Insurance....sigh

[Freeloader]

Maybe i bit off more than i could chew.

Im 17 and have an SV650 S (Passed A2 test a fortnight ago). Its a T-reg and has a power restriction on it.

Am i just wasting my time on this? At the moment 'choice quote' are offering me a £980 quid premium for TPonly insurance and this seems to be the cheapest. I simply cannot afford to pay 980 quid insurance a year on a bike which is worth no more than £1500.

Can you recomend me some insurance companies please...i live in the gangster lands of west london so i fear im even further wasting my time with TPFT.
Or do i start looking for something with a lower NU group...

[TSM]

Try www.insurance2000.co.uk or Ebike Insurance. For your age and london they seem to give good quotes, but mabey you will be fleaced anyway.

[Freeloader]

£1600 quid and £1243.20 respectively

[Biker Biggles]

The SVS is a group 10 bike and at your age in London just passed test?no no claims, you ain't gonna get cheap insurance.If you shop around you may get it for a bit less but don't hold your breath. :cry:

[TSM]

i paid over 800 TPFT first year when i was 22

yes svs is about 100 more expensive for me than the svn

[Saint Matt]

Gods sake, the people that have been on here a long time and stil say 17 year olds can't get cheap insurance need to pay more attention. I am paying £445 tpft, I was 17 when the insurance started, 18 now. Try carole nash dude.

[TSM]

Gods sake, the people that have been on here a long time and stil say 17 year olds can't get cheap insurance need to pay more attention. I am paying £445 tpft, I was 17 when the insurance started, 18 now. Try carole nash dude.

yep, but you dont live in london, which is a mare to get insured on when you are young.

[Saint Matt]

Yes that's true, it is bound to be higher than my relatively quiet area, but he shouldn't give up hope. tpo was oddly mor expensive than tpft for mine, no idea how that worked. Was roughly £500 tpo :roll:

[Biker Biggles]

He lives in London
My son's quote for SV n
Age 20-three year's NCD TPO clean license £370 Passed test two years ago.That's with Ebike,and several others would'nt quote.
Once you get away from London you can get much better rates.

[Freeloader]

What about registering the bike at my grandmas address in Bristol (countryside)?

Is that cheating. WHy does it make a difference with 3party only.

[Valman]

The area and age are the killer when it comes to insurance, in fact it doesn't even seem to matter how much your bike is worth. I'm the same age as TSM and we both live in the "bad" parts of London, but even though I ride a K4 and he's got a K2, we both ended up paying almost the same in our first year despite my bike being brand new and his was obviously worth a fair bit less, I actually paid less than him even though it was with the same company, and it seems we'll be paying a similar amount in our second year too.

So I know it's not what you want to hear but I think at your age it's going to be hard to get a quote much less than what you've been quoted already, sorry.

[Freeloader]

You see. The annoying thing is really...

...that the Suzuki is actually a low insurance group. I was just looking in th back of bike and I dont want to ride a 125 as they are just abit soleless (and dare i say it kiddy)...and it seems that any 'proper' bikes are group 9 at the least. The only bikes which seem to be groups 1-7 are 125's in various guises.
The SV650 is the same group as the S which puzzled me rather, as this would suggest the same or similar premium.

[Valman]

What about registering the bike at my grandmas address in Bristol (countryside)?

Is that cheating. WHy does it make a difference with 3party only.

I know a few people who do this and to be honest they've never had problems and they save a packet, but obviously your insurance company will not be too happy if they find out.

[Kate]

Have a try with CIA and Motorcycles Direct, I found they weren't too bad. Also, have you got RnG crash bungs etc? I think its Ebike that gives discounts for that sort of stuff.

[Diveboy]

I based what bike I could get one insurance. Just so happened I got mine for £280 tpft with zero noclaims. Its garaged an i'm 28 which helps.

My advice would sell it get a bike with a low group (like a BMX :) ) and get some noclaims built up.

[northwind]

I started out on an insurance group 4... But your right, it was absolutely rubbish. SV650 and SV650S aren't in the same NU group, the N is one group lower (9? 10?)

I wouldn't recommend you insure it away from your actual address, if it does get stolen you can guarantee questions will be asked- insurance companies aren't stupid. If it was 2 similiar built-up areas they'd probably not bother, but for a big change like Bristol to London, they'll be suspicious. I know that's not what you want to hear but false disclosure can get you in a lot of bother, and can mean you don't get your payout too.

Is there anything you can do to beat that down? Fit an alarm/datatag/get a bike safe? They all cost but there's other benefits. Some insurers will discount for Thatcham approved locks (good investment anyway- though tbh it seems like only Almaxes are any good out of the "big expensive lock" category.

[Flamin_Squirrel]

...and can mean you don't get your payout too.

But if he's insuring TPO...

[Ed]

...and can mean you don't get your payout too.

But if he's insuring TPO...


...then the third party don't get a payout, means driving without insurance. And we get back to the debate we had last year :roll:

[northwind]

So he is. That's brave :shock: Definately get a good chain then, unless it's permanently indoors.

[$i]

my first year at 17 for a brand new sk3 was £1049 tpft. that was with h&r. and I live not 2 far from london. now jumping up 5 insurance groups to the RR (being 19), I pay £770 tpft with 3 yrs ncb and IAM.

Basicly, i am still getting stung. but its worth it :twisted: !

[northwind]

...and can mean you don't get your payout too.

But if he's insuring TPO...

...then the third party don't get a payout, means driving without insurance. And we get back to the debate we had last year :roll:

This is not true. Without boring you with details, false disclosure doesn't invalidate a third party's entitlement to a payout- it's not literally the same as iding without insurance, though it's similiar. It does mean the insurance company can recover the cost of any payout from their customer though. Courts, insurance blacklists, possibly prison.

Is it just me, or is a it a bit cheeky for TPO insurers to weight heavily for postcode? After all, why do they care if it gets nicked?

[Diveboy]

Is it just me, or is a it a bit cheeky for TPO insurers to weight heavily for postcode? After all, why do they care if it gets nicked?

I have always wondered about that. You would have thought a bad postcode would be better cos if the bike get nicked you can't crash into someone on it. :wink:

[northwind]

Now I think about it, I believe there may be some liability on the insurers even after the vehicle's stolen. Could be rubbish though :)

[philipMac]

What about registering the bike at my grandmas address in Bristol (countryside)?

Is that cheating. WHy does it make a difference with 3party only.

I know a few people who do this and to be honest they've never had problems and they save a packet, but obviously your insurance company will not be too happy if they find out.

Just keep one thing in mind: Insurance companies are only too happy to take money off you. And considerabley less happy about giving you money.

Any single "mistake" on your details can completely invalidate your policy. And, they are quite good at finding mistakes when the need arrises. So, you can reg with an address in the country, never claim, and never have any problem. Loads of my mates did it (in Dublin, where its twice the price compared to the country), I dont think any of them got caught. Equally I dont think any of them put major claims in on their policy (during this period).

Just be aware of the risks ...
(Quotes seem very high though, you are in the UK as well. Nasty. I dread to think how much you would have to pay in Ireland....)
Good luck :!:

[philipMac]

Now that I think of it... we all had a deal where if any of us had claim-able off, and we were spoofing addressed. we would (somehow) contact eachother and get clothes / sleeping crap out to the address we were using. :lol:

What can I say. There might have been one or two holes in this strategy. We were 17. :?

[philipMac]

Is it just me, or is a it a bit cheeky for TPO insurers to weight heavily for postcode? After all, why do they care if it gets nicked?

I have always wondered about that. You would have thought a bad postcode would be better cos if the bike get nicked you can't crash into someone on it. :wink:

Its an algorithm. The actuary assess any risk by any means nessesary. Any variable she has at her disposal, that she thinks is statistically significant, she'll just throw into the equation. They are well within their right to do this. And, if you have a degree in maths, they will pay you a lot of money to assess risk. Massive amounts of money hinge on them being right about the variables that matter.

No help to the poor sod who gets shafted with huge premiums though.

[northwind]

I have always wondered about that. You would have thought a bad postcode would be better cos if the bike get nicked you can't crash into someone on it. :wink:

Its an algorithm. The actuary assess any risk by any means nessesary. Any variable she has at her disposal, that she thinks is statistically significant, she'll just throw into the equation. They are well within their right to do this. And, if you have a degree in maths, they will pay you a lot of money to assess risk. Massive amounts of money hinge on them being right about the variables that matter.
[/quote]

I know that, I've worked in the industry... I was asking why it's relevant, not why they weight for relevant factors.

[philipMac]

I have always wondered about that. You would have thought a bad postcode would be better cos if the bike get nicked you can't crash into someone on it. :wink:

Its an algorithm. The actuary assess any risk by any means nessesary. Any variable she has at her disposal, that she thinks is statistically significant, she'll just throw into the equation. They are well within their right to do this. And, if you have a degree in maths, they will pay you a lot of money to assess risk. Massive amounts of money hinge on them being right about the variables that matter.


I was asking why it's relevant, not why they weight for relevant factors.
Sorry Northwind, I didnt make my point well...
I meant, they just pump a load of variables into some stats, and get an actuary to pick the vars that are significant.

As far as I know, to some extent its a hidden Markov model. It basically doesnt matter why they are significant. They just are or arent. Any theory about why could be put forward and argued for or against. But, they cant really be tested, you cant proove it, since there are too many other vars to control out. Like, you can make up stories, try "good guesses", pick some canditate vars, change one at a time, and see what happens to try to get at why. But, then the standard error goes through the roof, everything becomes meaningless. So you have to test loads more instances. But then you change the test environment, blah blah, hidden Markov stuff.

You can almost never get to a hard why in these cases. Just rank probabilities. Even then you are on shakey ground.

You know what I mean?
(These sorts of problems come up all the time in complex systems (like Biology for instance). They are a nightmare to deal with. )

(OK. I didnt strictly answer your question. I think its almost impossible to correctly answer though. And i mightnt have made anything clearer at all. If so, I am sorry dude. :? I tried! )

[northwind]

No, I get it... I don't know if anyone else will ;)