View Full Version : STOP...
...Child Abuse and Pornography sites....
Sorry if this is a sad subject and this may get deleted but I'd just like to get as many people as possible to light a candle to support Victims of Child Abuse.
There is NO money needed just your support.
What good it will do I don't know but hey, lets try eh?
http://www.lightamillioncandles.com
Thanks
tinpants
20-10-06, 08:02 PM
Anything to help. This is a worthy cause. My candle is now lit.
kwak zzr
20-10-06, 09:20 PM
i was number 700.691 hope this helps.
Peter Henry
20-10-06, 09:30 PM
700,701.
No one will ever convince me that the stealing of the innocence of childhood by physical, mental or sexual abuse is right and I will not accept these actions being excused away by some "condition" or result of the perpetrators own childhood. :?
Filipe M.
20-10-06, 09:38 PM
700,711.
Based on my experience in this field, as much as I would like to think this will help I dont see how it can. Sorry if this upsets or annoys but I would like to highlight some of the issues.
Most lolita parts of pornography sites which I suspect is part of the 100,000 figure are actually legal. They use barely legal teens who appear younger and are promoted as such but being 16 does not make the image an illegal one and means there is nothing law enforcement can do.
The issues involved are complex and global. A lot are based on culture where life is hard and cheap and interwoven with extreme poverty and corruption of law enforcement meaning sex tourism can flourish. Also the spread of material is global requiring co-operation of law enforcement and establishing jurisdiction and extraditions which can be a legal minefield.
Also, you will never stop people being born whose brains are not wired right and think child abuse is not abuse. Nor will you catch all the abused who dont seek help and repeat the cycle and become abusers. Nor will you be able to stop the Maxine Carrs of this world helping them. In my time in the NHTCU I was flabberghasted by the women who knowing what their husband was arrested for took them back with a small child in the house and putting that child at risk.
Sadly I have to disagree with their advert in part - that abuse is getting worse and children younger. The material I was evidencing five years ago involved a six month old toddler and it really doesnt get much worse than that. The abuse is as bad as it gets and has been for some considerable time - its just that the public does not get to see that.
All I can say is this - if you have kids, educate them to the risks. People in chatrooms are not necessarily who they say they are. If theyre trying to arrange a meet, at least give them a lift and verify they are meeting who they think they are. And have the PC in the lounge or somewhere you can keep an eye on what your kids are doing. I cant tell you how many images of young teenage girls stripping off on webcams to paedophiles pretending to be similar aged boys I came across but it was scarily very high.
I really hope this actually achieves something. But ime the only thing that does is actually catch the guys that distribute it or who create it or who engage in sex tourism. Given the internet has taken their sense of isolation away and they can now reinforce with each other what they see as validity of their views I think this problem is going to get very, very much worse even with the resources put into trying to catch them. :(
philipMac
20-10-06, 11:06 PM
http://adapted.com/jay/pq/images/stop-hammertime.jpg
21QUEST
20-10-06, 11:52 PM
....Stuff......
...okay. So did you light a candle or not :?
Cheers
Ben
....Stuff......
...okay. So did you light a candle or not :?
Cheers
Ben
What does it matter if I did or didnt? I added what is my experience to the consideration of whether a virtual candle will make an indent on those issues.
But I guess its just another opportunity for you to try and have another dig at me. :roll:
Apophes
21-10-06, 12:10 AM
700,851
give the parents of the abused kids a few mins alone with the pervs
oh and did i forget hand them a browning high power on the way in :)
21QUEST
21-10-06, 12:27 AM
....Stuff......
...okay. So did you light a candle or not :?
Cheers
Ben
What does it matter if I did or didnt? I added what is my experience to the consideration of whether a virtual candle will make an indent on those issues.
Sorry, it's just with your post being overwhelmingly negative, I was just wondering aloud like. Of course it doesn't matter.
But I guess its just another opportunity for you to try and have another dig at me. :roll:
Now, that's not a very nice thing to say and you know it :( .
As an aside I was 700,701 I believe.
Cheers
Ben
EDIT: Looks like PH was 700,701 :? Oh well .......
Agreed Lyn it's not going to create a miracle cure. But on the otherhand it didn't take any effort, just some thought - Just as your post was thought-provoking and with good advice.
Anyway, 700,881.
philipMac
21-10-06, 01:11 AM
http://jonescollegeprep.org/ourpages/auto/2006/1/31/1138729345621/mc-hammer.jpg
Are you looking for a reaction?
Or just airing your taste? :lol:
philipMac
21-10-06, 01:44 AM
Hammer is just dancing.
The world falls appart. War in Iraq. Kiddie porn left and right. Lyn gets in a strop with someone or other.
And... Hammer is just dancing... despite it all.
http://usera.imagecave.com/wigglywiggly3/May29/mchammer.jpg
Seriously. WTF difference does clicking on some candle gif make? Oh right, I get it, kids get molested, and its a bad thing. Ahh. We should stop this at once.
And Terrorists. They should stop too. Maybe we could set up a site to stop them.
Awesome.
setanta
21-10-06, 02:20 AM
I have to agree with Lynw on this one
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
Totally agree.
For me lighting a candle might not stop anything buy lighting it but, what it does do is raise the issue again to keep it in the public eye so people are aware and can look for signs etc and maybe it might help stop something.
Alpinestarhero
21-10-06, 08:18 AM
Lit a candle for the cause. 701, 341 at my count.
Matt
rpwoodman
21-10-06, 09:21 AM
701,401
candle lit quite some time ago.
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
Totally agree.
For me lighting a candle might not stop anything buy lighting it but, what it does do is raise the issue again to keep it in the public eye so people are aware and can look for signs etc and maybe it might help stop something.
That was exactly the reason I made the post in the first place. I didn't want this to get contraversial and I certainly didn't put the topic up to belittle the subject, I studpidly thought that maybe if as many people could light a candle to show their support it might get the "Authorities" to act and to get these sites banned! That was purely the reason behind it. Lynw, I know it's a drop in a very big ocean but if every one had the same view as you that it was pointless then why vote for anything? Why protest if it isn't going to get us anywhere? Surely it's a start isn't
it??
What is stopping the authorities checking out the sites to see who is actually paying to see these vile images. for goodness sake, they can access your account to take money off of you to pay a fine or council tax so why can't they access these sites to see who's paying so they can arrest these sick bast*rds!?!?!
p.s Thanks for your support you guys and gals who have lit a candle!
* sorry but I have no idea why this is the size that it is... I've tried changing it but then it goes really small! sorry! :oops:
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
I guess it's a balance between doing this to raise public awareness and raise your own personal awareness for signs around you (all good stuff). And thinking that lighting a virtual candle is all that's required to make a serious difference.
I personally don't see it as bickering but adding valid points for consideration.
Biker Biggles
21-10-06, 11:06 AM
701501.
One long essay later it can be summised as this:
1. The point of the sight is to take this to governments, law enforcement agencies, ISPs etc. This presumes they are doing nothing or are unaware of the problem which is simply not true. They are fully active in this field. They are simply prioritising on the really horrific stuff which is simply not what you get on lolita sites tbh.
2. If you want to do something, do something. How many people will only leave it as a click on a link? If you want to make a REAL difference you have to feel strongly enough to get up off your **** and leave your computer behind and donate or volunteer for charities working to change the law, alleviate poverty or protect children. For intance, Childline NEED volunteers now, if people did that that would actually be helping children for real, more so than simply clicking a link.
philipMac
21-10-06, 04:17 PM
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
Ed my friend.
Maybe my approach could be better put.
But, simply put, I think these sorts of sites are worse than usless. I group them together with those emails you get saying "forward this on to all your mates and you will have a good day". Best case scenario is nothing happens.
This site is worse than that, (IMO), because the user is left thinking, there, ahh, made a difference there, I did my part.
When they didnt.
They did nothing of the sort. A server incremented an integer variable somewhere. Nothing else happened. No one stopped molesting a kid. No one became more aware about kids being molested.
The idea that now, people need to be reminded that child molestors exist is absurd. There has been a media frenzy and a hysteria so pronounced that BrassEye did a mock special on paedophilia.
There were child molestors under every bed and on every computer in the country. Every priest had to be watched. When I am out playing with kids on the road when i come back from work, I have to make sure everything I do cannot be construed as wierd.
So, yeah, "lighting candles", clicking on a candle gif on your Web browser, come on.
Maybe the post was intentioned well. Maybe those post this email on to all your friends for luck are well intentioned.
It still doesnt mean its not a load of rubbish.
Peter Henry
21-10-06, 04:19 PM
Hell no, the well meant concept of the lighting of candles is not going to make one bit of difference. But it does no harm for people who find the subject matter disgusting to let themselves be known.
philipMac
21-10-06, 04:20 PM
And... having just read lyn's above post... I have to say I agree.
If you are going to do something, do something. Dont "Click here to save the world". Dont kid yourself. Do it or dont do it. Dont just talk sh!te and click links.
Spiderman
22-10-06, 01:33 PM
It is a crying shame that such a well intentioned thread has turned into petty bickering.
Ed my friend.
Maybe my approach could be better put.
But, simply put, I think these sorts of sites are worse than usless. I group them together with those emails you get saying "forward this on to all your mates and you will have a good day". Best case scenario is nothing happens.
This site is worse than that, (IMO), because the user is left thinking, there, ahh, made a difference there, I did my part.
When they didnt.
They did nothing of the sort. A server incremented an integer variable somewhere. Nothing else happened. No one stopped molesting a kid. No one became more aware about kids being molested.
The idea that now, people need to be reminded that child molestors exist is absurd. There has been a media frenzy and a hysteria so pronounced that BrassEye did a mock special on paedophilia.
There were child molestors under every bed and on every computer in the country. Every priest had to be watched. When I am out playing with kids on the road when i come back from work, I have to make sure everything I do cannot be construed as wierd.
So, yeah, "lighting candles", clicking on a candle gif on your Web browser, come on.
Maybe the post was intentioned well. Maybe those post this email on to all your friends for luck are well intentioned.
It still doesnt mean its not a load of rubbish.
Read all the comments on this thread so far but i have to say this sums it up best for me.
Its also the reason why i dont give money to big charities cos all i realy think it does is make me feel good that ive done something to help. But in reality i dont believe that money i give goes very far to helping those i give to, rather it helps the chrity pay for more printing/website costs to promote itself.
Now days i'd rather just give my cash to the homeless. A lot of people say to me "But he's only gonna waste it on drink or drugs" well good for him, cos after i'd paid my rent and bills that all i'd be wasting it on too ;)
If people wanna make a real change they need to get off their sofas and go out and show themsleves i believe.
I marched against the Iraq war, knowing it wont really make a diffrence and the govt will never listen to the electorate over this type of issue but at least i was there to show suuport.
I marched against the Criminal Justice Bill and before that the Poll Tax, again knowing these things relly wont make a diffrence but at least we were all out there being seen to be trying to do something.
Sitting on your ****, clicking a mouse on a webiste IMHO amounts to F all as far as doing something goes. It makes you feel like youve done your bit, its soothing yourself. Nothing more.
Now look at Brian Haw. How many of you know who he even is i wonder 9without resorting to google or the like i mean) To me he's the living embodiment of doing something that you feel very strongly about. He's like me and you not just some nutter who has nothing better to do. he has a wife and kids who miss him dearly but support him totaly. He's rissens above govt attemts to shut him up and all because he wants others to have a better life then they have and for Govt around the world to do something to stop the sufferign that is happening on a daily basis.
thats doing something. Click a mose and add a digit? :roll:
i lit it a while ago
cant see the point myself,as i dont think it will do any good. :(
& when people get caught doing things they should' ent they practicaly get off with it(but dont get me started i got to be in work for 3pm)
but lit all the same
21QUEST
22-10-06, 02:31 PM
You guys are making me laugh :lol: :lol:
A lot of assumptions being made as I see it.
Anyways if we are to say generally speaking "The world runs on Bullsnutse" then maybe we could say we humans produce it. Seeing as there are a multitude of different shades in humans, maybe the difference is just in the type of bullsnutse.
Maybe some are talking bullsnutse and doing nothing
Maybe some are talking bullsnutse and clicking on a mouse
Maybe some are talking bullsnutse and doing stuff which amounts to nothing.
That being the case the sum total of the all the different ****e amounts to the same. A whole lot of feckall. No? :roll: :wink:
Cheers
Ben
UlsterSV
22-10-06, 03:34 PM
Well I doubt BabyJ was trying to change the world with this thread. By posting this she does bring attention to the issue and maybe her post will have spurred someone into making a donation to a charity or engageing in some sort of charitable work. Who knows? But it's better to make the thread than not make it.
21QUEST
22-10-06, 03:42 PM
Well I doubt BabyJ was trying to change the world with this thread. By posting this she does bring attention to the issue and maybe her post will have spurred someone into making a donation to a charity or engageing in some sort of charitable work. Who knows? But it's better to make the thread than not make it.
Agree :thumbsup: so now do you want to buy a book or what :lol: :wink:
Cheers
Ben
Well Oiled
23-10-06, 11:59 AM
I lit a candle. Some negative, defeatist comments above (doesn't make any difference, worse than useless etc) but I look at it this way:
- If just 1% of the people of those who follow this link take a bit more of an interest and write to their MP or make a small donation to childline, NSPCC or a similar charity, that's 7000 people doing a bit more.
- If just 1% of those 7000 got really involved in the fight against child abuse, that's 70 more volunteers and a lot of abused or potentially abused children helped.
So maybe it is worthwhile taking a look ?
Cheers Keith
My friend does something about it...she knicks people that do this stuff, and throws them in jail. I lit a candle ages ago.
As i saw on a bumper sticker one "make a parent happy, Run over a Peadophile"
My friend does something about it...she knicks people that do this stuff, and throws them in jail. I lit a candle ages ago.
As i saw on a bumper sticker one "make a parent happy, Run over a Peadophile"
even bumper stickers have spelling mistakes these days
no wonder the country is going to walthamstow
For some reason our firewall has decided that I am not to light a candle :cry:
If a polictial party were to promise to tatoo a symbol on the face of convicted perverts I would vote for them, I dont care about their civil liberires they have taken a childs childhood away, no matter how far removed from the actual act they are. I already give to charity and to childrens charities the most.
Well some good views some bad views and Some really dissapointing views but I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion at the end of the day.
I know I wasn't going to change the world by starting this thread but as I said before I did it for a little comfort by thinking that "most" people would think that it was a positive thing to try and put a stop to child abuse and by 'lighting a candle' you were showing that you agreed that it needs to be stopped. If everyone had the negative thoughts that some of you have had then no one would do anything. No one would give to charity. No one would protest against anything.
As for a few comments about "why don't you get up and actually do something" well I did enquire to child line but unfortunately being a parent of 3 and working full time (term time is still classed as full time) they said that I wouldn't be able to dedicate the time that was needed. I also make a monthly contribution to the NSPCC
Thanks for the support guys
If people want to "do" somthing. Not victims of abuse but in need, just the same.
http://savethechildren.sandbag.uk.com/
krazykim
24-10-06, 10:59 AM
My friend does something about it...she knicks people that do this stuff, and throws them in jail. I lit a candle ages ago.
As i saw on a bumper sticker one "make a parent happy, Run over a Peadophile"
even bumper stickers have spelling mistakes these days
no wonder the country is going to walthamstow
No Keith, Viney's talking about the small vegetable molesters.
If everyone had the negative thoughts that some of you have had then no one would do anything. No one would give to charity. No one would protest against anything.
I've done my bit and actually spent two years of my life putting these *******s away - my negativity of this stems from that. Because it takes more than a virtual candle to change things and there are so many complicating factors in reality it will not stop overnight as well intentioned as you may be with virtual candles.
You may not like what I have to say but I have every right to point out the failings of what this is likely to achieve or about peoples ignorance about how much is ACTUALLY being done to counter this which that site fundamentally presumes to be very little.
Frankly, you complaining about the defeatist attitudes when you yourself put in your first post a qualifier about not being sure what it will achieve seems pretty hypocritical tbh. Hardly a positive comment is it? :roll: Neither is it defeatist to say theres very little something like this will achieve - its REALISTIC. There is a danger that some people WILL think this is all they have to do and they have actually done something.
But how silly of me not to have seen that invisible qualifier of how you want to raise awareness as long as it doesnt mean hearing the truth or from even dicussing very important and very crucial issues regarding this subject raised on this from someone qualified to give it. :roll:
21QUEST
24-10-06, 12:04 PM
Ok everyone, I think it's time for :grouphug: :grouphug: Now there's a good bunch :wink:
Cheers
Ben
Ok everyone, I think it's time for :grouphug: :grouphug: Now there's a good bunch :wink:
Cheers
Ben
Sorry if Ive caused offence to anyone. This is a very emotive subject for me - not least because whenever its raised my mind recalls images and sounds of videos which will never leave me they are so horrific. With that in mind tends to make me a bit tetchy when people ask for awareness then criticise anyone giving it.
This isnt meant as a criticism of Babyj or anyone else with well meaning intentions. But I am very able and qualified to try and make people, particularly parents on this forum, aware of the reality and where the risks really lie or what can be done constructively to help.
If you want awareness then you have to be prepared for a harsh and unpleasant truth. That making yourself feel good by lighting a virtual candle only helps you and your conscience but doesnt make much difference if thats all you leave it as.
On that note I'll leave with a :grouphug:
Every one needs :grouphug:
If you've been involved with it it does affect the way you view things and all respect to those who have dealt with it.
but support shown candle 734,291
Ok everyone, I think it's time for :grouphug: :grouphug: Now there's a good bunch :wink:
Cheers
Ben
Sorry if Ive caused offence to anyone. This is a very emotive subject for me - not least because whenever its raised my mind recalls images and sounds of videos which will never leave me they are so horrific. With that in mind tends to make me a bit tetchy when people ask for awareness then criticise anyone giving it.
This isnt meant as a criticism of Babyj or anyone else with well meaning intentions. But I am very able and qualified to try and make people, particularly parents on this forum, aware of the reality and where the risks really lie or what can be done constructively to help.
If you want awareness then you have to be prepared for a harsh and unpleasant truth. That making yourself feel good by lighting a virtual candle only helps you and your conscience but doesnt make much difference if thats all you leave it as.
On that note I'll leave with a :grouphug:
What does it matter to you how it makes people feel?? So you have seen it first hand, You are not the only one to be affected by theses issues! Do you not think we are aware what these sicko's do to these children?? So what if it makes me feel better by lighting a candle, and YES it does helps my consience.
I am not trying to change the world here Lynw, I couldn't possibly do that with this "issue" I am just trying to make people aware that's all!!
You call me a defeatist and a hypocrite, I am certainly not either! The reason for my hesitant original post was purely through nerves as to how this subject would be met. Simple. And I am certainly not afraid of the truth, if that were the case I would not have made the thread in the first place. It is you who is afraid. Afraid of what you saw.
Stop being so bloody opinionated and take it purely for what it is!!
I'm sorry for being so simple minded! :notworthy:
tinpants
24-10-06, 03:36 PM
Ok everyone, I think it's time for :grouphug: :grouphug: Now there's a good bunch :wink:
Cheers
Ben
Sorry if Ive caused offence to anyone. This is a very emotive subject for me - not least because whenever its raised my mind recalls images and sounds of videos which will never leave me they are so horrific. With that in mind tends to make me a bit tetchy when people ask for awareness then criticise anyone giving it.
This isnt meant as a criticism of Babyj or anyone else with well meaning intentions. But I am very able and qualified to try and make people, particularly parents on this forum, aware of the reality and where the risks really lie or what can be done constructively to help.
If you want awareness then you have to be prepared for a harsh and unpleasant truth. That making yourself feel good by lighting a virtual candle only helps you and your conscience but doesnt make much difference if thats all you leave it as.
On that note I'll leave with a :grouphug:
What does it matter to you how it makes people feel?? So you have seen it first hand, You are not the only one to be affected by theses issues! Do you not think we are aware what these sicko's do to these children?? So what if it makes me feel better by lighting a candle, and YES it does helps my consience.
I am not trying to change the world here Lynw, I couldn't possibly do that with this "issue" I am just trying to make people aware that's all!!
You call me a defeatist and a hypocrite, I am certainly not either! The reason for my hesitant original post was purely through nerves as to how this subject would be met. Simple. And I am certainly not afraid of the truth, if that were the case I would not have made the thread in the first place. It is you who is afraid. Afraid of what you saw.
Stop being so bloody opinionated and take it purely for what it is!!
I'm sorry for being so simple minded! :notworthy:
:winner: =D> =D> =D> =D>
It seems to me that there are an awful lot of people on this forum that seem to make a career out of belittling other peoples points of view. Sure, these people are entitled to their opinion but not to the point that it belittles people.
I think these people need to just lighten up a little. Lynw says she has seen many horrific things regarding paedophiles. Fine. No problem. I sympathise, but you gotta deal with it. I see horrific sights virtually every shift I do. For instance, a mothers grief after she had accidentally run over her son; a father and son burnt to death in an RTC- one in which they were the innocent parties. I could go on but I won't as there isn't much point and it would soon get a bit boring. The point that BabyJ was trying to make was NOT one of trying to change the world but to raise awareness. There is a difference.
Flame me if you like. I'm not really that bothered.
Good on you though BabyJ for raising awareness. :thumbsup:
Thanks for the encouragement Belleropon (and everyone else who has shown their support) it means a lot :kiss: xx
krazykim
24-10-06, 04:03 PM
2 pence worth:
:grouphug:
philipMac
24-10-06, 04:31 PM
Do you not think we are aware what these sicko's do to these children?? So what if it makes me feel better by lighting a candle, and YES it does helps my consience.
BabyJ, In fairness... you clicked a gif, and you eased your conscience?
Lyn (regardless of her tone) actually did something.
The site is meaningless. Sorry if that upsets you. Like you say yourself, no one needs be "made aware" that molestors exist.
medwaysv
24-10-06, 04:52 PM
Do you not think we are aware what these sicko's do to these children?? So what if it makes me feel better by lighting a candle, and YES it does helps my consience.
BabyJ, In fairness... you clicked a gif, and you eased your conscience?
Lyn (regardless of her tone) actually did something.
The site is meaningless. Sorry if that upsets you. Like you say yourself, no one needs be "made aware" that molestors exist.
no...but perhaps a gentle reminder from time to time dont hurt
besides whats wrong with making your views and feelings known
if you dont stand up and be counted for what you beleive in then you may aswell go and bury yourself
the next time someone puts a poll up...dont bother voting...after all...it dont mean anything does it?
philipMac
24-10-06, 05:10 PM
no...but perhaps a gentle reminder from time to time dont hurt
besides whats wrong with making your views and feelings known
if you dont stand up and be counted for what you beleive in then you may aswell go and bury yourself
the next time someone puts a poll up...dont bother voting...after all...it dont mean anything does it?
A gentle reminder. Sound. Because, I had almost forgotten my mate was abused by a priest in Dublin. And it had clean slipped my mind how that kiddie porn existed and was a bad thing.
And, I am relieved that every one can ease their concience by clicking a gif.
I am saying what I believe. That is what I am doing. I am not burying my head in the sand. It might be unpopular, but I think its true.
If someone puts up a poll, they are looking for a consensus opinion. This has nothing to do with polls or voting.
My friend does something about it...she knicks people that do this stuff, and throws them in jail. I lit a candle ages ago.
As i saw on a bumper sticker one "make a parent happy, Run over a Peadophile"
even bumper stickers have spelling mistakes these days
no wonder the country is going to walthamstow
No Keith, Viney's talking about the small vegetable molesters.
:lol:
for everyone :grouphug:
Do you not think we are aware what these sicko's do to these children?? So what if it makes me feel better by lighting a candle, and YES it does helps my consience.
BabyJ, In fairness... you clicked a gif, and you eased your conscience?
Lyn (regardless of her tone) actually did something.
The site is meaningless. Sorry if that upsets you. Like you say yourself, no one needs be "made aware" that molestors exist.
I'm not upset, but what you are saying is just because I haven't actually worked within that organization then I'm not entitled to start this "meaningless" thread (as you put it) ??
But someone posting what they've had for breakfast or what the best colour for their bike is or whether or not they should go out today is ok??? (Sorry not putting down those posts just trying to make a point!)
You think this thread is meaningless yet you post your opinion. A little hypoctritical don't you think?
no...but perhaps a gentle reminder from time to time dont hurt
besides whats wrong with making your views and feelings known
if you dont stand up and be counted for what you beleive in then you may aswell go and bury yourself
the next time someone puts a poll up...dont bother voting...after all...it dont mean anything does it?
A gentle reminder. Sound. Because, I had almost forgotten my mate was abused by a priest in Dublin. And it had clean slipped my mind how that kiddie porn existed and was a bad thing.
And, I am relieved that every one can ease their concience by clicking a gif.
I am saying what I believe. That is what I am doing. I am not burying my head in the sand. It might be unpopular, but I think its true.
If someone puts up a poll, they are looking for a consensus opinion. This has nothing to do with polls or voting.
Just like I had almost forgotten that I was RAPED when I was 12!!! :evil:
I'm going to stop posting now. I've made my point. The thread has worked. I have had a LOT of support because lots of people have lit candles, which was the whole point of the thread.
For those of you against this meaningless thread, we are all entitled to our opinions but I thank you for making this thread more popular because of your negativity.
medwaysv
24-10-06, 05:51 PM
If someone puts up a poll, they are looking for a consensus opinion. This has nothing to do with polls or voting.
the people who created this website who put the gif for you to click on were asking you for a concious opinion you either click on it or you dont,if you do then you are voting all the same.
same principal as a poll so YES it could be classed as a poll,the only difference being there is no Yes/No option
Just like I had almost forgotten that I was RAPED when I was 12!!! :evil:
I'm going to stop posting now. I've made my point. The thread has worked. I have had a LOT of support because lots of people have lit candles, which was the whole point of the thread.
For those of you against this meaningless thread, we are all entitled to our opinions but I thank you for making this thread more popular because of your negativity.
Sorry but you did this to raise awareness of 'the issue' and you then complain when someone who actually has worked in this field tries to discuss this and enlighten people to the complexities surrounding this?
More than a little contradictory - because surely if you wanted awareness you would have taken the opportunity to discuss what I was saying but clearly you want selective awareness without too much truth or reality. :roll:
Because one thing you have still failed to realise is this - this isnt the real issue that needs addressing. Clearing the public area of the web will only banish it to the private domain - and that is where the really horrific stuff is, it is rarely in the public domain. I dont think you could even begin to comprehend what its like to trawl through hard disks with nearly 100,000 paedophile images - very few of which are available on the sites this site is trying to get closed down [and ignoring the efforts of police, government, ISPs and IWF].
I mean the IWF in the past 10 years has seen child porn drop from 18% hosted in the UK to 0.2%. How much fecking more can they do in this jurisdiction? Do you not think they are going after the remaining 0.2%? And even if they do, the police units will be full time busy going after the private collectors and those who do not share or host in public. But I guess getting them will be just as easy as clicking a link too. :roll: [Damn - mods can we have the visordown dozey smiley, nothing on here really seems to compare :P ]
And while some people who lit a candle sits smugly having eased their conscience, like someone said earlier, it hasnt stopped a child from being abused.
And frankly, it is stopping the abuse in the first place which is the issue which REALLY needs to be addressed.
21QUEST
24-10-06, 07:27 PM
I thought I said 'leave it' folks :? :) . Alright.....
:winner: =D> =D> =D> =D>
It seems to me that there are an awful lot of people on this forum that seem to make a career out of belittling other peoples points of view. Sure, these people are entitled to their opinion but not to the point that it belittles people.
I think these people need to just lighten up a little. Lynw says she has seen many horrific things regarding paedophiles. Fine. No problem. I sympathise, but you gotta deal with it. I see horrific sights virtually every shift I do. For instance, a mothers grief after she had accidentally run over her son; a father and son burnt to death in an RTC- one in which they were the innocent parties. I could go on but I won't as there isn't much point and it would soon get a bit boring. The point that BabyJ was trying to make was NOT one of trying to change the world but to raise awareness. There is a difference.
Flame me if you like. I'm not really that bothered.
Good on you though BabyJ for raising awareness. :thumbsup:
I won't flame you as I think that is a very good post and I agree with a much you said. Wholely agree with you with regards to witnessing horrific things in the course of your job. it comes with the territory as you said. It is arguable whether that can be classed as getting off you ass to do something. It's a job which you are being paid to do. End off.
no...but perhaps a gentle reminder from time to time dont hurt
besides whats wrong with making your views and feelings known
if you dont stand up and be counted for what you beleive in then you may aswell go and bury yourself
the next time someone puts a poll up...dont bother voting...after all...it dont mean anything does it?
A gentle reminder. Sound. Because, I had almost forgotten my mate was abused by a priest in Dublin. And it had clean slipped my mind how that kiddie porn existed and was a bad thing.
And, I am relieved that every one can ease their concience by clicking a gif.
I am saying what I believe. That is what I am doing. I am not burying my head in the sand. It might be unpopular, but I think its true.
If someone puts up a poll, they are looking for a consensus opinion. This has nothing to do with polls or voting.
Just like I had almost forgotten that I was RAPED when I was 12!!! :evil:
I'm going to stop posting now. I've made my point. The thread has worked. I have had a LOT of support because lots of people have lit candles, which was the whole point of the thread.
For those of you against this meaningless thread, we are all entitled to our opinions but I thank you for making this thread more popular because of your negativity.
BabyJ I applaud your courage in making the above post.
Now what did I say earlier about people making assumptions because someone may have clicked on a gif?
The thing is this, is a lot of people IMO have posted a lot of ****e even if there may have been some facts with said crap. The thing is everyone thinks theirs(opinion) is not. That is fine to a point Everyone has one and all that. :wink:
Like I said ealier, all this 'what's the point of clicking on a gif' IMO is a load of bollix precisely because some people have missed goal mouth by a wide margin(IMO).
Now I hope this is the last post on this thread :P :wink:
Cheers
Ben
So, is there any point in signing a petition about anything? Saving the cottage hospital? Banning hunting? Stopping the war in Iraq? Taken to extremes, you could say that the Government has the country's best interests at heart, is on the case already (whatever the case is) and therefore theres no point in doing anything.
EDIT: was replying to lynw's post - which has mysteriously disappeared.
So, is there any point in signing a petition about anything? Saving the cottage hospital? Banning hunting? Stopping the war in Iraq? Taken to extremes, you could say that the Government has the country's best interests at heart, is on the case already (whatever the case is) and therefore theres no point in doing anything.
EDIT: was replying to lynw's post - which has mysteriously disappeared.
I thought on reflection best not left.
Now there would be no problem to me with this if:
1. child abuse was not a topic which a lot of people are aware of. But they are. Its got stupid to the point parents cant take pictures of their kids at football matches in Ashford now because of child protection laws. As someone said in the other thread - this is not an issue that needs its profile raised - its pretty well debated and well known subject with nigh on universal agreement that its not a good thing.
2. if we were actually addressing the real areas of concern. Cleaning up the internet is not going to make a difference to abused children. The bulk of abusers and paedophile material are not in the public domain - theyre well hidden and encrypted on private servers. All you are doing is clearing one area - and for that I have no problem with it. But to me, the real issue is catching the abusers and stopping the abuse - which this will not change.
3. because its too easy for people to click on a link and think thats all it takes to do something. It would be fine if it were aimed at people who werent doing anything - but law enforcement, governments, ISPs and other agencies are working flat out. As Ive just put in the other thread - IWF have cut public images hosted in the uk from 18% to 0.2%. And they managed to do that without 700,000 odd clicks on a link to help them. Theyre clearly dedicated and working flat out as it - and they are fully aware the majority of people want them to do it. They dont need a petition telling them theyre seen as not doing enough.
I have not said I dont want it to work - I would dearly love to think it would. But given the factors above and my knowledge that the abusers lurk in the private area its not going to change anything for the children being abused which to me is the real issue. We should be actively trying to stop the abuse. Not easing our consciences with a quick click on a link - life simply isnt that simple unfortunately.
Ime its rare for a petition to work - not saying they dont. But the aims of this one are imo while worthy aims they are also a bit pointless - because theyre petitioning people already doing what they are petitioning for and will continue to do even if this petition didnt exist.
northwind
24-10-06, 10:50 PM
I'm kind of with PhilipMac... I don't really think a website's needed to tell the world that people don't approve of child abuse. I'm pretty sure most people know already. And anyone who doesn't, or who disagrees, won't be affected in the least by a website. So I'd say it's entirely irrelevant, personally. Perhaps next we'll have a campaign where we can all declare our distaste for murder.
You can get 400,000 people in England and Wales to declare themselves Jedi on the census, doesn't change anything there either. I hear 23 people declared me ginger the other day...
Of course, it does no harm. Unless people light their candle and consider that their "good deed for the day", and find it salves their conscience enough that they can turn the other cheek to someone else in need- sorry buddy, can't help you today, I already helped kids to not get abused. But then, people who'd think like that are a lost cause whether they sign up to these websites or not, so does it make a difference to that either? Who knows.
741092.
I've deliberately stayed away from this thread for a while, mainly to let the dust settle. I'm probably almost as close to the issue as some people can be. Granted not as affected by it as BabyJ and people like her, but I have known people that have been through similar situations, and as Bellephron, helped with the aftermath (as much as possible - which is not much at all) of very bad situations.
As Lynw, I've also spent time dealing with, for want of a better term (limiting because of U-rating), offenders. I too have had to sift through truly shocking imagery, and not only related to child pornography/rape.
My take on the candles website is simply that it's a petition. Granted it's more graphical than your usual petition, but a petition non -the less.
Yes there are organistaions (and even sole individuals) doing as much as physically possible to combat these issues and others. However, there are also 'NIMBY' organisations out there, the ones that know the problem exists, but do little about it. I know of many ISPs for example, that knowingly host illegal content, and even when this is reported to them, they do nothing about it because of their 'legal disclaimer' stating that they CAN remove data, but they don't have the duty to do so. I also know of banks that invest the interest they make on regular current accounts etc in, well, lets say dubious places.
Where's the harm in giving these 'NIMBY organistions' a little push?
With all this in mind, there is a candle lit for me, my fiance, each one of my children, and all the rest of my friends & family have been informed about the site.
Alpinestarhero
25-10-06, 01:40 PM
Whatever anyone says, the website is intended for good, not bad. Its there for people to show they care - everyone knows about it, but nobody talks about it. I think its good.
How many candles is it now?
Matt
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