Shock settings

[Jase22]

Got me a ZX6 shock, the new shape with the horizontal reservoir, and just wondering whether anyone could give me a clue of best settings?

I've based my settings on the recenty issue of PB that had all their settings, one of which being the ZX6 itself, however I reckon these will be a little different with popping the shock into my SV.

Cheers
Jase

[haggis]

I've just unwrapped one myself today Jase. I'll probably not get to fit it 'til Sunday but we can swap settings after that if you like. I'm about 75kg in bike gear.

Big tip of the hat to Captain Nemo for supplying mine. Looks like a brand spanking new one mate. Muchos gracias!!! :thumright: :thumleft:

[johnnyrod]

I'd be interested to see, a mate of mine has got one recently and made a fist of it, says it feels better than stock, but till I get my hands on it I have no idea (and neither will he) what the settings are.

[Jase22]

[quote="haggis"]I'm about 75kg in bike gear. [quote]


I'm a couple of kg's over that without my gear :D, but will be interesting to see what settings you reckon are best.

[sdusk]

You could try my rough and ready method to get you started:

First set the static sag to 30 - 35mm. This is measured directly from the rear axle straight up, and is the difference between the bike with the suspension fully extended (lift the back until the wheel is almost off the ground), and with you sitting on the seat in the riding position with all of your gear on. Adjust the pre-load on the spring until this right. A friend to hold the front of the bike straight up and another to read the tape measure (one end taped to the axle bolt) are needed.

Now for the rebound. First wind out (anticlockwise) the compression screw a good 10-15 clicks so that it is not doing much. Now while one friend holds the front steady, give the seat a good ol' push down and watch how it comes back up. You want it to come up more slowly than you push it down. Some folk state that it should take about 1 second to come back up, but for me this is too much rebound damping for the road. I adjust it until it comes visibly slower than you can push it down, but more likely in the half to three quarters of a second range.

Now for the compression. This requires road tests. Go for a ride and see how the bumps feel. Keep on increasing the compression (turning clockwise three clicks at a time) until the bumps feel too hard, and then back it off three clicks.

After that, go for a lot more riding with the screwdriver close at hand. If you feel you are being bounced off of the road by the larger bumps then unwind the compression a click or two. If that doesn't help than undo that change, and add a click or two of rebound damping and see if that helps more. Additional rebound damping makes the bike feel more planted, but if you go too far there is much more chance of sliding.

[Jase22]

Now I may be wrong about the sag, but I thought static sag was when you compared unloaded suspension (back wheel off the floor) to when the back wheel is on the floor, hence the weight of the bike.

I understood that you then set rider sag being the difference between when you're sat on the bike and not.

[sdusk]

There is a lot of bad terminology floating around for this. However there is only one important one, and that is how far the suspension drops from full extension with the rider on the bike. I read once in an article about setting up a Ducati that mentioned setting the sag without the rider, but this is only really to help get things ready for the 'average' rider. I never figured out how to make the bike work very well without a rider :D It is called static sag by the Racetech, Maxtons and others who modify/improve bike suspension, so I think it is the right term.

[johnnyrod]

Got some links for you, setting up damping is not a quick job.

http://www.gostar-racing.com/club/motorcycle_suspension_set-up.htm

This is my Ohlins manual, check out page 9:

http://www.ohlins.com/pdf/07241-02A.pdf

They key really is to set the sag and leave it alone, set up rebound, then set up comp damping. Do things one adjustment at a time, write notes for yourself. If you make a change e.g. bit more rebound, and can't feel it, do it again i.e. add a bit more, so you can feel what the difference was - you can always go back to your earlier settings with the twiddle of a screwdriver.

Finally, if you go on a track day they often have suspension techs who can help you out with setup. Worth getting right, feels good when you do.

[sdusk]

That gostar-racing article misses out on the single most important item - spring strength. If you don't have the correct springs for your weight, then the rest is a waste of time as you will end up with too much compression damping and preload in order to attempt (unsucessfully) to stop your spring bottoming out. The article uses the R1 as an example - and it has springs that are correct for someone weighing 55kg. I bet that there are not that many R1 riders that are so light.

Getting someone to set it up for you is a good idea, however the racetrack isn't the road, and everyone has their own preferences for weight transfer/wheelspin etc...

[chunkytfg]

Now I may be wrong about the sag, but I thought static sag was when you compared unloaded suspension (back wheel off the floor) to when the back wheel is on the floor, hence the weight of the bike.

I understood that you then set rider sag being the difference between when you're sat on the bike and not.

you're right.

Static sag is the amount the bike compresses under it's ownb weight and is adjusted using the preload and the rider sag is the amount it compressess when ther rider sits on the bike and this is adjusted by using different rate springs.

Anyone who says you can adjust rider sag by upiing or lowering the preload is talking out there ****. A starndardly wound spring will compress att eh same rate all the way though it's compression so by compressing it a bit more to start with, to aparently adjust rider sag does nothing as the spring has the same rate as when you started.

I dont profess to know anything about suspension setup(i have the invoices to prove that:p) but i do know what the terms mean and whats is and isnt bull****.

[chunkytfg]

That gostar-racing article misses out on the single most important item - spring strength. If you don't have the correct springs for your weight, then the rest is a waste of time as you will end up with too much compression damping and preload in order to attempt (unsucessfully) to stop your spring bottoming out.

And so we have someone who actually knows what they are taling about.

I have lost count of the amount of times in the past i have seen on the hornets nest( the place to which i generally reside) someone recommend for a front suspension upgrade ''just fit ohlins fork springs and 15W oil''. Agreed it will imrove the forks but if someone is spending out £100 on a fork upgrade they would want to know it is done properly and set up for there stature and not just a guestamate.

Okay fair enough some people dont have the dosh to fork out on paying someone to set there forks up for them but at the end of the day you only have to ring the likes of Ktech for the parts to do it yourself and when you speak to someone they will want to know the info required to supply you the correct rate springs and weight oil for you personally.

[21QUEST]

That gostar-racing article misses out on the single most important item - spring strength. If you don't have the correct springs for your weight, then the rest is a waste of time as you will end up with too much compression damping and preload in order to attempt (unsucessfully) to stop your spring bottoming out.

And so we have someone who actually knows what they are taling about.

.


Em... I don't think it did IMO

A top racing suspension company suggest that rear wheel rider sag should be around 30-40mm and static sag should be around 5-10mm. However this many vary depending on your bike and manufacturer. The more rider sag you have, the softer the bike suspension will be. I personally use 35mm for road and a few track days use.

Therefore if your rider sag is less than 30 mm then your preload is too hard, if it is more than 40 mm, then it is a bit soft. Once you have set your rider sag as close as possible to 30-40 mm, next check your static sag. If you have more than 10mm then you may need stiffer springs. If however, if your static sag is less than 5mm or you have no static sag then your springs may be too hard for your weight.

If you have to compromise then try to have at least a bit of Static sag in order to stop the bike from topping out.


Cheers
Ben

EDIT: Personally with what you have I would start off by setting the static(bike sag) first at 10mm. If you really think about it it's the most important of the two sag measurements. No point in getting 30mm or whatever rider sag leaving you with no static/bike sag

[haggis]

Sorry about the delay on this one Jase. Got the shock fitted last weekend at last!!!

Had a wee play on it, but my MOT is up and going in on Wed. for that so no more setup til after then. :(

Did feel dramatically better though. So here's my findings....

Setup:
Front - Ohlins springs with preload adjusters and 15Wt oil. Preload has 4 rings showing. Rider sag is 34mm.
Rear - ZX636 B1H with standard dog-bones for now. Preload has 10.5 threads above lockring (to give you the ballpark area), equating to 33mm rider sag. [edited] Compression is 6 clicks in. Rebound is 8 clicks in.

It feels very stable, and balanced front/rear now. Perhaps a little too hard on the rear for my weight, but I've got used to it being wallowy before now so I suspect I just need to get used to this big change and it'll feel fine.

I'm leaving the settings like this for now, do an extended test run over the next couple of weeks and tweek it from there.

How did you get on? What's your settings?

[Viney]

Heres a question....!

If you buy siad springs for yoru weight (me, im 98kg) whats the margin on that? So, say for the want of figures, i get a 300lb spring(or wahtever the metric is) and thats right for a 98kg rider. I loose 8kg (Which i have done before) will the bike be over sprung as a result, or will it be ok?

[haggis]

Here's the cop-out answer: if your weight goes up and down get a spring rated for your average inbetween weight!

I don't think 8kg's are gonna be a worry, especially when you think about adding a pillion. The bike is designed to still have acceptable handling when you've just doubled the rider weight value. That and the fact that pillion weight is more or less over the rear spindle.


The important thing to remember is it's always a compromise when it comes to suspension settings.

[Jase22]

Had a play myself at the weekend having only just fitted my own shock :oops: (after owning it for some months now!!!)

Bit different to yours thought it would seem as I don't appear to have any "clicks" when adjusting my compression and rebound. Not sure if that means I have a different shock to you?

I think I may have a touch too much preload on my unit though, but I didn't have a C spanner to hand so didn't adjust it from what it was set at.

Also, I have zero preload adjustability on my forks, just some custom made spacers for me!