority. And that's a bit mad. DAS is the accelerated scheme, but now it's become the norm it seems.

The way a lot of people use the system, it works very well- I think I'm a reasonably good example, did CBT, spent 9 months on my orrible Yam then did DAS, before getting on a powerful but not ludicrous machine. But that's certainly not the way everyone's doing it.

One of my customers just did his DAS and now he's on a new Blade 2 days later. He's a good guy, and not a reckless kid, but I fear for him on that thing. There's plenty of experienced riders that'd find that bike too much.

I agree - I went for a 500 cc machine (partly cos im a wimp and partly common sense) :oops: :lol: after passing my DAS then a 600 and now a 650. 2 years later Ive still so much to learn and still would not consider getting anything too much bigger and more powerful yet. (I dont feel the need anyway) :D

Passing the DAS is only the beggining of a long learning curve. IMO even if they brought in a new catergory where you were restricted to say a 500 for a 2 year time period, ppl who did not ride in that time would not get any experience, and then still go and get on a big machine at the end of that time limit.

I think there ought to be some sort of compulsory advanced training after the DAS - I think that is they key to avoiding so many tragedies.

[Ceri JC]

I did my test as DAS and got my SV650s straight after. I've noticed a great many older, more experienced riders (not to mention biking publications) slate DAS and blame it for a large number of biking accidents.

Now, whilst I'm certainly a novice rider I'm better than 2 friends of mine who did the CBT->125 route (and by that I mean "better" and not just faster/more of a lunatic- better at filtering, much better slow control, better at cornering, no offs, no accidents. And again, whilst mine is very limited, I have a better knowledge of bike maintenance too.)

My friends have more "near misses" than me, one of them has dropped his bike, the other failed his test first time (nearly getting hit by a truck in the process). Their slow control is very poor. Both passed with more minuses than me.

I know a sample of 3 riders isn't many, but I think it shows the
DAS/CBT->125 issue isn't as clear cut as a lot of people would like to think.

I wonder if there's more than a hint of envy when older people think back to their first bikes :wink:

[Cloggsy]

It says 'New European laws mean full motorcycle tests will be too dangerous to carry out on the road. As a result the DSA needs to build dozens of new test centres.'

Have I missed something? :-s

I tell ya... The sooner we 'get out of Europe,' the better :roll: :toss:

[northwind]

I think maybe the Shropshire Star isn't neccesarily the most accurate source of news on EU regulations though :)

Baggazee, he's 3PF&T with a £1000 excess :shock: Don't know what he's paying though, he wouldn't tell me... He offered me a go on his Crazy Widowmaker, how tempted? But no, I like my nervous system the shape it is.

[Ed]

I think maybe the Shropshire Star isn't neccesarily the most accurate source of news on EU regulations though :)

They came up trumps this time though, coz it's true, have a look at the DSA website under consultation papers and it's all there.

Cloggs - I shall be voting 'no' come 2006 no matter what the constitution says...

[northwind]

Well, the consultation papers say some new high speed maneuvre tests will take place off road, but also says that there'll be an on-road section:

"Key decisions are:
the new higher-speed manoeuvres will be tested on safe sites off the public road.
other special manoeuvres will be tested off-road on the same occasion. This will allow DSA to exploit the value of the investment in the manoeuvres sites, and minimise the loss in the number of tests conducted per standard examiner day.
all the special manoeuvres will be tested as part of a single test event, undertaken immediately before the general on-road riding assessment. This will avoid duplication of test appointments, booking costs, paperwork, etc.
candidates exhibiting riding skills at a dangerously incompetent level during the off-road part of the test (e.g. being unable to brake safely) will not be permitted to proceed to the on-road part. "

So in fact, this is an extra section before you ever hit the road, not a move to remove any part of the existing test from the road. I imagine they'll do the U-turn and e-stop in these centres too though, since that'd be safer and fairer and wouldn't detract at all from the actual test elements.

So not what it's being made out to be at all, really... Is anyone here actually against introducing additional parts to the test to include extra maneuvres not currently included?

[BaggaZee]

Baggazee, he's 3PF&T with a £1000 excess :shock: Don't know what he's paying though, he wouldn't tell me...

If the excess is a grand it must be monstrous!

How could you resist?! :o
Had a go on a ZX-9R once, magic! Couldn't own one though, well, not for very long anyway. :P

[northwind]

The 2 great risks of trying another bike, my friend:

1) You crash it
2) It's far, far, far, far better than your bike will ever be and you doom yourself to a purgatory of bike jealousy.

[Ed]

Windy, I don't think they actually say what the new manoovers will be.

[timwilky]

These changes to tests have been floating around for some time.

I seem to recall on the off road section they want to change the emergency stop requiremnet to include a manouvering exercise whilst braking. but as they have to be done from a minimum speed you are going to need space to accelerate up to 30+ , exercise and space to run out of road if they feck up. do I guess you are looking at a 100yd long stretch of car park

Also I guess the examiner is going to have to have a radar gun to establish that you are actually at 30+

[21QUEST]

These changes to tests have been floating around for some time.

I seem to recall on the off road section they want to change the emergency stop requiremnet to include a manouvering exercise whilst braking. but as they have to be done from a minimum speed you are going to need space to accelerate up to 30+ , exercise and space to run out of road if they feck up. do I guess you are looking at a 100yd long stretch of car park

Also I guess the examiner is going to have to have a radar gun to establish that you are actually at 30+. A stop watch would do.

Cheers
Ben

[Ed]

...what about a speed camera, after all may as well get peeps started off properly....

[21QUEST]

...what about a speed camera, after all may as well get peeps started off properly....

:lol:

Cheers
Ben

[Ceri JC]

These changes to tests have been floating around for some time.

I seem to recall on the off road section

Trailies included now, eh? ;0)

[Carsick]

These changes to tests have been floating around for some time.

I seem to recall on the off road section

Trailies included now, eh? ;0)
Now that would make for an interesting test.