Ignition Retarder

[Duck-man]

Just been browsing another (shock! Horror :D) SV site

http://www.sv650.tk/ (Scottish section)

and found a section about removal of the ignition retarder and it says

quote" ...get about 1bhp extra from 2nd and 3rd gear, the reason there is a retarder on 2nd and 3rd gear is so the bike can meet E.U noise regulations, ..."

is this true? Not fussed about just interested to see if it is actually the case?

cheers

Duck-man

[Luckypants]

Tis true, do a search for TRE mod (Timing Retard Eliminator).

[northwind]

Not that simple, it basically moves the power up the rev range so you don't get more at full power (or if you do, it's irrelevant) but you get a tiny wee bit more at lower revs. I didn't notice any difference myself, but some people do. Is it psychological? Who cares? As long as it feels real to you what does it matter :) It's also free and takes about 10 seconds to do, so even if you think it does nothing there's nothing to lose. If you do it right you can lose a couple of feet of wire as well, which will save you, oh, tens of grams :)

[Duck-man]

Did this tonight, havent had a chance to "test" the feeling of 1-2 extra horses :LOL: but hey it was cool to say i did it! haha!

[hovis]

stupid question.........but how do you remove the wires? do you just pull them out?

[jambo]

stupid question.........but how do you remove the wires? do you just pull them out?
carefully, or with wire cutters, depending on how your "undo" button in the toolkit's doing :smt109

[hovis]

i dont want to cut the wire i just want to get them out of the big connecter .

[Born again]

i dont want to cut the wire i just want to get them out of the big connecter .


I have just done mine, I used a small flat blade screw driver, pushed it gently down the bottom face of the conector whilst gently pulling on the wire. If you have released the conector with the screw driver the wire will pull out without much of a tug. Then repeat on the other wire.
I noticed that after I done mine, in second and third it reached the rev limiter very quickly. Its now how the bike was meant to be, not a huge difference but it was noticable:)

[hovis]

so you just wiggle in the other end & give it a little pull?

[Born again]

so you just wiggle in the other end & give it a little pull?


Thats about it, the wire is held in by a little plastic lug that is part of the conector body.........

[hovis]

cool, i plan to do it mid ride-out to see if i can tell the differance

[Born again]

Its easy, if you take your time it could take you sixty seconds and thats with a break...........and its free.....

[danf1234]

This might be a daft question but does this mod do exactly the same as a G-pack thing that just clips into the loom??

Dan

[phil24_7]

Does it do the same as the smart TRE too?????

[hovis]

yes & yes

AFAIK

[phil24_7]

Guess I'll add it to the list of things to do then!!!

[Blue_SV650S]

Not that simple, it basically moves the power up the rev range so you don't get more at full power (or if you do, it's irrelevant) but you get a tiny wee bit more at lower revs. ...

I think that is slightly misleading Northy ...

The retard circuit is active between say 3-4000 rpm (can't remember exact revvs, and can't be bothered to look it up :lol:) .. in 2nd and 3rd ... so it will not effect outright power in 2nd or 3rd (like northy said) ... however there is no actual addition or 'moving' (where I think it is a bit misleading northy) ... just a bit of subtraction in the 3-4k mark with the device activated .... so all this mod will do is give you back the little bit that the retard circuit would have robbed in the 3-4k area 8)

The actual power loss and if it is detectable is debatable, but it WILL be loosing you power ... its free to eliminate (on the curvy), and it won't do the bike any harm, so why not?!?? :)

Oh and can someone make a note of where the wires are in the connector as I need to put them back on my trackbike and I can't remember which one went in which hole :oops:

[Born again]

Oh and can someone make a note of where the wires are in the connector as I need to put them back on my trackbike and I can't remember which one went in which hole :oops:

Connector#3-red/yellow
Connector#4-green/blue

[Blue_SV650S]

Connector#3-red/yellow
Connector#4-green/blue

Ta :thumright: ,

But just to clarify, is that looking from the back of the plug 'wire in side', or the 'mating' side :scratch:

I presume its as if I was looking at the mating side of the plug i.e. The 3rd pin on top row (left to right) is the red/yellow right?!?!!?

To be honest the pin numbers might actually be molded in the plug ... I can't remember and not near my bike to look :oops:

[Born again]

Yes that is looking at the mating face, ie looking at the end you would put the blade in to release the wire. Numbered left to right........

[Blue_SV650S]

Yes that is looking at the mating face, ie looking at the end you would put the blade in to release the wire. Numbered left to right........

TA :thumleft:

[hovis]

Ehy You Refitting Them Blue?

[Blue_SV650S]

Ehy You Refitting Them Blue?

Yes, its only to make sure my bike falls in-line with minitwin regulations on my trackbike/s if/when I race it, that's all ... I intend to leave it done on my road bike!! :D its a bit of a pointless reg anyway ... I mean how often does a race-bike see 3-4k??? I'd wager only when it is on the stand warming up!! :lol: .. anyway, thems the rules, so thems the rules and I will abide 8)

On my commute on my road bike, it sees 3-4k in 2nd and 3rd plenty ;)

[northwind]

What I meant was, it doesn't cost you power, it just means you need more revs to get the same power. Obviously that's still not good but a lot of people think they're going to get power on top, so I was getting at that. Or trying to anyway :)

[danf1234]

I bought one of these off e-bay which I am led to believe does the same job. I haven't fitted it yet though.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/G-PACK-for-SV650-SV650S-SV-650-SV650-S-EFI-MODELS_W0QQitemZ300100186945QQihZ020QQcategoryZ256 23QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[hovis]

i cant do it:(

how do you relese the wires?:help:

[Blue_SV650S]

What I meant was, it doesn't cost you power, it just means you need more revs to get the same power. Obviously that's still not good but a lot of people think they're going to get power on top, so I was getting at that. Or trying to anyway :)

I know YOU know what you are on about, I was pointing out that it didn't quite read as it might!! ;)

[northwind]

i cant do it:(

how do you relese the wires?:help:

You can just cut them... And insulate the ends, obviously. I cut mine at the time, just recently I removed them from the connector just by pulling with pliars. Hulk smash. But it works :)

[hovis]

did'nt really want to cut the wires, if they need to be connected back up thers not a lot of wire to play with

anywho........... going to the local meet tonight so might get sombody to give it a go?

its just im not sure whre i should be putting the screwdriver

[Blue_SV650S]

did'nt really want to cut the wires, if they need to be connected back up thers not a lot of wire to play with

anywho........... going to the local meet tonight so might get sombody to give it a go?

its just im not sure whre i should be putting the screwdriver

You will need a small screwdriver, like a watchmakers one ... or one that you repair glasses with ... as someone else said, you are trying to lift a little retaining plastic bit ... so take the plug off the CDI and jam the screwdriver in along the top surface of the relevant connector .... if you push it home it will lift the flap, the wire can then be removed with a gentle tug :)

[SoulKiss]

did'nt really want to cut the wires, if they need to be connected back up thers not a lot of wire to play with

anywho........... going to the local meet tonight so might get sombody to give it a go?

its just im not sure whre i should be putting the screwdriver

[Appologies in advance Hovis, but if they are lined up for me..........]

Its just two wires mate, you sure that its JUST the ignition that Retarded on your bike :P

[Sorry again - David]

[ejohnh]

I have just done mine, I used a small flat blade screw driver, pushed it gently down the bottom face of the conector whilst gently pulling on the wire. If you have released the conector with the screw driver the wire will pull out without much of a tug. Then repeat on the other wire.
I noticed that after I done mine, in second and third it reached the rev limiter very quickly. Its now how the bike was meant to be, not a huge difference but it was noticable:)

Well I just released the plug to have a close look at it. The pin positions are not numbered. I used several different sizes of watchmaker's flat blade screwdrivers in abortive attempts to 'release' the quoted connectors. Nothing released it and I am not going to wrench it out nor cut it. Has anybody besides Born Again found the 'releasing' mechanism without resort to brute force or cutters?:rolleyes:

[Born again]

I used the srew driver that comes with a swiss army knife, push it in give a little push on the pin and it should come out.......

[northwind]

All this complication. I cut mine, then later on I ripped the wires out of the plug with a pair of pliars, cut off all the spare wire, and threw it in the bin. Sounds barbaric, possibly is, but it works ;)

[Blue_SV650S]

Its a bit fiddly, but really not that hard ... you need to put the screwdriver in and then wiggle the wires at the same time and pushing the screwdriver ... eventually it'll all just free up ... its not like you can really see the tab when you are screwdrivering anyway ... its just a wiggle till it comes free job ;) ... you do need to give the wires a bit of a tug, but they come away pretty easily really ..

[kcowgergmm]

i think a better way to get more power is to turbo it does anyone make a turbo for an sv?

[northwind]

Nope. Not worth it, you can build an SV motor to the point it's unreliable with NA after all. You couldn't run high boost on a stock bottom end, which defeats the purpose really- you could build a strong bottom end and run it to, oh, 90bhp or so without too much concern on reliability but it'd cost you about £4-£6 with the turbo and engine management and still be less powerful and drivable than a thou. Less reliable too.

It's not that the SV motor's not strong- in fact it is, you can get an extra 15-20% or so out of it without ever going deeper than the pistons and have no real reliability issues, that's good going- like adding 30bhp to a GSXR thou. It's just not got that level of invincibility that you'd look for in a turbo motor, that's why 9/10 of all turbos are on GSXR1100 and Busa lumps.

[kcowgergmm]

have you heard how well turbos were working on the gsxr 1000 When it comes to turbos i am only familiar with cars

[northwind]

Which version? Couple of different motors out there. I've only heard of a K2 being turboed and it was pretty solid, but needed new pistons and eventually broke a rod. He was shooting for 200bhp with no other mods, think a K2 does about 150 in the first place. Oh yes, it was fitted into an SRAD 750 :smt107.

Oldschoolsuzuki for the impractical motorcycle win :)

[hovis]

DONE

you realy have to tug the wires. i was being a bit of a pansy b4 but its now done

its seems more revy now:smt102

:smt031 14 tooth front sprocket tommorrow:smt031