View Full Version : Have a heart
"After negotiations with the hospital, Mr Thayers is repaying his debt at a rate of £25 a week."
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,8122-2293981,00.html
Stuff the system, I mean what are they going to do, reverse the op? I have to admire him for his courage.
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Fair play to the chap I say.
Fizzy Fish
01-08-06, 12:49 PM
nice one!
Marshall
01-08-06, 12:53 PM
Fair play
Biker Biggles
01-08-06, 01:04 PM
Good on him.The Hammersmith is an NHS hospital so why should it be allowing people to jump the queue just because they can pay?They all do it of course as "income generation"and it's about time it was stopped.
Thief :lol: :lol: :lol: classic
northwind
01-08-06, 02:56 PM
OK, fair play, I'd probably do the same thing. But on the other hand, he had it done at an NHS hospital, which puts everyone ahead of him in the queue back a step. So, what happens if tomorrow, someone who'd more of a sense of fairness or, I don't know, honesty and who chose to wait , and would have got his slot, drops dead of a heart attack because he's jumped the queue?
Darwin's Law ;) — this guy had the gumption to do something about it (that or die) so he deserves to live from an evolutionary viewpoint. Survival of the fittest, even if it is morally dubious.
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wonder if I can do that for a few op's :lol:
So let me get this right?
His wife fies 30 years ago of cancer.
He works his whole life, pays tax on his wages that pays for his hospital treatment.
His wife would have been taxed on her wages, then taxed on her death and will..
He carries on the next 30 years, working his life, still paying his taxes.
The time comes he needs to use the NHS, and its for a vital reason or he'll die. But the NHS say you have to wait, in which time, u'll die anyway...
Why do i pay national insurance?????????????? For me to wait a year for a vital op, in which time i'll die.
But dont pay tax, and they will put me in jail. Hey, least i might get my vital op in time though....
Good on him i say.
I don't want to pay national insurance anymore, it doesn't get me anything. Go private on everything, you might live then.......
What does my national insruance go on again? Oh thats right, no-one really knows... At least in the USA they get an itemised type billing saying what taxes have gone on what......
God damn i hate this country, can I get out to where i want to go though, of course not..... :roll:
Daimo. When you had your bike crash, did you get taken to hospital?
As for the bloke, thats fraud, and im sure that they will stop that, buy paying up fornt before all types of operations.
northwind
01-08-06, 03:11 PM
I'm sort of amazed they didn't wait for the cheque to clear to be honest, I do that if I sell something on Ebay never mind selling someone an £8000 heart op :)
northwind
01-08-06, 03:18 PM
Nah, that's because so many people that buy stuff off me are thieving Englishmen :)
But dont pay tax, and they will put me in jail.
Not so. Only if you fraudulently declare a tax return will you be liable for imprisonment. Simply not paying will mean they'll come after you to attempt to recover their loss by seizing any assets you may have.
As for the bloke, thats fraud
True. But consider this: had they prosecuted then the adverse publicity would have been huge. Not only would the NHS have been made to look like the evil empire, but so would that particular hospital too. For eight grand they've had damage limitation and the hospital itself actually looks quite good by accepting £25 per week. Rather than being a huge national story, this way they've kept it to the sidelines.
I'm sort of amazed they didn't wait for the cheque to clear to be honest
I'm sure they'll be looking at their methods a little more closely after this, so don't start planning anything :wink: .
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I'm sort of amazed they didn't wait for the cheque to clear to be honest, I do that if I sell something on Ebay never mind selling someone an £8000 heart op :)
Yeah, I'm kinda surprised by that too.
I doubt anyone else will get away with it that easily - but hats off to him.
The thing with the NHS is it's all swings and roundabouts (when it should be slides and see saws :wink: ).
OK, so he put everyone on the 'legitimate' waiting list back a slot. But the money generated would also have done some good in some small way too. Enough to balance it out - probably, well no, definately not - but therein lies the problem.
Money.
Can't live with it, can't live without it.
For an entity (the NHS) which has no real definable 'product' to have to meet specific targets like a commercial company is an untenable situation. But it exists. So what are they going to do? - damned either way.
It maybe a mess, but I for one am still glad we've got it.
UlsterSV
01-08-06, 03:33 PM
Daimo mate stop complaining. Your tax money is feeding Africans and killing Iraqis. You're meant to be grateful.
The Basket
01-08-06, 03:39 PM
NHS is very good from my own experience. At least the man on the street can get medical care regardless of age, rank or station in life.
Just a kickball for here today gone tomorrow politicians and it pays the price.
Ward8124
01-08-06, 03:48 PM
The man is a legend! Good effort my old son!
Biker Biggles
01-08-06, 04:04 PM
Real trouble with the NHS is that it spends far too much money pandering to too many "lowest common denominators"when it should be concentrating on the important things.By that I mean blokes like this who need an op quickly in order to stay alive,but have to sit on a waiting list where they may well die.There are many other similar cases.While he is waiting the hossie will be merrily treating countless lower priority cases who are in no danger of imminent demise.This is made very much worse by our target obsessed government who make hospitals treat anyone who has waited too long however trivial their condition,but allows a six to nine month delay for this man.It's a real mess,with your treatment being something of a lottery depending on which conditions are flavour of the month at your hospital and which ones are in vogue with the Department of Health.
Fortunately for us,if we crash our bikes and smash ourselves up we should find ourselves in one of the flavour of the month sections,but that could all change with healthcare fashion.
The NHS is no longer about health, it's about politics.
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Biker Biggles
01-08-06, 04:23 PM
Yes Politics.It always was very political,but it's more so than ever now.This government has spent a great deal of money on the NHS and is desperate to be able to scream about the results,but much of the money has gone into vast projects that have failed dismally.We now have lots of shiny new walk in centres and advice lines (NHS Direct),computer systems to arrange everything and vast numbers of managers and supervisers to oversee the staff,but someone has to actually do the donkey work,and a fair few of them have recently been made redundant.We could of course invest more money in a leafleting campaign to tell everyone how well it's all going. :roll:
northwind
01-08-06, 04:26 PM
Yep, I'd agree with that... The NHS have basically been told it's not acceptable to delay someone's treatment because someone else needs it more, so a less urgent case can get precedent over a non-emergency, but still urgent case simply because of the time they've been waiting. It's pretty illogical. You can't judge the success of an organisation by waiting times, especially since the goalposts are always shifting
By this I mean, new treatments come along and change things. Along comes a new treatment that means you can operate on someone with heart disease and keep them alive, whereas before they'd have just died. Obviously, this is great, but that fills a bed and takes up surgeon's time and of course, money- so despite keeping someone alive who would have died, it actually makes the NHS look bad!
I'm a good example... 5 years ago, they'd have given me a hip replacement and left me needing a new hip once a decade for the rest of my life, not to mention with limited movement... but I'd have been out of hospital faster, after a simpler, faster surgery, with less skilled surgeons. I'd also have needed less physio- since I could make a near perfect recovery, it takes a lot of physio to finish the job, whereas with a half-hip replacement it's never going to be right anyway, so it's easier to get it as far as you can!
So, I'm obviously better off, and quite pleased about it, but it's cost the NHS more time, more training, lots more money... Of course, it'll pay off, since if I lived to 70 I'd need probably another 4 replacements, but that's not taken into account by the waiting list and budgetary systems. So as far as the figures show, the NHS did a bad job with me :roll:
In this case the end justified the means.
I could go on and on about my battles with the NHS, but I'll probably end up leaving the country for treatment elsewhere.
I could go on and on about my battles with the NHS, but I'll probably end up leaving the country for treatment elsewhere.
Blimey, I thought it was just clothes you wanted to swap :shock: :wink: .
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No it's my own personal restoration project. I need to streamline the chassis, remove some unneeded parts and add on some curvaceous bits.
:shock: :shock: :shock: — TBH I admire your guts (as they'll be the only bits left :lol: :oops: :wink: ). Well each to there own, best of luck with it.
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Biker Biggles
01-08-06, 09:31 PM
Don't tell Northwind----He might suggest a GSXR front end.
TAXI
Upside down ones :shock: But at least it'd have adjustable preload, compression and damping :lol: .
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northwind
01-08-06, 09:41 PM
I was going to suggest an Ohlins in the rear- it's adjustable for length. But that'd just be rude.
Biker Biggles
01-08-06, 09:52 PM
How about swapping your inlets for pointy exhausts?
Far more effective than fiddling with your downpipe.
And what do you do about your airbox?
STOP THAT -----THAT'S BEING SILLY. :D
:shock:
Ok thanks for the advice, back to the drawing board then eh?
On topic, interestingly. Heart operations aren't the only thing they do at hammersmith Hospital. :wink:
Remember the Fosters (? ) beer advert — Australian voice: "it's gonna hurt in the morning, son" :lol: . Rather you than me, but if it makes you happy then I for one don't have the slightest problem with it. However, it might just add a new meaning to the term saddle-sore :wink: .
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It's not about being happy. There is no choice here, if I don't I'll probably end up killing myself.
Kee-rist that sounds kinda whiney and pathetic :roll:
northwind
01-08-06, 11:11 PM
Not really... Sounds from the heart to me.
Me, I have a genius trapped in the body of a d***head :)
That reminds me must start looking for a gel seat...
It's not about being happy.
Of course it is. Contentment equals happiness. If you're not currently content, then you're not happy, which is why you're considering this course of action.
There is no choice here
There's always choice, even if it's choices we don't wish to make.
if I don't I'll probably end up killing myself.
I doubt it, you seem pretty well balanced overall. Plus you have a sense of humour, which always helps.
That reminds me must start looking for a gel seat...
You'll need more than a gel seat :lol: .
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The Basket
02-08-06, 09:11 AM
Send the baliffs round...
But dont pay tax, and they will put me in jail.
Not so. Only if you fraudulently declare a tax return will you be liable for imprisonment. Simply not paying will mean they'll come after you to attempt to recover their loss by seizing any assets you may have..[/quote]
But they put you in prison for non payment of Council tax so why not Income? tax :?
As for the bloke, thats fraud
[
True. But consider this: had they prosecuted then the adverse publicity would have been huge. Not only would the NHS have been made to look like the evil empire, but so would that particular hospital too. For eight grand they've had damage limitation and the hospital itself actually looks quite good by accepting £25 per week. Rather than being a huge national story, this way they've kept it to the sidelines..
per month IIRC. Was a major news event going by last night's news.
I'm sort of amazed they didn't wait for the cheque to clear to be honest
I'm sure they'll be looking at their methods a little more closely after this, so don't start planning anything :wink: .
.[/quote].[/quote]
would not be able to provide a next day service but seeing him on the news a credit check would have been a worthile and obvious investment.
Peter Henry
02-08-06, 09:52 AM
I would have whipped the old fraudster right back in to the hospital and removed said organ without anaesthetic or tools...a la those freaky far eastern mystic doc's that dig around with their hands?
He has deprived some other poor soul of treatment, someone with just as much right as he has...but they were willing to,(no doubt reluctantly) follow the procedure!
I think I am corect in saying that in the U.S. issuing a cheque with no funds to support it, is a federal offence.
I cannot believe the ineptitude of the admin peeps of the hospital in not waiting for funds to clear before appointing the patient.
(ooof Jeez that will rattle a cage or three!*)
wyrdness
02-08-06, 11:08 AM
And today we have this story (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/suffolk/5237824.stm) on the BBC. The NHS trust won't allow the hospital to treat patients who haven't been waiting at least four months even if the hospital has spare capacity. What the f*uck is happening to the NHS?
But they put you in prison for non payment of Council tax so why not Income? tax :?
People are only sent to prison with regard to non-payment of Council Tax if they genuinely refuse to pay. If they can't pay then they are not imprisoned and it's treated as any other civil debt, though interestingly the local council is now treated as a priority creditor whilst the Revenue and Customs are not. And no, I don't know why.
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What the f*uck is happening to the NHS?
Simply, the NHS is f*ck*d — and by the Labour Party, how's that for irony?
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What the f*uck is happening to the NHS?
Simply, the NHS is f*ck*d — and by the Labour Party, how's that for irony?
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It's not f*cked, it's just trying it's best to cover all the bases, reach all the targets and do the best it can to please everybody...
...including the people that aren't worth pleasing. :roll:
It's old and tired. In it's youth it was fit, lean and did it's job well - then times changed and it was left at the back of the queue for re-training. Now it struggles to do the best it can whilst other new, leaner services are promoted above it.
But like so many intelligent, middle aged people who are devoted to the company they work for (ie, us) give them a break, give them what they need to compete in today's environment and they will work hard and pay you back many times over.
It's not f*cked, just f*cked over. :roll:
Sorry, K, on this occasion I have to disagree with you. It's not a question of times changing, the NHS has been criminally managed and manipulated to a state of supreme incompetence and victim to nervous political diktat. A vast number of the employees are inefficient, incapable and poorly trained and supervised. It's on its knees and needs radical restructuring with first class management to save it from falling apart completely. As it's unlikely to get that, the future really doesn't look too healthy — for any of us.
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Biker Biggles
02-08-06, 12:45 PM
You are both right to some extent.The NHS is a victim of poor management and gross political interference,but it always has been,and the problem is made hugely worse by changeing times.There is a culture change in our society which can be summed up as a dependance on the State to sort out all our problems,and the NHS is the most extreme manifestation of this.A generation ago we would'nt dream of troubling the NHS for trivial complaints but now it is swamped by them.It used to function well because our society exercised an element of self discipline which is now history and demand was kept at reasonable levels,and people were able to sort out most of their own health issues,at least initially.
Now the NHS is first port of call for for all the headaches and cut fingers that we are no longer able to deal with ourselves.
I don't know what the answer is,but some sort of discipline needs to be put back into the system or the NHS will sink under the weight of demand whoever is in Government.
But they put you in prison for non payment of Council tax so why not Income? tax :?
People are only sent to prison with regard to non-payment of Council Tax if they genuinely refuse to pay. If they can't pay then they are not imprisoned and it's treated as any other civil debt, though interestingly the local council is now treated as a priority creditor whilst the Revenue and Customs are not. And no, I don't know why.
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Sorry but IIRC Revenue & Customs are high up on the list of Creditors, not sure of the correct order. Oi Lyn where are you?
They used to be, but are not technically considered a "priority" creditor any more. Oh, and I got that from Lyn :lol: .
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OK, was a long time ago that I learnt it - learn something new everyday. Thanks.
was it when they combined then I wonder - really surprising the Govt would change the law not in its favour, sounds like a **** up :lol:
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