View Full Version : Bio-fuel
Why aren't we all using it? Im watchin best of top gear at the min and it just said that with bio-fuel you a load more power from a car, it also said this on fifth gear with a Lotus Exige. The goverment uses the environment and lack of oil as an excuse to tax petrol so much so why not give really low tax on bio-fuel to make up for the lack of economy?
I looked into this a while ago, you can basically convert old chip fat (Vegetable) oil into bio fuel, or at leasts a diesel additive very cheaply. The problem is the government has strict rules on the duty due on fuels, and unless your home made biofuel is exactly the right mix you still get taxed (although not as much as forecourt prices), and you don't actually then save that much.
Talking to several businesses around my area, they would have gladly given me gallons of used chip oil if I'd tried it.
Look up on the web, theres plenty of how to make Biofuel websites. heres one
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#3biod
Well Oiled
22-04-07, 08:47 PM
Most bio fuels are VERY bad for your engine. They damage the fuel line seals and cause the injectors to foul up. They also do horrendous things to the engine oil if they get into the sump in any great quantity. This is because they are very poor in terms of oxidation. Most manufacturers will void the warranty if you run on more than 5% biofuel, unless the engine is specifically designed for it. Where it is accepted, there are often conditions, such has having to change your oil 3 times as often in the case of some trucks.
Biofuels are NOT the renewable fuel many think they are. The energy required to grow, harvest, process and transport them to the filling station means the 'Well to wheel' benefits are maybe 20% of a truly renewable fuel.
Also, if every single piece of land that could grow bio-fuels did so, only about 10% of Europe's total fuel requirement could be satisfied. Virgin forest in places like Malaysia (a big CO2 absorber) is being chopped down in order to produce palm oil as a biofuel source - crazy!
We'd do far better to invest the time and effort into improving the efficiency of vehicles, but biofuels sound nice so the politicians have jumped on the bandwagon. Believe me, the world's energy / oil crisis will NOT be solved by biofuels.
Not sure about bio-ethanol for petrol cars, but bio-diesel has a much lower calorific value than mineral diesel and your power/mpg will suffer.
http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#3biod
I'd love to have a go at making some of this stuff, maybe when I get a car I'll make sure its diesel so I can have a go. :D
unless your home made biofuel is exactly the right mix you still get taxed
Do they actually have a way to check for home-made fuel or could you just brew it in your shed and keep :-# about it?
Luckypants
22-04-07, 09:45 PM
Do they actually have a way to check for home-made fuel or could you just brew it in your shed and keep :-# about it?
Dunno but defrauding the Revenue and Customs carries heavy fines. Ask anyone whose been caught using red diesel.
That would be the Swiss(?) car. I saw it too.
The one that develops 804hp on American (80ish RON) fuel. 850hp on EU fuel. Convert & tune it to bio-fuels & it kicks out 900hp. Damn.
Stig lost it on a corner because it lacked a spolier for rear downforce. So they sent it back for one fitting. The manufacturers then sent it back to Stig for testing.
Classic.
Most bio fuels are VERY bad for your engine. They damage the fuel line seals and cause the injectors to foul up. They also do horrendous things to the engine oil if they get into the sump in any great quantity.
The webcit AlanSv gives lists fuel lines and injector seals being a problem but says you can get replacement parts that are bio-fuel resistant.
I think it was this bio-ethanol stuff that normal petrol cars can run on with bettert performance tho and no the diesel stuff.
Also the environment thing doesnt bother too much in the case of bio-fuels as I think a lot of it is used by the goverment as an excuse for tax. I'm not looking to save the planet or anything I'm just tight! :D
That would be the Swiss(?) car. I saw it too.
The one that develops 804hp on American (80ish RON) fuel. 850hp on EU fuel. Convert & tune it to bio-fuels & it kicks out 900hp. Damn.
Stig lost it on a corner because it lacked a spolier for rear downforce. So they sent it back for one fitting. The manufacturers then sent it back to Stig for testing.
Classic.
Thats the one! I didnt even want to try and spell the name as I cant even say it! :rolleyes:
TVR_Tracy
22-04-07, 09:48 PM
My friend works for TMO renewables in Guildford, they're a company which make "biologically derived fuels from agricultural waste" using fermentation techniques...
They don't have a functioning website yet, but here is some info...
http://www.tmo-group.com/tmo/media/releases/2006/2006-06-19/
http://www.geifventures.co.uk/pdfs/TMO%20press%20release%20sept%2004%20final.pdf
gettin2dizzy
24-08-07, 10:01 PM
They've now changed the rules. Your allowed 50 litres a week tax free! Old diesels seem fine with vegetable oil unprocessed :) anyone tried it?
Cloggsy
24-08-07, 10:23 PM
Old diesels seem fine with vegetable oil unprocessed :) anyone tried it?
... goes and looks for an old Peugeot 205 Diesel... "Richie" :lol:
gettin2dizzy
24-08-07, 10:31 PM
I'm buying a diesel tomorrow....
I feel awful about it :(
and it's a rover....
I'm such a goon!
MiniMatt
25-08-07, 12:28 AM
My old xantia 1.9td worked just fine on about a 30/70 mix of neat tesco's veggie oil and diesel. Ran it like that for about 60,000 miles without any problem whatsoever. I, ahem, recorded everything for customs, ahem.
Reason we don't all do it, as I understand, is that to produce enough oil seed rape to fuel the worlds cars we'd need to turn *all* agricultural land to it, have none left for food, and still be well short.
gettin2dizzy
25-08-07, 09:11 AM
just normal veggie oil, no filtering?
ianofbhills
25-08-07, 01:16 PM
i'm on a 50/50 mix straight veg oil (svo) and regular pump diesel at the moment.
when it gets a bit colder its harder to start the car so i change my mix to 70% diesel 30% svo
i just buy the 3 litre bottles of veg oil from tesco it works out at 54p/litre and i dont do anything like filtering or converting to bio diesel etc i just pour it in from a big jerry can.
If you can get waste veg oil for free then obviously thats a decent cost saving but i cant be bothered with all the filtering and water extracting thats involved.
I change my oil and fuel filter every 6 months and i've been running my combo van 1.7 dti for 12,000 miles like this with no problems to report as yet apart from the usual donut smell coming from the exhaust.
MiniMatt
25-08-07, 06:56 PM
just normal veggie oil, no filtering?
Yep, just slap it in. Not so sure I trust it with newer common rail diesels, not tried it on my audi but the citroen seemed to love it. As stated, if using second hand oil then all sorts of filtering needed.
Mate of mine has a 205 diesel and has a twin tank setup, he starts and stops the car on dino juice and when it's warm flips a switch to run on 100% neat veggie oil (it's thicker than dino juice so 100% kinda needs a warm engine or a pre-heater). His main "fuel" tank is filled with 100% veggie oil and he has a jerry can in the boot that holds five or so litres of dino juice to start and stop on.
Alpinestarhero
25-08-07, 07:44 PM
There was something in MCN the other week, about 2-strokes being run on 90% (or more) ethanol. The emissions where cleaner (hurrah! return of RGV's and RS250's!!!) and there was more power
I would like to run a bike on ethanol - thats not hard to make
Fermentation of sugars :)
Matt
Thats the one! I didnt even want to try and spell the name as I cant even say it! :rolleyes:
That would be the Swiss(?) car. I saw it too.
The one that develops 804hp on American (80ish RON) fuel. 850hp on EU fuel. Convert & tune it to bio-fuels & it kicks out 900hp. Damn.
Stig lost it on a corner because it lacked a spolier for rear downforce. So they sent it back for one fitting. The manufacturers then sent it back to Stig for testing.
Classic.
That's a Swedish car, the Koenigsegg, which is an odd word even by Swedish standards!
I'm driving around in a hire car at the moment (valet parking in Stockholm crashed my Passat!) and it's a Bi Fuel Focus. Haven't tried it on normal petrol, but it seems to have plenty of poke running on Ethanol, which is 7 and a half Kronor a litre, rather than 12 ish for unleaded. Bit noisy though, although that might just be a Ford thing....
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